Company News Tim Cain joins MCA over at Obsidian Entertainment

[Excidium]

Are you sure you want Arcanum 2?

 

[Jaesun]

If Activision approached Obsidian with the idea of Arcanum 2 that would be awesome, provided it still is a turn-based/real time engine with stats and skills.

Not a Yet Another Shitty Action Game Labeled A RPG With Little Or No RPG Elements™.

 

[Excidium]

Not a Yet Another Shitty Action Game Labeled A RPG With Little Or No RPG Elements™.

Which is exactly what it would be.

 

[Jaesun]

Not a Yet Another Shitty Action Game Labeled A RPG With Little Or No RPG Elements™.

Which is exactly what it would be.

It's Obsidian, always releasing the same crap as everyone else but with better writing.

The things is I'm certain Obsidian WOULD love to do a proper cRPG, but no Publisher on Earth is going to ask them to make one (Publishers think they do not sell well enough as apposed to shitty action rpg #79824692834762). Or possibly the Publisher that finally gets the D&D rights might want to make a proper cRPG like say a Neverwinter Nights 3. Or something similar. But I doubt it. Look at the last D&D game done by Atari.

Obsidian trapped within it's "Publisher" model of business is what they are stuck with. Unlike indies (like AoD, KotC, Frayed Knights etc...).

 

[Excidium]

Yeah, I know. But they're locked with publishers because they want, it's no excuse...

 

[Metro]

Exactly. And while I don't begrudge them the right to earn a living at some point you stop being a 'good' developer if such reputation is based on purely hypothetical circumstances/potential.

 

[Jaesun]

Yeah, I know. But they're locked with publishers because they want, it's no excuse...

Since I do not do Obsidian's Financial Statements, generally it is not financially feasible to use resources to work on a project with no publisher and receiving no funding, like (a beginning) indie can do. I doubt they can afford that (especially with the way the hire then lay off employees once a project is completed). Like *most* other Development studios also do.

They are making enough by taking offers from Publishers that want shitty action games, and at least trying to introduce some classic cRPG elements (see New Vegas). That is about all they can do. The only other thing they ARE free to do is tell good/decent stories. Additionally, with the one interview with MCA, there was vague mention on how Publishers demand certain things when they are working on a game (as in Make us a game with ACTION! Kids LOVE action! OMG Action!!!).

If they were smart (and have the finances to do so) fund a type of R&D branch of Obsidian doing their own type of game they they want to do. Now that they have their own Onyx Engine done (and paid for). But Art and other resources are still a bit expensive.

 

[Excidium]

I understand, but like Metro said:

And while I don't begrudge them the right to earn a living at some point you stop being a 'good' developer if such reputation is based on purely hypothetical circumstances/potential.

 

[Esquilax]

Yeah, I know. But they're locked with publishers because they want, it's no excuse...

Please, like developers have any real choice in the matter - the publishers hold all the money, so they've got you by the balls. I'm not sure what you'd suggest as an alternative. The industry as a whole is fucked, so you have to go with the flow unless you are an indie. It's a systematic problem, so you can't really reduce it to "well, it's their choice to lock themselves in with publishers" because it's pretty clear that they'd go out of business.

 

[Davaris]

Please, like developers have any real choice in the matter - the publishers hold all the money,

They are not trapped (unless they have dependents). They could make an RPG any time they like. They can walk away/take a break from the industry like Brian Mitsoda did. As you say, the industry will never allow anyone to make a RPG. Those days are gone.

 

[Roguey]

Since I do not do Obsidian's Financial Statements, generally it is not financially feasible to use resources to work on a project with no publisher and receiving no funding, like (a beginning) indie can do. I doubt they can afford that (especially with the way the hire then lay off employees once a project is completed). Like *most* other Development studios also do.

Their upcoming downloadable action RPG is self-funded. Feargus isn't your friend.

http://web.archive.org/web/200409100631 ... p9_01.html
GS: Are games that feature only turn-based combat "dead"? Do you think any RPG you produce will need some form of real-time combat, at least as an option (in spite of the fact that a lot of fans of the Fallout series loved the turn-based combat)?

FU: Dead? I think that has to do with the available time people have, more than any other reason. People need to get through combat quickly, and turn-based combat can drag things along. Turn-based combat is fine if there are three turns. I get frustrated in Wizardry 8, spending four turns just to get to the creatures I want to fight and then spending a long time in battle--sad to say, I just don't feel like I have time for all that, and I think a lot of gamers feel the same way.

GS: And yet turn-based strategy games, like Civilization III, still seem to have a viable market.

FU: That's true because you're not waiting. Except for very short periods of time, you're always in control of the game. In a role-playing game, since you're playing the heroes, your party members will typically be fighting twice as many monsters, and you'll have to wait for all of those enemies to take their turns.

 

[Jaesun]

Their upcoming downloadable action RPG is self-funded.

Is that MCA's rumored XBox game?

Feargus isn't your friend.

http://web.archive.org/web/200409100631 ... p9_01.html
GS: Are games that feature only turn-based combat "dead"? Do you think any RPG you produce will need some form of real-time combat, at least as an option (in spite of the fact that a lot of fans of the Fallout series loved the turn-based combat)?

FU: Dead? I think that has to do with the available time people have, more than any other reason. People need to get through combat quickly, and turn-based combat can drag things along. Turn-based combat is fine if there are three turns. I get frustrated in Wizardry 8, spending four turns just to get to the creatures I want to fight and then spending a long time in battle--sad to say, I just don't feel like I have time for all that, and I think a lot of gamers feel the same way.

GS: And yet turn-based strategy games, like Civilization III, still seem to have a viable market.

FU: That's true because you're not waiting. Except for very short periods of time, you're always in control of the game. In a role-playing game, since you're playing the heroes, your party members will typically be fighting twice as many monsters, and you'll have to wait for all of those enemies to take their turns.

Don't see much relevance here, as at that time in 2004 Fergie was an employee of Interplay saying Interplay PR Speak.

Does Ferigie still believe this today? Who know. Probably.

 

[Excidium]

Yeah, I know. But they're locked with publishers because they want, it's no excuse...

Please, like developers have any real choice in the matter - the publishers hold all the money, so they've got you by the balls. I'm not sure what you'd suggest as an alternative.

Self-publishing? Like Larian is doing with their next game.

 

[Roguey]

Their upcoming downloadable action RPG is self-funded.

Is that MCA's rumored XBox game?

Avellone's not involved as far as I know. It's going up on Live Arcade, yes.

Don't see much relevance here, as at that time in 2004 Fergie was an employee of Interplay saying Interplay PR Speak.

Does Ferigie still believe this today? Who know. Probably.

Definitely not a priority regardless.
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/5 ... allout.php
What did you personally think of Fallout 3?

FU: I don't want to just say that I really enjoyed it, because that feels like I'm just kissing ass: "It was a wonderful experience!" But I am not a guy who was caught up in the notion that Fallout had to be an isometric, turn-based experience. To me, Fallout was always just the feeling of the world.

http://www.gamebanshee.com/interviews/9 ... uhart.html
GB: Did you ever try to convince them that you should do an isometric turn-based Fallout after Fallout 3?

Feargus: [laughter]

 

[DragoFireheart]

He's (Feargus) probably laughing because he knows what a waste of time it would be. Anyways, combat was never Fallout's strong point so I don't see what the issue is. I've played Fallout 1, 2, 3, and NV and personally while I personally like the action-hybrid style of Fallout 3/NV, it's the story that matters (which F3 fails oh so horribly at). I really wish F3 didn't exist and F:NV was our F3. At least we can pretend Fallout: New Vegas is a First Person Shooter off-shoot of Van Buren.

 

[Stinger]

Wasn't it Feargus who said that character creators as deep as IWD's aren't really relevant these days or something? Ignoring him, people like Sawyer are clearly onboard with the opportunity to make a TB iso game, but the opportunity just isn't available in today's market. Maybe the XBLA/Steam/PSN title will be their chance to make something more in line with what they want to do but in the mean time Obsidian is right now stuck with having the best intentions but trapped by the current market.

 

[Jaesun]

Wasn't it Feargus who said that character creators as deep as IWD's aren't really relevant these days or something?

You also have to keep in mind, when Fergus is giving interviews he is carefully saying PR speech that will hopefully attract more Publishers so they can stay in business. If he made a statement "Jebus Fucking Christmas! The fucking shit that is passed as a RPG these days if fucking shit!" might get a cheer here at the Codex, but Publishers wouldn't really be knocking down their door asking them to make games for them.

Ignoring him, people like Sawyer are clearly onboard with the opportunity to make a TB iso game, but the opportunity just isn't available in today's market.

Yep. Also one of Saywers favorite games is Darklands.

 

[Wunderpurps]

There's no need to hero worship anyone, why not just judge the actual games? If the game is good enough to get your dollar then that's as good as it's going to be. Withholding money from substandard games won't make a new golden age but maybe it will mean an occasional decent game instead of nothing but really bad consolized shooters with a story.

 

[DwarvenFood]

...

preserved in Dresden ? That is a small miracle of it's own

 

[Oriebam]

But please, try to channel your disbelief and anger in a less destructive manner.

 

[Sannom]

Wasn't it Feargus who said that character creators as deep as IWD's aren't really relevant these days or something?

It was more along the lines that players today wouldn't have the patience to go through the creation of the entire party.

 

[Elwro]

...

preserved in Dresden ? That is a small miracle of it's own

In fact yes, it is a miracle. It's also the complete opposite of the usual situation. You see, usually music from the XVIIIth century is preserved in sets of parts, one for each instrument. Frequently there is no "score" at all. But in this case, before the war they had both parts and scores (the Church sat on it for a long time, so nobody knew the music, but it got preserved :D). Someone made a very wise decision to separate the parts from the scores during the war. All the parts seem to have been destroyed in the bombings, but miraculously the trunks with the scores survived in a church basement. Unfortunately, there is big water damage, but the music is mostly legible. And sometimes it's great :D


Another thing: the Soviets pillaged the SingAkademie zu Berlin archive in 1945. The whole collection (including works by various Bachs) was lost... until its recent rediscovery (seemingly INTACT) in trunks in the Kiev conservatory. (Looks like no one even touched it for at least 50 years.) We still don't exactly know what's in there...

@DS: In "The Chimney Sweeper" you use the low "D" in the basso voice quite a few times, and it was not evident for me these were solo sections. Are you sure you want the choir bassi to sing so low? Also, I was wondering about that low "D" note with the text "Angel"... was it a conscious decision with some specific effect to be achieved?

And yes, I guess I am a "professor" , even if it's "Assistant Professor". In philosophy. I mainly teach logic and my research is math related.

 

[DwarvenFood]

My brain is imploding slowly with the knowledge that Dicksmoker and his legendary awful taste in movies can into music.

 

[commie]

Wasn't it Feargus who said that character creators as deep as IWD's aren't really relevant these days or something?

It was more along the lines that players today wouldn't have the patience to go through the creation of the entire party.

I'm from the 'old days' and I still go with the pre-rolled parties in old games except usually for 'my' character and to fill a specific need. I always end up spending forever trying to get the perfect warrior or paladin when it makes little difference otherwise.

 

[Forest Dweller]

@DS: In "The Chimney Sweeper" you use the low "D" in the basso voice quite a few times, and it was not evident for me these were solo sections. Are you sure you want the choir bassi to sing so low?

Yeah, when I was composing I wasn't quite aware how rare it was for a voice to have that low D. I sung in a men's chorus for 9 semesters at my undergrad school. There were lots of people in it and in the bass section there were always plenty who could get that low D. What's good is that you only need a few who have it solidly; its low pitch will carry easily underneath everything else. But yeah, I thought it was more prevalent in male singers than it actually was (turns out the majority of low singers are baritones, with "true basses" being somewhat of a rarity).

Also, I was wondering about that low "D" note with the text "Angel"... was it a conscious decision with some specific effect to be achieved?

It's basically a text painting, except that it's the opposite text painting that you would expect (i.e. something foreboding, evoking a sense of dread). The thing that's interesting about the text (to me), is that there's this interesting duality present in it, where on the surface you have a very childlike rhyme scheme, but underneath that you have dark undercurrents and more mature themes. There are several ways I tried to represent this in the music, and one of those ways was to have on certain words the "opposite" music one would expect in order to undercut the traditional connotation of the word. Another example is on the word "warm" in the last stanza. Here, on what is superficially the "happiest" moment of the poem, I have written a very mournful harmonic progression (suspensions ftw). Because honestly, if you look deeper, that moment IS the saddest part of the poem, to me.

Anyway, a bit of a rambling answer but I think that answers it.

And yes, I guess I am a "professor" , even if it's "Assistant Professor". In philosophy. I mainly teach logic and my research is math related.

Interesting. You're so knowledgable about music, I would have assumed your primary degree would be in music.

So are the current "musicological" projects you're working on which you mentioned earlier basically a hobby, then? Or are you getting some sort of compensation?