Development Info ToEE patch in QA

[Vault Dweller]

No, I didn't mean SP's news post which is fine, I meant Jinxed's post where he mentioned the source.

 

[Dan]

Edit: I just noticed that Dan posted a split second earlier and arrived at the same conclusion:

Using pm's would have been a much smarter choice here.

Great minds think alike

Damn. I hate it when that happens. One side gets the first post which is better, and the other gets the second more read post which is also better.
Everyone's a loser

But yeah, pm's are nice heh.

 

[Jinxed]

What if Atari suddenly emails SP and asks, where did he get this information from? SP: I heared it from the grapevine". Heh, although I must say, I would give them the same treatment as they give fansites, the no reply treatment. This is just a matter of how you do your shit. But needless to say, I thought the codex should know better.

No, I didn't mean SP's news post which is fine, I meant Jinxed's post where he mentioned the source.

For goodness sake, you don't need half a brain to know where it came from.

That said, I'm really gone.

 

[Whipporowill]

Call me crazy, but I actually trust Saint's judgement, howevet odd this might sound. That said, I´m pretty sure that he´d not sit with any kind of info if he was known to be a blabbermouth. Gorvernments and companies do these kinds of leaks all the time.

Information wants to be free, as the "old" proverb says. So if someone wants something secret, they shouldn´t tell ANYONE.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Actually there are but two places were such news could come from. Either Atari or Troika. There is no underworld. And hell, anyone who's part of a fansite that has to do with Troika could get this news, including Exitium.

Or from another game developer, outside of Troika and Atari. Or from a friend of someone who works for them, and so on.

Atari doesn't even reply to emails from fan sites.

Maybe not yours. Mr. Smith has always replied to my emails so far.

While I'm kinda mad that I didn't post news when I had the chance, if I would go back in time, I would have done the same thing. But I guess my evil "how to run a fan site" code book is quite different from the people around here.

The difference would be that you were told in a private email not to post it whereas I was told in a public chat about it, with no disclaimer at all - several hours after you were emailed. I see nothing remotely evil about posting something stated in a public setting with no such disclaimer.

But we're at the crux of the matter. You're just being pissy about this because you didn't post it first. Get over it.

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

hey

We asked TIm in the chat when the patch would come out. He didn't answer completely, he just said it's in QA stage. I dont see anything that needs to be hidden from the fanbase, since they don't have to fear of not getting Atari's support because Atari's now doing the QA.

 

[chrisbeddoes]

.
But we're at the crux of the matter. You're just being pissy about this because you didn't post it first. Get over it.

No. Jinxed is like a paladin in a world where paladin's are outdated .

I used to be like him until I was 27.

He believes in the rules even if nobody else does.

 

[Seven]

What if Atari suddenly emails SP and asks, where did he get this information from? SP: I heared it from the grapevine". Heh, although I must say, I would give them the same treatment as they give fansites, the no reply treatment. This is just a matter of how you do your shit. But needless to say, I thought the codex should know better.

No, I didn't mean SP's news post which is fine, I meant Jinxed's post where he mentioned the source.

For goodness sake, you don't need half a brain to know where it came from.

That said, I'm really gone.

You've always been an ass who could never admit when he was wrong. Like you BIO says, you wield what little power you have like a 6 yr old. RPG Codex made a news post, where they got their source from was debatable (and still is since SP hasn't commented on his source), then you come along and make a big stink and implicate Troika (Do you hate Troika so much?). Whose bad is it? Yeah, that's right, it's your bad, so now piss off.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

But we're at the crux of the matter. You're just being pissy about this because you didn't post it first. Get over it.

He believes in the rules even if nobody else does.

I think Chris is right. I posted it at Terra-Arcanum just slightly under 3 hours after it appeared on the Codex (2:27 pm --> 5:24 pm if you go by Adelaide TIme ). That's pretty good for news (Not that I actually know that much, seeing as I've only been in the job for the last 3 days).

Regardless, I don't think Atari are going to give a damn about a patch leak. The game is out and people deliberately AREN'T buying the game because of bug fears. A patch that potentially fixes those bugs can only generate more sales. That = Happier Atari.

As to the information source and who told what who, when and why and should it or shouldn't it have been posted or not... I'm not going near that one with a 40 foot pole. More so because I don't care more than anything else. The news is out, Atari can deal with it anyway they choose. I don't seriously think they're going to hurt Troika over it, especially when the game reaches the top 5 in the NDP whatever game sales rating thingy.

 

[Jinxed]

Or from another game developer, outside of Troika and Atari. Or from a friend of someone who works for them, and so on.

You didn't mention the cleaning lady, the janitor and someone's shrink. To me, that's a load of bull.

You've always been an ass who could never admit when he was wrong. Like you BIO says, you wield what little power you have like a 6 yr old. RPG Codex made a news post, where they got their source from was debatable (and still is since SP hasn't commented on his source), then you come along and make a big stink and implicate Troika (Do you hate Troika so much?). Whose bad is it? Yeah, that's right, it's your bad, so now piss off.

You seem to know me better than I know you. It's easy to point out other people's shortcomings from behind the smoke screen.

*news flash* SP convinced me of things on multiple occasions. As well as other people. I don't know from where you're getting your info pal, but I suggest you better stop talking so long to yourself.
I don't consider myself in a position of any power. I run a fansite dedicated to Troika. We aren't doing this for money, fame or power. I think you should take up on Exitium's suggestion, and breathe some outside air.

The only person who cannot be conviced of anything, is SP. Sure, he's an established news/content writer with a slew of people carring his golf clubs behind him. This doesn't give him the right to leak out information though. Everyone who writes news or whatever has some sort of codebook they follow, I verified if I could use this information, while SP did not and his post and arguments are based on assumption that it was ok. See the difference in codebooks?

But we're at the crux of the matter. You're just being pissy about this because you didn't post it first. Get over it.

This could be a decent argument, but it's a moot point. As DU said, he posted it three hours after you. It's not like I was gonna email news sites about T-A's scoop.

Last but not least:

Maybe not yours. Mr. Smith has always replied to my emails so far.

I don't really understand where you're trying to get with this, T-A is a fansite, Codex is a news site. Big difference there.

 

[Seven]

*news flash* SP convinced me of things on multiple occasions. As well as other people.

Well then, if you're so open minded why don't you realize that it was you who made the mistake?

I run a fansite dedicated to Troika. We aren't doing this for money, fame or power.

What are your reasons for running the afore mentioned fansite?

The only person who cannot be conviced of anything, is SP. Sure, he's an established news/content writer with a slew of people carring his golf clubs behind him. This doesn't give him the right to leak out information though.

Do realize the amount of info that he has "leaked"? Hmmmmmm... NEWSFLASH, he's a news writer, news is his job, posting news without compromising his sources fits in his job description, YOU took iy upon yourself to compromised what/who may have been his source, why did YOU do this?

Everyone who writes news or whatever has some sort of codebook they follow, I verified if I could use this information, while SP did not and his post and arguments are based on assumption that it was ok. See the difference in codebooks?

Codebooks? Maybe you mean ethics, and while we're on the subject of ethics you can explain to us why you selfishly compromised some one else's source?

I suggest you better stop talking so long to yourself. ,...I think you should take up on Exitium's suggestion, and breathe some outside air.

My, my aren't we a clever little chunky-monkey. I could repond with profanity, but I wouldn't want to offend your impeccable codebook of rules... er Ethics?

You seem to know me better than I know you. It's easy to point out other people's shortcomings from behind the smoke screen.

Lets just say I've been around since FO1. If this was vault13 you would have been flamed beyond recognition, and your mailbox would be so full of spam your grandkids would be picking through it. So why don't count yourself lucky, apologise for exposing some one else's source and then we can be shits and smiles again.

 

[Jinxed]

Well then, if you're so open minded why don't you realize that it was you who made the mistake?

You are not doing a very good job at convincing me.

What are your reasons for running the afore mentioned fansite?

Because I like doing something with a purpose.

Do realize the amount of info that he has "leaked"? Hmmmmmm... NEWSFLASH, he's a news writer, news is his job, posting news without compromising his sources fits in his job description, YOU took iy upon yourself to compromised what/who may have been his source, why did YOU do this?

It's his job to write news but not to leak information. Writing up crap like this is getting you nowhere kiddo.
As to the other part of the post, yes, I did disclose on the source, my bad, assuming the people who read this news page aren't total idiots who can't put 2 and 2 together...

Codebooks? Maybe you mean ethics, and while we're on the subject of ethics you can explain to us why you selfishly compromised some one else's source?

No, I call it a code book. A very good friend of mine showed me the ropes when I was getting into this thing. I adapted his, and made my own corrections based on observation and experience. This friend works for the RPGCodex. As to the answer to your question, I repeat this time with bold letters so you may understand: This info had to be given to saint by someone, it wasn't the cleaning lady nor your boyfriend. It was either what I mentioned, or Atari. And judging how Atari handles PR they don't really give a flying fuck about you untill you have "leetnewspage" in your email address. Atari stinks and that's a no brainer. They would not give any info out. Hell, I think 90% of news concerning TToE came up on gamespy or gamespot first.

My, my aren't we a clever little chunky-monkey. I could repond with profanity, but I wouldn't want to offend your impeccable codebook of rules... er Ethics?

Well what's stopping you? You started a flamewar after all...

Lets just say I've been around since FO1. If this was vault13 you would have been flamed beyond recognition, and your mailbox would be so full of spam your grandkids would be picking through it. So why don't count yourself lucky, apologise for exposing some one else's source and then we can be shits and smiles again.

Hah! The good ole days of V13... How I miss that bunch of self centered ego maniacs! And if it was V13, I would still make that post, why? Because I believe in something. Spam my mailbox? What are you, a spammer? Get a life instead of carring someone elses trash. It's not what you think, it's not all about flames, calling names and dishing out frustration for not being able to score with your wife. Some of us here actually respect other people's opinions.

Go back to designing some more fallout tactics levels.

 

[Severian Silk]

Will this patch conflict with the Co8 patch? I would like to have both patches installed, but give priority to the official patch. Will some of the official changes be inferior to those introduced with the Co8 patch?

- Mikail

 

[Ausir]

Wait for a version of the Co8 patch made after the official one then.

 

[Sol Invictus]

You must uninstall the CO8 patch before installing the new patch. The CO8 will develop a new patch to support the official update once it is out.

 

[Eldar]

I'm looking forward to see what modding project Co8 starts. Better yet, maybe they'll finish a large mod and we can extend our gaming experience. ...And I have no doubt that Co8 can't have worse writing than the writing Troika put into ToEE anyhow.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

You didn't mention the cleaning lady, the janitor and someone's shrink. To me, that's a load of bull.

You'd be surprised how often one developer spreads rumors, true or untrue, about another one. Happens all the time.

It's his job to write news but not to leak information. Writing up crap like this is getting you nowhere kiddo.

FUN FACT: Telling a room full of 20 people something means it's not a secret.

It's pretty hard to leak information that's been made public. Considering I was in the midst of talking with this person in private about other things, and this information was told to everyone in the room and not in the private session, I think it's rather safe to conclude that what I posted was not considered a huge secret at the time by the person who was talking.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Whoa.... this just took a wickedly nasty turn. :shock:

Regardless, I don't think Atari are going to give a damn about a patch leak. The game is out and people deliberately AREN'T buying the game because of bug fears. A patch that potentially fixes those bugs can only generate more sales. That = Happier Atari.

Exactly! I mean, I have friends who have watched me play the game and really want to get it, but then they see some of the bugs I run into and decided to wait. Now, knowing that a patch is on the way, two of my friends bought copies of the game today and are now playing it, biding their time until the patch comes out. I did convince them to get the Co8 patch though. And on that note....

You must uninstall the CO8 patch before installing the new patch. The CO8 will develop a new patch to support the official update once it is out.

You guys rock, and I am sure there will be issues not addressed with the official patch that will be taken care of by the Co8. I definitely look forward to your future efforts and just want you to know that I appreciate all efforts made to date on your part. You truly have made TOEE a better experience for me. :thumbs up:

 

[Vegamax]

Okey I've been readin also this forum every now and then (also eye-on-troika, TA, official and vnboards) - first of all I didn't want to get into the debate but here I am donating something to this thread.

It looks like some persons were too angry or something in the first place so the somewhat friendly posts turned up into a personal debate. "who is the best fanboy"-text is not fun to read.

I agree with the fact that if someone asks if he can share the info and he is said no - then he should not share that info. But should everyone go asking after any little bit of information if they could share it - ofcourse not.

Did someone do something wrong ? Nope. Did someone do something which is against someone others ethics - yes. Are those thics such that all of we should act after them ? I don't know and to tell you the truth I don't really care.

But I do want to say that somehow I've gotten the feel that rex and sp don't like "outsiders" (people like me). Maybe it's because they have been doing things like this for much longer, but does it give them the right to laugh at others.

No, those have really want to support something should never act in a way that the noob might feel bad. It doesn't help anyone if the oldtimers make fun of the mistakes noobs might have done. Have some members of this community done that - yes.

And now I get to the point which I wanted to have in my message.

Such communities which try to be better than the others are not good communities. They can be more productive and they might have more members but still it's not a real community where new members are accepted. Such closed communities normally die away after a while. On the other hand we have communities like vnboards which are open and friendly. Not much on topic discussion, not much anything game related but the community is alive and new members stick around - one does not have to be one of the first ones to stay.

Am I saying that some members here are trying to be in the first group (we were the first and therefore we are the best) - no. I wanted to point out how it might end if such posts which are not the way you see things are not accepted.

Have a nice day and thanx to those who spend their time to mod ToEE - I might not like you personally, but I do like your work.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Did someone do something which is against someone others ethics - yes.

Not really? It's more like that: Jinxed was under impression that Saint did something unethical. The right thing to do would have been to ask him privately and share the concerns with him, not to start the drama.

But I do want to say that somehow I've gotten the feel that rex and sp don't like "outsiders" (people like me). Maybe it's because they have been doing things like this for much longer, but does it give them the right to laugh at others.

Well, I disagree with you, I don't recall anybody here lashing out at "outsiders" unless they managed to prove their stupidity and/or inability to play well with others beyond the reasonable doubt .

They can be more productive and they might have more members but still it's not a real community where new members are accepted. Such closed communities normally die away after a while. On the other hand we have communities like vnboards which are open and friendly.

You see, this is exactly what I'm talking about. You just joined this here lil' community and started with false accusations based on some misconception. I don't recall a case where a new member was turned down and kicked out unless he was an asshole. If you have a specific example proving me wrong, post the link to the thread.

 

[Sharpei_Diem]

But I do want to say that somehow I've gotten the feel that rex and sp don't like "outsiders" (people like me). Maybe it's because they have been doing things like this for much longer, but does it give them the right to laugh at others.

I'd agree with Vault Dweller; The only people who I've ever seen slammed down are those that can't support what they say.

No, those have really want to support something should never act in a way that the noob might feel bad. It doesn't help anyone if the oldtimers make fun of the mistakes noobs might have done. Have some members of this community done that - yes.

I think that's a bit of a naive approach Veg. The net is filled with noobs, trolls and griefers(among other things too) and while I don't like slamming down on noobs, the thing is that it's often difficult(if not sometimes impossible) to tell the difference. Like it or not, some people get off on bothering the fuck out of people. And they like it even more when you try to coddle them. I like the idea that the codex assumes that people posting here have a point, and will post harshly on those that don't.

Someone may well correct me in this, but the codex doesn't exist to support any one product in particular, but to espouse a certain belief in rpg design. Whereas the support of a product depends only on a fondness of the product, the support of this belief requires people have thoughts about it and can support those thoughts. If a person doesn't or can't, then perhaps they shouldn't be here. I don't mean that with any enmity, but just pointing out the reality of the situation.

On the other hand we have communities like vnboards which are open and friendly. Not much on topic discussion, not much anything game related but the community is alive and new members stick around - one does not have to be one of the first ones to stay.

If not much is discussed, then what criteria are you using to establish that it's alive? Hits? Number of members?

 

[Seven]

Because I like doing something with a purpose.

Does your purpose include sabotaging Troika and being a drama queen?

As to the other part of the post, yes, I did disclose on the source, my bad, assuming the people who read this news page aren't total idiots who can't put 2 and 2 together...

What in the news post would lead you to believe that Troika disclosed any information. In fact there is nothing there that would point to a source, please substantiate your answer or get off your horse.

This info had to be given to saint by someone, it wasn't the cleaning lady nor your boyfriend. It was either what I mentioned, or Atari. And judging how Atari handles PR they don't really give a flying fuck about you untill you have "leetnewspage" in your email address. Atari stinks and that's a no brainer. They would not give any info out. Hell, I think 90% of news concerning TToE came up on gamespy or gamespot first.

Why do you take it upon yourself to constantly try and implicate the source of the news? Have you been personnally wronged by the afore mentioned source? For Christ's sake, who do you think you are the news police?

Well what's stopping you? You started a flamewar after all...

That's right I started this. That would mean that I was the one who came to another site with a condescending attitude and tried to expose some one else's news source because my impecable sense of ethics forced me to. Yup, you got me, that was all me.

 

[Jinxed]

I didn't mention fallout tactics without a reason. That game made more sense than your posts.

I must repeat for the 100th time: Such information does not come out of the woodwork. You might as well use all that energy that you're putting into not realising where it came from into not believing me when I mentioned the source. Because it does take a lot not to know where it came from. I was told to wait for an official statement, favourism? Hardly, and why? Because that answer came after I pushed the matter further.

Why don't you just drop it, everyone else here seemed to do it already. No one will convince anyone of anything this time.

Does your purpose include sabotaging Troika and being a drama queen?

I must had it to you, this bit is funny. My post here was about SP doing the same thing. What is NOT part of my purpose is arguing with dolts like you who have ZERO impact on anything that happens. That's why I'm really gone this time, flame away, write whatever you please, I'm not gonna set foot on this thread again.

 

[Sol Invictus]

On the other hand we have communities like vnboards which are open and friendly. Not much on topic discussion, not much anything game related but the community is alive and new members stick around - one does not have to be one of the first ones to stay.

If not much is discussed, then what criteria are you using to establish that it's alive? Hits? Number of members?

I think he means that they talk about nonsense (that's not an insult, that's just what it is), like #interplay on Gamesnet or Missy's forums. Pointless discussion, really.

 

[chrisbeddoes]

By The Time That This Thread has 500 posts everybody will be happy.

Ehh wait a minute mayby not.