Game News Wasteland 2 Kickstarter Update #25: Reactivity Up The Wazoo

[Crooked Bee]

I didn't pledge to that and don't really know what's going on there. But I can see now that there's some news there that Crooked Bee won't like.

Maybe she should do it.

It's an anti-keyword conspiracy!

Goddamn libruls wanting to participate in the conversation.

 

[Infinitron]

It's no mean feat to elicit such enthusiasm from villain of the story. Well done, Mr. Fargo

Some good advice from a kebab gentleman:

Excellent news! I absolutely love every bit of information there. However, it can be even better! I already feel spoiled but little things make big differences so I will stress yet a few more things about camera and general controls!

(1) Camera rotation in 90º increments is already great but why leave it there? Since we will have an option to set the camera pan speed (a slider, I imagine?), why not give the same treatment to rotation? Perhaps a slider that goes like: [ Free / 5 / 15 / 22,5 / 30 / 45 / 60 / 90 / 120 / 180 ] (or any degree from 1 to 180).
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(2) An option to switch to orthographic projection, and if not, at least to set the FOV angle of the camera will surely save a lot of people a lot of headache! It will make it easier to assess the whole screen at the very least, as no matter how hard you try, perspective always gets in the way of things.
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(3) Arrow + WASD keys + edge of the screen are great variety to pan the camera but how about one last extra? A "pan" key so that you can hold it down and move the mouse to pan the camera, without dragging the mouse at the edges of the screen.
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And for a non-camera related request,
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(4) RTWP controls for non-combat! Because the game plays in real time outside combat and so do other things in the game. In Fallout, lack of a Pause feature to issue orders while paused was not a problem because you commanded only one character but when you are commanding several characters, the ability to pause the game at any time, asses your environment and revise your tactics is vital.

Imagine if the "pause and issue orders" aspect of Infinity Engine games worked only during combat. Imagine you couldn't issue orders to your party while paused unless you were in combat. That would take a lot from the game, now, wouldn't it? What is different with Wasteland 2, a party based game with TB combat? Absolutely nothing. We need to be able to coordinate our rangers without having to race against the AI in real-time, before and outside combat. So give us RTWP (please :blink: :blink: )

That's all. I guess.

Oh, I forgot. This should really be a basic requirement but since it was not mentioned: in the same vein as camera pan speed, also an option to set camera rotation speed, please?

That "pan key" thing is pretty common in games, actually. Usually it's the middle mouse button. (Although it actually usually rotates rather than pans)

 

[Grunker]

Yep. It's fantastic that they seem to be copying one of the best dialogue-systems in RPGs to date.

 

[Infinitron]

I believe Roguey was referring to the expected quality of the individual lines of dialogue, not to the system as a whole (which is not the same as SoZ in any case)

 

[Grunker]

I believe Roguey was referring to the expected quality of the individual lines of dialogue, not to the system as a whole (which is not the same as SoZ in any case)

I know, I was making the point that I don't much care what such one-liners actually state.

 

[Excidium]

Well it's a post-apocalyptical game populated by raiders, fanatics and illiterate people, writing should be more focused on being functional and straightforward than deep and philosophical walls of text that drive you to tears.

 

[Grunker]

Well it's a post-apocalyptical game populated by raiders, fanatics and illiterate people, writing should be more focused on being functional and straightforward than deep and philosophical walls of text that drive you to tears.

Edited my post. Should have "care what" not "care for"

 

[Maiandros]

Could they perhaps release a secondary version for the mentally fossilised, wherein keyword is not just a buzzword, but actually the only way of communicating with NPCs? Like Police Quest 1 maybe? please?

..i'd buy it..

Anyway, the more i see, the less i find me bitching about the stupid fucking 2013sque graphicz..next thing i know, i may even start being polite in my conversations way this is going..

 

[EG]

I like what I am hearing.

Though now I can't bitch about keywords verses dialog.

 

[Tytus]

I don't really know how to feel about this keyword system right now. I'm not going to judge the game as whole until it comes out. But the keyword system on it's own seems like a retarded attempt to gather more crowd.

You don't like reading but you like to play RPG's? No problem. We will cut out the 60% of reading out of the equation just for you. Especially now that I will be forced with every single dialog to wave my mouse like an asshole, up and down, just to find out what is hidden under all keywords option. I thought this was going to be an RPG, not MSpaint color adventure. Seriously the only game that did the keyword system right, is in my opinion Alpha Protocol - with using a base set of emotions as keywords, so every time I knew what tone the conversation will take. But to be clear I don't want that system to be in W2 or anything. It worked good in a AP-like game, so it should stay there.

But if they really want to use a keyword system why not go further with it? Let's instead of Mass Effect market appeal dialog system have two separate dialogs systems (so even when you fuck up, you can still get some basic information). The normal one like in Baldur's gate and keywords. But, let's MUD-ify it. You still collect keyword around the world like Witcher sex cards, but they don't appear in the conversation box, until you write them in yourself. That way you'll never know what NPC will react to what keywords and what keywords will block the conversation entirely. So now you have to be smart about what you're doing. And take into consideration, the NPC's background, location, allegiance etc. And a good idea would be that every NPC has a limited number of keywords you can ask them about. So when you start writing every keyword from the list, the NPC gets tired of you are interrogating him, flips you offs and walks away.

1. So let's say you input (or choose from your keyword list) - giant scorpion -

The NPC respond - I don't know anything about that.

2. You input - cannibals -

For some reason the NPC doesn't want to talk about it. Respond only by saying something like "fuck off" and closes the dialog box or even attacks you in some situations.

3. But instead of that you decided to input - rangers -

This is is something the NPC knows about or wants to talk about so now - you get 5 or 6 different questions you can ask about one keyword. Not this W2 system that when you unlock a keyword you automatically get one additional dialog option in the box.


This is of course a really loose idea - I just want something new done with the keyword system that's all.

 

[Captain Shrek]

^You don't have to make that user input, since it boils down to some abstruse form of pixel hunting into dialogues. Instead allow for many keywords and have responses you suggest, the order of which determines where and how the conversation ends.

 

[Captain Shrek]

It's not new enough for you already? This is Wasteland 2, not "Interrogation Simulator 2013".

Actually, I'm not a big believer in the "keywords allow TRUE ROLEPLAYING" LARPing argument. I interpret keywords as the player character basically taking a neutral, investigative (and therefore not very interesting) tone. It's a narrative technique - analogous to the "silent protagonist" trope found in certain first person shooter games.

What a surprise.

 

[Infinitron]

It's not new enough for you already? This is Wasteland 2, not "Interrogation Simulator 2013".

Oh wait

But the keyword system on it's own seems like a retarded attempt to gather more crowd.

Seriously the only game that did the keyword system right, is in my opinion Alpha Protocol

Let's instead of Mass Effect market appeal dialog system

Posts: 2

Yeah.

 

[Infinitron]

Captain Shrek Investigative tone of dialogue != interrogation simulation

Learn 2 nuance.

 

[Oesophagus]

So was the sentence preview thing planned earlier, or did it come about because of fan feedback?

Also, I'm curious what the chances of W2 being released on time are

 

[Infinitron]

So was the sentence preview thing planned earlier, or did it come about because of fan feedback?

I think it's pretty obvious it was fan feedback. Although who knows, they might have anticipated that people would dislike it and ended up doing it anyway even if they hadn't published that demo video.

 

[Lancehead]

The potential problem I see with this keyword system is when they said player input keywords are "never required". So e.g. the party fails the perception check to identify NPC Bob belonging to Red Skorpians, so that keyword doesn't appear in the list. But if the player types in "Red Skorpians", I imagine Bob will react to it same as if the party had passed the perception check and selected Red Skorpians from the list.

 

[Infinitron]

The potential problem I see with this keyword system is when they said player input keywords are "never required". So e.g. the party fails the perception check to identify NPC Bob belonging to Red Skorpians, so that keyword doesn't appear in the list. But if the player types in "Red Skorpians", I imagine Bob will react to it same as if the party had passed the perception check and selected Red Skorpians from the list.

Hmm, interesting point. Player skill, in my hardcore RPG? Of course this is a problem that also existed in 80s games - if you already knew a keyword from a previous playthrough, you could use it to sequence break.

Brother None, what do you say about this

 

[EG]

But . . . but then there'd be differences between players who enter keywords manually and players who click on revealed keywords.

InXile will not stand for this!

 

[Lancehead]

In it's current state with full dialogue lines available, player input keywords are the only things that separate the dialogue system from other traditional system, or specifically SoZ's. So saying they're never required kinda defeats the purpose of system.

I dropped McComb a question on this, let's see if he has anything to say about it.

 

[Infinitron]

In it's current state with full dialogue lines available, player input keywords are the only things that separate the dialogue system from other traditional system, or specifically SoZ's. So saying they're never required kinda defeats the purpose of system.

No, because in SoZ you could select which party member spoke (which could lead to different outcomes depending on which one you used, if a class/race/stat/skill check was involved)

 

[Lancehead]

You can't do that in WL2? I was pretty sure you could.

 

[Infinitron]

You can't do that in WL2? I was pretty sure you could.

Hmm, not in the same way as in SoZ as far as I can tell (freely changing the active speaker in the middle of dialogue)

 

[some guy]

I hope they keep the keyboard interface and let some keywords only be accessible by keeping a focused eye for potential hidden topics or just fluff. Trying keywords yet to be discovered could result in just useless derp-rambling together with any other random trash you might input.

 

[marooned]

Brian Fargo definitively knows his thing. Good news all around. Kind of hard not to be excited over Wasteland 2, honestly.

And congratulations Brother None for his kind-of-obvious-by-now promotion. Live long and prosper and don't make many ugly babies.