ToEE: New player

[Cynic]

You must play with the Co8 bug fixes. Some of the new content isn't good, but some of it is actually very well done. In particular Hickory Branch was excellent, really good encounter design and a cool area to explore. Even some C&C at the end of that one. I liked the Arena of Heroes as well, and Welkwood Bog was good for avoiding Hommlet (although I liked the relaxed vibe of Hommlet even though it got boring). I haven't tried the War of the Golden Skull bit yet. However, Verbobonc felt kind of bloated to me...but there was also some okay stuff in it.

The only complaint against NC is that it makes you far too OP for the main quest. Some of it is VERY challenging to do at level 10 though (slavers). It's really up to you, maybe play it twice. Imo the game is worth it.

 

[Lorica]

The Arena of Heroes was interesting mostly for getting you to use some of the underutilised spells in the game.

The secret? encounter that they add is the high level challenge that really makes the NC worthwhile, IMO.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

Yeah well most of the new content is now available only after you kill Zuggtmoy so you won't be overpowered anymore. Only the "Welkwood Bog" and the "Arena of heroes" are available before temple completion.
The first two AoH fights are pretty lame since a simple "Web" spell, or "Entangle" will keep the guys at bay for the whole encounter. As opposed to the hill giant in Emridy meadows, they didn't even try to "Break free" in my current playthrough. I dismissed the spells myself out of pity to get some measure of fighting. The final fight is good though.

Some new things are nice in that "Final" version of the Co8 new content, like the improved harpies encounter.

 

[King Crispy]

Casting Ray of Enfeeblement in conjunction with Web at the giant in Emridy Meadows worked out well for me. The Ranged Touch Attack luckily hit him, so his STR was drained, and he thus kept failing his repeated breakout attempts. A subsequent scroll of Stinking Cloud on top of that really put him in a world of hurt, just in case. I just plinked him to death with arrows and crossbow bolts while he sat there and whimpered.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

"Stinking cloud" is so broken I try not to use it. I don't always succeed though. Some fire salamanders got sick.

 

[Kitako]

This thread makes me want to reinstall, it's been years now.
Anyone tried it on a sucky netbook? Is it playable? I have no real computer for the foreseable future.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

 

[King Crispy]

No numerical HP display?

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

I don't like it. It's ugly and the game is not difficult enough to warrant such precise feedback. I like to see the portraits, and since the devs had the good grace to put the spells/status icons above and below the portraits and not plastered over them like in BG...

 

[Desmodus Rotundus]

What really breaks the reach weapons in this game is the fact that unlike in PnP you can attack stuff that is right next to you in addition to those 5ft away, it gives you such a crazy area of control. Also about the monk, I liked it for its mobility, it was great for setting up flank attacks and being able to run around in the middle of enemy groups without getting hit.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

Yes, reach weapons are OP in the game. That's why I limit the "reach weapons, AoO specialists, enlarged mofos" killing machines to one in my plays.

As for running around in the midst of enemies, most characters can do that if you put points in "Tumble", wear light or no armor and have decent DEX. My rogue and wizard for instance, move around freely without getting too worried about AoO. As a matter of fact I pump "Tumble" on most of my characters. Damn, even my fighter/cleric NPC tank, wearing an elven chainmail, manages to move into position unhurt most of the time.

On another note, I had to redo the Zuggtmoy fight. There's a bug in Co8 NC ver 8.0 that prevents Verbobonc from appearing on the world map once you killed her and fucks your game. A patch was made, ver 8.01, but I didn't know about it before running into the problem and it didn't fix my post fight save. So, Crispy, you may want to download it if you haven't already :
http://www.co8.org/forum/showpost.php?p=116174&postcount=3

 

[King Crispy]

Cool, thanks.

 

[Dorateen]

As a matter of fact I pump "Tumble" on most of my characters.

Every 5 points in tumble is supposed to grant an extra point to Armour Class in 3.5 D&D as well. Was that implemented in ToEE? Another reason to invest in the skill, no matter how ridiculous some characters might look tumbling around the battle field.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

Every 5 points in tumble is supposed to grant an extra point to Armour Class in 3.5 D&D as well. Was that implemented in ToEE?

Really ? Without any class or armor restriction ? As for the game, it doesn't seem to work that way since none of my characters gets any AC boost, yet all except one are well above 5.

 

[Melcar]

I don't think it does. It didn't on my games (or at least I did not notice).

 

[Dorateen]

Yeah, that was something I learned in NWN2. So I wasn't sure if it was the case back in ToEE.

 

[Lhynn]

Yeah, that was something I learned in NWN2. So I wasn't sure if it was the case back in ToEE.

Thats not 3.5E.
Thats just nwn 1 (every 5 points) or nwn 2 (every 10)
In 3.5E you get a bonus to AC from tumble if you fight defensively, but no one ever did that, because its a stupid mechanic and the guy that wrote it should die a horrible death.

 

[Dorateen]

Well I like AD&D or 2nd edition better anyway.

 

[Melcar]

They see me tumblin'...

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

I'm currently exploring the sewers under Verbobonc. What the fuck went wrong with the Co8 team ? This is the most annoying piece of shit map I've played in, like, ever...

 

[Melcar]

So they went derp?

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

The map is huge. And I'm talking PoR : Ruins of Myth Drannor kinda huge. And empty. I spent at least an hour exploring it (I'm not completely done yet), and all I met so far was one NPC. Plus there are tons of exits and 90% of them are one way, so you want to save before trying them for fear of having to walk back there from one map away. And saves tend to get corrupted every once in a while down there so you have to double check. Add to that that there is this annoying water sound constantly bothering you and you get the picture.

The best part is that it's not even some unfinished optional content but that you get a specific quest to make you explore the sewers, ironically named "What lies beneath". What indeed ?

 

[Corporate_Jew_Master]

Casting Ray of Enfeeblement in conjunction with Web at the giant in Emridy Meadows worked out well for me. The Ranged Touch Attack luckily hit him, so his STR was drained, and he thus kept failing his repeated breakout attempts. A subsequent scroll of Stinking Cloud on top of that really put him in a world of hurt, just in case. I just plinked him to death with arrows and crossbow bolts while he sat there and whimpered.

Pretty much this. Ray of Enfeeblement and Web are one hell of a combo and pretty easy to pull off. Darkness->dimension door-> aoe spell also works sometimes when you are more spread out.

Btw, why does continual light blind people so often? It's a pretty low level spell.

 

[fastjack]

Casting Ray of Enfeeblement in conjunction with Web at the giant in Emridy Meadows worked out well for me. The Ranged Touch Attack luckily hit him, so his STR was drained, and he thus kept failing his repeated breakout attempts. A subsequent scroll of Stinking Cloud on top of that really put him in a world of hurt, just in case. I just plinked him to death with arrows and crossbow bolts while he sat there and whimpered.

Pretty much this. Ray of Enfeeblement and Web are one hell of a combo and pretty easy to pull off. Darkness->dimension door-> aoe spell also works sometimes when you are more spread out.

Btw, why does continual light blind people so often? It's a pretty low level spell.

I like to use a bard to throw tasha's hideous laughter at him then coup de grace if it hits. (and load if it doesn't)

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

Holy shit ! After wandering the vast emptiness of the sewers, I'm now in the new Hickory Branch, talk about contrast... every inch you move reveals 20 new enemies. Now, I don't mind the sheer numbers (I'm not crazy about it either) but there are some mysterious exploding runes that come from I don't know where that decimate my party. It's totally frustrating and i'm seriously considering putting a stop to that Co8 play. I liked the previous versions better overall.
After trying the fight three times, dying, and failing to find any relevant info in the dice rolls history box in-game, I checked on the Co8 forums about that invisible exploding runes affair. Apparently they're very proud of it and the lack of information that goes with it, so you have to figure it out... basically out of the dozens of enemies in that fight, some wield runes, some don't, have fun finding out who's who in less that ~10 turns, otherwise you're toast. Most of them "rune" you from the dark, so it's an exercise in frustration.
While one poster sensibly suggested that the runes should be toned down a bit, the two messages that were less critic on the Co8 forums both strangely enough mentioned exploits :

I just think on the rune fight your work is very easy to circumvent/exploit because of the engine issues.

My solution was an invisible rogue (using ring of invisibilty) with a wand of fireballs, which apparently doesn't cancel the invisibility when used, though changing your equipped items will.

Doesn't it make you want to play ? Doesn't it ?
Son, I am disappoint.

Also,