Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[Jason Liang]

Just to clarify, mana regen not only factors in starting class, but race, piety and vitality as well. You should have characters that meet the piety+vitality threshold.

 

[gman42]

Starting out with hybrid classes in Wiz 7 may not be such a good idea, since they both level slower and gain less of those oh so precious (magic at least) skill points than base classes.

Yep, but for a true and hardcore min-maxer(tm) added difficulty in very early game doesn't matter, only the end result does. Don't ask me why, its' how min-maxing logic works. Besides, it doesn't really matter in the long run because in Wizardry 7 (and I assume probably in 6 as well) you can level and re-level low levels over and over by changing classes practically ad infinitum, using one of the infinite enemy respawning points in early game. In consequence you can have as much spell points and skill points as your patience and sanity allows. Again, all this assuming you're into this kind of abuse of the system. What you cannot get trough grind is the mana regen rates though, those are set when choosing your first class.
On the other hand if you don't want to grind skill and spell points that way, then going spell caster -> class with ninjutsu -> final class is probably not a bad idea. Still, min-maxed but without all the grind. But on yet another hand spell points recovery rate is not THAT important iirc, so it's all a moot point.

Yeah I definitely would rather get the class changing done early and stack up those levels, I feel like it makes such a huge difference with the saving throws against tough enemies' spells/criticals/etc. What's the point of having lots of 100 skills if an instant death spell still has a 50/50 chance of taking you out, ya know?

This became very evident in Wiz6, when I started grinding through the temple a bunch of times after winning the game, just to try to find all the rare items (this is when the game first came out so there was no item list online or any editors yet). It was an enormous pain in the ass the first few times through, then suddenly I realized I was becoming basically immune to all the "fuck you" spells that everyone would throw at you. Eventually it became a "hold down enter" fest where I didn't have to bother with any strategy. Not as much fun but satisfying in its own way.

 

[gman42]

Just to clarify, mana regen not only factors in starting class, but race, piety and vitality as well. You should have characters that meet the piety+vitality threshold.

Right, I'd be sure to max VIT and STR when creating the characters in Wiz6 to get around the limitations with MP regen and CC (piety apparently only controls the regen rate in Wiz7+). Still trying to figure out race combos, mostly just avoiding ones where I'd risk dropping really low in certain stats during the early class changing and getting stuck. Although with ninja as the intermediate class, I guess personality would be the only one I'd have to worry about dropping through the floor.

 

[Roqua]

Good that you are not sure then because you're incorrect. Spell point recovery rate is set when you make the character and so it depends on your first class. That's why for pure min-maxing starting with caster classes with additional stat points then immediately switching to hybrid classes (for better hp and hit chances per level than with casters, and of curse for skills, especially ninjutsu) is a good strategy. At least this is how it works in W7, which means with 99% probability that it works the same in W6.
All assuming you want to min-max like crazy of curse.

The question was, does it carry over from Wiz6 to Wiz7. When I carried a party over from 6 to 7 it didn't seem like anything but their current class at the end of 7 mattered. Again, I don't know for certain, but I felt gipped with how truncated thinks felt and how items carried over and I would be surprised if it counted all classes and magic regen from 6 for a transported party in to 7.

The question of his I was clearly replying to was -

--When I import to Wiz7 does MP regen value carry over from 6, or does it get set again based on current class? I just remember spell point recovery being super painful in that game.

 

[Wizfall]

Wizfast is outdated, use Faster Combat by Kaucukovnik (it's simply awesome).
Faster combat :

• All monster animations speed increased
• Velocity of all conventional projectiles greatly increased
• Rockets fly twice as fast
• Poison Spit and Stinger Thorn sped up, as they are extensively used by monsters encountered in large groups

-spells untouched (never bothered me)
-speed of party members' melee attacks untouched, probably hardcoded
http://www.mediafire.com/file/yhfg5fkz16ijyj5/Wiz8_Faster_Combat.exe

 

[Roqua]

I found this in a Wizardry 6 FAQ here - https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/564807-wizardry-vi-bane-of-the-cosmic-forge/faqs/63361

So it looks like I was right

Mana regeneration in Wizardry VII will actually adjust during the game upon
class changes and adjust to statistics when you level up, so while your current
class does affect mana regeneration upon transfer, it is not a major long-term
consideration.

 

[Serus]

I found this in a Wizardry 6 FAQ here - https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/pc/564807-wizardry-vi-bane-of-the-cosmic-forge/faqs/63361

So it looks like I was right

Mana regeneration in Wizardry VII will actually adjust during the game upon
class changes and adjust to statistics when you level up, so while your current
class does affect mana regeneration upon transfer, it is not a major long-term
consideration.

Interesting, it basically says that mana regen is recalculated when leveling up in Wizardry 7 which I was always pretty certain is not the case.
http://www.abandonia.com/vbullet/showpost.php?p=420843&postcount=236

- the mana regeneration rate is set at creation, gaining levels, improving stats or switching class afterwards won't change it

Both can't be right.

One would need to check it in game looking at the saves before and after a class change/level up to verify but I'm too lazy to do it.

 

[gman42]

Anybody ever determine exactly what effect Karma has? I originally thought it might weave its way into a bunch of different calculations like the old Wiz1-5 Luck stat, but if that were the case it wouldn't really be fair that it's fixed at creation (yeah I know you can raise it with Ankhs eventually).

 

[octavius]

Finally completed the three towers in Wizardry Gaiden IV, and I'm now exploring the Ancient Cave. I get a strange sense of Deja Vu from this dungeon...

 

[Curratum]

So, uh, guys... Wizardry 8 has been sitting in my libraries for the longest time and I kinda want to give it a go, but I'm a little hesitant about it.

How is the story / interactions / narrative / exploration vs combat mix? Watching Youtube gameplay, I get the impression that a good 75-80% of the game is relatively slow-paced, long battles and I'm not too hot for that.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

It's incline

 

[Tito Anic]

I get the impression that a good 75-80% of the game is relatively slow-paced, long battles and I'm not too hot for that.

Last time i played it, 15 years ago - it was like that.

 

[gman42]

Yeah the story/puzzles/NPCs are decent, and treated as more than just "flavor", but also squarely in the minority of the game. There are utilities that you can run so you're not staring at your watch waiting for animations to finish during battle, which makes it a little less obnoxious. But if you're not into primarily building your characters and watching them get stronger, it might not be your thing.

 

[octavius]

Just completed Wizardry Gaiden IV, my first venture into the world of Japanese Wizardry.

So how does it compare with the American Wizardries?

The main difference is that the combat is easier.
I had no party deaths, and only lost one character. Combat was only challenging the last 3-4 dungeon levels.
Balance was overall a bit off, especially when starting to face lvl 1 monsters again in the penultimate dungeon.

Visually it was very pleasing with no anime and only a few cute characters, and with some nice animations.

The encounter design was a bit poorer due partly to me not being able to relate to most of the Japanese names, and the inclusion of enemies like squids, crabs and fish on dry land. But I liked that the furry races were included amongst the enemies, and enemy figher types could be of any race, for example.

Level design was very good in the first three dungeons, with hard puzzles and a decent amount of NPC to react with. The only downside is that the levels were of predictable size and shape, unlike Wiz 5.
The two final dungeons were of poorer quality and much more straightforward, with four or so level lifted directly from Wiz 1, and three levels containing a rather annoying "Mandala" puzzle (I used the walkthrough for that one).

Overall a worthy Wizardry game indeed, and I think I'll rate it above Wiz 2 and 3 at least.

EDIT: forgot to mention that it has probably the best itemization of any Wizardry games I've played, with a large selection of items. The drops are scaled to the level of the monsters, but you only get items from fixed encounters.

 

[Max Heap]

I was thinking about getting into the Dark Savant Trilogy.
Carrying a party through three games seems pretty exciting and the first region in Wiz6 (which is the only bit of Wizardry I ever played) had a certain charm to it.

Anything I should know in particular or can I just read the manual?

 

[Darth Roxor]

Anything I should know in particular or can I just read the manual?

Apart from RTFM, you should know that thieves are terrible and should never be used, and that you should try to clench your buttocks and go through some of the more bullshit 5x5 enemy encounters instead of savescumming till you get scrublords - otherwise you won't be levelling enough and you'll have a very bad time later on, especially in the final dunjin.

 

[Covenant]

I was thinking about getting into the Dark Savant Trilogy.
Carrying a party through three games seems pretty exciting and the first region in Wiz6 (which is the only bit of Wizardry I ever played) had a certain charm to it.

Anything I should know in particular or can I just read the manual?

If you're starting with VI, bear in mind that your carrying capacity and mana regeneration are both fixed at the start of the game. So this means that you want to start with A) a decent amount of strength on all your characters and B) If you're planning on any of your characters ending up as casters (including hybrid casters), you might want to begin the game with them as pure casters with a decent amount of Piety and Int so that they have a half-decent mana regeneration rate. That said, it's not a huge deal. These bugs aren't present in VII or VIII, where things like your carrying capacity and mana regen update as your attributes change.

Other things to note:

Faeries can't equip most gear you find, so it would be unadvisable to make one a gear-dependant class like a Fighter or Samurai. They work much better as spellcasters, or Monks/Ninja. Starting with a Faerie Thief (with a high bonus roll) and class changing them into Ninja when you can is a popular way to go.

VI is more RNG than VII, and I wouldn't advise an Ironman attempt.

Try to make sure you have at least one character with access to Mage spells and one with access to Priest spells.

Bards can be very helpful in the early game, but lategame are (in my experience) better turned into a Ranger or something.

The final dungeons of both VI and VII are kinda bullshit with monsters much, much stronger than anything else in the game, but thankfully the dungeon in VI isn't too long and in VII it's just the final floor that you need to worry about.

There's a bug in Wizardry VII that pure Fighter characters take double damage from enemy weapons. This isn't that bad in the early game but it's advisable to switch your Fighters to Lords/Samurai/whatever as soon as you can.

The puzzles are generally rather fair and you shouldn't need to look up a guide for most of them. The exceptions that spring to mind are two endgame puzzles, one in VI and one in VII. In VI, there's an alternate ending route that's accessible right before you gain access to the last segment of the game. You're very unlikely to work out how to access that alternate route on your own. Also at the very end of VI, if you say a certain phrase you can get a bonus item that you import to the later two games in the trilogy. I've yet to see anyone offer any kind of reasonable explanation for how that phrase could be guessed by the player. It might as well be Shadow of the Beast II and its 'Ten pints'.

In VII, an endgame puzzle involves something called the Gaelin Stone. Similarly to the situation mentioned above, I've never found anyone offer an explanation for how the player could be expected to solve it, other than one walkthrough that makes an offhand mention of a clue that seems to not even exist in the game based on an examination of the files.

 

[octavius]

There are patches for some of the bugs in Wiz 6.

 

[Grauken]

The final dungeons of both VI and VII are kinda bullshit with monsters much, much stronger than anything else in the game, but thankfully the dungeon in VI isn't too long and in VII it's just the final floor that you need to worry about.

This strikes me as an odd sentiment, what did you expect to find on the final floor of any RPG if not the most hardcore monsters there are

 

[BEvers]

There are patches for some of the bugs in Wiz 6.

The SNES version is already fully patched, has better keyboard/gamepad controls, and looks better too. Savegame transfers are overrated anyway

 

[turkishronin]

Savegame transfers are overrated anyway

It's like the best thing in the entire trilogy

 

[Covenant]

The final dungeons of both VI and VII are kinda bullshit with monsters much, much stronger than anything else in the game, but thankfully the dungeon in VI isn't too long and in VII it's just the final floor that you need to worry about.

This strikes me as an odd sentiment, what did you expect to find on the final floor of any RPG if not the most hardcore monsters there are

It's a matter of degrees; I'm happy with the final floor being the hardest challenge of the game but I expect it to be a somewhat smooth curve rather than a cliff-edge, and it should still be balanced so that a well-prepared player playing intelligently should have a good measure of success. The areas in question here are difficult to the extent that it's pretty much a matter of 'Reload until the dice fall your way'. Which is fine, I guess, but I prefer the more consistent balance of the earlier areas. You could play through the whole of Wizardry 7 up to that floor without reloading, with a bit of luck, but good luck taking it to the end through those robot fuckers.

 

[gman42]

If you're starting with VI, bear in mind that your carrying capacity and mana regeneration are both fixed at the start of the game. So this means that you want to start with A) a decent amount of strength on all your characters and B) If you're planning on any of your characters ending up as casters (including hybrid casters), you might want to begin the game with them as pure casters with a decent amount of Piety and Int so that they have a half-decent mana regeneration rate. That said, it's not a huge deal. These bugs aren't present in VII or VIII, where things like your carrying capacity and mana regen update as your attributes change.

Important clarification to this: In Wiz6 for whatever reason they made vitality the controlling attribute for mana regen (PIE and INT control something like mana added at level-up and general spellcasting effectiveness IIRC). Specifically you want to give your characters 16 VIT to start to get a +1 bonus to each realm's regen. VIT also adds to CC (half the effect per point as STR though) so it helps on both fronts.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

but good luck taking it to the end through those robot fuckers.

You had to have been underleveled, I carved through those things like a whirlwind of death.

 

[Atomboy]

Lol for some reason I just noticed this post in that forum bar on the right, and spent an hour and a half reading the last 10 pages. So many sweet, sweet memories came back to me, as I read on. Wizardry is such a beautiful set of games. My favorite is still VI with VII coming up second. Everyone should at least try to play it! There's just so much mystery, and fun, and character development, fun battles and D.W. Bradley's crazy genius and style, and his weird fetishes, and the language he uses... I still remember the castle kitchen where "now it is time who became the chef, and the kitchen is it's meal" or something along those lines. What kind of a metaphor is this?! Time cooked the kitchen and ate it up?! I laughed for ten minutes straight and then became sad... And the silly bits with Snoopcheri the stuffed beagle that was also there for some reason and the moment you know that the Queen was into bondage and BDSM. And then you meet the voluptuous Amazulis, and there's that river part which constantly loops and then my party is wiped out. And those gray bricks which are supposed to be everything from trees to mountains to cave walls to pyramid walls really became all those things for me in the imagination. I don't even wanna play the sega neptune anime remix! All because it was a true high adventure! Where you dealt with tragedy, gathered treasures, fought yojimbos, saw the folly of hubris, broke walls by summoning fat rodents with cheese. Oof. And it's not even like these games imprinted on me as a child and that's why I like them, I first played VI when I was 24, and spoiled by thousands of titles. Still, it managed to conquer my heart, just like that one other game years later!

golden baby jazz-hands

Spoiler

lol as i typed this i suddenly remembered that my first attempt at game making was also a wiz clone :D what can show love better than an attempt to rip off the very thing you love?..