First person is not more immersive than Third person view

[luj1]

Abstraction > simulation

/thread

 

[octavius]

close your eyes when your character is blinded

Use The Force, lukaszek.

 

[jf8350143]

Unless you are using VR, otherwise both FPP and TPP are not immersive. Unless you like to play as someone who can't turn neck or eyeball and can only see things right in front of them.

So TPP is much better because it allows you to access more info. As a matter of fact TPP is closer to how you see things in real life comparing to FPP.

 

[Saduj]

To me, “immersion” just means I’m really into the game. Doesn’t mean I actually believe I am in the game world because I am not a character in a bad made for TV movie that preaches the dangers of fantasy role playing games.

A turn based based game can cause more tension than an FPS if the difficulty is there AND as a player you care about the stakes. Obviously, the opposite could also be true.

 

[S.torch]

That's the opposite of immersion dude, immersion is about feeling like it's you, being there, in that world.

And again, I want to know how do you feel part of a world were you don't have even the most basic sense of weight or orientation. I already asked the question, and I got a few "fake news ratings" but unsurprisingly, no arguments. Probably because there's none.

 

[DalekFlay]

And again, I want to know how do you feel part of a world were you don't have even the most basic sense of weight or orientation. I already asked the question, and I got a few "fake news ratings" but unsurprisingly, no arguments. Probably because there's none.

"Orientation" I don't really know wtf you're talking about. You have the same ability to orient yourself to your surroundings as you do in real life. It's third-person that is unnatural and shows you more than you'd normally see. As for weight... meh. It's only recently that third-person games have really focused on that, and usually (like with Red Dead 2 recently) I find it gets in the way of gameplay smoothness more than anything. Also no one's saying first-person is perfection, just more immersive.

Also I feel the need to point out "immersion" and "realistic" are two different things. Video game realism is vastly overrated, outside of sim games, and being immersed in a game world doesn't require strict realism like "weight" or whatever else.

 

[Farewell into the night]

In FPP you possess, in TPP you manipulate.

 

[Lemming42]

Otherwise it could be just another nameless drone from a generic first person shooter in which your character is nothing but a floating gun and floating hands. Games like Kingdom Come knew this, because while most of the game is in first person, you can see your character very often during conversations or cutscenes.

That's an interesting thing to say because I think I'm "immersed" more with silent first-person protagonists more than I am with third person protagonists, or even protagonists who just have voice acting and strong pre-written characterisation, like JC Denton.

People love protagonists like Gordon Freeman, the Hacker, Doomguy etc even though they have literally no personalities and never speak (other than the Hacker's very short personal log entry). They're all meant to just essentially be you. They never speak because they say whatever you'd say, they never react to anything because they react however you'd react. Surely that's the peak of "immersion", nebulous though the concept is.

With RPGs the goal shouldn't necessarily be immersion anyway. I'm not immersed in Fallout, because I'm not meant to be inserting myself into the game or feeling as if I'm really there. I'm meant to be roleplaying a character (who ideally isn't just a shitty self-insert) and guiding him or her through the world. Same with Deus Ex, like I said earlier - I don't feel like the player is meant to feel as if they actually are JC or actually inhabit the game's world, which is why it's not jarring to have him speak or see him in third person during dialogue.

 

[octavius]

That's why JC has such a monotone voice.

 

[S.torch]

It's third-person that is unnatural and shows you more than you'd normally see.

What an incredible display of lack of self-awareness. First person perspective in videogames is not "natural" neither, humans don't have the tunnel vision that videogames use, we have a wider range of view that is blurred which give us a sense of placement, alarm and body control. If you can't even notice this when is literally in front of you, obviously you will say something like this

You have the same ability to orient yourself to your surroundings as you do in real life.

You can sense the wind in a videogame? You can sense the frost or the sun? No. In real life you do, so you don't have to look at yourself to know that you're in a desertic dune. In a game you need to look at your character to get this sense of orientation. Otherwise is just a poor attempt of simulation.

 

[octavius]

It's called "filling in the gaps".

As for tunnel vision, many/most games have adjustable Field of View. Or it may simulate wearing a hood or helmet. Anyway, how hard is it to look around in game with mouselook?

 

[Beastro]

So you know what the most immersive game is? Some scuba simulator, because IT LITERALLY CANNOT GET MORE IMMERSIVE THAN BEING LITERALLY IMMERSED.

Lies. Nothing is more immersive than a good old fashion 90s FMV fest:

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Isn't it all technically 2D? I mean I can't physically pick it up and lick it. Come on star trek holosuite.

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

To me, “immersion” just means I’m really into the game. Doesn’t mean I actually believe I am in the game world because I am not a character in a bad made for TV movie that preaches the dangers of fantasy role playing games.

A turn based based game can cause more tension than an FPS if the difficulty is there AND as a player you care about the stakes. Obviously, the opposite could also be true.

I agree with this. Having moments where you had the RNG swing your way and save you from a possible party death is one of those moments of immense relief from all the nervous leg shaking leading up to that. Also makes it more satisfying when you make a mid-fight recovery and emerge victorious.

 

[Saduj]

To me, “immersion” just means I’m really into the game. Doesn’t mean I actually believe I am in the game world because I am not a character in a bad made for TV movie that preaches the dangers of fantasy role playing games.

A turn based based game can cause more tension than an FPS if the difficulty is there AND as a player you care about the stakes. Obviously, the opposite could also be true.

I agree with this. Having moments where you had the RNG swing your way and save you from a possible party death is one of those moments of immense relief from all the nervous leg shaking leading up to that. Also makes it more satisfying when you make a mid-fight recovery and emerge victorious.

Yeah I was actually thinking about the first time I was trying to beat Dungeon Rats. Ending the turn and then praying whatever happens next isn’t too bad....

 

[samuraigaiden]

If Immercenary came out in 2019 it would be the Codex GOTY

 

[Lurker47]

FPP would be the best perspective if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (the obvious exception are dungeon-crawlers.)

 

[mondblut]

As a matter of fact TPP is closer to how you see things in real life comparing to FPP.

If I had a butt hanging in front of my eyes all the time, I'd consult with a doctor.

 

[mondblut]

if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (except in all the games where it is.)

What was your point again?

 

[mondblut]

All the best hack 'n' slashes and 3D platformers are in TPP. That alone should tell you.

And that is good for RPGs since when?

 

[Lurker47]

if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (except in all the games where it is.)

What was your point again?

You know it.

 

[mondblut]

if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (except in all the games where it is.)

What was your point again?

You know it.

If Wizardry, Might & Magic, Realms of Arkania and countless others are not "first person" enough for you, you are part of the problem.

 

[Lurker47]

if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (except in all the games where it is.)

What was your point again?

You know it.

If Wizardry, Might & Magic, Realms of Arkania and countless others are not "first person" enough for you, you are part of the problem.

OK, but what about shooters

 

[Sreggin Etah I]

Nothing immerse me more in a game than background sound effects(especially with headphones),it's one of the main things i loved about infinity engine games.

Looks at this shit:



the background sound effects really makes this place feel cold and real.

Edit: i forgot to say,i using loudness Equalization that makes me hear sound effects better,just turn on loudness Equalization in your sound settings,it's a lot better !

 

[mondblut]

if it didn't almost always mean that the combat isn't turn-based (except in all the games where it is.)

What was your point again?

You know it.

If Wizardry, Might & Magic, Realms of Arkania and countless others are not "first person" enough for you, you are part of the problem.

OK, but what about shooters

Shooters as well might not exist. This is GRPGD.