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True Endings

Unwanted
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Oftentimes the True Ending is a lot more satisfying and it can be fun to go back and unlock the True Ending sometimes. SMT V’s True Neutral ending requirements are a little obscure, but it’s mostly pretty fun to unlock, and AFAIK is the only way to interact with a specific boss.
What specific boss? You can fight Shiva whenever you want if you are talking about that, you can use spoilers.
 

InD_ImaginE

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Pathfinder: Wrath
lt1ZYil.jpg


WMZBnnB.jpg


What about tr00 endings that get retconned later anyway


tbf Shadow Heart is a very nice one regardless. Normal ending of SH2 has everybody traveling back to place/period of time they wished for,

This time around he wakes up on the train ride back in SH1 with assumption that this time, he is saving Alice (thus getting true ending of SH1).

I find this to be a very nice touch overall.
 

Skinwalker

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What are your thoughts on true endings?
Bullshit mechanic for spergs to artificially encourage replayability. "Ooh, you want to know how the story REALLY ends, why don't you run through the game with no pistol in less than 15 hours, keep trying to get that S+ rank, tee hee!!"

FUCK OFF
 
Joined
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Depends on the game.

I don't think gritty war stories like Suikoden should have a true ending, as they usually involve "the main characters are resurrected and lives happily ever after" and undermine the tragedy and the sacrifices.
 

InD_ImaginE

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Depends on the game.

I don't think gritty war stories like Suikoden should have a true ending, as they usually involve "the main characters are resurrected and lives happily ever after" and undermine the tragedy and the sacrifices.

playing Suikoden once naturally and seeing the painful ending and then playing next with 108 stars and everybody being happy is worth it. it's the best feeling in the world. Suikoden 2 is the best on this one.
 

SumDrunkGuy

Guest
Any game with multiple endings gets the youtube treatment from me. Ain't got time for that stupid shit.
 

Rahdulan

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Valkyrie Profile has an ending that most information says is impossible to get by accident. You must have lowered Valkyries Seal Value by a specific number by a specific chapters. Complete a named tower by the end of chapter 4. Recruit two specific characters in chapter 3. Send a specific character to Valhalla in chapter 5 or 6. There is several guiders on how to achieve this ending. All contain massive spoilers and are extraordinarily comprehensive. About 45 hours to beat the game.

You got any of that, mhmmmm, Strategy Guide?

crack-cocaine.jpg


I can only surmise desire to sell those was a strong motivator behind obtuse true endings. In comparison something like Yoko Taro's approach of "beat the game X number of times for new tidbits of info or different ending(s)" to his games seems perfectly innocent.
 

Sarathiour

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It's a thing in a lot Japanese game, not just jrpg. Lot of Castlevania got at least two endings.

I don't really get the complain for falcom's game, true ending are extremely lenient in Ys 8 and TX, and you can skip all the way through the extra boss in CS4 for the true ending if you initially missed it an the game is piss easy in the first place).

It was also a thing in old arcade game, where you get an ending depending on the difficulty level. I'm totally fine with that, because I think difficulty is an integral part of the story telling, which his a view that has been brutally butchered with all the new journalo crybaby.

I unironically think the way Kingamker did it was an interesting one : it require a few steps that could not really do without foreknowledge, but veer the ending in a different direction if you the "meta" knowledge of previous playthrough.
You probably won't prevent Narysssa from getting her hand on vordekai' eyes on you first playthrough, but on a a second one, you can persuade tristan from breaking it aas soon as he gets it, which prevent naryssa from getting her hand on the bryar in Pitax.
 

kaisergeddon

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Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
The Mercenaries SRPGs are another collection of Japanese games that give path choices halfway through them due to the inspiration the series takes from Tactics Ogre. Like that game, these paths steer the narrative in different directions, and give you unique characters too.

Most interestingly, picking one of the paths in Mercenaries Blaze turns a protagonist into an enemy who rejoins much later with a cursed class, and you see the same events from different perspectives. It's neat, and the outcomes are mixed enough that most of the time you can't call any of them a "true" ending.

The latest game, Mercenaries Rebirth, has two choices up front. You can decide to fight your brother, or ignore him and proceed will helping the war resistance. However, a third path besides the other two unlocks only after beating the game, and it's interesting because this is the first time the series has a true ending. It sounds like a lot of work, but they're fairly quick games to beat that don't waste time, and you can keep a save before making the choice so you can experience the changes without starting over entirely.

Basically, what I'm saying is I like true endings when they aren't committing you to hundreds of hours of slave labor, and if they're treated as a reward for digging deeper into the game mechanics and clearing optional contest like hidden battles and bosses. Mercenaries unlocks new fights, difficulty levels, and content if you're willing to play them multiple times, so getting three different story paths is a sort of gift to ease the repetition. You only need a single clear to get it too.
 

Terra

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Some games have multiple endings. Some of those have "True Endings". Sometimes they are referred to as a secret ending.They are almost always the desired ending. Being longer, tying up loose ends, extra cutscenes are some of the benefits of getting the true ending. JRPG's for whatever reasons really seem to be the dominant force when it comes to true endings. Many times they involve some obscure set of invisible rules the player must complete in often times, a shocking display of randomness. Some games go so far as to not give you the true ending even if the player so much as does one thing out of order or answers a question wrong. Usually though its a complex affair. Many times the only way to be sure you are getting the true ending is to look it up which is inevitably filled with spoilers.

Valkyrie Profile has an ending that most information says is impossible to get by accident. You must have lowered Valkyries Seal Value by a specific number by a specific chapters. Complete a named tower by the end of chapter 4. Recruit two specific characters in chapter 3. Send a specific character to Valhalla in chapter 5 or 6. There is several guiders on how to achieve this ending. All contain massive spoilers and are extraordinarily comprehensive. About 45 hours to beat the game.

What are your thoughts on true endings?
I like true endings, so long as they follow and favour the most complete route / path of most development for the characters. So like with Valkyrie Profile; you have to unearth Lenneth's past, deal with Lezard and a whole bunch of other stuff I'm forgetting. You pretty much do all the things you only scratch the surface of in the B/C routes. True endings should both embody & conclude the main story's themes, I think.

I feel true ending/routes should also, where appropriate, favour / include said game's waifu (and that character's main quest / plot beats should lead up to and play into the finale. Not the absolute best example (and I can't fully cite the details as I've yet to do it), but something like Nyrissa in Pathfinder Kingmaker; she's one of the main baddies and plays a pivotal role in the story, but is also a hidden romance. Similarly, you could have characters like Morrigan in DA:O who tie into the endgame and the continuation of that arc in potential (properly made) sequel is obviously infinitely more interesting than the characters without a tie to the main overarching plotline. Another more contempory example might be Geralt's love interest in Witcher 3; it's very much set up to favour Yennefer, and in my opinion, rightly so.

Ideally, I think a true ending path should be somewhat hidden/obfuscated; while we can debate the execution, the recent Pathfinder Wrath has its true ending hints littered across the path of the game, but you'd probably never fully unlock it the first time through. This is fine, I think, like with Valkyrie Profile, having a riddle to ponder and having to read between the lines to find a hidden way of dealing with/escaping a seemingly inescapable situation strikes me as something that is an inherent positive in gaming. I think allowing the player a hidden, hard to achieve "out" or way to overcome a situation where the deck is stacked against them, and allowing them to feel that they figured it out themselves is a great way to end a game (although, debatably, most game's true endings are too obfuscated, necessitating usage of a guide and diminishing any feeling of accomplishment in the process). I think Shadow of Destiny/Shadow of Memories on PS2 is a good example of how to do this well. In the game; you are killed near the start and given the ability to travel through time to some extent by a mysterious benefactor. Shit happens, and there are various ways the game can end, with the true ending being you getting the better of the antagonist. Admittedly it is a game meant for replays and structured around delving deeper until the player hits the true ending, but it embodies the notion of letting the player feel like they figured it out themself quite well.

You mention Lenneth's "Seal" value in Valkyrie Profile. I think there is probably enough to go on from the game's intro in the Weeping Lily Meadow and scattered across the game to guess at who Lenneth really is/was and to make a determination that the seal itself is something negative imposed on her by Odin. Sending specific characters to Valhalla in/by certain chapters seems a little more difficult to unravel imo. I'll grant you, VP's true ending path isn't perfect, but I think having it be somewhat obfuscated was the right call. Your first playthrough/maybe second - you can see there's something there beneath the surface, even if you don't know exactly how to get at it. Heck, I'm currently replaying FF7 (with mods) and there are moments where the game flat out doesn't tell you where to go next on the main plot path, requiring you to venture out into the world and gather info; unheard of in today's AAA space, but back in the PS1 days, not all that uncommon, I sure as heck didn't remember the game doing that till I started my replay a week ago though!

I think true endings, if they are picked as canon by a developer, offer an opportunity to inherit the most complex & payoff rich worldstate for a sequel, provided the setup was there in the first place. This in itself, I think, is often preferable to having 3 different flavours of "sweet fuck all" afforded to us in sequels with save imports. I don't give a fuck who my character romanced in game X if none of it matters moving forward, but is one of them becomes the Omega Doom Goddess 5000 in the sequel, sign me the fuck up, I'm coming in for that later payoff.

True endings can lead to one "gaming the system" I suppose, Suikoden being a good example, there are certainly some characters that probably deserve to die, but you must recruit them to realise the true ending... I think getting the player to the true end finishing line, without it feeling "gamey" in some way, can be a challenge.

The Suikodens handled their true endings well in terms of final payoff, Suiko 3 particularly, given you got to see the antagonist's motivations and actions from his POV, with minor allusions to the Suiko 1 & 2 heroes true runebearers as semi justifications of his actions. It's one of the best examples of multi-game payoff in my opinion.

Shadow Hearts was an odd one, I think SH2 went with the bad ending, BUT, I think it ended in such a way that the SH1 good ending happens as a direct result of the endgame time travel shenanigans in SH2. As a result, both endings are "true" in a sense. My memory is hazy on this one though as it's been a long time.

Then you have endings like FFX-2's which arguably undermines the ending of the original...

Hell, despite my best efforts, I never got to see Vandal Hearts 2's true ending as the protagonist's waifu Rosa killed herself close to end due to me missing something... twice!

Then there are games where you can't get the true ending on your first run, but it's still the true ending, even though it's initially unachievable... This seems a bit illogical, but there's games that do it.

So in conclusion, I like them, they shouldn't take the form of a 100% collectathon like FFX-2, but should instead require a series of actions from the player to unlock.
 

Rean

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Strap Yourselves In
This was quite tilting since after normal ending credits start to roll and after it you can decide if you want to try the new ending. I missed true ending (realized it later thought) because why would I watch 5min credit screen.


LMAO IMAGINE NOT WATCHING THE ENTIRETY OF COLD STEEL CREDITS WHILE SILENTLY SOBBING
Noob.
 

ELEXmakesMeHard

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Are there any good examples of unexpected true endings?

The closest I can think of is nu-XCOM 2, which assumes you fucked up in nu-XCOM 1. But those obviously aren't RPGs.
 

InD_ImaginE

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Are there any good examples of unexpected true endings?

The true ending for the GBA Tactics Ogre shows that you are actually playing the origin story of one of the main villain of the original Tactics Ogre.

The True Ending, so to speak, is the "Bad Ending" resulting in the events of original Tactics Ogre.
 

Krraloth

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Covenant makes Yuri look like the biggest retard to ever live. Didn't save Alice, never acquired Seraphic Radiance and has Albert, quite literally, living rent free in his head
True but then at the end of Covenant you go back in time and save her. So a true ending would of Shadow Hearts is acheived by SH1 let her die -> SH Covenant back in time -> SH1 save Alice
So in true ending timeline Covenant events never happened

Inviato dal mio A80S utilizzando Tapatalk
 
Unwanted
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Are there any good examples of unexpected true endings?

The closest I can think of is nu-XCOM 2, which assumes you fucked up in nu-XCOM 1. But those obviously aren't RPGs.
Dungeon Travelers 2-2, game starts with the party losing the final battle, 2-2 is basically post apocalyptic setting where the store vendor is a jewish robot.
U9BtQ5i.png
 

Dishonoredbr

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I like True Ending but only if the others endings are very clearly meant to be fake, bad ending or incomplete endings.

I really dislike when JRPGs like Shin Megami Tensei include a True Ending because invalidates all other endings and make then pretty pointless because there's obvious right option when those games are all about not having a right or wrong answer.

I think they work pretty fine in a game like Caligula Effect. But i dislike when comes to something like Devil Survivor 2 and Daichi's ending.
 

Hyperion

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The most recent example is Triangle Strategy, where you have three endings, all of which are very clearly flawed. The player immediately sees that any ending involves using limited resources to go all in on one thing, giving up two other things that they had fought hard for. There are gameplay costs to your party as well. This fits perfectly with the game's story strengths, which is to show that every faction ideology has its own costs and that your MC cannot magically solve every problem to everyone's satisfaction.

But then, you discover the True Ending, in which you, the underdog faction beset by powerful forces, can suddenly do everything you need to do across the entire world simultaneously and completely overturn the political order of every country and basically end up with "all problems are solved" future. Why is this "better"? This isn't more satisfying for the player unless you happen to like this kind of magic wonderland. It cheapens the existing endings and the story as a whole

Triangle is a bit different from most games when it comes to the Golden Route. The game itself is kinda designed to be played more than once, the choices required to pull it off make sense from a characterization standpoint, and the 3-pronged attack that Serenoa devises as a way to fulfill all 3 of your advisors' whining is recognized as a *major* risk and if any of the 3 fail, the entire army is fucked. Plus, the requirements, rather than being obscure bullshit, are ingame challenges that make sense from a story standpoint. Convincing your confidants to become smugglers, taking a chance with Svarog and Roland's identity, defying your Muslim Hyzantian overlords and protecting the jews Roselle isn't always an easy task, and choosing to visit your Dad who just woke up from a coma just makes sense from a personal standpoint.

And it's only possible if you beat back Avlora's siege on your home fort without wasting the Wildfire, which is arguably one of the hardest things to pull off on a blind playthrough. The game overloads you with hints from NPCs that maybe destroying your vassals' home to repel an enemy invasion is not what you should not be doing.

The result of that is dividing your entire army and having 3 battles that are quite difficult if you aren't on NG+, and is completely worth a fresh start to experience. The only downside of the whole playthrough is that seeing Serenoa's determination suddenly steels Roland's conviction to not be a total cuck just waiting to be usurped by the rightful heir instead of giving the throne away to the next group of zealots who promise equality.

I have a bigger issue with the non-Golden Route choices at endgame than the true ending, because of the 3 choices only Benedict's makes any sort of sense. You're then left with usurp the throne, cuck to the muzzies, or desert the entire nation and go on a search for fantasy Jerusalem which isn't even known to fucking exist.

So yeah, I have less of an issue with the Golden Route than I do the Roland and Frederica endings being downright stupid. Also, if you do the opposite of what Frederica wants in all choices (except protecting the Roselle, which you'd be stupid not to expect some sort of negative out of selling thrm out) you'll get the Golden Ending. Keep a firm grip on your balls, men.
 

Alpan

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Grab the Codex by the pussy Pathfinder: Wrath
In Persona 4 they call it the Golden Ending. You need to max out a specific characters specific social link. Which unlocks new personas, an extra in game couple of months, and a new lore based dungeon. To be able to do that one must go to a specific room on April 18th. Spend time with the aforementioned character on speicific days unless of course its raining. You must then travel to downtown, have a specific persona equipped for the extra points it nets you. To get this persona you must be level 18, and perform a specific fusion with with three specific characters. There there is a series of conversations topics, 7 to be exact, save for the first one, the 6 following must be answered with the "correct" choices. Expect around 90 hours or more before seeing an ending.

I get the general critique about True Endings requiring obnoxious things, but P4G isn't an example of them. This is a vast misrepresentation of what it actually takes.

Basically, you don't need most of the stuff you say you need. The "specific room" you mention is a key area you visit frequently because of its gameplay function. April 18 is the baseline, not the deadline. You do need to max out that character's Social Link but you can pretty much do it -- I mean, you just do it -- playing through the game normally. You certainly don't need the matching Persona to give you extra points. The bit about the dialogue choices is correct, but in that case you find out very quickly that you fucked up, because you get the bad ending, so can just reload instead of having to play many hours again.

Yes, the game is long with multiple endings. But you don't need to work hard to get the best one.
 

Late Bloomer

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I get the general critique about True Endings requiring obnoxious things, but P4G isn't an example of them. This is a vast misrepresentation of what it actually takes.

Basically, you don't need most of the stuff you say you need. The "specific room" you mention is a key area you visit frequently because of its gameplay function. April 18 is the baseline, not the deadline. You do need to max out that character's Social Link but you can pretty much do it -- I mean, you just do it -- playing through the game normally. You certainly don't need the matching Persona to give you extra points. The bit about the dialogue choices is correct, but in that case you find out very quickly that you fucked up, because you get the bad ending, so can just reload instead of having to play many hours again.

Yes, the game is long with multiple endings. But you don't need to work hard to get the best one.

I apologise for any confusion. I know it sucks to see a game you enjoyed on a list where someone might be critical of it. I enjoyed the games I listed. If a game is disagreeable, I just quit. But true ending, in this case, the Golden ending can be daunting, frustrating and in many cases unwarranted. I didnt want to post step by steps well because I was trying to go from memory. A few I verified. Anyhow, here is a step by step guide for Golden. I am trying to figure out how to make this a spoiler tag but I am new so lets see if I can.

Complete Aeon SL by 12/22. In December, SL will be available everyday.
Reach rank 6 of Jester before November. SL available during the day at Junes and night in the Shopping District.
On 12/03, you’ll be asked, “What do you want to do…. Leader?” The following responses you pick should be, C A C B C B. You know you’ve started the golden ending when a certain SL is complete and a new one starts.
On 12/05, choose person #10 when going through the list of suspects and tell your friends who it is.
On 12/07, when the game asks you a question, choose option A.
On 01/02, go to the Velvet Room. Choose dialogue options, B A/B A A.
On your last day, don’t go home when the game asks and go to Junes.

If you dont do this exactly? Bad ending.
 

Alpan

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Grab the Codex by the pussy Pathfinder: Wrath
It's fine, I wasn't offended that you criticized the game. But if you genuinely think the Golden Ending of P4G is frustrating I honestly am not sure what I can tell you, because it just isn't. I suppose it can be frustrating if you prefer to just blast through dialogue options always selecting the first option, or something, but otherwise I don't see it, sorry.
 

Late Bloomer

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It's fine, I wasn't offended that you criticized the game. But if you genuinely think the Golden Ending of P4G is frustrating I honestly am not sure what I can tell you, because it just isn't. I suppose it can be frustrating if you prefer to just blast through dialogue options always selecting the first option, or something, but otherwise I don't see it, sorry.

Totally not the type to blast through dialogue. Its a touchy subject to be sure. But its been good conversation throughout.
 

Falksi

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I can't think of a "true" ending which was worth the extra effort tbh. All my favorite endings are straight up ones which just emotionally grab you by the bollocks and leave a lasting impression (Phantasy Star 4, FFX etc.)

I like the idea of alternate endings, but it should be based on C&C and actions you encounter throughout the game, not having to fanny about on some 30 hour excursion which you'd never do without a guide.
 

jungl

Augur
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the only game that implemented this right where it was not annoying was chrono cross and lesser extent trigger.
 

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