Ultima The Ultima Underworld I & II Thread

[Elwro]

I'll back up save games as well - I guess that's due to the inventory bug I was reading about?

Yes. But there's also one deep-level thing that I vaguely recall which may render your game unfinishable. I forgot the details and the issue was rare. Maybe it's nothing to worry about, sorry...

(I think in very unlucky circumstances one important NPC could die in lava or something)

 

[Cael]

So, in my current 2020 quest to play early 90s RPGs, I've just started playing UU1. Have some questions if anyone could help out in answering.

1) I'm playing as a Druid and I've levelled up but was not able to choose any new skills or improve current skills. If I remember correctly what the manual said, I need to visit shrines?

2) Is there a way to know the stats of a weapon or armour? How will I know if a cudgel is better than a sword?

3) There isn't any quest journal right? All I know is that I was put in this dungeon to save the daughter of the baron (?) for a crime I don't think I committed. The reason that I'm not so sure is because I could barely make out the introduction video due to terrible sound output.

4) There's this "Underworld Exporter" mod where you play the game in Unity (I guess similar to Daggerfall Unity). Is it recommended? I don't mind gameplay changes if they just make the controls more intuitive.

Thanks!

1. Yes, find shrines. You will also need the mantras.

2. The manual tells you the basic weapon tiers. However, there is no way to tell if a Longsword of Damage is better than a bog standard Broadsword other than fight with them and go with your gut feeling.

Spoiler

For more indepth info: Here.

3. No, there isn't.

 

[Cael]

I'll back up save games as well - I guess that's due to the inventory bug I was reading about?

Yes. But there's also one deep-level thing that I vaguely recall which may render your game unfinishable. I forgot the details and the issue was rare. Maybe it's nothing to worry about, sorry...

(I think in very unlucky circumstances one important NPC could die in lava or something)

Level 5. One of the mages lurks near the lava. She is vital to the completion of the game. However, I can't remember if she drops the item you need if she goes swimming in lava or not. I am under the impression that she does, for some reason. I seem to recall the item floating on the lava near where she normally lurks and she was nowhere in sight during one of my runs.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

2) Is there a way to know the stats of a weapon or armour? How will I know if a cudgel is better than a sword?

The Underworld games play very loosely with weapon stats, but the manual (pg 23 for UUW1, pg25 for UUW2) has some info on them.

 

[xuerebx]

Thank you all (and cheers for the Wiki link on the weapons/armour stats)! Fingers crossed that mage doesn't go swimming in lava in my game

 

[Cael]

Thank you all (and cheers for the Wiki link on the weapons/armour stats)! Fingers crossed that mage doesn't go swimming in lava in my game

She has been known to do a Jesus thing on lava as well, so even if she does, pray she does the Jesus thing instead.

She is on level 5, by the way. Sorry, my memory was faulty in the previous post.

 

[Arrowgrab]

1. Yes. Some shrines teach specific skills, while others are more general and IIRC teach a random skill in a skill category or spread a few points around.

That's not quite correct. First you need to find some mantras (a few are written on the walls at the first shrine you're likely to find, you can find others elsewhere). Then you go to a shrine, any shrine, and invoke a mantra of your choice. The effect only depends on the mantra (some spread around skill points among several skills, others give you a more focused boost to a single skill). It doesn't matter which shrine you use.

 

[xuerebx]

Don't know if this was posted before, but apparently someone has hacked mouse look and WASD control scheme (among other small things) into UW1 and UW2. Didn't have the chance to test it, though, so I don't know how well it works, if someone here tested it or has the chance to do it before me, please post some impressions ...

https://github.com/JohnGlassmyer/UltimaHacks

Got the mouse look patch + WASD movement up and running - it's fabulous! Not enough brofists for cocorulverde :D

 

[Spukrian]

I usually picked the Paladin. 30/18/12 S/D/I.

Paladin is one of the better classes, as it gives you a chance to get 30/18/12 (S/D/I)

Paladin is Med Dex, Low Int.

Druid is Low Dex, Med Int, IIRC.

Sorry for homing in on you dude, but this is incorrect. At least for UUW1. In the 1st game, Paladins can have a max strength of 24.

I figured out the starting stats of each class:

Fighter: S20 D16 I12
Mage: S12 D16 I20
Bard: S14 D20 I14
Tinker: S18 D18 I12
Druid: S18 D12 I18
Ranger: S16 D16 I16
Paladin: S12 D18 I18
Shepherd: S12 D12 I12

Everyonr gets 12 bonus points (except Shepherd who gets 20 bonus points), unfortunately the max stat at creation is 30, so you can't create a Fighter with Strength 32.

 

[Cael]

I usually picked the Paladin. 30/18/12 S/D/I.

Paladin is one of the better classes, as it gives you a chance to get 30/18/12 (S/D/I)

Paladin is Med Dex, Low Int.

Druid is Low Dex, Med Int, IIRC.

Sorry for homing in on you dude, but this is incorrect. At least for UUW1. In the 1st game, Paladins can have a max strength of 24.

I figured out the starting stats of each class:

Fighter: S20 D16 I12
Mage: S12 D16 I20
Bard: S14 D20 I14
Tinker: S18 D18 I12
Druid: S18 D12 I18
Ranger: S16 D16 I16
Paladin: S12 D18 I18
Shepherd: S12 D12 I12

Everyonr gets 12 bonus points (except Shepherd who gets 20 bonus points), unfortunately the max stat at creation is 30, so you can't create a Fighter with Strength 32.

You are absolutely wrong. In UW1, you can easily get 30/18/12 or 30/12/18 depending on which class you choose (Paladin or Druid). I have done it before many times. In UW2, it is much harder. I think the highest I have seen is 29 in a stat, although personally, I have only gone to 28.

 

[Spukrian]

You are absolutely wrong. In UW1, you can easily get 30/18/12 or 30/12/18 depending on which class you choose (Paladin or Druid). I have done it before many times. In UW2, it is much harder. I think the highest I have seen is 29 in a stat, although personally, I have only gone to 28.

I think you're misremembering. First read the relevant info on the wiki:
https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/wiki/Character_creation_in_the_Underworld_games

Stats in UW1 aren't random. They follow a "track" so to speak (maybe it's an algorithm?). If you create 20 fighters and quit the game, then restart and create 20 fighters again you'll see that the 1st fighter after restart has identical stats to the 1st fighter before quitting, and it goes on and on...

There are three tracks:
1. Paladin, Druid, Bard, Ranger and Tinker. In other words, if the 1st character you create is a druid it will always have S23 D13 I24, then if you quit and restart and make a Paladin as the 1st character it will have S17 D19 I24.
2. Fighter and Mage.
3. Shepherd.

The only way to "break" these "tracks" is if you create characters who use different tracks, this changes the algorithm I guess.

That said, different versions of UW1 might work differently.

 

[Cael]

You are absolutely wrong. In UW1, you can easily get 30/18/12 or 30/12/18 depending on which class you choose (Paladin or Druid). I have done it before many times. In UW2, it is much harder. I think the highest I have seen is 29 in a stat, although personally, I have only gone to 28.

I think you're misremembering. First read the relevant info on the wiki:
https://wiki.ultimacodex.com/wiki/Character_creation_in_the_Underworld_games

Stats in UW1 aren't random. They follow a "track" so to speak (maybe it's an algorithm?). If you create 20 fighters and quit the game, then restart and create 20 fighters again you'll see that the 1st fighter after restart has identical stats to the 1st fighter before quitting, and it goes on and on...

There are three tracks:
1. Paladin, Druid, Bard, Ranger and Tinker. In other words, if the 1st character you create is a druid it will always have S23 D13 I24, then if you quit and restart and make a Paladin as the 1st character it will have S17 D19 I24.
2. Fighter and Mage.
3. Shepherd.

The only way to "break" these "tracks" is if you create characters who use different tracks, this changes the algorithm I guess.

That said, different versions of UW1 might work differently.

It is likely a XOR pseudo-random code. I use to make those for fun back in my uni days.

And no, I only play with 30/12/18 or 30/18/12. The carry limit is and always will be my biggest bugbear, so a Str of 30 is mandatory. I do tend to chose Druid over Paladin because Lore is better than a weapon skill at the beginning, and higher Int is more useful to me than Dex.

 

[Spukrian]

It is likely a XOR pseudo-random code. I use to make those for fun back in my uni days.

Ok, cool.

And no, I only play with 30/12/18 or 30/18/12. The carry limit is and always will be my biggest bugbear, so a Str of 30 is mandatory. I do tend to chose Druid over Paladin because Lore is better than a weapon skill at the beginning, and higher Int is more useful to me than Dex.

If you have the game installed right now, could you perhaps create a Paladin with 30/18/12 (or at least with strength higher than 24) and screenshot it? If you do I'll admit that I'm wrong.

 

[Cael]

It is likely a XOR pseudo-random code. I use to make those for fun back in my uni days.

Ok, cool.

And no, I only play with 30/12/18 or 30/18/12. The carry limit is and always will be my biggest bugbear, so a Str of 30 is mandatory. I do tend to chose Druid over Paladin because Lore is better than a weapon skill at the beginning, and higher Int is more useful to me than Dex.

If you have the game installed right now, could you perhaps create a Paladin with 30/18/12 (or at least with strength higher than 24) and screenshot it? If you do I'll admit that I'm wrong.

Firstly, whether you admit you are right or wrong is really no skin off my nose.

Secondly, your linked page doesn't actually say anything about UW1. The only numbers it has is for UW2 (which you have posted as UW1 numbers). In fact, it outright states that the numbers for UW1 is unknown.

I have no clue as to why you'd even think you are correct, when it is very obvious you have not played the game.


Oh, and by the by, the page you linked to extracted all of its information directly from the manuals. It even replicated the UW1 manual's mistake of Paladins having a low Str.

 

[Spukrian]

Firstly, whether you admit you are right or wrong is really no skin off my nose.

Ok, cool.

Secondly, your linked page doesn't actually say anything about UW1. The only numbers it has is for UW2 (which you have posted as UW1 numbers). In fact, it outright states that the numbers for UW1 is unknown.

Except I posted the numbers in my first post. I figured them by making 100 or so characters.

Also if you look at the page you would see that it says plain as a day that Paladins have low/high/high in UW1.

I have no clue as to why you'd even think you are correct, when it is very obvious you have not played the game.

I'm playing the game right now, however I suffer from Chronic Restarter Syndrome. I haven't gotten further than level 3, yet.

 

[Cael]

Firstly, whether you admit you are right or wrong is really no skin off my nose.

Ok, cool.

Secondly, your linked page doesn't actually say anything about UW1. The only numbers it has is for UW2 (which you have posted as UW1 numbers). In fact, it outright states that the numbers for UW1 is unknown.

Except I posted the numbers in my first post. I figured them by making 100 or so characters.

Also if you look at the page you would see that it says plain as a day that Paladins have low/high/high in UW1.

I have no clue as to why you'd even think you are correct, when it is very obvious you have not played the game.

I'm playing the game right now, however I suffer from Chronic Restarter Syndrome. I haven't gotten further than level 3, yet.

You are talking to someone who has completed the game dozens of times, and first played it when it first came out. But you still insist you are correct, because of course you will, zoomer.

And if you have restarted that many times with a Paladin as you claimed, you'd know for sure the manual is incorrect with regards to Paladins being low/high/high.

 

[Spukrian]

From my point of view low/high/high corresponds well with my experience with the game. FWIW I made about 20 paladins.

I only see two possible scenarios:
1. You suffer from dementia due to old age.
2. You never patched the game after buying it.

I feel scenario 1 is the most likely.

 

[Cael]

From my point of view low/high/high corresponds well with my experience with the game. FWIW I made about 20 paladins.

I only see two possible scenarios:
1. You suffer from dementia due to old age.
2. You never patched the game after buying it.

I feel scenario 1 is the most likely.

Yes. Your experience, which consists of you never passing 3rd level.

The hilarious part is that the know nothing zoomer twat feels that his ego is somehow hurt when he is told he is wrong about a game he had never played.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Shut it, Cael. Spukrian isn't wrong.

I just installed UUW1 (GOG installer) and created dozens of Paladins. The highest STR-score I ever saw was 24.

Then I dug up a zipfile of the game from an old PC Game-megacollection and installed that. I never saw a higher STR-score than 23, but I did see DEX reach 30 once.

Unfortunately the third version I have, containing the pure install files, refuses to install the game, so I can't test this with a fresh and potentially unpatched UUW1.

Now this doesn't mean Cael is wrong either - all signs points to the UUW1-patch being the possible culprit. The problem is finding an unpatched copy of the game to finally test this... and honestly I can't be bothered to dig up my disks.

Source: Someone who bought the game in September 1992 (and still owns it) and had to wait three more months until he had a computer that could run it, and has played (and beaten) the game regularly and extensively on a regular basis since then.

EDIT: Checked another source. I have a version 'vF1.51S', but I don't know whether that's the patched version or not. Gonna give it a try.

EDIT 2: The above version has the original release date for the game (March 1992) so there's a high chance it's the unpatched version. AND it has the installer files, and they successfully installed the game. So I ran the Paladin-test... and never got a STR-value above 23.

 

[Sinatar]

Spukrian is correct.

 

[Arrowgrab]

The conversation in this thread over the last couple of days made me reinstall UUW1 and 2 again, with the intention of another playthrough, but I encountered a problem.

I'm using the GOG version, patched with the JohnGlassmyer/UltimaHacks hacks, which add mouselook, standard WASD movement and some other quality-of-like modifications. The problem is that if I Alt-Tab out of the game then Alt-Tab back again, the mouse cursor goes absolutely berserk. It starts quickly swinging left and right across the screen. Actually moving the mouse adds to the movement (so if I pull it straight down, the motion will become left/right plus down), but the cursor will continue swinging after I release the mouse. Opening the options icon/F1 returns cursor movement to normal, but only as long as the options menu is open. I think it already started happening before I installed the hack, so that's probably not the reason.

Any idea how to fix this?

 

[Denim Destroyer]

Just to let you know that problem isn't caused by the patches as I faced the same issue with both Underworld games. If I remember correctly using alt+enter to quickly go into windowed mode then back into fullscreen will fix it.

 

[Cael]

Shut it, Cael. Spukrian isn't wrong.

I just installed UUW1 (GOG installer) and created dozens of Paladins. The highest STR-score I ever saw was 24.

Then I dug up a zipfile of the game from an old PC Game-megacollection and installed that. I never saw a higher STR-score than 23, but I did see DEX reach 30 once.

Unfortunately the third version I have, containing the pure install files, refuses to install the game, so I can't test this with a fresh and potentially unpatched UUW1.

Now this doesn't mean Cael is wrong either - all signs points to the UUW1-patch being the possible culprit. The problem is finding an unpatched copy of the game to finally test this... and honestly I can't be bothered to dig up my disks.

Source: Someone who bought the game in September 1992 (and still owns it) and had to wait three more months until he had a computer that could run it, and has played (and beaten) the game regularly and extensively on a regular basis since then.

EDIT: Checked another source. I have a version 'vF1.51S', but I don't know whether that's the patched version or not. Gonna give it a try.

EDIT 2: The above version has the original release date for the game (March 1992) so there's a high chance it's the unpatched version. AND it has the installer files, and they successfully installed the game. So I ran the Paladin-test... and never got a STR-value above 23.

Then what do you call this, you fucking retard? He said this was impossible.

This is why you don't let fucking zoomers and millennials play old games. They will always fuck it up with their feels and sjw shit.

 

[Invictus]

Shut it, Cael. Spukrian isn't wrong.

I just installed UUW1 (GOG installer) and created dozens of Paladins. The highest STR-score I ever saw was 24.

Then I dug up a zipfile of the game from an old PC Game-megacollection and installed that. I never saw a higher STR-score than 23, but I did see DEX reach 30 once.

Unfortunately the third version I have, containing the pure install files, refuses to install the game, so I can't test this with a fresh and potentially unpatched UUW1.

Now this doesn't mean Cael is wrong either - all signs points to the UUW1-patch being the possible culprit. The problem is finding an unpatched copy of the game to finally test this... and honestly I can't be bothered to dig up my disks.

Source: Someone who bought the game in September 1992 (and still owns it) and had to wait three more months until he had a computer that could run it, and has played (and beaten) the game regularly and extensively on a regular basis since then.

EDIT: Checked another source. I have a version 'vF1.51S', but I don't know whether that's the patched version or not. Gonna give it a try.

EDIT 2: The above version has the original release date for the game (March 1992) so there's a high chance it's the unpatched version. AND it has the installer files, and they successfully installed the game. So I ran the Paladin-test... and never got a STR-value above 23.

Then what do you call this, you fucking retard? He said this was impossible.

This is why you don't let fucking zoomers and millennials play old games. They will always fuck it up with their feels and sjw shit.

That “Dumbfuck” tag is well earned Cael; so you were right and now have won the internetz... fuck off and be merry with your aggressive bullshit

 

[Cael]

Shut it, Cael. Spukrian isn't wrong.

I just installed UUW1 (GOG installer) and created dozens of Paladins. The highest STR-score I ever saw was 24.

Then I dug up a zipfile of the game from an old PC Game-megacollection and installed that. I never saw a higher STR-score than 23, but I did see DEX reach 30 once.

Unfortunately the third version I have, containing the pure install files, refuses to install the game, so I can't test this with a fresh and potentially unpatched UUW1.

Now this doesn't mean Cael is wrong either - all signs points to the UUW1-patch being the possible culprit. The problem is finding an unpatched copy of the game to finally test this... and honestly I can't be bothered to dig up my disks.

Source: Someone who bought the game in September 1992 (and still owns it) and had to wait three more months until he had a computer that could run it, and has played (and beaten) the game regularly and extensively on a regular basis since then.

EDIT: Checked another source. I have a version 'vF1.51S', but I don't know whether that's the patched version or not. Gonna give it a try.

EDIT 2: The above version has the original release date for the game (March 1992) so there's a high chance it's the unpatched version. AND it has the installer files, and they successfully installed the game. So I ran the Paladin-test... and never got a STR-value above 23.

Then what do you call this, you fucking retard? He said this was impossible.

This is why you don't let fucking zoomers and millennials play old games. They will always fuck it up with their feels and sjw shit.

That “Dumbfuck” tag is well earned Cael; so you were right and now have won the internetz... fuck off and be merry with your aggressive bullshit

Some fucking zoomer comes in here, starts throwing accusations, argues the impossible, tries to impose his shit on others, and telling him that he is a fuckwit is somehow a bad thing.

This is why we have Biden as President of the US, Big Tech taking over and why we don't have good RPG any more. In fact, ANY good games any more. Fucking zoomers and millennials should be retroactively aborted.