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TBS The Fall From Heaven Thread [Civ 4 mod] - 2016 Edition™ - 2022 Update!

Unwanted

SunKing

He/Him
Patron
Dumbfuck
Joined
Nov 23, 2022
Messages
129
Location
Mars
Codex Year of the Donut
Can you play vanilla FFH2? Does it start up normally? EMM is a modmod, you don't actually need it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Try starting a new game in "vanilla" FFH 2, just to check if your base installation is working. With that out of the way, use the manual method for installing EMM:

https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/extramodmod-archive.28259/


Installation instructions:
  • Download and install Fall from Heaven 0.41 and patch "o" from here.
  • Copy or move the the "Mods/Fall from Heaven 2" folder to "Mods/ExtraModMod".
  • Extract emm-0.6.0-beta6.zip into "Mods" (or extract the contents of the "ExtraModMod" folder inside the archive into "Mods/ExtraModMod"). If you do everything right, you probably have to confirm that you want to overwrite files, and in the end there should be a folder "Mods/ExtraModMod/doc".
Just remember that there's another folder called "beyond the sword" or something inside your civ 4 installation. If you drop mods into the root Civ 4 folder, they won't work with BTS. If you get no prompts about files being overwritten, you're dropping the zip contents into the wrong folder. EMM is used as a patch on top of vanilla FFH2.

Oh, and you might wanna create a new shortcut for EMM since you're doing it manually, if you don't want to go "Advanced -> Load a Mod" every time, you CUCKOLD.
Can you reupload this please?
 

Eyestabber

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jan 15, 2015
Messages
4,733
Location
HUEland
PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015
Can you play vanilla FFH2? Does it start up normally? EMM is a modmod, you don't actually need it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Try starting a new game in "vanilla" FFH 2, just to check if your base installation is working. With that out of the way, use the manual method for installing EMM:

https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/extramodmod-archive.28259/


Installation instructions:
  • Download and install Fall from Heaven 0.41 and patch "o" from here.
  • Copy or move the the "Mods/Fall from Heaven 2" folder to "Mods/ExtraModMod".
  • Extract emm-0.6.0-beta6.zip into "Mods" (or extract the contents of the "ExtraModMod" folder inside the archive into "Mods/ExtraModMod"). If you do everything right, you probably have to confirm that you want to overwrite files, and in the end there should be a folder "Mods/ExtraModMod/doc".
Just remember that there's another folder called "beyond the sword" or something inside your civ 4 installation. If you drop mods into the root Civ 4 folder, they won't work with BTS. If you get no prompts about files being overwritten, you're dropping the zip contents into the wrong folder. EMM is used as a patch on top of vanilla FFH2.

Oh, and you might wanna create a new shortcut for EMM since you're doing it manually, if you don't want to go "Advanced -> Load a Mod" every time, you CUCKOLD.
Can you reupload this please?
https://easyupload.io/pykax2
 

Quiddity

Barely Literate
Joined
Jan 3, 2023
Messages
3
Erebus in the Balance does indeed attempt to implement some balance changes, but their version of "Balance" HEAVILY favors warlike nations like the Clan of Embers and thus indirectly weakens relatively peaceful builder-civs like the Elohim, Kuriotates, and Ljsofar by doing far less to strengthen them... Great for aggressive, fast-paced gameplay, but if you have any kind of attachment to playing as the "good guys" (Kael, like the designers of Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri had a bit of a soft spot for builders and pacifists, and created a game balance that gives them a fighting chance- indeed the Armageddon Counter itself was originally a kind of negative feedback for warmongering by harshly penalizing Evil civs) then you're better off with just More Naval AI...

Plus, the current modmod maintainer for EitB is kind of a jerk, unlike Kael, who was a complete gentleman and a good person- which I think reflects in his favorite civ being the Clan of Embers (violent brutes) and his favoring Evil warmongers in the game balance...

For a little context, Kael was such a good person and complete gentleman he rarely said an unkind word about anyone unless severely provoked, as I hear, and his "Donate" button for Fall From Heaven 2 actually leads to a donation page for UNICEF and a blurb about how making our world better would best honor his work.

The modmod maintainer for EitB, by contrast, gladly cusses out people he doesn't like, hints at how people ought to give him donation money, walked the fine edge between cheating and unconventional strategy in a couple of his PBEM's, hacked player passwords whenever he felt one was falling behind in PBEM turnaround time, and ignores any design suggestions for EitB he doesn't like.

My brief exposure to the modmod maintainer for EitB left a foul taste in my mouth (as foul as orcs must smell!) that I shall not soon forget, whereas Kael is the sort of person who left everyone he met with a sort of warm tingly feeling afterwards. Even now his "Donate" button for FFH2 leading to UNICEF continues to do good in the world long after he ceased developing his amazing game mod...


In short, EitB is kind of an acquired taste. It doesn't remain as true to FFH2's original spirit or lore as you might think, changes the game balance to unduly favor extremely aggressive tactics even more than in vanilla FFH2, and the modmod maintainer was still a jerk worth boycotting the work of, last I checked...
Oh Northstar, never change :lol:

For the record, Northstar joined our community, played in a few games (including one against me where I was playing as the Clan), took every chance to call everyone else on the forum cheaters, before leaving after even the most patient of us were thoroughly sick of him. Here is a good example of this that I happened to reread recently, where he quickly decides that his opponent must have hacked his save in order to alter the RNG such that he would randomly change into traits he didn't like. Despite many people explaining why there was no reason to believe this was the case, he eventually only came to terms with it by deciding that divine intervention (?!) was somehow involved. (Apologies if I'm somewhat short with Northstar in that link - you have to understand, this was after six+ months of being exposed to his craziness.)

I also have no particular affiliation for the Clan (indeed, I proposed nerfs after the game I won with them), have never asked for or received donations, have never hacked a players password (I believe Northstar is referring to someone else who hacked his save after all the other players agreed to kick him out because he was too slow to play his turns), and I have no idea what he means by cheating (possibly that I blockaded him when he was protected by the Sanctuary worldspell, which is apparently an exploit). I will confess to happily ignoring many of his design suggestions, however, as well as to swearing :lol:


Anyway, sorry for the many years old hijack! I've also been playing EMM lately, after a multi-year break and found this thread after googling around.

I'm curious by some of your AI ratings, Eyestabber. I've found Khazad and Luchuirp not very notable, whilst Illians and Ljolsofar tend to be formidable. Elohim seem to die quite quickly in my games also, though I don't select opponents.


Also, we're organising another PBEM, if you want to try out multiplayer. PBEM is where you play one turn (or so) a day, and generally report on your games as you're going. We operate on a trust policy that people won't cheat or read others threads. See here if you're interested. Or, if you don't want to commit to a game that will last several months, Tasunke is trying to get faster (live) MP games going here.
 

oscar

Arcane
Joined
Aug 30, 2008
Messages
8,038
Location
NZ
Ah tasty forum drama like these it's like I'm back in the good old days. A shame he hasn't posted (or been online) since that day in the 4th of April 2017.
 

Quiddity

Barely Literate
Joined
Jan 3, 2023
Messages
3
Ah tasty forum drama like these it's like I'm back in the good old days. A shame he hasn't posted (or been online) since that day in the 4th of April 2017.
Yes, I wouldn't normally have dived into this but it was particularly personal and targeted, so I thought I might as well correct the record. Besides, the remaining FFH2 community is pretty small, and it was really nice to stumble across another place EMM (which I indirectly contributed to) is being played.

By the by, I can't seem to reply to profile posts.
 

notfind404

Novice
Joined
Nov 9, 2019
Messages
1
What option do you use to start the game?I feel that the game is too slow compared to vanilla games(in normal speed), a settler need 220 Hammer in normal speed, it's crazy!
What is the difference between Erebus map,ErebusContinent and WorldofErebus?Even without the magic system, I think it's very different from vanilla, with a lot of powerful wildlife.
 
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Acrux

Arcane
Joined
Jul 1, 2019
Messages
1,489
I'm probably one of the very few people who uses Quick speed (and no turn limit). From what I've seen, most people use Marathon.

Erebus map is not recommended, mostly because it gives too much unusable terrain (desert, mountain). ErebusContinent and WorldofErebus are similar, but EC gives one large continent and WoE is supposed to give a couple of large land masses. Doesn't always happen, though.

Yes, wildlife and barbarians are MUCH stronger in FFH and it's descendants. It's not uncommon for an AI civ to be wiped out in the first few turns.
 

Quiddity

Barely Literate
Joined
Jan 3, 2023
Messages
3
Eh, while there's a definite segment that like the endless games of Marathon or Epic, most people I know who play FFH will play on Quick - simply because it's necessary to get through the early game. But the elongated early game is a definite decision from the creators, who felt that barbarians weren't dangerous enough and wanted people to value exploration and make it difficult. That being said, I often start an age in (Classical on EMM or Discovery on EitB) in order to skip the 50-80t it takes before anyone even has Mining.
 

Sarathiour

Cipher
Joined
Jun 7, 2020
Messages
3,262
Ah tasty forum drama like these it's like I'm back in the good old days. A shame he hasn't posted (or been online) since that day in the 4th of April 2017.
Yes, I wouldn't normally have dived into this but it was particularly personal and targeted, so I thought I might as well correct the record. Besides, the remaining FFH2 community is pretty small, and it was really nice to stumble across another place EMM (which I indirectly contributed to) is being played.

By the by, I can't seem to reply to profile posts.
Your account is too young, give it a year for more tasty drama.
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2010
Messages
8,848
Location
Italy
blasphemy. no civ game is a real civ game unless you spend most of your first 150-200 turns just pressing "next turn".
i wish cavemen2cosmos devs would cut 90% of the useless, pointless, redundant buildings and fuse them into permanent civ boni once researched. ai just can't keep up, it doesn't know that the +production buildings must absolutely be built first.
 

coldcrow

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
1,656
Reminds me of a discussion I had on steam with the creator of this HUGE map for C2C: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2817004555
He claims that C2C has the best AI of all civ4 mods, then puts out this huge map with recommended settings of nightmare difficulty and slowest speed. Welp.
And then continues to question the basically only best strategy of building order (in C2C) prod-food-commerce.

Also while I like playing on slower settings, slow speeds make the AI noticably worse in most bloated mods, since it will invariably make poorer decisions by not optimizing output.
 
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covr

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Messages
1,319
Location
Warszawa
Which modmod is the best to play in mid 2023? Some time ago Magistermodmod was the true one, as it was mostly about fixing stuff, AI and some lore changes. But now I see that he has added a lot of new stuff and ppl are complaining about constant crashes and errors.

I am looking for a relatively bug free experience, preferably something that is still being updated.
 

Blake00

Learned
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
275
Location
Australia
I plan to play Master of Mana Xtended in the not to distant future but am worried about the AI and bugs people talk about here. I hope the more recent Tweak & MoM Updates version of MoM Xtended fixes some of these issues.
https://forums.civfanatics.com/forums/master-of-mana-xtended-mod.366/

Looks like Fall from Heaven creator Kael's moved on from Stardock to Amplitude.. but is it to work on Endless Legend 2, or his own Fall from Heaven like standalone game he always wanted to do...
https://www.reddit.com/r/civfanatic...s_civ4_fall_from_heaven_creator_kael_working/
.
 

covr

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Messages
1,319
Location
Warszawa
Well, Kael was one of lead designers of Galactiv Civ 4, which was released recently. Amplitude latest 2 entries were shit or boring, so he might help them a bit. But he had his chance with Stardock on Fallen Enchantess and its clones, and it failed to be memorable games.
 

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