Interview Todd Howard: 15 years of screwing up Elder Scrolls

[Shannow]

Jesus Christ at this nonsense that modern games are crappy or at least inferior to many older games where it really matters.

You people are out of touch with standards that modern games have. End of story. Just because your self-determined standards do not match those of modern games does not matter; you are playing them on the developer's terms and not yours.

Seriously, Luzur, I thought you knew better than that. There are lots of other legal means to aquire games apart from ebay. And why wouldn't you reference to anything with hardcore nudity in it? This is fairly normal stuff in modern games.
You guys just don't get it - you are not supposed to criticise modern games. That is what real journalists are for. You're not supposed to come in with high standards, you're not supposed to analyse gamemechanics or express opinions on games, you're not supposed to stop buying crap games; this is not how normal gaming business works.

Tell me more.

Anyway, about the news item: I actually kind of agree with Howard's sentiment of not doing "+1" sequels, at least in the sense of not marketing something which is essentially an expansion with minor graphical upgrades as a full sequel. If you're going to release another game in a series, you should try to fix the broken mechanics and gameplay elements, as well as add something compelling to differentiate the new game from the old game(s). That's something that made FO2 kind of stale; the whole game felt like a glorified expansion (or even a mod) of the first FO, as pretty much everything worked the same as its predecessor. Of course, the ES implementation of that sentiment doesn't always work out (the changes in the combat and AI were pretty awful, as is their continued refusal to fix the utterly awful character system that the ES games use stand as testaments to that). As someone mentioned earlier, FO3 was in most ways better than OB, so hopefully Bethesda will transplant some of the ideas from FO3 to ES5, if it ever gets made.

And speaking of which, I really do hope that they make an ES5. There's a high probability that the Todd factor will make it a steaming pile of shit similar to OB, but there's always an irrational glimmer of hope that they'll finally get it right and make an ES game that combines all the best aspects of the previous games in the series.

First you give some very contentious basis for your opinion. FO2 a mod or expansion of FO? FO2 is superior in almost every way. It has more balance in the character system, vastly more content (mostly high quality), more polish, more npcs, more everything. It took a good game as basis and made a great game. Similar improvements happened in BG2 and G2. Then you go on by naming a game that supposedly followed this "design philosophy" but badly. You would have been a lot more convincing if you had named games that followed a series but made major changes apart from minor improvements and polish.
Let's see: G3: worse than the previous ones.
FO3: You must be kidding me.
Oblivion: You said it yourself.
...

I can't think of much else. But it stands to reason that changing major parts of you design for successors will alienate most of your previous fanbase.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

So are their forums on lockdown? Because I tried to register and they haven't sent me an activation link yet.
Rofl at how super serial the thread got after Ausir was no longer "derailing"

Same here.

 

[Admiral Rimjob POOBUM]

I registered my new account last night and it went through fine.

 

[Mattresses]

All post-Zenimax Bethesda have ever done are +1 sequels to Morrowind.

 

[JarlFrank]

All post-Zenimax Bethesda have ever done are -1 sequels to Morrowind.

Fixed.

 

[FeelTheRads]

You got suspended for NMA style bitching, i.e. "they raped my favorite franchise, first person view and real-time combat ruined all role-playing for me BAWWW".

Try harder.

LEAVE BETHASDA ALONEE!!!!!!

Like this?

 

[ElectricOtter]

All post-Zenimax Bethesda have ever done are -10 sequels to Morrowind.

Fixed.

double fix

 

[Xi]

The TES forum moderators are about the stupidest people on the planet when it comes to understanding the principles of argumentation, logic, and debate. You aren't free to look outside of the rose-colored glasses over there, and you're not free to talk about what you see when you take them off.

I rarely even read those forums these days. I hadn't checked it for a long time, and only went back to it's old games forum when they released DF for free. It's just so pathetic. A lot of the moderators only last a short while any way, with the exception of maybe Freddo, who doesn't actually enforce much anyway.

I'm willing to bet that TES 5 is the MMO, and that Bethesda is waiting to announce it. Zenimax is a business before it's a gaming studio. People always forget that. MMO = HUGE $$$, and in terms of capitalism, doing anything else is bad business. Especially once you've branded your product and it becomes a common household gamer's name.

The Bethesda forum is about as exciting as talking to a bunch of cattle before they go into the slaughter.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Not that you can even *do* that since RPGCodex is automatically converted in to "I love Oblivion" and overcoming this spellcheck will get you an IP ban.

...I always thought this was just a meme.

jesus

 

[Shannow]

I'm willing to bet that TES 5 is the MMO, and that Bethesda is waiting to announce it. Zenimax is a business before it's a gaming studio. People always forget that. MMO = HUGE $$$, and in terms of capitalism, doing anything else is bad business. Especially once you've branded your product and it becomes a common household gamer's name.

Like the financial crisis
One, exactly one, MMO = HUGE $$$. The others are all either moderately successful or failures. Greed always seems to turn off rationality. And capitalism is based on greed, OMFG... But that's for GD, sry.
Don't ban me, mods. Pretty please?

Not that you can even *do* that since RPGCodex is automatically converted in to "I love Oblivion" and overcoming this spellcheck will get you an IP ban.

...I always thought this was just a meme.

jesus

Oh, you really missed the good times. VD even acquired the domain www.iloveoblivion.com, so links to the codex were censored and converted to links to www.iloveoblivion.com and still lead to the codex . Didn't last long and the domain is free again but it still is one of my favourite internet "pranks".

 

[JarlFrank]

Oh, you really missed the good times. VD even acquired the domain www.iloveoblivion.com, so links to the codex were censored and converted to links to www.iloveoblivion.com and still lead to the codex . Didn't last long and the domain is free again but it still is one of my favourite internet "pranks".

It did last pretty long. Only fairly recently Calis said in the staff forum that the "iloveoblivion.com" domain is not needed anymore because Bethesda just censored "rogcodex.com" into "[censored]", so the purpose of the domain name has vanished.

 

[Luzur]

Oh, you really missed the good times. VD even acquired the domain www.iloveoblivion.com, so links to the codex were censored and converted to links to www.iloveoblivion.com and still lead to the codex . Didn't last long and the domain is free again but it still is one of my favourite internet "pranks".

It did last pretty long. Only fairly recently Calis said in the staff forum that the "iloveoblivion.com" domain is not needed anymore because Bethesda just censored "rogcodex.com" into "[censored]", so the purpose of the domain name has vanished.

those where the guter alter tagen.

 

[Shannow]

those where the guter alter tagen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwSwGGPa ... re=related

 

[Luzur]

those where the guter alter tagen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwSwGGPa ... re=related

 

[Secretninja]

So which one of you is Mentok the Mindtaker?

 

[Torquemada]

First you give some very contentious basis for your opinion. FO2 a mod or expansion of FO? FO2 is superior in almost every way. It has more balance in the character system, vastly more content (mostly high quality), more polish, more npcs, more everything. It took a good game as basis and made a great game.

????????????????????????????????
????????????????????????????????
????????????????????????????????

!!!!

Oh motherfucking lord of shit be praised. FO2 superior in every way to FO what load of nonsense are you spouting out. More balance in the character system, a big maybe, but the game overall was far less balanced and easier to be an overpowered monster. Once you get the bozar, which can be VERY soon in the game nothing can beat you.
Vastly more content but most of it is crap referencing pop culture and unfunny jokes, quantity over quality here. New Reno didn't even make sense in a post apocalyptic world no matter how Sci-Fi it was. Most of the game arguably didn't have that genuine post apocalyptic feeling FO1 had.
More polish, I fucking hope so, because they took the same engine and most resources, if FO2 had less polish the dev team would have died from the ridicule.
More NPC is not desirable. FO1 had the right balance of NPC in my eyes for that kind of setting. That and the evil NPCs were far more lovable in Fallout 1 than Fallout 2. I actually felt wishing I could side with the master (and not have the game end just there) in FO1 while there is no redeeming feature to the enclave organization and Frank Horrigan is just some dipshit used by the org as a tool.

It took a great game and perverted it into shit.

Similar improvements happened in BG2

That was because Bioware couldn't make it worse than BG1. BG1 is a GLORIFIED DUNGEON HACK. There is little side quests content other than dumb fetch quests, most of the actual game was about killing stuff in dungeons with even open areas managing to feel like dungeons. There was practically no branching in quest (while BG2 had great parts like the underdark), the game was full of filler content, what people call exploration I call a walking simulator in the vein of Morrowind.
BG2 is like not the same game at all. It has the same engine and it builds on the story of BG1 but it's not the same game. Walking was fast, there was little filler, there was ton of sidequests and interactive stuff like quests depending on your class, branching, party NPCs that actually talked to you and reacted to events and the story got much better, instead of "I am evil for evil's sake I am the incarnation of evil" Sarevok we got butthurt revengeful Irenicus trying to save his ass from the mortality that has been imposed on him.

BG2 builds on the infinity engine but that's about it. I can't get myself to consider BG2 as truly being a "successor" to BG1, more like a new game based on the setting. Icewind Dale is the spiritual successor to BG1. IWD1 and IWD2 are much more like BG1 than BG2.

 

[Emotional Vampire]

And here's true face of the Codex!*

More balance in the character system, a big maybe, but the game overall was far less balanced and easier to be an overpowered monster. Once you get the bozar, which can be VERY soon in the game nothing can beat you.

NCR is not "very soon", it's 3/4th through the game, lol. Pretty fucking comparable to Turbo Plasma Rifle from Fallout if you ask me.

Vastly more content but most of it is crap referencing pop culture and unfunny jokes, quantity over quality here.

Most of it? I won't even try to claim that one, I can't be bothered to list every fucking single location in the game and write "NOT VERY REALL POPCULTURISH HUH" next to it. Let's just assume you're a dumbfuck and move on.

New Reno didn't even make sense in a post apocalyptic world no matter how Sci-Fi it was.

Uh huh, yeah, a city controlled by mafia would stop being controlled by mafia after a nuclear war. You're so ass-backwards here you're licking your own anus.

Most of the game arguably didn't have that genuine post apocalyptic feeling FO1 had.

Well fuck, how many years it's been? Sorry dude, even post-apo will not stay post-apo forever.They can't eat dirt all the time.

More NPC is not desirable. FO1 had the right balance of NPC in my eyes for that kind of setting.

Three cheers for you never working in video game industry!

It took a great game and perverted it into shit.

Kind of like your parents took all these resources - food, water, energy, etc. and then made you? Yeah it's pretty tragic, bro.

BG2 is like not the same game at all.

And if anyone needed any further proof you're dumber than two bags of bricks, here it is. BG2 is fucking identical to BG, same dungeon-to-dungeon progression following story as linear as Lenin's EKG. Fuck, at least in BG most locations were open and optional which gave you the ILLUSION of freedom, BG2 doesn't even have that much.

* - uneducated, ignorant fuckwit drunk with unwarranted self-importance spewing out blind hate bullshit.

 

[Azrael the cat]

First you give some very contentious basis for your opinion. FO2 a mod or expansion of FO? FO2 is superior in almost every way. It has more balance in the character system, vastly more content (mostly high quality), more polish, more npcs, more everything. It took a good game as basis and made a great game.

????????????????????????????????
????????????????????????????????
????????????????????????????????

!!!!

Oh motherfucking lord of shit be praised. FO2 superior in every way to FO what load of nonsense are you spouting out. More balance in the character system, a big maybe, but the game overall was far less balanced and easier to be an overpowered monster. Once you get the bozar, which can be VERY soon in the game nothing can beat you.
Vastly more content but most of it is crap referencing pop culture and unfunny jokes, quantity over quality here. New Reno didn't even make sense in a post apocalyptic world no matter how Sci-Fi it was. Most of the game arguably didn't have that genuine post apocalyptic feeling FO1 had.
More polish, I fucking hope so, because they took the same engine and most resources, if FO2 had less polish the dev team would have died from the ridicule.
More NPC is not desirable. FO1 had the right balance of NPC in my eyes for that kind of setting. That and the evil NPCs were far more lovable in Fallout 1 than Fallout 2. I actually felt wishing I could side with the master (and not have the game end just there) in FO1 while there is no redeeming feature to the enclave organization and Frank Horrigan is just some dipshit used by the org as a tool.

It took a great game and perverted it into shit.

Similar improvements happened in BG2

That was because Bioware couldn't make it worse than BG1. BG1 is a GLORIFIED DUNGEON HACK. There is little side quests content other than dumb fetch quests, most of the actual game was about killing stuff in dungeons with even open areas managing to feel like dungeons. There was practically no branching in quest (while BG2 had great parts like the underdark), the game was full of filler content, what people call exploration I call a walking simulator in the vein of Morrowind.
BG2 is like not the same game at all. It has the same engine and it builds on the story of BG1 but it's not the same game. Walking was fast, there was little filler, there was ton of sidequests and interactive stuff like quests depending on your class, branching, party NPCs that actually talked to you and reacted to events and the story got much better, instead of "I am evil for evil's sake I am the incarnation of evil" Sarevok we got butthurt revengeful Irenicus trying to save his ass from the mortality that has been imposed on him.

BG2 builds on the infinity engine but that's about it. I can't get myself to consider BG2 as truly being a "successor" to BG1, more like a new game based on the setting. Icewind Dale is the spiritual successor to BG1. IWD1 and IWD2 are much more like BG1 than BG2.

Yeah, but people often mention BG2 as a sequel because it's one of the rare examples where a studio that made an utterly shite 1st game improved and made a decent one. In any objective look at BG1, keeping in mind that the licence and dialogue design was imposed on them by Interplay, it would be nigh-impossible to believe that Bioware was capable of making something like BG2. Same if you replace 'BG1' with 'everything other than BG2 that Bioware has made'. It's a random talent spike of Courtney Love 'Live Through This' (aka the Hole album that Cobain wrote for her) proportions. In fact [/consipiracy] I'd find it easier to believe that Gaider killed Chris Avellone immediately after PS:T was written, replaced him with his supa-dupa-look-alike-Avellone-clone designed to bring Black Isle down from the inside, and stole the BG2 design docs from the original Avellone's briefcase.

Actually that would explain quite a few things....

 

[Torquemada]

* - uneducated, ignorant fuckwit drunk with unwarranted self-importance spewing out blind hate bullshit.

Considering most of your answer consist of "I don't think so hence you are an idiot" I'll point out your own state of mind and won't bother entering into an argument with ye Emo bitch.

Actually that would explain quite a few things....

It doesn't need to be that complicated. I believe PST was a fluke, a complete byproduct of sheer luck. PST was a decent game despite what Avellone wanted it to be, what saved the game was its unique setting because there are large parts of the story that feels ridiculously emo such as the sensorium or ravel and wouldn't have flied had it be done in another setting, the influence of japanese RPG on the mind of Avellone at the time cannot be underestimated. Mask of the betrayer pushed the emo envelop to new levels with Safiya, Kaelyn and Gann which even had the emo haircut.
Planescape writing at times feels like a verbose derivative of fanfics written by goths.

Chris Avellone is the One Trick Pony of the codex. He made a Planescape game and for that single game will get praised forever no matter how many shitty game he has been working on since then.

 

[Emotional Vampire]

Considering most of your answer consist of "I don't think so hence you are an idiot" I'll point out your own state of mind and won't bother entering into an argument with ye Emo bitch.

Run away, little piggy.

 

[Shannow]

First you give some very contentious basis for your opinion. FO2 a mod or expansion of FO? FO2 is superior in almost every way. It has more balance in the character system, vastly more content (mostly high quality), more polish, more npcs, more everything. It took a good game as basis and made a great game.

Oh motherfucking lord of shit be praised. FO2 superior in every way to FO what load of nonsense are you spouting out.

*sigh* Reading comprehension much? It is contentious. If you want to use something as the basis for an argument you don't chose something that a large portion of people will disregard out of hand. Even on the codex that supposedly is visited the hardcore nerds we can't agree what the better game is. Many here see FO2 as better. Just go and look up ALL THE FUCKING OTHER THREADS WE HAVE ABOUT FUCKING FO VS FUCKING FO2

More balance in the character system, a big maybe,

I'll count that as full agreement, thank you.

but the game overall was far less balanced and easier to be an overpowered monster. Once you get the bozar, which can be VERY soon in the game nothing can beat you.

FO1 was vastly easier. I played FO2 6 times and don't remember this "bozar". Neither game was especially difficult combat wise. But FO was easier.

Vastly more content but most of it is crap referencing pop culture and unfunny jokes,

See, we completely disagree here.

quantity over quality here

"Bring me to the radscorpion cave."

New Reno didn't even make sense in a post apocalyptic world no matter how Sci-Fi it was. Most of the game arguably didn't have that genuine post apocalyptic feeling FO1 had.

I don't agree on NR either. (I'd have chosen Sanfran as the boo-boy since they were running out of ideas and polishing at that point). Of course, it feels PA. More in a "rising from the ashes" way than FO but distinctly PA all the same.

More polish, I fucking hope so, because they took the same engine and most resources, if FO2 had less polish the dev team would have died from the ridicule.

So it is more polished. Thank you for agreeing.

More NPC is not desirable. FO1 had the right balance of NPC in my eyes for that kind of setting. That and the evil NPCs were far more lovable in Fallout 1 than Fallout 2.

What's there more to say?

I actually felt wishing I could side with the master (and not have the game end just there) in FO1

I'll have to take up your criticisms of FO. They're better than some of my own.

while there is no redeeming feature to the enclave organization and Frank Horrigan is just some dipshit used by the org as a tool.

You forgot "in my eyes" this time. Bad Torq, bad boy!

It took a great game and perverted it into shit.

Now this goes past opinion and right into the sphere of the ridiculous, but hey, your entitled to it anyway.

Similar improvements happened in BG2

That was because Bioware couldn't make it worse than BG1. BG1 is a GLORIFIED DUNGEON HACK. There is little side quests content other than dumb fetch quests, most of the actual game was about killing stuff in dungeons with even open areas managing to feel like dungeons. There was practically no branching in quest (while BG2 had great parts like the underdark), the game was full of filler content, what people call exploration I call a walking simulator in the vein of Morrowind.
BG2 is like not the same game at all. It has the same engine and it builds on the story of BG1 but it's not the same game.

Boils down to what one counts as +1. Continuation of the story, same enginge (+ some updates), returning npcs, etc all counts as +1 for me.

Walking was fast, there was little filler, there was ton of sidequests and interactive stuff like quests depending on your class, branching, party NPCs that actually talked to you and reacted to events and the story got much better, instead of "I am evil for evil's sake I am the incarnation of evil" Sarevok we got butthurt revengeful Irenicus trying to save his ass from the mortality that has been imposed on him.

"Walking was fast" If I knew what you meant he I might respond. Game speed could be upped in BG1, too. Filler depends on opinion. Class specific "quests" + "branching" + party banter = +1. Sarevok isn't evil for evil's sake. He is evil to become an evil god. Blame D&D's alignments system. Good for you that you liked Irenicus' story better.

BG2 builds on the infinity engine but that's about it. I can't get myself to consider BG2 as truly being a "successor" to BG1, more like a new game based on the setting. Icewind Dale is the spiritual successor to BG1. IWD1 and IWD2 are much more like BG1 than BG2.

I believe that is your opinion. Doesn't really matter, does it?

On FO vs FO2: You just confirmed my point that it is contentious. If you are really interested in debating the games necro one of the SEVERAL threads we have. I'm sure andhairy will thank you. Discuss!

On BG/BG2: You seem to have missed the point that I like BG2 much better... But still consider it +1. (IWD 1+2 are fun too )

 

[poocolator]

no hotlinking?

 

[Torquemada]

If you want to use something as the basis for an argument you don't chose something that a large portion of people will disregard out of hand.
[...]
FO1 was vastly easier. I played FO2 6 times and don't remember this "bozar".

The opening sentence wasn't an argument, it was me expressing my disgust at such taste.
You must be kinda ignorant to be able to quote '' the bozar as if I made up the weapon and to play FO2 6 times and yet never finding it you sound like a noob.
It is one, if not the one, of the most powerful FO2 weapons. You can get it early if you have an habit of stealing from everyone, though I am not going to spoil the fun if you are ready to play a seventh time as a thief (you played FO2 6 times and didn't play a thief already ?)

I don't agree on NR either. (I'd have chosen Sanfran as the boo-boy since they were running out of ideas and polishing at that point). Of course, it feels PA. More in a "rising from the ashes" way than FO but distinctly PA all the same.

The problem with New Reno is that in a world whose economy has been totalled and people got out of vaults I don't believe any kind of mafia family could have maintained any kind of power whatsoever. In the real world, the real power of the mafia is the power of money and corruption rather than raw strength. NR doesn't make sense to me in any possible way.
And more, it's not just one but many families operating in the same place with casinos and street hookers ?

So it is more polished. Thank you for agreeing.
-
What's there more to say?
-
I'll have to take up your criticisms of FO. They're better than some of my own.
-
You forgot "in my eyes" this time. Bad Torq, bad boy!
-

VD, is that you ?
Did you really need to separate multiple quotes to write useless oneliners ?

Sarevok isn't evil for evil's sake. He is evil to become an evil god.

Reread this sentence. Don't tell me you make any sense.

I believe that is your opinion. Doesn't really matter, does it?

Because the drivel you wrote is not your opinion, right. That you think that FO2 is FO1++ is YOUR opinion, too, and doesn't matter at all because it's all dumb.

But still consider it +1. (IWD 1+2 are fun too

This is where we part. I considered BG2 good enough to finish it but I was bored as HELL in BG1 and the IWD.

I hate to do it VD multiquote style but it can't be helped when the opponent is doing it ala VD too.

no hotlinking?

Rehosted it :

 

[poocolator]

I'd say. Damn.

 

[Shannow]

The opening sentence wasn't an argument, it was me expressing my disgust at such taste.

Thanks for sharing.

You must be kinda ignorant to be able to quote '' the bozar as if I made up the weapon and to play FO2 6 times and yet never finding it you sound like a noob.

Ah, the infamous codex ad hominems. Right on time, if I may say so. Neither did I claim you made it up, nor did I say that I didn't find it. I said I didn't remember it. Suggesting that it was by far not as overpowered as you claim.

It is one, if not the one, of the most powerful FO2 weapons. You can get it early if you have an habit of stealing from everyone,

"One of the most powerful weapons", but not the most powerful. How does this imbalance the game? You can get advanced power armor early, too. Can be fun going through the game in god mode.

though I am not going to spoil the fun if you are ready to play a seventh time as a thief (you played FO2 6 times and didn't play a thief already ?)

Is that an attempt at insulting me because I find thieving boring? Really? People here used to be creative in their insults...

The problem with New Reno is that in a world whose economy has been totalled and people got out of vaults I don't believe any kind of mafia family could have maintained any kind of power whatsoever. In the real world, the real power of the mafia is the power of money and corruption rather than raw strength. NR doesn't make sense to me in any possible way.
And more, it's not just one but many families operating in the same place with casinos and street hookers ?

What is your point? I'm not arguing FO vs FO2.

VD, is that you ?
Did you really need to separate multiple quotes to write useless oneliners ?

VD manages to be a lot more condescending than I do. I haven't attacked you personally yet. "Useless" one liners? *g* I had a point each time. And the separation is purely for your sake since I doubt you'd be able to follow me otherwise. Seeing as you weren't able to even with the separation I feel justified. (There, the first little insult. And it wasn't even ment as one. It is just the impression you give me.)

Sarevok isn't evil for evil's sake. He is evil to become an evil god.

Reread this sentence. Don't tell me you make any sense.

Two sentences. Which one do you mean? (And nice job misquoting me by dropping the D&D alignment comment.) [Fake edit]: Since you were whining about oneliners and kept quite civil for codex standards I'll explain what I mean: Sarevok isn't killing and maiming because he's evil. He is killing and maiming because it is an means to an end. If he could inherit the throne of Bhaal by saving kittens from trees and cuddling with cute little bunnies, he'd do that, too. So Sarevok is evil because he has no scruples and use any "evil" means to reach his ends. Irenicus is the same. [/edit]

I believe that is your opinion. Doesn't really matter, does it?

Because the drivel you wrote is not your opinion, right. That you think that FO2 is FO1++ is YOUR opinion, too, and doesn't matter at all because it's all dumb.

And exactly here you show that you weren't following my points at all. This was never was about FO vs FO2. I pointed that out and even refered you to one of the several threads we already have if you wanted to debate the topic.
It was about KreideBein following Todd's statement basing an argument against "+1 sequels" on a weak and contended basement.

Now do you really want to continue this? We are boring everyone to tears.