Are the Final Fantasy Series games Beginner RPGs?

[Jasede]

Well they did, they tried it in 10. Worked great. Then they tried something else because that's just how FF works.

 

[Morenatsu.]

Real gamers play with default settings and don't do low-level runs because that's gay and not the point. And if you were really hardcore, you'd play with no pause anyway.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

I'm downloading the ps3 version of ff xiii right now, i remember it being shit but the meme is that it gets good 30hs in. If it's not true i'm gonna rape every single faggot in this thread that shills final fantasy games.

FFS, if you had read my posts about FF XIII, then you would know that it's the worst RPG I've ever completed --- assuming it even should be considered an RPG. Someone in the Japanese FF fanbase termed FF XIII the "Great Japanese Tunnel Simulator" because most of the game consists of you running forward through corridor after corridor, without even a pretense of exploration, only with combats alternating with cut-scenes. It's only around the 25-hour mark that the game delivers its final tutorials and unlocks all combat roles. It is also at this point that the game spits you out into a superficially open area, but even this openness is deceptive because, if you ignore optional monster hunts and simply proceed to finish the game, you'll have another 15 hours of running down tunnels. Moreover, the combat is terrible, as you only have direct control over one character in your party, with the gameplay instead centering around shifting the roles, such as sentinel (defender) or medic (healer), assigned to your party members. Also, the characters are the worst in any main series Final Fantasy, while the plot is essentially finished at the 20-hour mark, meaning halfway through the game assuming you don't waste time on later sidequests hunts.

You have been warned and have only yourself to blame.

 

[Sigourn]

Depends on the game, but yes.

I wouldn't recommend FFII to a beginner of the genre.

 

[Carpincho Pampeano]

I'm downloading the ps3 version of ff xiii right now, i remember it being shit but the meme is that it gets good 30hs in. If it's not true i'm gonna rape every single faggot in this thread that shills final fantasy games.

FFS, if you had read my posts about FF XIII, then you would know that it's the worst RPG I've ever completed --- assuming it even should be considered an RPG. Someone in the Japanese FF fanbase termed FF XIII the "Great Japanese Tunnel Simulator" because most of the game consists of you running forward through corridor after corridor, without even a pretense of exploration, only with combats alternating with cut-scenes. It's only around the 25-hour mark that the game delivers its final tutorials and unlocks all combat roles. It is also at this point that the game spits you out into a superficially open area, but even this openness is deceptive because, if you ignore optional monster hunts and simply proceed to finish the game, you'll have another 15 hours of running down tunnels. Moreover, the combat is terrible, as you only have direct control over one character in your party, with the gameplay instead centering around shifting the roles, such as sentinel (defender) or medic (healer), assigned to your party members. Also, the characters are the worst in any main series Final Fantasy, while the plot is essentially finished at the 20-hour mark, meaning halfway through the game assuming you don't waste time on later sidequests hunts.

You have been warned and have only yourself to blame.

FF trannies already moving the goalpost, go larp with your faggot friends on FF XIV.

 

[SomeGuyWithAnOpinion]

Don't even bother with any Final Fantasy game. Their core design is so fundamentally broken that they invite insane amounts of grind and power creep.

You know something is really wrong when doing 2 million damage just doesn't quite cut it anymore, so you need to farm for more items.

Are they RPGs? Yes, technically. But they are basically the combination of every bad aspect of RPG design - grind, repetitive actions to slightly buff a character, repetivie encounters with little to no strategy, power creep, horrible balance, little choice with even less consequence, horrible writing and characters, etc.

The ONLY remotely interesting aspect of Final Fantasy games is the intra-party dynamics in combat, and it has been done elsewhere and better. Even most Infinity Engine games, despite their horrendous flaws, let your party members support each other better in combat than any FF game.

JRPGs in general are shit. Probably the only good RPG made in Japan is Dark Souls, and that's because it's basically a western RPG made by Japanese developers. JRPGs in general aren't worth your time.

 

[Jasede]

Don't even bother with any Final Fantasy game. Their core design is so fundamentally broken that they invite insane amounts of grind and power creep.

You know something is really wrong when doing 2 million damage just doesn't quite cut it anymore, so you need to farm for more items.

Are they RPGs? Yes, technically. But they are basically the combination of every bad aspect of RPG design - grind, repetitive actions to slightly buff a character, repetivie encounters with little to no strategy, power creep, horrible balance, little choice with even less consequence, horrible writing and characters, etc.

The ONLY remotely interesting aspect of Final Fantasy games is the intra-party dynamics in combat, and it has been done elsewhere and better. Even most Infinity Engine games, despite their horrendous flaws, let your party members support each other better in combat than any FF game.

JRPGs in general are shit. Probably the only good RPG made in Japan is Dark Souls, and that's because it's basically a western RPG made by Japanese developers. JRPGs in general aren't worth your time.

Wow, not a single sentence there is true. It's all made up.

1) no final fantasy requires or invites grinding - in fact they can all be beaten even if you were to run from every encounter (I have done this myself)
2) you don't do "2 million damage" in any of those except the very latest ones and even there it requires special skills and is useful only for superbosses - optional challenges for completionists
3) on the contrary - random encounters in 1, 3, 4 for example have plenty of strategy and it is unlikely you would prevail without. Furthermore, while the writing's quality can be argued about, it's nowhere near as bad as Pillars of Eternity or these RPGs. It gets the job done.
4) characters in FF games can support each other in combat well. Even in the very first one they can cast potent buffs on one another and a party with synergy is much stronger than one without

 

[Gastrick]

For FFXII, I didn't get why they had to base their world after the phantom menace. That every creature and the architecture look like they belong in that movie. Also that the game makes you watch all those cutscenes and gives you zero control over how the characters react. You might as well just skip them all, but you can't, because then you miss the story.

 

[Gastrick]

Without a doubt FF are games made for beginners, besides the games that the fans ignore for the NES.

 

[Morenatsu.]

Don't even bother with any Final Fantasy game. Their core design is so fundamentally broken that they invite insane amounts of grind and power creep.

You know something is really wrong when doing 2 million damage just doesn't quite cut it anymore, so you need to farm for more items.

Are they RPGs? Yes, technically. But they are basically the combination of every bad aspect of RPG design - grind, repetitive actions to slightly buff a character, repetivie encounters with little to no strategy, power creep, horrible balance, little choice with even less consequence, horrible writing and characters, etc.

The ONLY remotely interesting aspect of Final Fantasy games is the intra-party dynamics in combat, and it has been done elsewhere and better. Even most Infinity Engine games, despite their horrendous flaws, let your party members support each other better in combat than any FF game.

JRPGs in general are shit. Probably the only good RPG made in Japan is Dark Souls, and that's because it's basically a western RPG made by Japanese developers. JRPGs in general aren't worth your time.

Wow, not a single sentence there is true. It's all made up.

1) no final fantasy requires or invites grinding - in fact they can all be beaten even if you were to run from every encounter (I have done this myself)
2) you don't do "2 million damage" in any of those except the very latest ones and even there it requires special skills and is useful only for superbosses - optional challenges for completionists
3) on the contrary - random encounters in 1, 3, 4 for example have plenty of strategy and it is unlikely you would prevail without. Furthermore, while the writing's quality can be argued about, it's nowhere near as bad as Pillars of Eternity or these RPGs. It gets the job done.
4) characters in FF games can support each other in combat well. Even in the very first one they can cast potent buffs on one another and a party with synergy is much stronger than one without

ah yes, running from every encounter, something that's not allowed half of the time. ah yes, that plentiful strategy, like spamming your second-best offensive spells so you can save the best for the boss, and sometimes healing. ah yes, those potent buffs which waste precious time better used for attack-spam and heal-spam. Sorry, your retarded self-imposed challenges don't matter and never did. JRPGs exist for cute anime adventures where the only thing wrong with the writing is that it doesn't appeal to Codexers (which is a good thing). Storyfags only.

Since you're an ignorer now I can say whatever I want to your face and feel justified even more than I already do.

 

[flyingjohn]

It is weird how people are grouping 10+ games that have been through multiple generations into one single cohesive game series?
The "everything is atb" reminds me of people who group fallout 3 with New Vegas just because they are on the same engine.

The FF series(minus 13 onward) when compared to the more generic jrpg of their era always had systems that are either unusual or certainly not beginner friendly either by complexity or having plenty of customization.1,8,12 systems are not beginner friendly.
The dq series is designed to be as accessible as it can be to anybody,doesn't make it a bad game series though.
And when you compare trigger to any ff games,the ff games look like hardcore rpg's.


And let's take a look at ff 1 nes:
-Full party creation compared to one guy in dq and linear party in phantasy star.
-Grind is optional compared to grind being necessary for both dq and phantasy star. Dq avoids grinds with the metal slime trick which is again just grinding and phantasy star requires grinding in order to progress because story progressions is tied to money.

The only one i would consider relatively normal and for beginners is 9.

 

[tentanz]

Without a doubt FF are games made for beginners, besides the games that the fans ignore for the NES.

They don't really prepare beginners for more complicated rules. You aren't learning awful lot from FF, better off starting with a difficult game on low difficulty.

 

[Gastrick]

Without a doubt FF are games made for beginners, besides the games that the fans ignore for the NES.

They don't really prepare beginners for more complicated rules. You aren't learning awful lot from FF, better off starting with a difficult game on low difficulty.

You mean what beginners should play? I don't see it being much different than any other player, that they'd want to play good games that will make them love the genre. Any complicated game can be picked up with some tenacity, so it doesn't make sense to exclude them.

Edit: What games are recommended for beginners to play are so well known, that what to avoid is the only actually useful knowledge. In Final Fantasy, avoid II, VI, IX, remastered X, XII, and any of the modern games.

 

[Zed Duke of Banville]

It is weird how people are grouping 10+ games that have been through multiple generations into one single cohesive game series?
The "everything is atb" reminds me of people who group fallout 3 with New Vegas just because they are on the same engine.

There's a fundamental disjuncture between the period 1987-2001, meaning the original Final Fantasy through FF X, and the period since. During that 14-year stretch, Squaresoft released ten main series FF games but only a few spin-offs, and those ten main series FFs do exhibit a considerable consistency in their gameplay, even with the switch from turn-based to ATB in FF IV and then back again for FF X. The fundamental issue during the two decades after FF X, Squaresoft SquareEnix has released a ludicrous number and variety of games bearing the Final Fantasy title but not part of the main series, even including two MMORPGs that used main series numbering, but has only managed to release three games actually in the main series. It's FFs XII, XIII, and XV that lack any cohesiveness even with each other, much less the first ten proper FFs; however, it's perfectly reasonable to discuss the commonalities of those earlier games, especially if you recognize the shift from the Wizardry-based original Final Fantasy to a narrative focus typical of the new JRPG subgenre that the FF series was instrumental in defining.

 

[Bruma Hobo]

Well they did, they tried it in 10. Worked great. Then they tried something else because that's just how FF works.

Well yeah, and this doesn't speak so well about this series' mechanics, nor its fans. Because obviously they would never change core elements from their flagship series, which means that combat and RPG systems are actually secondary, and non-storyfag Final Fantasy players are just full of copium.

 

[S.torch]

Well yeah, and this doesn't speak so well about this series' mechanics, nor its fans.

I think it talks way worse about people that don't even know there's not that much difference between active turn based and just turn based combat. But it doesn't matter, because said people probably would be complaining anyways if none was changed saying "noooo they changed nothing!!!!11" since their whole character is only being whiners.

At least they should have the decency to do it with an actual change like the one they did with real time combat, so they can hide their obvious poseurism better.

Also JRPGs always had a major focus on story and atmosphere.

 

[Carpincho Pampeano]

I don't understand how people deep throat FF X and shit on FF XIII when FFX is a proto XIII, just bandwagoning niggers.

 

[Falksi]

I don't understand how people deep throat FF X and shit on FF XIII when FFX is a proto XIII, just bandwagoning niggers.

On one hand I think FFX's story hit far more emotional notes which connect with people, not to mention when it was released it was a real frontrunner in terms of cinematics. Plus the cloister of trials give the game an extra dynamic too.

That said, mechanically I totally get where you're coming from. The latter game is more fun, but the corridor combat for 20-30 hours plays itself (albeit at a fast pace with the interchangeable characters adding a bit more variety to proceedings).

I've just replayed FFX and, whilst I'd still class it as an OK/good purchase, it's definitely way more show than dough, and hadn't held up anywhere near as well as I remembering thinking it would. The easyness is just off the scale for a long period.

 

[Carpincho Pampeano]

I don't understand how people deep throat FF X and shit on FF XIII when FFX is a proto XIII, just bandwagoning niggers.

On one hand I think FFX's story hit far more emotional notes which connect with people, not to mention when it was released it was a real frontrunner in terms of cinematics. Plus the cloister of trials give the game an extra dynamic too.

That said, mechanically I totally get where you're coming from. The latter game is more fun, but the corridor combat for 20-30 hours plays itself (albeit at a fast pace with the interchangeable characters adding a but more variety to proceedings).

I've just replayed FFX and, whilst I'd still class it as an OK/good purchase, it's definitely way more show than dough, and hadn't held up anywhere near as well as I remembering thinking it would. The easyness is just off the scale for a long period.

I'm playing it right now, dungeon crawlers are my favourite sub genre of RPGs so i don't really need town exploration to enjoy a game but i can see why people are mad of corridors in a game that used to be relatively open, i just wished if had more meat in it's design. Combat system is fantastic and so is the visual aspect of the game but i can't recommend this game to a FF fan, so they are in the right at being mad at the game.

 

[Softgels]

The first FF game I played was VI, the plot, characters and music was surprisingly good.

 

[Val the Moofia Boss]

I didn't like FF10's story very much. The best part is the early journey but once you go to Seymour's home I started tuning out.

The problem with FF13's story is the style and execution of it. It's not that the story is bad, but the way it is presented to the player makes it seem unnecessarily convoluted. There are flashbacks and flash forwards. Characters are separated by hours and hours of gameplay that by the time you get back to the other party, you forgot who they were and what they were doing. At one point you fight a guy who comes back from the dead, but it has no impact because that was like 40 hours ago and you've completely forgotten about him. It'd be like a minor character who showed up in the second episode of Game of Thrones, and he shows up in the last season and you're supposed to remember him.

Game design wise, it's mindboggling that the devs thought that Final Fantasy fans wanted a FF game without a world map, without pilotable airships, and would be fine with corridors.

 

[somerandomdude]

The recent remasters done of the original 1, 2, 3 are way easier than the originals. They're for the zoomer. They did buff the last boss in 1 a bit, so you can't 1 turn cycle him anymore, but the regular battles pose no threat at all, and they were a huge threat in the original FF1, even more than the actual bosses. 3 is a bit tougher than 1 and 2. In 2, just remove weapons and use bare fists on everyone and put buff/heal spells on everyone. You can read topics on the 3 remaster, and see that zoomer normies are still getting owned on that one. There's a few noob-wall bosses like Salamander. I really don't get these people, it's like they're mad when something pwns them in a game as if it's a personal affront to their very existence. Squeenix did their best to appeal to this crowd, but I guess they didn't dumb down 3 quite enough

 

[Corbin Dallas Multipass]

I don't understand how people deep throat FF X and shit on FF XIII when FFX is a proto XIII, just bandwagoning niggers.

Lol FFX let you have control over how your characters were built, at least to a degree. FFXIII you just pointlessly had to hold a button down to level up your characters with the XP you got, you had no choice whatsoever. In FFX you controlled each character individually and tried to damage the enemies until they died. In FFXIII you controlled one character, and swapped your party members between 3 roles, for the purpose of building up a combo meter to allow you to actually hurt the enemies.

They were incredibly different games. That doesn't even get into the fact that FFXIII was bad and dumb and had bad and dumb characters, and FFX was less bad and less dumb, with not terrible bad and dumb characters.

My first "RPG" was dragon warrior, aka dragon quest if you ask a japanese person. Grinding WAS the name of the game. There was some exploration as well though.
My first FF was "FF2", aka FF4 if you ask a japanese person. Somehow I always ended up losing the thread of the story and wandering the world in my airship trying to figure out where in the hell I was supposed to be going.

I beat dragon warrior, eventually. I never beat FF2/4.

Going back now, I find dragon warrior more satisfying. More... open, somehow.