Monolith said:
I'd say too much hype. Every week a Divinity 2 week is simply too much, people lose interest - I know I did. Anyway, from what I've seen I think the scores are quite fitting - although I can't say I'm far into the game.
Just look at the offfical web page of DD2. There are not even gameplay scenes, all you get is pretty accurate text description of the game. I don't know about you but I prefer a company which actually delivers what they promise instead of twisting the truth through gameplay videos. Hype also means ad revenue for magazines and it is accepted as a fact around here that this equals good scores in reviews. I was just trying to explain why the game has such a low score (in my opinion).
Monolith said:
shardspin said:
If you played Divine Divinity and liked its writing (or its odd sense of humour) and the exploration parts, then I am pretty sure you will like this game too because it only improved on those parts (with the humour it is hard to tell of course, but I already had a few grins and I usually never laugh about video games). Dialogues are a lot shorter because of voice acting but it is definitely similar. I had doubts regarding the writing since the pre release material was not really descriptive of that but it turned out pretty good.
Eh, define pretty good. Because what I've seen so far isn't. Usually characters are either overdone or bland. When they show personality it's either in their journals or when interacting with other NPCs (the latter being quite well done), dialogs are simply functional - most of the time you've got just two options, and often they lead to the same outcome (cosmetic choices). I just became a Drachenritter and I'm trying to enter that huge mage tower while exploring the countryside - will it get better?
My description was meant for people who know and liked DD1's writing (specifically because some people asked for an opinion on that in another thread and I tried to reassure them). Well, the writing might not be everyone's cup of tea because it focusses alot on meta-game humour. But it fits the setting and often ridicules fantasy cRPG clichees (for example the pig farm).
I personally never found anything interesting in journals regarding the NPC's personalities, for me it was just a spelled out description of the character as opposed to drawing conclusion from the dialogue alone. Cosmetic choices ? Are you kidding me?
Did you try to find the bandits camp? Did you always follow Richard's orders?
Yes, there are quests with only one possible solution but it is not like every quest has one solution only.
Do you mean the mage's temple or the big tower? Different things, I am currently heading towards the temple and I was having a blast so far.
As for funny dialogue:
I laughed my ass off when I could try to elaborate on the philosophical matters of the typical bandit threat "Money or I'll take your life!". This seemed somehow familar, so it might be that another RPG already did something like this (Baldur's Gate or DD1 maybe?) but I think this gives a very good impression of the kind of humour you will find in DD2.
Monolith said:
shardspin said:
I'll start with the story. The whole dragon thing is a bit generic, but I challenge you to come up with something containing dragons that is not in some way generic. And what cRPG was there really with a good story? Even PS:T sucks if you only analyze the story. So what is important in an cRPG regarding the story? The presentation of it! And how is it done in DD2 ? Pretty good actually. And the story is not as boring as it may seem at first. There a lot of small twists to the usual clichees. For example the big enemy's wrath has its cause in the harsh reaction by the shining good guy (hero) of DD1, who is raising him as a son, towards a corrupting influence.
First of all, nobody is forced to make a story centered on dragons. Then, you're telling me PS:T sucks if you analyze the story. If that's the case, what extent of suckage do we have when analyzing the story of Divinity 2?And Damian, the big enemy, might have an intriguing backstory (and so far that's been one mighty "might"), he still ends up being a chliche fantasy villain. And the presentation? One MacGuffin following another - not bad per se, but I didn't catch myself giving one single fuck about the story. Become a dragonkiller, ask about that, kill this, don't kill that, become a dragonknight, get in there - the first 10 hours in a nutshell.
Yeah I know, nobody is forced. Blablabla... I already said that I waited for such a game a long time and it is not like the whole thing is completely unoriginal - there are a lot of neat touches to the usual generic material. Also comparison to P:ST:
wake up, read tattoos, look for journal, find pharod, look for journal AGAIN - first few hours of P:ST ; one MacGuffin after another - really what is the point, cRPGs are bound to have a structure like this.
Did I mention that the story behind Damian is not even told in the game itself at that point? Clichee villain ? He is the fucking incarnation of evil (this is from hearsay only, I did not play DD1 to the end myself). In the beginning he is supposed to be perceived as a typical clichee villain. I guess you did not meet Lovis yet because this encounter puts a small spin on everything again (a decadent ghost who reveals a very atypical solution to the typical big enemy problem).
Monolith said:
I don't agree with the miles ahead of The Witcher part. At the beginning, fights can be really tough, even filler combat. That's about the only thing that's better than combat in The Witcher. With the little tactics and possibilities you've got Divinity, I prefer The Witcher's reaction based combat system. In Divinity 2 fights usually end up in a health potion overdose. The only real options you've got is choosing an enemy, drawing single enemies out of packs, taking cover because enemy archers and mages can be a bitch, spamming the skills you've got, clicking, clicking, clicking and drinking health potions when health goes down below 20%. Might get better when better skills get available (more stun-attacks, the like). Right now, the only thing that's keeping fights interesting is the difficulty - but supposedly the difficulty will sag as soon as you get your undead follower. What about combat do you like?
As opposed to the unbelievably high amount of different choices regarding combat in The Witcher this sounds really truly awful.
You also just reminded me how bad the TW's combat really was. FUCKING REACTION BASED PATTERN FOLLOWING. I totally forgot about that.
If you want to react to the same pattern in the same way the whole game then this is your choice. But when I compare this to DD2's fast paced action combat where I must react to the situation at hand, something which is at most times totally not necessary in TW, DD2 easily wins.
I like about the combat that my selection of skills determines how I can or must play the game. I have a very similar build to that of Morgoth who also seems to use the healing ghost as a backup. It might be possible that this is the only build which is fun to play but I somehow doubt that. Because I can imagine that a mix of a fighting character with some spell casting abilities and thus the ability to dish out huge amounts of damage in a shorter time might be just as satisfying as relying on brute force alone as I currently do. (This is actually pretty similar to the build I used in DD1, so I have pretty good reasons to believe that I am correct with my assumption).
I prefer the class-free approach to generic skill trees, but that is a matter of taste of course. I personally don't like Diablo 2's skill system and its combat at all, but I am satisfied with DD2. Why ? Because combat is a lot less important. I see it as a quick way to gain some experience points and to get some quests done along the way while exploring is the main focus. So I don't have very high expectations towards it. With Diablo 2 on the other hand combat is the main part of the game and for a whole game clicking someone to death with whatever spell effects is just not enough for me.
But still, feel free to name more cRPGs with "fun" combat. Even with tactical ones it is not really a fun system on its own but only becomes so because it is heavily influenced by the choices you make in your character design. And this is true for DD2 as well as far as I am concerned.
Monolith said:
shardspin said:
So what is actually bad about the game ?
The game world, imho. A lot of whiny NPCs, some of the geography doesn't make much sense (goblin village right next to the town, blocking the only way to the mine - and a whole battalion sitting tight behind the rampart), a self-sustaining village in a valley with basically no fields to till, a famine next door but nobody complaining about the player stealing everything and going through all chests and barrels, unpickable doors that need a specific key to be opened, unhostile NPCs can't be attacked , NPCs lack topics that simply would make sense (a century old alchemist that took the form of a tree you can find could have a lot to tell - and all he can do is...make potions? - compare that to MotB), and a lot more. Mostly a case of "this would be so much better if...", but it's what's bugging me the most.
Oh please, are you trying to deliberately disagree with me here or what?
Do you even realize that the whiny NPCs are ridiculing clichees by being a contrast or a caricature? And if you want to go down the "logical flaws in cRPGs" road, have fun taking that long walk alone. The alchemist you mention is also a hidden quest and a nod to players of the original. And by the same logic: why would the tree have any agenda to share his secrets with a complete outsider? I suspect that you might later run into a more talkative form of this one. I was actually pretty surprised by this because I was already finished with the village and only came back because I needed apples.
Monolith said:
To be fair, you can be a prick past the "Gimme money" quite often, taking the money and ratting out somebody anyway. And sometimes it's just a choice between two factions, which affects your reputation with some NPCs (and, that's often the only real consequence, affects merchant prices).
So you are defending the game, but you still wont acknowledge that you might close or open up different quest lines depending on your choices? Or maybe you just did not notice it yet?
Oh, I just saw you are from Poland. Do you speak German on a native level? It might be that you lost a lot in translation if you do not.
