Baldur's Gate The Baldur's Gate Series Thread

[Theldaran]

Robes of the Archmagi and similar gear by themselves are nice for the occasional auto-save. You can't use them expecting to save your ass consistently, though.

 

[Harry Easter]

I finished Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition yesterday. I needed 40 1/2 hours for the whole game and most of the major sidequests. This was my first try after fifteen years.

Thoughts:

- I always thought, that BG2 was a mage-game. This time, I only had one mage (Aerie) and I used her mostly for identifying stuff and opening doors.

- The theme for my group was Lawful Good, so I had one Lawful Good Fighter, Keldorn (Paladin/Inquisitor), Anomen(Fighter/Cleric), Aerie (Mage/Cleric), Rasaad (Monk) and Mazzy (Fighter). I tried this years before in the original game (with Nalia instead of Aerie and my char as a Paladin) on "Original D&D-rules" diffculty and did the same this time. And it worked out quite well. My characters just went in there and killed everything at sight. This was fun, especially after being afraids of mages all these years.

- My Half-Orc Fighter had strength 19, constitution 19 and dexterity 18 (magically enhanced), specialised in two-handed swords. He was one big killing machine and could kill hordes of Beholder on his own, after I gave him a mantle, that protected him from offensive magic. Did anybody else try a similiar character? I still think, that the Bhaalspawn is somehow tweaked.

- The parts I liked (cult of the Eyeless, the circus, castle de'Arnise, Umar, Trademeet, the serial killer-stuff) I still like, but on the other hand I'm still not sold on the pirate island, the magical sphere and the prison for mages.

- I started to appreciate the Underdark more, but mostly because I accidentally entered every monsterlair before the drowcity, so I had no timelimits to work with. Ust Natha itself was more fun than I remember. I would've liked a longer mini-campaign with it.

- What works with this game and the quests is that these quests feel like real adventures. Big, interesting adventures, with fighting cool monsters and telling neat little stories you want to share with your friends. It just feels right and reminds you, why Faerun is such an adventurer-friendly setting for p&per.

- Irenicus is indeed an interesting villain and gets a good build-up through out the game, but it also showed that you could take him out and nothing would've changed about the overall plot. This is his story and I get the feeling, that putting the Bhaalspawn in it may have been an afterthought.

- The overall Bhaalspawnstuff is build upon, but if you just cut it out, the story wouldn't have changed a bit. What happens to you, could happen to any powerful adventurer.

- The environmental graphics still look stunning.

- The new companions are still as horribly written as I remembered, but Neeras and Rasaads questline are actually quite fun and interesting. The quests, not the companions. They are just idiots.

- I still think that the overall plot is thinly hold together. All the sidequests are standalone adventure modules, that could take place anywhere in the realms and nothing would be lost. I am the hero of those locations, not of Amn. Baldur's Gate 1 made it somehow work that the areas around Baldur's Gate feelt like home after a while. I don't know if that was, because the adventure was more low-level or because the mainplot was a bit stronger.

So yeah, still a great game, but it will be never a favorite. I can't say why that is. Maybe I liked exploring in 1 more, or it is because I explored Baldur's Gate first, but 2 always lacked the same spark and still does.

 

[coldcrow]

You should have used the SCS mod. Vanilla BG2 is really easy if you know what you are doing. With SCS and all options on you have to put in at least some effort.

 

[Storyfag]

I finished Baldur's Gate II: Enhanced Edition yesterday. I needed 40 1/2 hours for the whole game and most of the major sidequests. This was my first try after fifteen years.

Thoughts:

- I always thought, that BG2 was a mage-game. This time, I only had one mage (Aerie) and I used her mostly for identifying stuff and opening doors.

- The theme for my group was Lawful Good, so I had one Lawful Good Fighter, Keldorn (Paladin/Inquisitor), Anomen(Fighter/Cleric), Aerie (Mage/Cleric), Rasaad (Monk) and Mazzy (Fighter). I tried this years before in the original game (with Nalia instead of Aerie and my char as a Paladin) on "Original D&D-rules" diffculty and did the same this time. And it worked out quite well. My characters just went in there and killed everything at sight. This was fun, especially after being afraids of mages all these years.

- My Half-Orc Fighter had strength 19, constitution 19 and dexterity 18 (magically enhanced), specialised in two-handed swords. He was one big killing machine and could kill hordes of Beholder on his own, after I gave him a mantle, that protected him from offensive magic. Did anybody else try a similiar character? I still think, that the Bhaalspawn is somehow tweaked.

- The parts I liked (cult of the Eyeless, the circus, castle de'Arnise, Umar, Trademeet, the serial killer-stuff) I still like, but on the other hand I'm still not sold on the pirate island, the magical sphere and the prison for mages.

- I started to appreciate the Underdark more, but mostly because I accidentally entered every monsterlair before the drowcity, so I had no timelimits to work with. Ust Natha itself was more fun than I remember. I would've liked a longer mini-campaign with it.

- What works with this game and the quests is that these quests feel like real adventures. Big, interesting adventures, with fighting cool monsters and telling neat little stories you want to share with your friends. It just feels right and reminds you, why Faerun is such an adventurer-friendly setting for p&per.

- Irenicus is indeed an interesting villain and gets a good build-up through out the game, but it also showed that you could take him out and nothing would've changed about the overall plot. This is his story and I get the feeling, that putting the Bhaalspawn in it may have been an afterthought.

- The overall Bhaalspawn is build on, but if you just cut it out, the story wouldn't have changed a bit. What happens to you, could happen to any powerful adventurer.

- The environmental graphics still look stunning.

- The new companions are still as horribly written as I remembered, but Neeras and Rasaads questline are actually quite fun and interesting.

- I still think that the overall plot is thinly hold together. All the sidequests are standalone adventure modules, that could take place anywhere in the realms and nothing would be lost. I am the hero of those locations, not of Amn. Baldur's Gate 1 made it somehow work, that the areas around Baldur's Gate feelt like home after a while. I don't if that was, because the adventure was more low-level or because the mainplot was a bit stronger.

So yeah, some things never change. Still a great game, but it will be never a favorite.

Damn you, you're making me want to replay BG II.

 

[Harry Easter]

You should have used the SCS mod. Vanilla BG2 is really easy if you know what you are doing. With SCS and all options on you have to put in at least some effort.

Hmm, I left most mods alone, but maybe the time has come to finally try some of those out. Thanks!

Damn you, you're making me want to replay BG II.

You're welcome :D.

 

[YldriE]

Damn you, you're making me want to replay BG II.

If you are in "replay" mode, it's always a good thing to consider other similar games you missed instead. I played Baldur's Gate 1 for the first time ever a few weeks ago precisely because I was itching pretty bad for a BG2 revisit.

As a side note, putting my Guild Wars 1 experience to good use, I simply had all six characters use ranged weapons with enchanted projectiles. Zero difficulty, zero effort, like playing Red Alert 95 with six Tanyas.

- I still think that the overall plot is thinly hold together. All the sidequests are standalone adventure modules, that could take place anywhere in the realms and nothing would be lost. I am the hero of those locations, not of Amn. Baldur's Gate 1 made it somehow work, that the areas around Baldur's Gate feelt like home after a while. I don't if that was, because the adventure was more low-level or because the mainplot was a bit stronger.

That's an unexpected take, because the main plot of BG1 was anything but strong and that's one thing I eventually liked about it. The lack of strong direction put me off at first but in the end it reminded me how the best part of most open-world / free-roaming games is when, as Gandalf puts it, "you are only quite a little fellow in a wide world after all".

 

[Harry Easter]

That's an unexpected take, because the main plot of BG1 was anything but strong and that's one thing I eventually liked about it. The lack of strong direction put me off at first but in the end it reminded me how the best part of most open-world / free-roaming games is when, as Gandalf puts it, "you are only quite a little fellow in a wide world after all".

True, but it help that headhunters and assassins attacked you on a regular basis and that storypoints like the iron shortage and the bandit attacks were better connected with each other. I found that the better CRPG-stories somehow connect every little storybit, may it I through a plot or through a theme. In BG2 I'm always behind Irenicus and he does stuff, but it could be anything that has nothind to do with me. Even the vampire guild could be another group, but through a very thin thread, they have a connection with Irenicus. Hmm, if it comes to it, it helps in 1 that every bad thing that happens on a bigger scale is connected to the Iron Throne, while in 2, Irenicus may be A threat to you, but just one of many threats in Amn. It's just a little detail, but I think it does strengthen the story.

 

[chuft]

The elemental arrow damage in BG1 is obscene. If you play using BGT (or Tutu I think) it is (hugely) nerfed to BG2 levels. I found it quite effective (and more fun) to have the fighters using giant strength potions, heroism potions and melee weapons after awhile.

I just finished playing BG1 in a BGT runthrough, but got stopped by the extreme difficulty increase added to the Sarevok fight by BGT. I started discussing this here

https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.p...gate-ii-mod-thread.73121/page-67#post-6309200

It appears many people here have not run into this because they use SCS and it overwrites at least some of the files used in this undocumented difficulty increase, which took place silently around 2010.

It soured me a bit on BG for the moment so I decided to try POE with the IE mod. After that I intend to go back and Ctrl-Y Sarevok’s team out of existence and resume the play into BG2.

 

[hell bovine]

Hmm, I left most mods alone, but maybe the time has come to finally try some of those out. Thanks!

Now is the best time. The latest version of SCS lets you customize most of difficulty options in-game, e.g. spellcaster prebuffing scripts, creature abilitites etc. At this point professional game devs should be learning from that modder.

 

[chuft]

I personally found all the raise deads/bankruptcies/forced reloads in SCS to be immersion-breaking and chose to restart BG1 without it, but it seems ideal for those who want a series of tough puzzles rather than a continuous narrative.

 

[hell bovine]

I find the dumber-than-dumb unmodded ai more immersion breaking, tbh.

 

[chuft]

Try playing your fighters like they are impetuous medieval knights, not ninja chess pieces mind controlled by Hannibal Barca from a satellite in orbit over the map.

 

[hell bovine]

I don't even have fighters in my parties, too boring. And pretend playing your fighters is not going to do much for the lacking enemy ai. I do have fond recollections of how in original BG2 a lich would sometimes nuke himself with his own spells, though.

 

[chuft]

You don’t have to pretend play them. Just give them melee weapons and normal attack on sight scripts. Like having Sulik in your party. You won’t need any fancy A.I. upgrades.

 

[YldriE]

But ranged teammates don't wander off or trigger traps like MMO randos, and if you need bodyblockers, that's what summons are for.

 

[hell bovine]

You don’t have to pretend play them. Just give them melee weapons and normal attack on sight scripts.

Then it's basically the ai scripts playing against itself. Boring.

 

[Kliwer]

I personally found all the raise deads/bankruptcies/forced reloads in SCS to be immersion-breaking

To be honest SCS is not very hard... The "normal" difficulty should looks like that. Vanilla game is extremely easy if someone knows game mechanics... Only people who do not care to read manual and spell descriptions could call this game "hard". Of course it is hard when you do not know what are you doing.

I have finished BG2 firs time when I was in primary shool. Those time i thought that the game is hard... But I was playing the game in a random way, my wizards were cansting almost only offensive spells (no protections, no buffs, no mind-tricks...), my warriors were using wepons without proficiency point in them, my Minsc wore some fancy silver-ring to the end of the game (becouse I thouth it is so role-playing). The fact that I was able to finish the game means it is really easy.

 

[Daidre]

Components difficulty in later versions of SCS tied to Difficulty slider in the game. So setting Normal or Core should stop some questionable scripts from working.

I prefer to set difficulty higher for extra abilities on enemies but tune down/do not install some parts of SCS like:

1) (Re)moving + nerfing good items
2) Potions for NPC: whole thing is scripted weird - enemy fighters waste first round on potions and go into health-potion-gulping loop on low HP. They tend to end up less dangerous than original kamikaze-style.
3) Pre-buffing script for mages and priests was completely bonkers - it triggered not only on mage spawn or combat start, but in the combat too (not in triggers + sequencers) with ridiculous situations like enemy Wizard CCed by stun had whole prebuff package (~8 spells) constantly refreshing every round. Also instant buff refresh when you out of line of sight even a bit. Would avoid this as plague in the future.

 

[hell bovine]

Components difficulty in later versions of SCS tied to Difficulty slider in the game. So setting Normal or Core should stop some questionable scripts from working.

You can further customize them in the game via dialogue. It's still miles ahead what professional gaming studios put out. I mean compare it to PK (and I liked that game), where you can have an enemy cast the same spell over and over again on your prebuffed (and therefore immune) character.

edit: 3) sounds like a bug, I know there was a similar one that I've reported

 

[laclongquan]

Components difficulty in later versions of SCS tied to Difficulty slider in the game. So setting Normal or Core should stop some questionable scripts from working.

I prefer to set difficulty higher for extra abilities on enemies but tune down/do not install some parts of SCS like:

1) (Re)moving + nerfing good items
2) Potions for NPC: whole thing is scripted weird - enemy fighters waste first round on potions and go into health-potion-gulping loop on low HP. They tend to end up less dangerous than original kamikaze-style.
3) Pre-buffing script for mages and priests was completely bonkers - it triggered not only on mage spawn or combat start, but in the combat too (not in triggers + sequencers) with ridiculous situations like enemy Wizard CCed by stun had whole prebuff package (~8 spells) constantly refreshing every round. Also instant buff refresh when you out of line of sight even a bit. Would avoid this as plague in the future.

I play hardest difficulty with SCS31, so there's that.

Thieves start battle by drinking invi bottle is really hard to deal with because it work instantly and you will have a hard time with them. Case in point: battle at butcher's dungeon, the skin walker quest. They start with two thieves like that and my fragile casters like Aerie or Nalia get chunked instantly UNLESS they are very deep behind the meatwall. At that battle I have to bait them into attack one of my toughest meatwall to have a chance to kill them. Even worse with outdoor wide open, where the thieves can wander who know where and you dont have predicted avenue to bait them.

As for mage script, yeah they are hard. But, sooner or later you will the groove to deal with them. Like, you get out of the area, get in, their defense is still up but their toughest spell like deva summon and comet already spent. And however tough their defense are, it's not tougher than a deva with its vorpal crit hit.

If after three or four retries and you still cant kill that mage battle, then it's possible that you dont have tool/level/character to deal with it. Might be a good time to check out other places and return after a long while. Case in point: I simply cant deal with the lich in Ghoul Town. So I skipped it and finish the Beholders, do other stuffs, and return after next levelup.

 

[Daidre]

I mostly use True Sight and Thief Illusion Detection against Rogues so it is less of the problem. All my clerics have it memorized all the time and my mages never leave a home without Stoneskin.

I played Insane + No extra damage on 32.4 -32.5 SCS beta mostly, so a bugged scripts kinda expected I guess due to how different it is. Older versions of SCS from couple of years ago were a smoother experience for me in general.

Well, imho installing hardest mage options and waiting out their worst spells out of range is weird way to play SCS. My most universal tactics to nuke everything with couple of Acid Fogs and Fire Storms so nobody can cast anything, but it is kinda cheap too.

 

[Harry Easter]

Okay, I had a weird bug:

Watchers keep, Keldorn gets torn apart, but his portrait stays, so I can revive him. I revive him, but there's only a piece of him floating around, that I can't move but still have access to his inventory. And when I leave the area or kill and revive him, he is still only a floating piece of meat. I was to lazy to replay the whole area again (had overwritten my quicksaves) and just switched him with Sarevok. But did anybody else encounter that bug?

 

[d1r]

Never encountered that before. But you could have tried to use ctrl+4 or 5 to switch character animations. Or just ShadowKeeper to change his animation back to a human fighter.

 

[chuft]

I personally found all the raise deads/bankruptcies/forced reloads in SCS to be immersion-breaking

To be honest SCS is not very hard...

Nothing is hard if you keep reloading endlessly. I don't like to do that. I want to be able to win a battle on the first try, and to raise my dead rather than reload if I take losses.

With SCS I found, with 2nd level party, that I was having encounters like (on way to Gnoll Stronghold) having ogrillons attack from the front while an invisible ogre mage ran around the back and cast Sleep five times. There is no defense against this except the meta one of having Viconia and having her magic resistance work every time, which it did, but I (as so often was the case with SCS) lost a party member and had to turn around and go back to town for a costly Raise Dead on an evil character.

Tent in Nashkel Carnival similarly had a pre-buffed high level mage who could knock out most or all of the party and summon monsters to butcher us while down.

There is no tactics in having your characters stunned or unconscious by Sleep and Color Spray when they are 1st or 2nd level. It was stupid. Game got much better after uninstall.

 

[Harry Easter]

Never encountered that before. But you could have tried to use ctrl+4 or 5 to switch character animations. Or just ShadowKeeper to change his animation back to a human fighter.

Thanks! Will do! But now he's floating around in my dimension and I can't help but imagine the meat whispering sweet nothings to his wife and having the most wonderful marriage ever. It's just to absurd, you have to see this to believe it :D.