Elwro
Arcane
What are you guys even talking about. Every boss in Dark Souls has a bonfire within 30 seconds of running, with the exception of Seath and Gwyn. You don't need to fight everyone; you don't need to parry anyone.
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From Software The Dark Souls Discussion Thread
- Thread starter felipepepe
- Start date
Gargoyles, Bed of Chaos, Four Kings, Sif, Nito, Pinwheel (PTD only), Manus...
Latelistener
Arcane
- Joined
- May 25, 2016
- Messages
- 2,587
By 2015 Namco sold 8 millions of copies (DS + DS2 + SotFS), 40% of which came from PC. Considering that DS came out on PC a whole year later, you know which platform generated the most hype and sales (not doubt boosting sales for other platforms too).
And Demon Souls was never popular. No one was talking about it. Consoletards were too busy playing cinematic experience that Sony was feeding them with.
Then again, not the first time shit like this happened. Valkyria Chronicles was another gem ignored by consoletards.
Elwro
Arcane
I will have to check Pinwheel but with all the others once you know the shortcuts and choose the correct bonfire you can run to the boss without fighting anyone.
- Joined
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- 11,866
By the time Dark Souls was released in 2011, Demon's Souls had sold over a million copies on the Playstation 3 for which it was an exclusive. Although these sales would eventually be overshadowed by Dark Souls' combined sales on PS3 and PC, Demon's Souls was an unexpected success for From Software and generated anticipation for its sequel.
https://graphmag.wordpress.com/tag/demons-souls-sales-worldwide/
https://segmentnext.com/2020/07/13/dark-souls-franchise-sales/
The length of the corpse run really only ever bothered me on O&S and Bed of Chaos. Everything else felt fine. O&S doesn’t bother me at all now since I can reliably beat them, but Bed of Chaos is still annoying because I am terrible at that fight and quickly lose my patience with it and make stupid mistakes.
CthuluIsSpy
Arcane
Yeah Bed of Chaos is pretty trash. Of all the changes they could have made, Bed of Chaos was the most pressing.
cretin
Magister
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2019
- Messages
- 1,361
For me, ironically, the fights people complained about the most were very easy for me: Nito, Seath, BoC, pinwheel, etc. I think the most trouble I had was with the gargoyle because I was a scrub and the vagina demon who i ended up killing with arrows like a little bitch.
CthuluIsSpy
Arcane
Pinwheel isn't hard though. People don't complain about pinwheel because he's difficult, they complain about him because he's a joke.
Nito is hard if you don't have poise. If you have poise and an halberd he's hilariously easy. You just spin to win and that damages Nito while keeping the ads off of you. You have so much poise that you can't get stunned.
Or just use a holy weapon to get rid of the ads, either tactic works.
Nito is hard if you don't have poise. If you have poise and an halberd he's hilariously easy. You just spin to win and that damages Nito while keeping the ads off of you. You have so much poise that you can't get stunned.
Or just use a holy weapon to get rid of the ads, either tactic works.
I understand that your name is LITERALLY "latelistener", but everyone and their mother was talking about Demon's Souls and Dark Souls well before the PC port of DS.
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- Oct 3, 2015
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- 11,866
In my first run of Dark Souls, I died more times to the Gaping Dragon than to any other boss, whereas I defeated Smough & Ornstein on my first try.
Pinwheel is supposed to be the number 1 target for a person roleplaying a Cleric. Which, apparently, is someone Myiazaki hates with a passion, because you're constantly thrown under the bus because of it. Although, you do get access to prime equipment if you decide to roleplay all the way, and display mercy.
Also, Neato's stuff can be dodged if you backstab the skellies when you hear the yell. I-frames will keep you safe from the scythes. But, obviously, holy weapons and pyros are the optimal way.
Silverfish
Arbiter
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2019
- Messages
- 3,181
Miyazaki hates Clerics so much that Occult Rapiers can one-shot Gwyn.
People have difficulty with Seath? I’m pretty sure I’ve one-shot him from my first try on (well obviously not the first time, but the first time it’s actually possible to kill him). I would say O&S, Nikto, Four Kings, Gwyn, and all the DLC bosses are significantly harder.
Pinwheel is a joke though.
Pinwheel is a joke though.
Elwro
Arcane
Seath is easy until you want to cut off his tail...
cretin
Magister
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2019
- Messages
- 1,361
figured as much, he wrecked me the first time i tried because of that curse shit, but the 2nd time i said to hell with flanking, just went straight to his belly and it was over really quickly.
Parsifarka
Arcane
Finally completed this game (PtD) yesterday; I purchased it 8 years ago for 5€ and had a painful first experience back then by going to all the wrong places in every hub, only to quit out of exasperation when finding out there were TWO gargoyles; a few years later I only reached Taurus when I decided I had had enough, but this time I was adamant on playing through it as part of my gothumn program.
I always thought I was meant to eventually fall in love with the game if only because of its aesthetics and edgy lore, and truth is I had a brief romance with it this time: the tragedy was that my character sucked too much at the beginning of the game yet was too powerful by the end, being the sweet spot of perfect challenge just a few hours among the about 60 I invested in it.
You could say it was my fault to be over-leveled by the end, but it was never my intention and right now I think it would have been wise for the game to limit the levels I could get in NG.
For years I had been wondering why was Dark Souls regarded by many as a RPG, and now finally I understood: "git gud" means "minmax your stats". Unless you are one of those autists who goes through the game not levelling up or we are talking about NG+++++++++ in which case none of what I'll say applies, the game becomes banal shit boring as soon as you have maximized your damage output.
I wanted to make a fast character so I went all on Dex and End, and murdered the undead merchant to see what happened, luckily enough the result was me getting the Uchigatana so I stuck to that weapon through the whole game, getting 420 base damage by the time I reached O&S, who were swiftly dealt with in a minute. Up to that point I had struggled terribly with Taurus, Capra and very specially Queelag so it was great to have become so strong yet it was an announcement of dullness to come.
I reckon Taurus is a really bad choice for an early boss, being that at the time I didn't know about the roll i-frames so my best bet was the tiresome repetition of the plunge attack while avoiding getting stuck in the bridge by the weird hitbox of the demon -it was upsetting, but the worst was the punishment of having to run again and again through a gauntlet of at least 15 hollows who at the time posed quite a challenge. It was cruel, and I must have gone through that torture about ten times.
Then came Capra with his absolute bullshit of a fight where the player struggles against the camera and the horrid geometry once the bloody hounds are defeated. It's mind blowing to think that crap made it through the game testing, I felt the fight was a puzzle for the first five seconds in which I had to execute the precise movements for not getting murdered by either the blade or the fangs and then a constant dice roll to decide whether the fight would develop in a way I could win.
And then Queelag. I must have repeated that fight over 20 times, doing the walk through the poison pond across the rock-throwing trolls again and again and again -part of it was my fault because of my rejection of summoning and kindling, but still, that boss was abusive: a single mistiming of her shockwave attack meant instant death for my build and concentration was hard to keep on due to how much health she had in proportion to the pitiful damage I was dealing at the time.
But once I defeated her, I had pretty much conquered Dark Souls as Sen's Fortress was the last challenge the game presented to my character.
After that fight, once the character is strong enough as to freely (and rather carelessly) move about Lordran, I only encountered bosses that would have make for far more reasonable early fights than Taurus, Crapa or Queelag, such as the Hydra, the Golem or the Butterfly -yet being where they were, they had become laughable bosses. Why did they make the game easier as the player progresses? I have come to agree with those that say that Dark Souls is not a hard game, it just has a brutal step in difficulty right at the beginning and then it drops the ball.
The consequence of this is that the Lord fights were mere chores, tasks that could be performed swiftly without even understanding what was going on in the screen (special mention for the shitty bosses of Demon Ruins). Fortunately the DLC saves some face with well designed levels and Artorias, who actually forced me to think about what was I doing, but beyond that it was just a walk through the park until the end crushing the pathetic Gwynn. I'm positive by the time I finished the game I was a worse player than when I was fighting Queelag with all my senses fixed on her, as my Vit grew upon having reached optimal End and Dex I could just go kamikaze on anything except for the OVERDOSED TITANITE DEMONS.
These all are the negatives, but there were shining spots, such as Undead Parish and the Depths when the game opened up its secrets and I could finally upgrade my sword and while remaining challenging it felt far more reasonable, or Blighttown (the heights, not the gruesome pond) which was very dangerous but rewarded careful playing, or Painted World which is a showcase of all the virtues of the game (minus the sorry boss): it was in these segments where I felt the game succeeded the most by having my character in control of the situation only as long I kept my focus. It's in such situations when the game was like a Conan story, an adventure into the unknown wherein every step could be fatal but perception was rewarded with the ability to pull amazing feats.
I have talked with friends who are fans of the game and they largely agreed with me, even though they weighted these aspects more favourably, and probably I would too had I played it earlier. I perfectly understand why a teenager would become enthralled by the game, it manages to do something unique and it is so bold that its failures can be forgiven.
Also, I must remark how good the delivery of the story is; just by the level design and with a few sentences about the history of the world it managed to make me strongly antagonize the tyranny of Gwynn and his circus of freaks, a brave departure from the standard tale presented at the beginning of the game which felt natural and stated in a clear yet not ham-fisted manner, keeping the balance between the two prospective outcomes by showing the horrors the dark serpent's bet entails.
Overall it's a great set of design ideas and a good game with a ton of content but plagued by a rushed/faulty execution (the issues with the camera and geometry, the embarrassing design of Demon Ruins/Lost Izalith and the outside of Duke's Archives/Crystal Caves, bad bosses like Crapa or incorrect disposition of them along the game), but when it hits the spot there's nothing like it... though I hope there is, as I will be purchasing the sequels and Nioh as soon as the next sales comes; Dark Souls has created an itch hard to scratch for it's amazing how addicting and deep they made a combat with just two attack buttons.
Probably as time goes by my glasses will get rose-tinted and I will sing its praises and replay it, but as of now I regard it as an uneven experience with heights of enthusiasm like few games can generate and underwhelming valleys of jank.
I always thought I was meant to eventually fall in love with the game if only because of its aesthetics and edgy lore, and truth is I had a brief romance with it this time: the tragedy was that my character sucked too much at the beginning of the game yet was too powerful by the end, being the sweet spot of perfect challenge just a few hours among the about 60 I invested in it.
You could say it was my fault to be over-leveled by the end, but it was never my intention and right now I think it would have been wise for the game to limit the levels I could get in NG.
For years I had been wondering why was Dark Souls regarded by many as a RPG, and now finally I understood: "git gud" means "minmax your stats". Unless you are one of those autists who goes through the game not levelling up or we are talking about NG+++++++++ in which case none of what I'll say applies, the game becomes banal shit boring as soon as you have maximized your damage output.
I wanted to make a fast character so I went all on Dex and End, and murdered the undead merchant to see what happened, luckily enough the result was me getting the Uchigatana so I stuck to that weapon through the whole game, getting 420 base damage by the time I reached O&S, who were swiftly dealt with in a minute. Up to that point I had struggled terribly with Taurus, Capra and very specially Queelag so it was great to have become so strong yet it was an announcement of dullness to come.
I reckon Taurus is a really bad choice for an early boss, being that at the time I didn't know about the roll i-frames so my best bet was the tiresome repetition of the plunge attack while avoiding getting stuck in the bridge by the weird hitbox of the demon -it was upsetting, but the worst was the punishment of having to run again and again through a gauntlet of at least 15 hollows who at the time posed quite a challenge. It was cruel, and I must have gone through that torture about ten times.
Then came Capra with his absolute bullshit of a fight where the player struggles against the camera and the horrid geometry once the bloody hounds are defeated. It's mind blowing to think that crap made it through the game testing, I felt the fight was a puzzle for the first five seconds in which I had to execute the precise movements for not getting murdered by either the blade or the fangs and then a constant dice roll to decide whether the fight would develop in a way I could win.
And then Queelag. I must have repeated that fight over 20 times, doing the walk through the poison pond across the rock-throwing trolls again and again and again -part of it was my fault because of my rejection of summoning and kindling, but still, that boss was abusive: a single mistiming of her shockwave attack meant instant death for my build and concentration was hard to keep on due to how much health she had in proportion to the pitiful damage I was dealing at the time.
But once I defeated her, I had pretty much conquered Dark Souls as Sen's Fortress was the last challenge the game presented to my character.
After that fight, once the character is strong enough as to freely (and rather carelessly) move about Lordran, I only encountered bosses that would have make for far more reasonable early fights than Taurus, Crapa or Queelag, such as the Hydra, the Golem or the Butterfly -yet being where they were, they had become laughable bosses. Why did they make the game easier as the player progresses? I have come to agree with those that say that Dark Souls is not a hard game, it just has a brutal step in difficulty right at the beginning and then it drops the ball.
The consequence of this is that the Lord fights were mere chores, tasks that could be performed swiftly without even understanding what was going on in the screen (special mention for the shitty bosses of Demon Ruins). Fortunately the DLC saves some face with well designed levels and Artorias, who actually forced me to think about what was I doing, but beyond that it was just a walk through the park until the end crushing the pathetic Gwynn. I'm positive by the time I finished the game I was a worse player than when I was fighting Queelag with all my senses fixed on her, as my Vit grew upon having reached optimal End and Dex I could just go kamikaze on anything except for the OVERDOSED TITANITE DEMONS.
These all are the negatives, but there were shining spots, such as Undead Parish and the Depths when the game opened up its secrets and I could finally upgrade my sword and while remaining challenging it felt far more reasonable, or Blighttown (the heights, not the gruesome pond) which was very dangerous but rewarded careful playing, or Painted World which is a showcase of all the virtues of the game (minus the sorry boss): it was in these segments where I felt the game succeeded the most by having my character in control of the situation only as long I kept my focus. It's in such situations when the game was like a Conan story, an adventure into the unknown wherein every step could be fatal but perception was rewarded with the ability to pull amazing feats.
I have talked with friends who are fans of the game and they largely agreed with me, even though they weighted these aspects more favourably, and probably I would too had I played it earlier. I perfectly understand why a teenager would become enthralled by the game, it manages to do something unique and it is so bold that its failures can be forgiven.
Also, I must remark how good the delivery of the story is; just by the level design and with a few sentences about the history of the world it managed to make me strongly antagonize the tyranny of Gwynn and his circus of freaks, a brave departure from the standard tale presented at the beginning of the game which felt natural and stated in a clear yet not ham-fisted manner, keeping the balance between the two prospective outcomes by showing the horrors the dark serpent's bet entails.
Overall it's a great set of design ideas and a good game with a ton of content but plagued by a rushed/faulty execution (the issues with the camera and geometry, the embarrassing design of Demon Ruins/Lost Izalith and the outside of Duke's Archives/Crystal Caves, bad bosses like Crapa or incorrect disposition of them along the game), but when it hits the spot there's nothing like it... though I hope there is, as I will be purchasing the sequels and Nioh as soon as the next sales comes; Dark Souls has created an itch hard to scratch for it's amazing how addicting and deep they made a combat with just two attack buttons.
Probably as time goes by my glasses will get rose-tinted and I will sing its praises and replay it, but as of now I regard it as an uneven experience with heights of enthusiasm like few games can generate and underwhelming valleys of jank.
PorkyThePaladin
Arcane
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2013
- Messages
- 5,145
I think you are being autistic in your analysis, the same way that people complain that Baldur's Gate games are too easy if you are min-maxing munchkin.
Dark Souls is a great game. Sure, if you can't control yourself, there are ways to break it, just like most any other game, and it's balanced around a normal person's play style rather than a munchkin's, but that's ok.
Dark Souls is a great game. Sure, if you can't control yourself, there are ways to break it, just like most any other game, and it's balanced around a normal person's play style rather than a munchkin's, but that's ok.
Parsifarka
Arcane
Excuse me, I thought this was the Codex yet you seem to imply there's another way to play a RPG.
Jokes aside, I just wanted a warrior who could hit fast and many times, so End and Dex were the natural choices until I noticed diminishing marginal returns. I didn't intend to break the game, that's just how it is.
You should look around to beating the game without those 2 attack buttons. I usually say that you haven't really beat Dark Souls unless you've done 2 runs.
Try a different build. Your opinion(s) will definitely change.
Elwro
Arcane
Yeah. In the 2nd playthrough you should start to see that the stats are not too important save for meeting the item requirements. Minmaxing is not required at all and at least for me it'd make the game less fun.
toro
Arcane
- Joined
- Apr 14, 2009
- Messages
- 14,079
Finish a Soul Level 1 run and then come back.
I suggest you quickly replay through the beginning of the game one day, just to make sure you're not just a better player yourself.
Sure the character can get quite strong in terms of stats, but what truly triviliaze the endgame is your player xp imo.
Which is something I really liked back then. Creating a new character and going through the early game like "wait how the fuck is this so easy now ?" was a good feeling.
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