Game News Age of Decadence Demo Released

[hiver]

I accepted failed checks when they arose. I accepted the unperfect playthrough.

Thats not the problem for me either. If i can play on with reasonable consequences thats fine. If i come to a full stop because i didnt invest in some skill that just pops up all of a sudden then making me spend skills points as i get them will make me rage quit, delete the game, flush from memory.

 

[Lumpy]

The way I see it, players hoarding Skillpoints make a conscious choice to gain flexibility at a later point, while denying themselves options along the way.

For instance, a Praetor hoarding skillpoints can put them massively into lore when the mine quest comes up, as that's an obvious investment, but he'll miss the little Etiquette and Streetwise checks along the way, which would've brought better results.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Just realised another thing that bothers me with the combat stuff. The only defensive 'attributes' from all sources here are damage reduction, critical protection and either block or dodge (because going with both seems real dumb). What is this missing? Resistances. No blunt/slashing/piercing resistance, no acid resistance, nothing. Which also leads to a tricky question - does that mean you'll be fighting generic sword-wielding dudes till the end of your life and/or will there be lightning/acid traps that do exactly the same kind of damage to heavy metal armour and clothing?

 

[Vault Dweller]

As I have written in my earlier post, I'd offer more "in-between" resolutions, or partial-successes. If I just barely miss a skill check, why does it mean automatic failure or even death? Why not implement a imperfect closure?

It takes time, but I'll see what we can do to increase the number of such options.

The latter struck me with the mining outpost. If you don't have a combat character, fighting is pretty much out of question, I think.

As it should be.

So you get multiple approaches, but they are always a combination of two somewhat disconnected skills and you need both.

Because a single stat/skill is a single 'path' to victory.

There are two ways to balance game's difficulty. You can balance it for the first playthgrough, but then the game becomes too easy. You can balance it for subsequent playthroughs, but then the first playthrough is too hard. Choices & consequences.

 

[villain of the story]

Good dialogue screen from a recent game:

IE rehash, basically. AoD dialogue interface just feels dead.

It takes time, but I'll see what we can do to increase the number of such options.

Oh great. Game postponed to 2015.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Just realised another thing that bothers me with the combat stuff. The only defensive 'attributes' from all sources here are damage reduction, critical protection and either block or dodge (because going with both seems real dumb). What is this missing? Resistances. No blunt/slashing/piercing resistance, no acid resistance, nothing. Which also leads to a tricky question - does that mean you'll be fighting generic sword-wielding dudes till the end of your life and/or will there be lightning/acid traps that do exactly the same kind of damage to heavy metal armour and clothing?

Traps are done in the text-adventure style. They don't damage armor.

99% of enemies are "generic sword-wielding dudes", but once alchemy is added, they will be using poison and acid flasks. You do have poison resistance, determined by your Con. As for acid, there is no resistance (i.e. it will destroy the armor if the throw is successful), but such flasks are rare.

 

[Gord]

It takes time, but I'll see what we can do to increase the number of such options.

Because a single stat/skill is a single 'path' to victory.

True, but in the AoD demo the existence of the second skill/attribute check is not known until you encounter it.
You cannot prepare for it. It's encouraging a test/reload approach to quests with skill-checks.
You can choose the sneak path with a thief, only to fail at the next step because your DEX is too low (and that can't be raised).
Maybe I would have liked to see an optional second (and much harder) sneak check there.

I'll admit that it's hard to balance that without running into a problem eventually, though.
Choices & Consequences indeed...

 

[Marsal]

Just realised another thing that bothers me with the combat stuff. The only defensive 'attributes' from all sources here are damage reduction, critical protection and either block or dodge (because going with both seems real dumb). What is this missing? Resistances. No blunt/slashing/piercing resistance, no acid resistance, nothing. Which also leads to a tricky question - does that mean you'll be fighting generic sword-wielding dudes till the end of your life and/or will there be lightning/acid traps that do exactly the same kind of damage to heavy metal armour and clothing?

Traps are done in the text-adventure style. They don't damage armor.

99% of enemies are "generic sword-wielding dudes", but once alchemy is added, they will be using poison and acid flasks. You do have poison resistance, determined by your Con. As for acid, there is no resistance (i.e. it will destroy the armor if the throw is successful), but such flasks are rare.

Destroy as in "remove from inventory" (like shields) or turn armor unusable, but the metal remains, so you can melt and reforge the armor?

 

[Vault Dweller]

The metal remains. 80% of it, if I recall correctly.

 

[circ]

Ok thought I hit a CTD bug, but not quite. No, I don't have a save as it doesn't autosave or anything and I was in Antideswhatever's throne room fighting him and his goons.
Anyway. This brings ye olde reload back with a vengeance. It's all a crap shoot. Whose idea was it to equip every IG with bronze weapons, probably not even hardened, and the opposing force all with apparently steel weapons, probably hardened too.

Anyway bug. No, no save, but it switched to desktop and I thought shit hit the fan. Gave this message:

HEADER:
..\..\..\..\..\Engine\source\ITS_common\gameIO.cpp(298):Fatal
FOLLOWED BY:
CPathfinder::getRelativePath() - none of the directions match.

Then Torque asked if I wanted to start up debugger. I could now switch back to AoD but sound was laggy. Oh, just before the lag hit I killed the second longspearman, then I was suddenly transported next to the throne even though I was about 8 steps away. Well, that's what I thought at first. I got cloned. An invisible me was still in the old spot, getting pounded to fuck by guardsmen, and then a visible me was next to the throne, blocking spears thrown by the other half. Hmm I don't remember when the pop-up came, probably when I killed the last longspearman.

EDIT: Oh also, speaking of such options, I'm assuming quest variations, I noticed thief get some extra options with the muggers/Livia. She even joins the thief guild later and does stuff. BioWare stuff! No. But stuff. That was cool. Also gave you SP without a fight. Nice. Also kebab guy had other options with thief and assassin. But that's about it. Now these may seem like assquests, but still, throw in more options all over. Also wasn't aware of intimidate option with Mewhatthefuckisyourname, also easy SP there. Miss out on some steel though.

 

[CSM]

Played it for five minutes, quit because of the tiny font and the godawful "answers on top, questions on the bottom"-interface. I'd prefer not to break my neck playing a video game.

Did look promising though. Also, still needs a lot more in the sound department.

 

[AlabasterOvercoat]

Is there a reason to fight the Assassin at the beginning of the Gladiator game? He seems really tough, I have to make combat-only build to beat him, and he doesn't leave anything good behind, always leave me almost dead, which forces me to skip next non-combat encounter.

Other than that I don't seem to like the game very much, the combat system is good but would work much better on larger areas and with controllable party memebers, and the game feels really claustrophobic at the time. All I can do is go to the quest-giver, be teleported into adventure, try to pass checks (thanks for the tip to wait with skill point distribution) and if I can't try different quest. Perhaps full version will be better with more exploration.

 

[Grunker]

Fun story, (apropos target audience, Vault Dweller): My nephew, who is 14 years old and a colossal Oblivion and Skyrim-fan (we've argued on the subject before, especially about Oblivion) saw a facebook-update I made and decided to try out Age of Decadence. He didn't tell me about it, just downloaded that shit. He just completed it and he loved it. This is a 14 year old whose most hardcore RPG before AoD is probably Fallout: New Vegas. I logged into League of Legends today and he sent me a message:

Him: "Hey Casper! I just finished Age of Decadence!"

Me: ":D What did you think?"

Him: "I thought it was awesome. I especially liked how the different "backgrounds" were woven into each other..."

Me: "Yeah, that's pretty cool."

Him: "One thing that annoyed me a bit is how few skill points you get. Though I know it's a demo so I guess you get more later on. You also get too few stat points in my opinion."

Me: "Yeah, but don't you think it'd be boring not to have to sacrifice anything?"

Him: "Yeah, I guess you're right. And at least stats matter A LOT. I can really see what you mean when you talk about numbers in Skyrim not mattering... I played an assassin by the way, with Persuasion and Sneak, a little combat. I did think it was a little sad that it seemed you had to focus on either talking or killing. I'd have liked to switch a little. Also didn't like how if you focused on one skill you could be punished for it. Like I used sneak to get into a quest to get an object, but then I couldn't get it because my Lore wasn't high enough, so sneaking didn't help me much."

Me: "Well, I think you should expect to fail some quests. I don't think they intended you to win everything."

Him: "True, true. The way the game is made, it would be pretty shitty if you could just win at everything. I liked the challenge. All in all it was really good, especially how what you did affected stuff around you like you do things in this way something else happens than if you did it the other way." [he doesn't know what choices and consequences is ]

Me: "Yeah, definetely!

Him: "What did you play?"

Me: "I played a Praetor focusing on Block, Etiquette and Hammer."

Him: "Well, etiquette is pretty useless. Block is SOOOO over-powered. I tried using dodge but it's really bad compared to Block.

Me: "They're talking about buffing dodge."

Him: "I hope so! By the way, I think there needs to me more Lore-explanations and that kindda stuff. I don't really know what a Praetor or Grifter is, and the small explanation on the character screen isn't really enough to make me understand what they are."

Then we talked about some other stuff, and before we left he said:

"See ya. Gonna try a mercenary next. I want to kill some shit now. I never seem to be that good at avoiding combat anyway, and my assassin wasn't really made for it :p

Thanks for showing me the game uncle."

That right there is some major motherfucking , Codex!

:soproudofhisnephew:

 

[Tigranes]

I can't remember if merc killing assassin gives any more rewards from the innkeeper, but if you make a combat-oriented (not 100% combat) character, it's not very difficult to kill him then go on to help Vardanis. I actually even saved Vardanis in one of those, by killing the two thieves in two turns, I think with something like 35 axe and 35 block and combat-geared but not quite min-maxed attributes.

Also, total brofist to the 14yo.

 

[Humanity has risen!]

Sad that most people trying the demo will be like "what, I'm getting killed on the first fight????", will uninstall it, and never try it again.

 

[Hellraiser]

Meanwhile I finally discovered the MAJESTIC power of crafting. With my EPIC masterwork hardened edge iron gladius every time I click on an enemy something AWESOME happens. And my hardened masterwork armor made my mercenary nearly impervious to damage. Finally did the damn IG tower quest, after killing everything else (bandits+mine). Apparently you need about 60 block to pass the "solo distraction" check compared to the 50 block needed if you are not the only target. Still with the steel gladius of AWESOME and Praetorian hardened iron armor it was surprisingly easy.

Although I wish I had more steel. The amount present in the demo (outside of what you can get by killing the commercium shopkeeper which triggers the "leave or get raped" squad) isn't enough to craft both a max 9 AP armor and a gladius. So I just got a gladius.

However I feel that it is totally pointless to use shields better than a buckler. The attack penalty, combined with the ridiculous dodge/block rates of some of the tougher opponents, makes them a crappy choice. Unless want to tank a barrage of arrows. I can see how dodge can be worth it at higher levels though, especially with it's higher counterattack rate and a two handed axe of maiming. But as far as the demo is concerned block is just superior IMO.

 

[Jim Cojones]

I think it's the lack of decent armour for dodgers what makes that route very difficult. You can't really craft anything better than the armours you can buy (unless there are some secret techniques I didn't find) because +1DR masterwork is unavailable for light armours and the masterwork that reduces armour penalties is crap. Instead of lowering the penalties by 5 percentage points, it reduces it by 5% of total value, meaning that the penalty goes f.e. from 10% to 9%.

 

[Excidium]

That's probably a bug.

 

[felipepepe]

But as far as the demo is concerned block is just superior IMO.

Yeah, that's true. Dogde requires you to use shitty armors and never use shields, but offers no other benefit than perhaps more AP. Having a hand free from the shield doens't mean much, as dual-handed weapons are not that great, and apperantly you can't dual-wield.

[perception] Still, we have those pics on the user image gallery at ITS Forum...so, Vault Dweller , dual-wielding is a WIP or was discarted due balance issues (or I'm just dumb and didn't realise it was in the demo, like decomposing)?

 

[Excidium]

You can always have a net on your off-hand if you don't benefit from a shield. Or bolas, but I don't know what they do. I thought they tripped the enemy but when I used nothing happened (might be because he was already netted, wouldn't use it otherwise because the hit chance is low and it costs a fortune).

 

[Kosmonaut]

Fun story, (apropos target audience, Vault Dweller): My nephew, who is 14 years old and a colossal Oblivion and Skyrim-fan (we've argued on the subject before, especially about Oblivion) saw a facebook-update I made and decided to try out Age of Decadence. He didn't tell me about it, just downloaded that shit. He just completed it and he loved it. This is a 14 year old whose most hardcore RPG before AoD is probably Fallout: New Vegas. I logged into League of Legends today and he sent me a message:

[snip]
That right there is some major motherfucking , Codex!

:soproudofhisnephew:

Ha ha ha. This almost brough a tear to my eye. Nice to see ARPG people actually enjoying this game.

 

[Tigranes]

Ironically, I've found in both combat demo and here, that the way to go with dodge is to wield gigantic two handed weapons and use your high AP to lay the smackdown dealing lots of damage, all the while relying on your dodge to stay alive. It works well enough to be an entertaining and effective character build, but I've always thought it interesting that the best dodgers are wielding giant hammers.

Dual wielding is still possible in the demo btw, though I don't really see the advantages of it.

 

[felipepepe]

Dual wielding is still possible in the demo btw, though I don't really see the advantages of it.

Like in that pic? The way it worked for me was that I had a sword in one hand and a dagger in the other, using either one or another (they don't appear ath the same time in the model, like in those pics), so I could mix attacks that best suited my AP. As you said,that doens't give much of a advantage...I was thinking more of attacking with both weapons at the same time with reduced AP cost or something...

 

[Marsal]

I think the main problem with dodge vs block is that there is a third "defensive skill" in the game: tanking damage. This is represented as a combination of HP(CON) and DR(armor/crafting). This "skill" when paired with block can produce very resilient characters that break the skill balance.

I would reduce shield to-hit penalty (larger shields seem useless, unless fighting large number or archers), increase movements costs with (large) shield equipped to 3AP and 6AP and introduce special moves to facilitate maneuvering in combat. Small shields should get a chance to be split by any attack (not just axes).

Dodge characters would get to ignore AOOs at certain skill level (let's say 60 dodge), so they could use their high AP to avoid damage by positioning (DR from leather armor is useless vs higher-end weapons).

This could introduce kiting problems, but I think it's only fair for highly mobile characters to have an advantage in an open battlefield, as heavy melee characters have in confined spaces. Maybe some kind of "shield charge" move could help address the issue, or maybe bolas and nets with some tweaks would be enough? Maybe even having two handed crossbow or bow equipped cancels this perk? It would still work with thrown weapons, but they are not as cheap as arrows and weigh quite a bit, so ammo supply would be limited.

 

[hiver]

Oh great, more forced "solutions" by making something working even more shitty.

How about improving dodge instead?