Review Vault Dweller Does Dragon Age II

[Vault Dweller]

I'm not claiming it's a failure. If it sells 2-3 mil, it will clearly be a success, regardless of the expectations. I'm just curious what the fuck happened there.

Maybe the good doctors have grown accustomed to 2-3 mil sales and no longer saw it as "fucking awesome". If they truly set their sights on the 10 mil target, they maybe they've felt that they HAD to deviate from the formula and make the gameplay more actiony and "welcoming".

In the past Bio knew what they were doing. Their formula worked, their games had a strong audience, and Bio made very few mistakes. Then they start bouncing from one extreme to another. Suddenly they see the light and realize that ME2 should be more like a shooter because they are missing out on the shooter audience. The game sells well (seemingly), but then Bio announces that ME3 will be more like an RPG now. DA sells well, but instead of making the next one better (like they did moving from BG to BG2, which is considered by many Bio's best game) and securing their position with an uber RPG hit, they make DA2 (the best explanation is "we did it for the lulz").

EA pressure? Years ago Bio had no problems going to LA and arguing that KOTOR didn't work and that they have to go back and do it right. So, what the fuck happened now?

 

[Volourn]

They have hundreds of employees, 3+ divisions, and new owners to dealm with.

But, otherwise I agree with you.

the 10mil number is simply 'pie in the sky' wishful thinking. BIO will never be amongst the 10mil+ selling devs. No matter what. They have their customer base and it's not gonna change. ME2 despite being an action rpg shooter is still liekly 'too talky talky' for the hardcore COD audience where you pretty much go andf shoot with a quick 'mission statement' inbteween acts (at least the couple of CODs I've tried).

My point is some people 9espicially on the BIo baords0a re trying to use that 1mil quote out of context to proof that DA2 is a 'failure'. I mean he refers to DA and ME as 'moderate successes' yet we all know those games were anything but for BIO.


p.s. the difference with LA and KOTOR is their contract likely gave them leeway and they probably had an 'out clause' while with EA, they're stuck with them. They simply cna't pack their bags and go home.

Afterall, Interplay started crying that BIo was tkaing too long with NWN and BIo pretty much told them to fuck off.

BIO is a part of EA. they can't just leave or tell them to fuck off.

 

[waywardOne]

you speak of bioware as though it's the same people as 10+ years ago. that's like asking why are the St Louis Rams such a shitty team now; after all they won the Super Bowl 11 years ago, right?

 

[Volourn]

Um.. It is the same people in charge. the same two doctors are the bosses. Sure, they go through changes, but the people on top making the actual decisions are the same as always.

 

[Lumpy]

oh RPG Codex, a forum in which people talk like a bunch of 9 year olds and retards. The way they whine about DAII's story can be apllied to any RPG. Hell, I can go through Casear's Legions camp as a female PC without being raped in Fallout New Vegas. Every RPG has inconsistancies.

 

[Roguey]

"Um.. It is the same people in charge. the same two doctors are the bosses. Sure, they go through changes, but the people on top making the actual decisions are the same as always."

In addition to this, James Ohlen, Rob Bartel, Ross Gardner, Lukas Kristjanson, Mark Darrah, Mark Brockington, David Falkner, Don Yakielashek, John Winski etc. from BG all still work at Bioware. They're spread out over TOR/DA/ME.

 

[Xor]

oh RPG Codex, a forum in which people talk like a bunch of 9 year olds and retards. The way they whine about DAII's story can be apllied to any RPG. Hell, I can go through Casear's Legions camp as a female PC without being raped in Fallout New Vegas. Every RPG has inconsistancies.

 

[Volourn]

"Hell, I can go through Casear's Legions camp as a female PC without being raped in Fallout New Vegas. "

Okayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy.........

 

[Commissar Draco]

oh RPG Codex, a forum in which people talk like a bunch of 9 year olds and retards. The way they whine about DAII's story can be apllied to any RPG. Hell, I can go through Casear's Legions camp as a female PC without being raped in Fallout New Vegas. Every RPG has inconsistancies.

I'm sure the moders will fix that. Back to the topic Why VD is playing with the Dragon Turd 2 instead of making the AoD? Hive mind already has spoken in countless threads and even Volo is not as adamant in defence as usual. VD finish the the game.

 

[Azrael the cat]

I'm not claiming it's a failure. If it sells 2-3 mil, it will clearly be a success, regardless of the expectations. I'm just curious what the fuck happened there.

Maybe the good doctors have grown accustomed to 2-3 mil sales and no longer saw it as "fucking awesome". If they truly set their sights on the 10 mil target, they maybe they've felt that they HAD to deviate from the formula and make the gameplay more actiony and "welcoming".

In the past Bio knew what they were doing. Their formula worked, their games had a strong audience, and Bio made very few mistakes. Then they start bouncing from one extreme to another. Suddenly they see the light and realize that ME2 should be more like a shooter because they are missing out on the shooter audience. The game sells well (seemingly), but then Bio announces that ME3 will be more like an RPG now. DA sells well, but instead of making the next one better (like they did moving from BG to BG2, which is considered by many Bio's best game) and securing their position with an uber RPG hit, they make DA2 (the best explanation is "we did it for the lulz").

EA pressure? Years ago Bio had no problems going to LA and arguing that KOTOR didn't work and that they have to go back and do it right. So, what the fuck happened now?

LA was a very different beast to EA. LA has only one major IP and a massive financial interest in protecting it beyond their immediate product - not that that hasn't stopped them from massive screw-ups and rush-jobs, but if a developer says to them that their product is going to hurt their IP, and it is the very first entry of that product into a new and highly anticipated market (first AAA Xbox title for LA, as well as entry into the rpg genre) then they have excellent reason to listen. EA's business plan doesn't require them to protect an IP insomuch as milk it until it's time to acquire a new set.

Also, LA then was not LA today. The glory days of LA adventure games weren't long behind them, and even later games like The Dig were very much still in corporate memory. LA was, at the least, an innovative and talented development studio before they closed the 'adventure games' division in favour of the 'milk the star wars IP to death' division (albeit one that aimed at the 'easier' end of the adventure game market). Today that's just a distant memory for LA. But for EA, it's an era that never existed.

 

[Havoc]

oh RPG Codex, a forum in which people talk like a bunch of 9 year olds and retards. The way they whine about DAII's story can be apllied to any RPG. Hell, I can go through Casear's Legions camp as a female PC without being raped in Fallout New Vegas. Every RPG has inconsistancies.

If they need slaves, they go for them. So going for 1 fully armed woman is not a good idea. And after Benny, Caesar would kill anyone who would attack you.

 

[Secretninja]

Hmm. VD spends hours playing this rubbish, then writing a (admittedly witty) review proving what is already widely known, while I am forced to wait for AoD. I am not amused.

 

[Stalin]

VD should go back to making vaporware: read his stellar review of KOTOR. man has no pride

 

[Vault Dweller]

KOTOR review?

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Yes, this one.

Lightsabers. Check

Wookiees. Check.

Millennium Falcon-like spaceship. Check.

Compelling story. Check.

It's disgusting. -500 Kool Kredits for Vault Dweller.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Enough with the bullshit. KOTOR was a great game. Not only it's THE pinnacle of greatness in TB RPGs, its story is one of the best stories told this century. I wouldn't even call it a "game". It's a living; breathing world full of emotion, conquest, romance and epic battles. Few games have ever offered more.

 

[Azrael the cat]

Enough with the bullshit. KOTOR was a great game. Not only it's THE pinnacle of greatness in TB RPGs, its story is one of the best stories told this century. I wouldn't even call it a "game". It's a living; breathing world full of emotion, conquest, romance and epic battles. Few games have ever offered more.

The sad thing is, if you deleted that last sentence and replaced it with 'Relative to Dragon Age 2, I mean.' that description might actually be accurate.

 

[Xor]

Enough with the bullshit. KOTOR was a great game. Not only it's THE pinnacle of greatness in TB RPGs, its story is one of the best stories told this century. I wouldn't even call it a "game". It's a living; breathing world full of emotion, conquest, romance and epic battles. Few games have ever offered more.

 

[Monkeyfinger]

Enough with the bullshit. KOTOR was a great game. Not only it's THE pinnacle of greatness in TB RPGs, its story is one of the best stories told this century. I wouldn't even call it a "game". It's a living; breathing world full of emotion, conquest, romance and epic battles. Few games have ever offered more.

Goddamnit Rosh get off VD's account

 

[Elwro]

:D Remember, guys, that to have such an informed opinion on KotoR VD had to complete it 7 times. Just think. If not for things like these, we could now already be whining about lack of BROmances and stat respec in AoD at the official forums :-(

 

[Drakron]

I would not go as far was VD but KotOR is a good game, one of the "actually good" Star Wars game.

It is certainly better that the sequel.

 

[Crooked Bee]

THE pinnacle of greatness in TB RPGs

 

[Vault Dweller]

Ok, fine, technically, the game wasn't TB, but you've gotta admit that the way Bio blended TB with RT was pure genius. It's really hard to tell that it's not turn-based.

 

[Jim Cojones]

But it lacked hectolitres of blood, explicit sex scenes and the button of awesome. While KotOR was good, it was still more of a prototype for future BioWare masterpieces, rather than the ultimate RPG experience.

 

[Vault Dweller]

What I loved the most about it and why I kept replaying the game is that KOTOR was more than just a game where you kill bad guys. In a sense it was the best game since Planescape when it comes to the philosophical depth because of the focus on what makes a man a man. The moral questions asked through quests and how they are balanced as a dark or light side action are the stuff of philosophy classes into the duality of man.