World of Darkness Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2 from Hardsuit Labs

[Cricket McBangle]

https://www.wonderstorm.net/about-us

If anyone is curious about where Brian Mitsoda is at now

 

[Ismaul]

https://www.wonderstorm.net/about-us

If anyone is curious about where Brian Mitsoda is at now

So sad.

His comeback has been taken from under his feet, and that might be it. The end.

 

[Cricket McBangle]

Those quotes provide less than zero useful information.

Dangerhairs have no setting between zero and excommunication. They'd say the same thing whether he murdered someone at a company picnic or accidentally misgendered someone's cat.

For the sake of sharing everything I've been told from people who worked on the game directly, I feel it necessary to include it even if it is less than useful. Neither of the two were willing to share more than that. Cara Ellison and Rik Schaeffer spoke highly of him but the impression I got was that many others thought his exit was long overdue. Sure, maybe Mitsoda didn't stick to a script written in LGBTQWERTY and that bothered some people. It could have been that. Considering Mitsoda and Ellison were both cackling about including "depressed bisexual himbos" and other Seattle sterotypes in Bloodlines 2, I could see how those two could have annoyed the fuck out of everyone. I have no idea.

 

[Wesp5]

Considering Mitsoda and Ellison were both cackling about including "depressed bisexual himbos" and other Seattle sterotypes in Bloodlines 2, I could see how those two could have annoyed the fuck out of everyone.

Have you a source for the statement above? Because we still don't know if Mitsoda was fired because he was too woke or not woke enough. I would guess the latter, judging from his writing in Bloodlines 1 and some things in V5 like infamous Rudi.

 

[Roguey]

Looks like I still have to keep mentioning that Brian wasn't in a coma for the past 15 years and is completely on board with the Current Thing. Extremely confident "politics" were not the reason he was fired.

Anyway the himbo crap is from https://www.rebind.io/the-rebind-po...on-vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-ii-4799/

 

[Anonymous Wife Scholar]

Extremely confident "politics" were not the reason he was fired.

What! Roguey anon! Good strong friend anon! Mitsoda anon is not extremely confident anon any metric anon! Is not! He did marriage screeching harpy anon and he does need emotional support glove anon and he did lose game anon to American Seattle millenial shyster developer anon and he is American California cuckold nonsense KNEELER anon so he is not extremely confident anon! Is not! You are a good strong friend anon!

 

[Nano]

They're all assigned fucking pronouns. Oh my god. That's reason enough to quit.

 

[Sarathiour]

They're all assigned fucking pronouns. Oh my god. That's reason enough to quit.

That's actually a rather good way to know if the project is worth even a modicum of interest.

 

[Wesp5]

Extremely confident "politics" were not the reason he was fired.

So you mean "politics" were not involved at all or do you mean Mitsoda was not woke enough and this could have been a reason? Because the only other thing I can imagine is him persisting that things are done the way he writes them while the rest of the team disagrees. And I don't really believe that because his friend Kai was fired at the same time who should have been on his side. I also know that the producer Florian left on his own even before the firings and he never said anything about a connection with Mitsoda being too difficult.

Anyway the himbo crap is from https://www.rebind.io/the-rebind-po...on-vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-ii-4799/

Uh, a 3h podcast, I don't know if I can stomach that !

 

[Infinitron]

Brian Mitsoda was fired from Obsidian once (by Chris Avellone, no less!). Before anything else, the most likely theory is that he was fired from Hardsuit for similar reasons.

 

[Cricket McBangle]

Extremely confident "politics" were not the reason he was fired.

So you mean "politics" were not involved at all or do you mean Mitsoda was not woke enough and this could have been a reason? Because the only other thing I can imagine is him persisting that things are done the way he writes them while the rest of the team disagrees. And I don't really believe that because his friend Kai was fired at the same time who should have been on his side. I also know that the producer Florian left on his own even before the firings and he never said anything about a connection with Mitsoda being too difficult.

How can wokeness play a contributing factor to his firing? By his own account, he stayed on the game long enough to say "the story is pretty much done." If Mitsoda's politics were not in line with what Paradox wanted in the game they were pitched on and then approved, why did they not boot him much earlier? That would mean Paradox were misled into what game Hardsuit Labs were making for several years, finding out how and why, and then deciding to proceed with the development without his and Cluney's involvement (and the rest of HSL for that matter) over what gets released eventually.

 

[Wesp5]

If Mitsoda's politics were not in line with what Paradox wanted in the game they were pitched on and then approved, why did they not have boot him much earlier?

This might have been exactly what has happened. Florian once told me that in the end Paradox wanted a different game compared to what they wanted when development started! I don't know if this is about politics or gameplay or whatever, but I think during the BL2 development time the CEO of Paradox changed and has now changed back.

 

[Roguey]

What! Roguey !! Good strong friend !! Mitsoda ! is not extremely confident ! any metric !! Is not! He did marriage screeching harpy ! and he does need emotional support glove ! and he did lose game ! to American Seattle millenial shyster developer ! and he is American California cuckold nonsense KNEELER ! so he is not extremely confident !! Is not! You are a good strong friend !!

I meant I was confident. It's true that Brian's level of confidence varies with the situation. He convinced a coworker to leave her husband for him and then very likely cheated on her years later leading to their own divorce, so he seems to be quite confident with the ladies (pretty easy when you're a 6'4/193 cm silver fox)

So you mean "politics" were not involved at all or do you mean Mitsoda was not woke enough and this could have been a reason? Because the only other thing I can imagine is him persisting that things are done the way he writes them while the rest of the team disagrees. And I don't really believe that because his friend Kai was fired at the same time who should have been on his side. I also know that the producer Florian left on his own even before the firings and he never said anything about a connection with Mitsoda being too difficult.

The writing team loved him.

As I've mentioned before, he was the one who got Ellison hired. Everyone there was on the same page re: politics, just not other production-related matters.

 

[vortex]

With so many Mitsodas in the field there is already new trilogy being worked and written out.

 

[Cricket McBangle]

If Mitsoda's politics were not in line with what Paradox wanted in the game they were pitched on and then approved, why did they not have boot him much earlier?

This might have been exactly what has happened. Florian once told me that in the end Paradox wanted a different game compared to what they wanted when development started! I don't know if this is about politics or gameplay or whatever, but I think during the BL2 development time the CEO of Paradox changed and has now changed back.

Paradox ordered a game, they were okay with where it was going and then changed their minds when they saw what they got? Even with the CEO change, Fredrik Wester was still on the board of directors at Paradox. There couldn't have been surprises unless some people who acted as communication channels were misleading upper Paradox leadership about what was going in and what was going on with the game.

 

[Roguey]

Paradox ordered a game, they were okay with where it was going and then changed their minds? Even with the CEO change, Fredrik Wester was still on the board of directors at Paradox. It's not like he dipped out completely.

He may have had a seat on the board, but the calls were no longer his to make (hence why he had to step back in as a CEO after Ebba's decisions ran Paradox into the ground).

Avellone alluded to a change in scope in 2018 https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...adox-interactive.126124/page-540#post-7554651

And a glassdoor review likely from Christian Schlüter as Wesp noted: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...adox-interactive.126124/page-531#post-7443925

 

[Wesp5]

Paradox ordered a game, they were okay with where it was going and then changed their minds when they saw what they got?

Maybe. Didn't Paradox shut down WW USA because of political background in a PnP book? I have the "Berlin by Night" source book at home and some real world Nazis are described as being vampires there. How could that have been released today?

 

[Cricket McBangle]

Paradox ordered a game, they were okay with where it was going and then changed their minds when they saw what they got?

Maybe. Didn't Paradox shut down WW USA because of political background in a PnP book? I have the "Berlin by Night" source book at home and some real world Nazis are described as being vampires there. How could that have been released today?

Yeah, Paradox took away White Wolf's autonomy after controversy that came from a Camarilla sourcebook which linked recent LGBT hate crimes in Chechnya to the lore.

The section is as follows:

The recurring international controversy over the persecution of homosexuals is a clever media manipulation designed to keep the focus on Sharia law, away from the true inner workings of the republic. While homosexuals are indeed held in detention facilities for days, and humiliated, starved, tortured, and eventually fed upon and killed, this is not the point. The point is to distract from the truth of what Chechnya has become. That said, even among the Kindred [vampires of the Camarilla] any kind of “homosexual behavior” is punished harshly. ... There is unfortunately nothing we can do for our brothers and sisters in Chechnya who suffer under this — interference is ill-advised at this point, but should any Kindred (or even kine [mortals]) seek asylum within regnums under our control, granting it may win allies to our side who are not just well-trained in combat and thankful to us, but also knowledgeable in the ways of a people who might already be preparing to attack us.

 

[Cricket McBangle]

Paradox ordered a game, they were okay with where it was going and then changed their minds? Even with the CEO change, Fredrik Wester was still on the board of directors at Paradox. It's not like he dipped out completely.

He may have had a seat on the board, but the calls were no longer his to make (hence why he had to step back in as a CEO after Ebba's decisions ran Paradox into the ground).

Avellone alluded to a change in scope in 2018 https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/vampire-the-masquerade-–-bloodlines-2-vaporware-vtmb-sequel-from-paradox-interactive.126124/page-540#post-7554651

And a glassdoor review likely from Christian Schlüter as Wesp noted: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads/vampire-the-masquerade-–-bloodlines-2-vaporware-vtmb-sequel-from-paradox-interactive.126124/page-531#post-7443925

I'll be sure to keep this in mind if I even think about giving Paradox the benefit of doubt ever again.

 

[Alienman]

They fired his gloves, but Mitsoda was too attached.

 

[TheHeroOfTime]

Let's dance on this game grave

 

[RaggleFraggle]

Why is nobody else making urban fantasy rpgs with original IPs?

 

[Vincente]

I have the "Berlin by Night" source book at home and some real world Nazis are described as being vampires there.

Heinrich Himmler himself, in fact. 8th generation Tremere.

 

[Iluvcheezcake]

They're all assigned fucking pronouns. Oh my god. That's reason enough to quit.

Not all of them. I guess its voluntary.
Some still fight the good fight

 

[Wesp5]

I'm half-way through the podcaste that Roguey linked (https://www.rebind.io/the-rebind-po...on-vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-ii-4799/) and there is some interesting info to be found. Once BL2 comes out it might give us some insight on whether Brian and Carla were too woke or not woke enough . I don't know what Re:Bind is about, but the interviewer really was pushing it. Asking about presentation of mental issues, transgender people and even disabled NPCs. While agreeing overall, they pretty much evaded most of these issues as not being critical for the game. Malkavians will be darker, but players will still recognize them. Transgender people will not be central especially as older vampires don't care about genders, which is spot on . There might be some trans NPCs, but pronouns or similar won't make it because they can't be translated into other languages. Disabled NPCs won't play a role as well because of model animations, but there might be a deaf NPC later. So if pronouns and trans people and disabled play a big role in BL2, we know when the shift happened...