Wizardry The Wizardry Series Thread

[giantgnome]

Bishops are overpowered but I love them anyway. Reading the new posts made me start up another Wiz8 team. I took a Dracon thief and gave him bloodlust and the thieves dagger. He's now at level 14 and hits for about 140 or so damage at two different points in combat (3 swings with bloodlust at a time). If anything gets near him it's all over. The only downside is the cursed item aspect. Generally I don't use cursed items because of the inability to use ranged attacks. I hate my character sitting around doing nothing, but at least dracon breath helps with that.

Then I've got a Mook Ranger for the scouting and heavy ranged damage, elven bard whose use of the sirens wail and rousing drums is quite nice, human valk with the stun rod which I love for its chance of paralysis, faerie bishop who, at level 13, has about 60 skill in all 4 schools. I saved a lot of her picks and sold tons of potions to get as many spell books as possible. I keep checking for new ones. She has got crazy amounts of spell points and I just maxed out intelligence and piety.

Lastly I went with a faerie ninja for the first time in Wiz8. Cane of corpus is nice but I think my Dracon does more damage overall. That and the ninja goes after my dracon and by then usually everything around me is dead so he often wastes a turn which kind of sucks.

Anyway having a blast. I think this is the most fun I've had with a team. Thanks to whoever mentioned the dracon rogue with bloodlust and thieves dagger. That is a great combo.

 

[Shannow]

Just wanted to mention that my dracon fighter did similar dmg at that level and had a shield and heavy armor and could switch between ranged and melee

 

[giantgnome]

The not being able to switch to range does annoy me. Not wearing heavy armor isn't so big of a deal since stealth contributes to armor class. Stealth is at 78 right now. Unfortunately can't manually add to it anymore.I could add a shield but I like duel wielding even though I only seem to strike once or maybe twice with the offhand weapon. Still doing a total of around 300 damage a round is nice.

I think the one thing I'd do different is take a lizardman fighter instead of my ninja. But at this point my party is pretty overpowered anyway. I especially enjoy entering a battle with enemies who are at level 19 and having my dracon say, oh well, death awaits us all, and then four rounds later the enemies are all dead and I haven't been hit. But with armor shield, missile shield, bless and haste my ac is around 30. Not much gets through.

Lots of fun anyway. Wish there were more games like this out there.

 

[Gnidrologist]

I especially enjoy entering a battle with enemies who are at level 19 and having my dracon say, oh well, death awaits us all

I just love that voice sample.
Anyway, wanted to mention that training shield for stealth driven characters, some of whom would also get their DEX maxed out eventually and get Reflexion is just unnecessary waste of skill point. In all my parties the most invincible characters are always those who train in stealth, not the ones with more vitality and good armor class from armor/shield. High level rogue is even an overkill. They are just unreachable by anyone and they deal damage like the best fighters. I think the melee chars that benefits best from shields are the ones that aren't pure fighter types and thus may suffer high damage often. Like bards, for instance. I gave Saxx the *light shield* last time around and that really made him much more comfortable in intense melee fights.
The same as above goes with lizardmen fighters. Next time around i will certainly make a one that does dual wield. I feel that with their incredibly high VIT that gets maxed out and thus Ironskin at early levels (the same as with strength) they're practically the most survivable chars there can be (i had a fight once where all my party was wasted by some geo/whaever-mancers and their elementals and this liz was only one who survived even though disabled several times and still managed to finish off these pesky mages and their summons in the end; nice XP for him) and wasting point of shield seems just.. wasteful. They would be better off either dual wielding or using some awesome two-hander (like the sword of four winds that you can acquire early if lucky on drop list).

 

[DraQ]

Bishops are overpowered but I love them anyway. Reading the new posts made me start up another Wiz8 team. I took a Dracon thief and gave him bloodlust and the thieves dagger. He's now at level 14 and hits for about 140 or so damage at two different points in combat (3 swings with bloodlust at a time). If anything gets near him it's all over. The only downside is the cursed item aspect. Generally I don't use cursed items because of the inability to use ranged attacks. I hate my character sitting around doing nothing, but at least dracon breath helps with that.

That was part of the point - since rogues don't cast and since cursed weapons prevent switching, might as well take the only race that can still do something at this point. That it's a durable, heavy-hitting race that also gets decent rogue stat scores only makes it better. And you can always go for artefacts or thrown bombs to supplement your breath weapon.

One thing you really, really, REALLY don't want to happen to such character, though, is insanity. Or turncoat.

Use protective items guarding against mental magic and keep those defensive spells up at all time - having the rest of your party murderized for 300HP/turn is guaranteed to be a traumatic experience.

Thanks to whoever mentioned the dracon rogue with bloodlust and thieves dagger. That is a great combo.

I especially enjoy entering a battle with enemies who are at level 19 and having my dracon say, oh well, death awaits us all

I just love that voice sample.

He seems to be a kind, generous soul.




...
I *hate* him.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

I always loved taking the odd eccentric characters voices. So fucking good. And that one female voice: This reminds me of my first marriage. Alot of aimless wandering and the occasional big fight. Coming from my female Dracon Bard it's fucking hilarious.

 

[DraQ]

I always loved taking the odd eccentric characters voices. So fucking good. And that one female voice: This reminds me of my first marriage. Alot of aimless wandering and the occasional big fight. Coming from my female Dracon Bard it's fucking hilarious.

And that's why I have never played Wiz8 with reduced party.

 

[Daniel Valiente]

Hey guys, the last few hours of playing (and a defeated party) have left me wondering about the difficulty in Wizardry 8. What are the factors determining the strength and number of those random spawns? Is it only the average party level, the combined levels of the party, or something else? I generally think of Wizardry 8 as of a fairly easy game if you don't make a particularly crazy party like six thieves or something like that.
But my latest game has shaken my belief somewhat. Take these instances... and I had 3 fighters, 2 gadgeteers, and 1 bishop. Later — Sparkle and Madras.
1. Lower Monastery. When I got to Gregor, he was accompanied by a random spawn of 6 roaches. It was rather difficult. Had to use a resurrection powder.
2. Upper Monastery. A fight against 22 creeps (8 rabid rats, 8 gnawer rats, and 6 Higardi bandits). Rabid rats are hell at this stage, with their two attacks and the conditions from them.
3. Road to Arnika. Two successive fights with bunches of hardshell crabs.
4. Northern Wilderness. The first thing my level 5-6 party saw there was a level 9 swallower. Nice.
5. Road to Arnika. Two groups of level 9 Trynnie outcasts, whom I haven't seen in probably years.
6. Swamp. Now this just killed me. The first fight was against 9 swarming wasps. You can say that in was no big deal, but this time they surrounded me in one turn, paralysed nearly everybody at once, and I lost a few PCs. Managed to resurrect them, though.
The second fight. Steelhide, and a few turns later an ant queen (who drove EVERYONE she attacked insane), 14 soldiers. Later, 9 level 13 mosquitoes joined the fun. I had to retreat, and in two turns I had only 1 fighter left of all the party. "I CRUSH!" I positioned myself in such a way that they could attack me from two sides only, and resurrected everyone, and won the fight by the slightest of margins. Used up a lot of resurrection powders and restoration potions.
7. Marten's Bluff. A simulaneous attack of 5 mauligators + 5 deathsting apuses (who dealt 4 critical hits in one combat!) finished my party. Game over.

Now, I know that it's not about the Expert difficulty settings, as that only affects the enemies' Attack and AC, as I have read in an interview with Ian and Linda Currie. So what in the name of holy fuck was all that? A fast levelling-up party (6 no-magic guys, 1 hybrid, one elite), 200K of gold in my purse, top equipment available at that point, or what?

I'll probably replay with the same party, and see what happens. Meanwhile, any ideas as to what determines the spawns' strength (and luck as in the case with deathsting apuses)?

 

[DraQ]

Now, I know that it's not about the Expert difficulty settings, as that only affects the enemies' Attack and AC

I think it also affects resistances, and various success rolls.

Also, do you cast Armorplate, Missile Shield, Magic Screen and Enchanted Blade immediately after resting?

Because three fighters are rather extreme when it comes to adding tanking and heavy hitting power to the party. I've never used more than one pure fighter, actually, supplemented by some hybrid, rogue or bard, or maybe some sturdier caster like priest.

 

[Daniel Valiente]

Also, do you cast Armorplate, Missile Shield, Magic Screen and Enchanted Blade immediately after resting?

I do. (Sounds like I'm getting married...)

Because three fighters are rather extreme when it comes to adding tanking and heavy hitting power to the party.

I know, it's just I was intentionally going for an overkill with this particular party. My intent was dealing heavy damage in melee, as well as in ranged combat, the down side being only one caster in the group (Sparkle doesn't count).

 

[DraQ]

Also, do you cast Armorplate, Missile Shield, Magic Screen and Enchanted Blade immediately after resting?

I do. (Sounds like I'm getting married...)

Because three fighters are rather extreme when it comes to adding tanking and heavy hitting power to the party.

I know, it's just I was intentionally going for an overkill with this particular party. My intent was dealing heavy damage in melee, as well as in ranged combat, the down side being only one caster in the group (Sparkle doesn't count).

But that should make you rather resistant to melee attackers (though maybe not necessarily weak swarmers, but in Monastery, for example you need to fuck up pretty hard to get swarmed since there are so many potential choke points there). Lack of casters can indeed make you weak against multiple attackers, but you had two gadgeteers, as well (overkill IMO, unless you're really bent on using each and every gadget all the time), plus Madras, so by the time you left Trynton you should be able to manage your swarms with hypnotic lures from lava lamp.

 

[Daniel Valiente]

in Monastery, for example you need to fuck up pretty hard to get swarmed since there are so many potential choke points there).

I did stand in a choke point there. My point was that 22 enemies (8 of which are quite tough for that party level) is a bit too much.

you had two gadgeteers, as well (overkill IMO, unless you're really bent on using each and every gadget all the time) plus Madras, so by the time you left Trynton you should be able to manage your swarms with hypnotic lures from lava lamp

Well, I just love seeing a gadgeteer make 4-6 shots per round, dealing 10-15 damage with each shot and possibly knocking out/blinding the enemy around level 14. And yes, I was going to use gadgets to the fullest.
I did order one of the guys to use a lava lamp, but she was paralyzed before she could do anything. Just like nearly everyone else. Those swarming wasps may be weak, but they sure are fast.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Was your bishop able to cast insanity? Because that's what i always do in swarmed situations and all these bugs are thin skinned against mental spells. The same goes with any kind of gators and basically most animal/plant types. Gators would basically rip each other apart given their humongous damage and wasps would paralyze/poison each other. It give a lot of time to take them out in more calm environment.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

The best crowd control spells for the most part (for the MOST part remember) come from the psionic school. Insanity, sleep, and all that jazz is fucking phenominal against the swarmers.

 

[DraQ]

in Monastery, for example you need to fuck up pretty hard to get swarmed since there are so many potential choke points there).

I did stand in a choke point there. My point was that 22 enemies (8 of which are quite tough for that party level) is a bit too much.

When you have a choke point and some crowd control, enemy numbers are your strength.

I did order one of the guys to use a lava lamp, but she was paralyzed before she could do anything.

That's why lures should be pre-placed before the actual battle starts. Swarming wasps are not seekers or anything, they're fast, but don't sneak up on you.

Insanity

Oh, yeah.

Sleep, though, is difficult to work with - you'll do best arranging your characters so that the instakillers act first, then sleep-maker, then melee in order of decreasing hit power then rangers/AOE spellcasters. At the very well this should the party order (as it determines order of actions after move command), at best - the order of descending initiative. Fuckload of hassle.

 

[Gnidrologist]

lol

 

[Major_Blackhart]

WTF is that?

 

[Gnidrologist]

I went into Mountain Wilderness retro dungeon after had already completed it and gained some levels (21 or 22 i guess) and these appeared as random spawns. Guess it's some kind of joke by devs. Maybe alluding to archaic graphics of the first dungeon crawlers.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Never friggin saw those before. Christ I love this game.

 

[sirfink]

... and I had 3 fighters, 2 gadgeteers, and 1 bishop.

Why 2 gadgeteers? Dividing up the gadgets among them? I don't get that. Why not a bard or something? With both instruments and gadgets, you can cover most of the buffs and do a lot of area effect stuff too.

 

[Daniel Valiente]

Guess it's some kind of joke by devs. Maybe alluding to archaic graphics of the first dungeon crawlers.

It's alluding to WIz 1-4, I think, and maybe even a couple of games after them.

 

[DraQ]

Seriously? You guys have never seen the CKubes?
:/


Also, good (if a bit obvious) 2 class bishop school division - elementalist (Wiz,Alc) vs mentalist (Div, Psi). Mentalist ignores earth magic if you have gadgeteer or hybrid and can do without Armorplate 'till swamp.

Drawbacks include only one elemental.


Finally, yeah, 2 gadgeteers are rather pointless - bard would be much better, or Ranger if you want maximized ranged potential.

 

[Gnidrologist]

I can see the point in having two gadgies just like, say, two bards. The only time i played with one there was such a huge amount of gadgets, that i could only use 1/3 of them at any given time. They're also p. heavy and eat up stamina even faster than instruments, so it makes sense to spread them around two guys.

 

[DraQ]

I can see the point in having two gadgies just like, say, two bards. The only time i played with one there was such a huge amount of gadgets, that i could only use 1/3 of them at any given time. They're also p. heavy and eat up stamina even faster than instruments, so it makes sense to spread them around two guys.

I'd just rely on good ol' stamina-restoration gear and spells, plus pick those gadgets or instruments that are needed the most and can't be used before battle - 8 slots is not that few.

In any case 2 bards or 2 gadgeteers pale in comparison with one of each.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Love a gadgeteer but I found that alot of the time, they don't start being awesomesauce until much later levels. They really are a special type that requires a good amount of patience and diligence (to find parts). Though lets face it I love tripleshot crossbows.