KickStarter Underworld Ascendant Pre-Prototype Thread

[Morgoth]

Nostalgia Looking Glasses.

Also, the devs told mindx2 that if they met the main goal only, they will make a game that's good for what it is...

The way i see is they will bring a tight game focused on their basic ideas... and it will miss a lot of features they would implement had they got more money... It feels like legend of grimrock, which the 2nd game was bigger and more polished (so it seems). Maybe Underworld ascendant 2 will be more complete. even if one compare UU 1 and 2, it's noticeable that UU is a more polished game, and not as experimental as the first.

In any case, looking glass games were never blockbusters... It is fitting the kickstarter campaign is not a huge hit.

A restrained budget will only stiffen their rigor and make their creativity hormones flow harder, resulting in an overall better game. This is LGS folks we're talking here. They wouldn't know what to do with an exuberant budget to begin with, apart from throwing daily Pizza nights.

 

[Melan]

So, yesterday I bought GOG copies of the first two games (I still have my boxed originals, but they are far away) and started UUW1, which I last played in the mid-90s. I have explored all of level 1, some of level 2, and dipped down to level 3 and 4. I am playing a bard with a mixture of combat/misc skills, and haven't even touched the magic system.

• So far, the game is exceedingly generous with stuff. The promise is that I will need to scavenge to survive, but what I'm actually doing is throwing away serviceable cudgels and suits of leather armour because I am loaded with equipment, carrying the equivalent of a pantry, and enough light sources to start a shop.
  
• The levels are surprisingly small, but - that bit of LGS magic - use this space well. Lots of ways to travel through them in interesting ways, with good jumping puzzles and waterways that both isolate and connect various sections. Elevations and slopes also help to break up the terrain a bit.
  
• To compensate for the short distances, the lighting engine is really short-range, unlike more modern games (even their alpha footage) where you can see far ahead. If you ever ran out of torches and oil, you could barely see your toes (but it never comes to that). That's different and cool.
  
• The factions are also very small. There are something like four outlaws and maybe seven goblins per tribe. I remember it was low-key, but not this low-key.
  
• It uses the WASX layout, and every time I want to backpedal by reflex, I end up sliding closer to my doom.
• Leeches. Leeches are cool.

My main surprise has been the ease of survival, even though I remembered almost nothing concrete about the game.

 

[Darkzone]

Sure, a vocal group of PC owners conjured up a lot of hatred towards Microsoft, but unless I'm living in a parallel universe, the days of their iron-fisted market dominance have long since faded, they're actually struggling in some ways and the new corporate overlord that seeks to control you and your life is Apple - but the difference is that while people hated MS for trying to control their lives, people LOVE Apple for doing the exact same thing.

Apple is a religion and that is a differece. Apple fanboys are not fanboys, but are blind followers and believers. My best friend is sadly one of this mindless drones...
But despite that OS:X is fantastic on an apple machine, the freedom of Linux is awesome, and the Windows hatred is also irrational. I play and programm also on Windows and most people can afford themself a Windows OS.
I have to defend Apple on one point: they develop much in the software department, and they try to optimise OS:X even further. Ok they do this to grow their own market share, but windows is still stuck in their old kernel structure without improvement.

I'll never understand why M$ was successfully sued for shipping IE (crappy as it is) with their OS whilst iOS ships with a ton of proprietary software - some of which cannot be replaced by something non-Apple without Jaibreaking your device - yet they get away with it all?

Politics and NSA, not justice and truth.

And Linux ... fifteen years ago, I worked in a Linux only office, and a collegue of mine had a T-Shirt which still holds truth today: "Linux: The Operating System of the future", and then in smallprint "Since 25 years".

Nice t-shirt. No i love Linux but the problem is the community itself. While the kernel development is supported by the industry against windows server, the rest is not. And when someone (canonical) try to give a direction, the community leashes against them. Also the support from hardware developers is less than good.

 

[rezaf]

Apple is a religion and that is a differece. Apple fanboys are not fanboys, but are blind followers and believers.

True enough, I'd brofist this statement if I could.

I have to defend Apple on one point: they develop much in the software department, and they try to optimise OS:X even further.

I had a company iPhone a while back for a couple of months before they moved to android, and there's clearly a night and day difference in UI and usability, so Apple clearly does SOME things right, no doubt about it.
They charge a fortune for their crap and too often flat our refuse to support standards (SD Cards, USB etc.), and they police their systems to a degree that's downright insulting, but at least they expend some effort and stick to their plans.

I'd totally have understood if Microsoft wanted to clone the AppStore, for example, which is what they appeared to be going for with the ... whatever the Win8 Modern UI store thingy is called these days.
But in typical modern MS fashion, they totally borked it, it's hardly policed, a pain to use and generally crappy.
That's why I wrote Microsoft isn't threatening to anyone these days. Maybe once it was Darth Vader, but these days? Jar Jar Binks.

Nice t-shirt. No i love Linux but the problem is the community itself. While the kernel development is supported by the industry against windows server, the rest is not. And when someone (canonical) try to give a direction, the community leashes against them. Also the support from hardware developers is less than good.

Linux sux. Well, actually it's decent enough in principle, but even the most prominent distributions that tried to become mass-market-compatible failed so hard it isn't even funny. If you actually want to do something with your computer that doesn't involve mundane tasks (office work, programming etc) it happens far too early that you are expected to compile exotic libraries (and their references) by yourself, RTFM which is a 1275 page text file or, failing that, a seven screen long description of the parameters the executable will process/expect and then live with applications that are oblivious to each other (no copy-paste between them, not even text) and each come with their own set of UI paradigms (different hotkeys for everything). Then, as you mentioned, often enough trying to find a driver for something sometimes makes you wish you'd decided to do something easier such as launching your own space program.

Now, maybe someone sould relay the two of us to an asylum a thread where this stuff is the actual topic, lest we lob this one even further astray?

To include some alibi-statement about the topic at hand ...

Melan: How could you forget so much about the Underworld games? I think they are so memorable. I played them maybe twice, but I still remember their feel - it was so unique. I think I'd feel right at home in some levels even after at least ten years. I remember that cavern with the underground river in UUW2, where you fought yetis. Or travelling to the "orc dimension" with the crystal and killing everybody there, so it was one giant loot pinata.
The entrance area of UUW1, or the weird magical realm where you had to bounce around those ball thingies.
Man, I gotta replay those after I finish my current project of going through the GoldBox games again...

 

[Darkzone]

I have to defend Apple on one point: they develop much in the software department, and they try to optimise OS:X even further.

I had a company iPhone a while back for a couple of months before they moved to android, and there's clearly a night and day difference in UI and usability, so Apple clearly does SOME things right, no doubt about it.
They charge a fortune for their crap and too often flat our refuse to support standards (SD Cards, USB etc.), and they police their systems to a degree that's downright insulting, but at least they expend some effort and stick to their plans.

I:OS and Android have two different approaches towards user control, and that makes up most of the perception. I:OS give control to the user while it is not finished. Android waits for finishing of the start of the program to give the control to the user.
I don't like the usability of I:OS, it is kind of too smooth. It is not tekky it is bad utopia style. I hate also therefore the updates of OS:X after Snow Leopard.

Linux sux. Well, actually it's decent enough in principle, but even the most prominent distributions that tried to become mass-market-compatible failed so hard it isn't even funny. If you actually want to do something with your computer that doesn't involve mundane tasks (office work, programming etc) it happens far too early that you are expected to compile exotic libraries

If you work with robots, scientifically and you don't have the budget of X.milions, then that is the way to go.

Alibi-statement:
I like the picture that mindx2 has taken from the Otherside office. Nothing say more than the interior of the office and this guys: "I'm a nerd, a computer geek. Give me Kit Kat and Club-Mate and i will work for free."
Weird Al Yankovic should go there and sing for free 'White and Nerdy'.

 

[Gord]

Nice t-shirt. No i love Linux but the problem is the community itself. While the kernel development is supported by the industry against windows server, the rest is not. And when someone (canonical) try to give a direction, the community leashes against them. Also the support from hardware developers is less than good.

Linux sux. Well, actually it's decent enough in principle, but even the most prominent distributions that tried to become mass-market-compatible failed so hard it isn't even funny. If you actually want to do something with your computer that doesn't involve mundane tasks (office work, programming etc) it happens far too early that you are expected to compile exotic libraries (and their references) by yourself, RTFM which is a 1275 page text file or, failing that, a seven screen long description of the parameters the executable will process/expect and then live with applications that are oblivious to each other (no copy-paste between them, not even text) and each come with their own set of UI paradigms (different hotkeys for everything). Then, as you mentioned, often enough trying to find a driver for something sometimes makes you wish you'd decided to do something easier such as launching your own space program.

Too much fragmentation. With dozens of major distros there's just too little consistency in the underlying framework. It is much better nowadays, but it still can happen easily that something works without a hitch on one distro and is near-impossible to set up on a different, closely related one (e.g. works on Ubuntu, doesn't work on Mint).
A certain passive-aggressive mindset of aspie-Linux-geeks doesn't help either (although most are pretty decent folks, but I sometimes get the impression that esp. the high-profile users are just cunts).

Melan
The survival aspect in the UUs is not very pronounced indeed. With some competence you will have no trouble finding enough food or other equipment to get by, especially since you can create food trhough magic or go fishing. Exploration is great, though, often yielding some rare things like certain runes or magical weapons and armor.

 

[Melan]

Melan: How could you forget so much about the Underworld games? I think they are so memorable. I played them maybe twice, but I still remember their feel - it was so unique. I think I'd feel right at home in some levels even after at least ten years. I remember that cavern with the underground river in UUW2, where you fought yetis. Or travelling to the "orc dimension" with the crystal and killing everybody there, so it was one giant loot pinata.
The entrance area of UUW1, or the weird magical realm where you had to bounce around those ball thingies.
Man, I gotta replay those after I finish my current project of going through the GoldBox games again...

Again, the last I last played them was around 1996. :D Today, those memories could vote, drive and buy drinks.

 

[Minttunator]

Only $5K left to go and 7 days until the project closes - I'd say there's even a slight chance to reach the first stretch goal, depending on whether they manage a decent final push!

 

[catfood]

Honestly I hope they don't reach the second goal, but rather that they stop at about 700K. It's best to not to stretch too thinly the already meager funds.

 

[Infinitron]

VR update: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/othersidegames/underworld-ascendant/posts/1148942

Anyway, based on these considerations we are not prepared to make a decision yet as to if we might support VR for Underworld Ascendant. We will be staying on top of upcoming advances in the technology, and spending a bit more time doing experiments over the coming months. But until we get to a point where we are confident that the hardware is ready, and that we could deliver a great experience, we need to wait and see.

 

[mindx2]

I'll post the whole thing here:

#22
Messing around with VR

Posted by OtherSide Entertainment

Jeff having fun with VR
Many of you have been asking about VR for Underworld Ascendant. On our forum survey, over 40% say they have extremely strong or strong interest in this technology. That’s higher than we’d anticipated, especially considering the limited availability of VR these days. VR would be a natural fit for Underworld Ascendant for sure, as the game’s experience is rooted in deep immersion.

In fact, we have been working with an Oculus Rift developer kit. We’ve only spent a day so far experimenting with the kit on Underworld Ascendant, but already the prototype is running with full Oculus Rift support.

Playing it myself, it’s pretty darn cool! In the chamber shown in the prototype with the rickety wooden bridge over the pit of lava, I actually hesitated for a few moments, before stepping out over the void.

Peering down into the lava pit
VR holds great potential for us. However, a lot more goes into a great VR experience than simply getting a headset hooked up. For instance, it’s challenging to move through a 3D fantasy world while looking around in VR, while at the same time being in control of your character. To our knowledge, the hardware controllers / interfaces to make this all seamless have as yet to perfected. Also, the generation of VR headset that we are experimenting with does not support the combination of high-frame rates and high-resolution that we feel are needed to deliver a truly immersive experience we would be after for Underworld Ascendant. The upcoming generation of VR hardware promises to deliver on this front.

Then there are a bunch of details, such as supporting a user interface through VR, which is somewhat different than doing it well on a LCD monitor.

Finally, we are well aware that VR hardware, and a sufficiently powerful PC and graphics card to drive it, don’t come cheap. Most who play Underworld Ascendant would not have access to VR, at least not for a few years to come. So even if we were to support VR, it is essential that the game play wonderfully well without VR.

On a side note, some of us actually did VR headset support at LookingGlass in 1996. This was the first generation of consumer VR, and we experimented using it for Terra Nova and Flight Unlimited. We quickly concluded the technology was far from ready.

Anyway, based on these considerations we are not prepared to make a decision yet as to if we might support VR for Underworld Ascendant. We will be staying on top of upcoming advances in the technology, and spending a bit more time doing experiments over the coming months. But until we get to a point where we are confident that the hardware is ready, and that we could deliver a great experience, we need to wait and see.

We will continue to solicit feedback from our fans to help gauge interest, and keep you up to date with any new VR developments. We might put out a prototype with VR support to get more direct feedback down the line.

Announcements
As of this morning, we have reached over $595,000 in funding, and 10,500 backers. Yesterday was our best day since the first week of the campaign. A bunch of you stepped up to higher pledge tiers, and we’re incredibly grateful for your support. Also a lot more folks joined our community.

If this pace keeps up we’ll reach the $600,000 base funding later today, which would be phenomenal! We are as eager as we can be to dive into the stretch goals. Let’s keep the ball rolling!

On a side note, the new Digital Protagonist pledge tier seems popular. We did see a few folks who had stepped down from a higher pledge tier express regret that they were now funding the game less. Just so that they are aware, they can increase their pledge by adding on to the tier amount, either to put some money aside to get some Add-Ons, or simply to pledge more.

We have a new character to introduce, Jabbering Bertha. It turns out that Bart had a wife. After Bart was turned into a chattering skull, his soon to be deceased wife insisted she too would be. The two can talk up a storm! Sadly, Jabbering Bertha got separated from Bart. Indeed, taken through a portal to the land of the Shroud of the Avatar. For any players who get Bertha as a $5 digital Add-On in both games, the two will be reunited, and swap some unique quips. Not only that, but Bertha will put on her lipstick for Bart. Please just don’t make any ‘lipstick on a pig’ jokes, Bertha can be sensitive about her looks.

Today I wanted to introduce you to another member of our team, Joe Fielder. Joe spent some years at Electronic Arts as a designer, writer and producer on the Medal of Honor series. More recently he did much of the dialog for BioShock Infinite. Joe is doing narrative design in Underworld Ascendant. He speaks for himself:

https://d2pq0u4uni88oo.cloudfront.n...5f0721443c65bb6fb3dfde87c9_h264_high.jpg?2015
Joe has also written a blog post, on how narrative can work in an open world game like Underworld Ascendant. Take a READ http://www.underworldascendant.com/the-game/dev-updates.php.


Paul Neurath

 

[CyberP]

"Finally, I wanted to call your attention to another game that is looking to break new ground in an established genre. The folks over at Windy Hill Studio are taking the 2D platformer to new heights with Orphan. They are in the final days of their Kickstarter, so head on over and check them out"

Picking bunnies at random from your magic hat again, Sir? The game looks like a Limbo clone, and I have no idea how Limbo ever became successful because no new ground was broken at all, rather the game was relatively content-less..,this looks more of the same.

"For any players who get Bertha as a $5 digital Add-On in both games, the two will be reunited, and swap some unique quips. Not only that, but Bertha will put on her lipstick for Bart."

Corrupted in your time working on mobile games...sigh. I still love you guys but you're breaking my heart.

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

 

[Bubbles]

Today I wanted to introduce you to another member of our team, Joe Fielder. Joe spent some years at Electronic Arts as a designer, writer and producer on the Medal of Honor series. More recently he did much of the dialog for BioShock Infinite. Joe is doing narrative design in Underworld Ascendant.

 

[Infinitron]

Today I wanted to introduce you to another member of our team, Joe Fielder. Joe spent some years at Electronic Arts as a designer, writer and producer on the Medal of Honor series. More recently he did much of the dialog for BioShock Infinite. Joe is doing narrative design in Underworld Ascendant.

If only they had the original story designer of Thief and System Shock 2...oh wait.

 

[Metro]

If only they weren't wasting money on a guy with NARRATIVE experience in such gems as MOH and Bioderp. Hell I'd rather see it go to VR!

 

[Infinitron]

Oh, here's his dev update. It wasn't up when the update was published: http://underworldascendant.com/the-game/dev-updates.php

It's really inspiring working with designers as talented as Paul, Tim, and Scott. Looking Glass Studios' Ultima Underworld 1 + 2, System Shock, and Thief 1 + 2 helped create immersive sandbox gameplay and now they intend to push it to its next level with Underworld Ascendant. It's going to be something new and different, unlike anything you've ever played before. Creating a narrative that does it justice will be an incredibly fun challenge.

You're going to take an active hand in altering a dynamic underworld ecology, so you'll constantly be either averting or contributing to disaster. It's your choice. You drive the narrative.

Werner Herzog once said, "The common denominator of the universe is not harmony, but chaos, hostility, and murder." That's a bit dark, but clearly true in The Stygian Abyss. It's one of the most hostile environments possible. And yet Cabirus attempted to build it into a utopia, one of the most optimistic goals imaginable.

Will you decide to follow his example? Or stoke the flames of war?

It'll be our job to craft the story to react to your decisions, immerse in the world, compel you to discover all the amazing things you can do, and goad you to play further.

We'll also be working hard to ensure Underworld Ascendant retains its deep dark dungeon fantasy feel, but in a fresh, original way that's all its own. Part of that means coming up with takes on races that are different from what you've seen elsewhere.

For instance, the Dwarves in Underworld Ascendant are true mountain folk: rugged frontier types who are smart and wary, like early pioneers like Kit Carson mixed with HBO's Deadwood and Jack London's White Fang. They feel a distinct sense of ownership over the Underworld since they erected much of its infrastructure and see the other intelligent races as freeloaders, at best.

Meanwhile, the Shamblers are a fungal society, an alien hive mind who view The Stygian Abyss as a complete ecosystem... which would thrive under its direct care. The Dark Elves are obsessed with attaining mental and physical perfection, like a mix of Spartan warriors and social Darwinists. They're fiercely independent, rankle at what they perceive as The Shamblers' controlling influence, and like to pick fights with the Dwarves simply to test their mettle.

As in the original Ultima Underworld games, no race has a set alignment. Each faction has its own unique worldview and valid reasons for their actions. They're headed for conflict and, likely, tragedy.

As you've likely heard, voice actors Terri Brosius and Stephen Russell will be lending their considerable talents to the game. I'm in awe at the prospect of getting to write for the two of them. It'll be a tough challenge to create characters who are as memorable as System Shock's SHODAN and Thief's Garrett, but, likewise, incredibly fun.

I guess that's only fitting, though. As you'll soon see for yourselves, "challenging and fun" is pretty much a consistent theme throughout Underworld Ascendant.

We might just have the makings of a modern classic on our hands. Sincere thanks for your help in making it happen.

 

[PhantasmaNL]

Wow, this KS is really happening right now. No doubt thanks to the excellent Codex interview. creating buzz all over the intarnetz! (ok maybe other factors were more important)

Still im not convinced by the pitch and subsequent updates. Maybe my memory of UU is tainted since i had to play it in slideshow mode on my employer supplied shitty home computer (i think it ran WordPerfect pretty good, and thats about it).

 

[Darkzone]

The Banners, the Bertha and Bert thing, the lute, the buckler and etc. There is no other good explanation than Garriott is financing them, and he wants to push his SotA in every way. 'Ahhhh.' a cry of desperate anger. How could Lord British turn to such a greedy bastard. If he would made a new Ultima isometric single player turn based cRPG, then i would have backed it with over 200 bucks, but i will give nothing for an mmo and this greedy dlc shop. I really don't like their co-working with SotA and Garriott.

About Joe Fielder, i can not really say anything, because i never played Bioshock Infinite or Medal of Honor, but perhaps he can raise to the challenge. And W2 or D:OS are not really unbreakable benchmarks of dialog quality.
About VR. Told you one person less then a week and it works, at least of Oculus VR. Don't know about Razors thing, but this is not out yet, and Morpheus will be only for PS4.

How could Lord British turn to such a greedy bastard.

Hmm. That would be a good topic for a new Ultima.

 

[Infinitron]

FUNDED!

 

[Darkzone]

FUNDED!

Don't tell me that you were sitting there and you watched the revenues counter.

 

[Melan]

Speaking as one, Looking Glass fanboys tend to take things seriously.

 

[Bubbles]

Updated stretch goal map:

Would be fun to have a swamp without lizardmen.

 

[Darth Roxor]

please fund lizardmen please fund lizardmen please fund lizardmen

i really give zero shit about a tracy hickman novel, why keep a tracy hickman novel before lizardmen ffs

 

[Darkzone]

Melan
Zsidó, magyar – két jó barát
Kickstarter ne számolja össze a pénz

The stretch goal map looks now way better. But i would swap places of necropolis and companion creatures. And also between the the haunt and language localisation. And what Darth Roxar said.