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Preview Are you a man enough dude to become a machine?

DarkUnderlord

Professional Throne Sitter
Staff Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2002
Messages
28,318
Tags: Space Siege

<a href="http://www.gamesradar.com/pc/space-siege/preview/space-siege-hands-on/a-2008061685947822019/g-2007070616546493042">That's what gamesradar.com asks in their preview of Space Siege</a>:
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<blockquote>Hindsight says that wasn’t the best idea because I soon graduated from the weaker Kerak to the bigger, meaner Veteran Hunters, who surprised me by standing up again after being hit with a blast of fire ammo and then smacked down with a magnablade attack. Not coincidentally, this is also where I first experienced the BioShock-style resurrection system: I respawned in the nearest medical device at full health, but the damage I’d inflicted on the enemy was still in effect, leading me to believe that Gas Powered is going for a casual experience that doesn’t frustrate gamers with overly tough enemies. Fortunately (from a keeping-us-alive perspective), I stumbled upon the disassembled parts of an HRV robot. After a little tinkering, a fully upgradable “Harvey” sidekick bot was up and running, watching my back with machine guns that I later upgraded to napalm throwers.
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Cybernetic augmentation is definitely the stand-out feature of Space Siege, as destroying your own humanity to preserve the human race adds a little food for thought to the general coolness of being a killer cyborg fighting aliens. This is the thinking man’s killer cyborg game.</blockquote>
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Hey, whatever happaned to death? "Thinking" also seems to be the new catch-phrase for this round of RPG's.
 

AzraelCC

Scholar
Joined
Jan 2, 2008
Messages
309
Cybernetic augmentation is definitely the stand-out feature of Space Siege, as destroying your own humanity to preserve the human race adds a little food for thought to the general coolness of being a killer cyborg fighting aliens. This is the thinking man’s killer cyborg game.

Wow, a slight variation of charms! That just screams revolutionary!

:roll:

Losing your humanity doesn't even seem to have consequences gameplay-wise, what the hell is there to fucking think about?
 

OSK

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Messages
7,962
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Shouldn't it be "bad enough dude"?

Like this:

BadEnoughDude.jpg
 

Zeus

Cipher
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
1,523
Cybernetic augmentation is definitely the stand-out feature of Space Siege, as destroying your own humanity to preserve the human race adds a little food for thought to the general coolness of being a killer cyborg fighting aliens. This is the thinking man’s killer cyborg game.

That's the stand-out feature?

You wanna talk destroying humanity, Cyborgs got nothin' on clones. Try the lackluster Diablo-wannabe Cybermercs.

In Cybermercs, every time you suffer fatal injuries, you don't "respawn" in some magical Vita Chamber -- you die.

Meanwhile, your clone pops out of the cloning booth and heads off into battle to avenge his own death.

It's a subtle but disturbing difference.

The cloning backstory is actually a major part of Cybermercs', um, "mythos".

There are even Goofus & Galliant-style fables; gruesome little stories that all end with, "and so he died because he wouldn't get a clone." For example, Freddy "The Freddy" Alpion was too prideful to make a clone of himself, "a mistake that cost him when he fell under the alien's control. Now a sadistic murderer, any mercenary working to recover the mineral mine must destroy him." Then there's Blood Joe, who despite his good Christian name was "also too proud to make a clone of himself." - Ironic Consumer

Cybermercs is actually pretty good for a cheesy Diablo, ahem, clone. Plus it beat all these Johnny-come-latelies to the Diablo-in-Spaaaaaaceeeee punch by a good five years. :D
 

Lingwe

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 11, 2007
Messages
519
Location
australia
Not coincidentally, this is also where I first experienced the BioShock-style resurrection system: I respawned in the nearest medical device at full health,

I guess this explains the phenomenom of how Pete Hines has to continually remind us that if the dog dies then it doesn't come back to life.
 

DraQ

Arcane
Joined
Oct 24, 2007
Messages
32,828
Location
Chrząszczyżewoszyce, powiat Łękołody
Lingwe said:
Not coincidentally, this is also where I first experienced the BioShock-style resurrection system: I respawned in the nearest medical device at full health,

I guess this explains the phenomenom of how Pete Hines has to continually remind us that if the dog dies then it doesn't come back to life.
Eh, both SS1 and SS2 had resurrection machines without being doomed to suck.
 

ghostdog

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
11,067
Resurrection machines are lame, I never used them. Is reloading a save that hard?
 

MountainWest

Scholar
Joined
May 29, 2006
Messages
630
Location
Over there
ghostdog said:
Resurrection machines are lame, I never used them. Is reloading a save that hard?

Yes, because then the monsters will have the same amount of health as at the time of the save, thus not ensuring victory regardless of tactics. Plus, dying is the new thinking - neither should happen because it breaks the flow of killing stuff.
 

Darth Roxor

Royal Dongsmith
Staff Member
Joined
May 29, 2008
Messages
1,878,330
Location
Djibouti
I'm starting to have fucking enough of the death of the 'gaming cliches' such as health bars and normal 'GAME OVER, PLZ LOAD LAST SAVE GAME' texts and the replacement of these with 'hide and regen' and 'rez around every fucking corner'.
 

Claw

Erudite
Patron
Joined
Aug 7, 2004
Messages
3,777
Location
The center of my world.
Project: Eternity Divinity: Original Sin 2
Does anyone recall a game called Missionforce: Cyberstorm? It was the thinking man's battletech clone because the pilots of your HERCs were unstable clones belonging to the company.
 

ghostdog

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
11,067
The thinking man’s killer cyborg game has already been made. Suck it up Space Siege !
bionic20commandoeo3.jpg
 

denizsi

Arcane
Joined
Nov 24, 2005
Messages
9,927
Location
bosphorus
A Bionic Commando remake is in the works. It will still be a side-scrolling platformer though.

That Cybermerc shot reminded me of the isometric action Origin games, Crusader: No Remorse and the sequel, No Regret. Great games.
 

Zeus

Cipher
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
1,523
denizsi said:
A Bionic Commando remake is in the works. It will still be a side-scrolling platformer though.

Actually, there's TWO Bonic Commando remakes in the works. Bionic Commando Rearmed is a relatively faithful 2D sidescrolling conversion for, I believe, PC, Xbox Live and PS3 Nation or whatever it's called.

Then there's Bionic Commando, a modernized, third person, "running into the screen" game (like Crash Bandicoot camera angles and stuff) that actually looks REALLY fun. They've got some amazing Spider-Man-swinging-through-the-city camera angles. Check out the trailer if you wanna see what it's like.

An interesting note about the Bonic Commando remakes -- the 2D one takes place before the 3D one, so the hero is a clean cut, crew cut, All-American 80s Action Hero. In the 3D game, he's all grizzled and disillusioned. Also, he has a mullet and red headband.

So awesome.

denizsi said:
That Cybermerc shot reminded me of the isometric action Origin games, Crusader: No Remorse and the sequel, No Regret. Great games.

Yes, it did. Crusader is one of those games I always wanted to own but was stuck with the shareware. By the time I could afford it, my computer was too fast to run the sucker.

Cybermercs doesn't totally suck. It's like Diablo meets Aliens. Depending on how much a game's theme can do it for you, sometimes that can be enough for a few hours of fun. (I used to be big into Japanese/Samurai games. Didn't matter how bad the game was. Long as I could play a Ninja, I was happy.)
 

bgillisp

Scholar
Joined
Mar 18, 2005
Messages
248
Location
Iowa, USA
DraQ said:
Lingwe said:
Eh, both SS1 and SS2 had resurrection machines without being doomed to suck.

I think the feature worked there as you had to find and switch then to ressurect you instead of turn you into a cyborg. Until you found them and did that you died for good though. And I know in SS1 the last few levels had no resurrection machines, so permanent death became possible then. My memory is fuzzy on SS2 though and how it worked so can't comment.

I hink the problem Bioshock (and apparently Space Siege) have is the resurrection feature is there from the beginning. You do nothing to earn it, and there is little to no chance of ever suffering a permanent death as a result. I think that is why I got bored senseless of Dungeon Siege 2, and only finished Bioshock as it was short enough I got through it before I was bored completely to tears.
 

Section8

Cipher
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
4,321
Location
Wardenclyffe
My memory is fuzzy on SS2 though and how it worked so can't comment.

It was pretty much the same, you had to input your DNA or some such and then you'd respawn at the cost of nanites, and with low health. It struck a really good balance where dying was still a pain in the arse, but not enough to warrant constant quicksaving/loading.
 

Texas Red

Whiner
Joined
Sep 9, 2006
Messages
7,044
So basically you respawn with completely no penalties? Are they trying to make a shitty game? They removed the very concept of games: challenge.
 
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
6,207
Location
The island of misfit mascots
Section8 said:
My memory is fuzzy on SS2 though and how it worked so can't comment.

It was pretty much the same, you had to input your DNA or some such and then you'd respawn at the cost of nanites, and with low health. It struck a really good balance where dying was still a pain in the arse, but not enough to warrant constant quicksaving/loading.

There was two differences with SS2, both so minor I can see why a developer would underestimate their importance to that game mechanic, one of which you mentioned:
(1) nanite cost - yep, just a fairly minorish deduction of nanites each time you die. Not enough to be a problem every now and then, but if you keep dying stupidly it will add up and bite you in the ass. Also means you have to save some cash (nanites) up at all times rather than using it all on stuff, just in case you hit a hard part of the game. So why is this important? Because just having that minor cost there makes death meaningful - it stops you from corpse-running like its WoW PvP spammage. It means your strategy against the big brother isn't going to be 'fire two shots, die, run back, fire two shots, die run back, repeat'. It also gives the mechanic a purpose. Why have the resurrection mechanic if it puts you in the exact same position as if you reloaded - or worse, allows a gamebreaking exploit? I barely used the res chambers in Bioshock, not because they were imbalanced, but because there was no point - I may as well just reload given that it puts me in the same position as if I res'd. Whereas in SS2 I'd be less likely to reload, as I'd feel that was 'cheating' in a way - the res mechanic is all about making players choose that over reloading - so it better do something different. A marginal nanite cost was enough to encourage the player to accept a penalty for death, making death more meaningful than if you just reloaded each time.

(2). For a guy that doesn't player FPS much, SS2 could be fricken hard at times. The game seemed designed around the res system in that it had a checkpoint mentality. There were bits where even if you res'd you would still need a strategy to get through. So the first res might be recon (you could always recon without the res, but it was there if you f'd up) but you would approach it like a checkpoint game. Bioshock, however, was simply too easy to have a free res system - it felt more like godmode than a checkpoint system.
 

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