Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Elex]

That means the TB aspect didn't work that well. Along with the Vancian system of course.

you have no idea what 5e D&D is right?

 

[Lacrymas]

you have no idea what 5e D&D is right?

You have no idea what the context is, right?

 

[Atchodas]

Reading all this stupid talk about BG3 being like twitcher or Dragon Age I remembered this Larian interview about BG3 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ju12JNh8gJs
at around 8 minute mark they talk about what engine they gonna be using for BG3 and Swen basically says its gonna be next step of their D:OS engine, he says that D:OS was 2.0 of their engine then D:OS2 was 3.0 , Definitive Edition 3.5 and BG3 will be next step (and most likely we will get definitive edition of BG3 some time after release same as D;OS games). This only makes sense considering WoTC were holding off giving rights to BG3 until they saw what Swen and Larian can really accomplish with D:OS2, its safe to assume they gonna continue with their recipe for success.

 

[HoboForEternity]

DO:S combat without the retarded level scaling and DnD based class would be so fucking incline

 

[Rpguy]

DO:S combat without the retarded level scaling and DnD based class would be so fucking incline

DO:S 1 and 2 did not have level scaling, there was actually a mod that added level scaling because the games got too easy

 

[Atchodas]

Well since you get 99% of your stats while levelling up in D:OS2 technically everything scales with your level there.

Edit : I dont think he meant enemy level scaling or did he

 

[Rpguy]

This is the mod:
https://www.nexusmods.com/divinityoriginalsin2definitiveedition/mods/132

This is people asking about it:
http://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=646030
https://steamcommunity.com/app/435150/discussions/0/1728701877514432844/
https://www.reddit.com/r/DivinityOriginalSin/comments/8ti9on/do_enemy_levels_scale/

If you read into it , it says no level scaling

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Biting sarcasm aside, D:OS engine was pretty good, it's just that the dialogue, plot, storylines, lore, and quests were all so retarded as to take all the fun and immersion out of the games.

If Larian could somehow avoid their retarded attempts at humor, and hire decent writers, and stick to Baldur's Gate-like writing, I guess the game could be good. But that's a lot of ifs, and it's oh so much easier for Swen to design another cat co-op game for his gf.

 

[Rpguy]

Did you see the BG3 trailer? The theme looks dark and bloody. I think they got it covered with the no nonsense part.

 

[Jack_Deth]

D:OS was turn-based Magicka.

 

[Atchodas]

Its mentioned plenty of times that they are "working closely and cooperating" with WoTC for this game so no chance WotC allows them to butcher BG for mass production and turn it into "another cat co-op game for his gf" btw cat co-op game for GF's turned out to be one out of very few good new cRPGS released in last decade.

 

[Jack_Deth]

no chance WotC allows them to butcher BG for mass production.

WoTC are full SJW now though.

 

[Saerain]

no chance WotC allows them to butcher BG for mass production.

WoTC are full SJW now though.

And I thought Jeremy Crawford was seemingly one of the big forces behind that, considering Xanathar's Guide and his Twitter shenanigans, yet I noticed in Acquisitions Incorporated as GM that it seems absent from his personality.

Predominantly pressure from Hasbro or what?

 

[prodigydancer]

Are they going to release any gameplay info this year? I must confess that after D:OS2 I'm rather hyped for Larian because that game surpassed my expectations by a really wide margin. Everything that I found irritating or boring about D:OS1 was properly fixed or redesigned in the sequel.

A D&D game will have different combat mechanics, of course, which is why I'm dying of curiosity. To me right now Larian are the new kings of CRPG.

 

[Cryomancer]

WoTC are full SJW now though.

How is the situation with Paizo?

I must confess that after D:OS2 I'm rather hyped for Larian because that game surpassed my expectations by a really wide margin. Everything that I found irritating or boring about D:OS1 was properly fixed or redesigned in the sequel.

A D&D game will have different combat mechanics, of course, which is why I'm dying of curiosity. To me right now Larian are the new kings of CRPG.

I hated DOS2. Everything that i hate about modern RPG philosophies, limit you to one minion, cooldown, archers limited to 13m, mmo like itemization, etc exists on DOS2...

 

[hexer]

Its mentioned plenty of times that they are "working closely and cooperating" with WoTC for this game so no chance WotC allows them to butcher BG for mass production and turn it into "another cat co-op game for his gf" btw cat co-op game for GF's turned out to be one out of very few good new cRPGS released in last decade.

​

It will have integrated co-op from the start and something else I guess - support for gamepad controllers.

Baldur’s Gate 3 will have co-op multiplayer
https://www.pcgamesn.com/baldurs-gate-3-co-op

 

[vortex]

They shouldn't do game master mode. Did anybody even play that in D:OS2?
Was it really worth the stretch goal?

 

[prodigydancer]

limit you to one minion

One per character (nothing stops you from playing a party of four summoners). In D:OS2 fully buffed minions are very strong. You seem to imply that controlling a swarm of weaklings would be more interesting. How exactly?

cooldown

"Cooldowns are bad" is just a dogma. People say that but they can never explain why cd/s are so bad. In D:OS2 many cd/s are long enough to make abilities effectively once per encounter. How is this system so different from any other form of resource management?

archers limited to 13m

In most fights you can easily increase range by jumping to high ground. We could have a round of the old "what's better - 13m limit or hit-and-run abuse of sniping?" debate here, of course. But let's just accept that all VG combat systems are imperfect in some way.

mmo like itemization

It's really a matter of taste. I can see how people who dislike such itemization won't like D:OS (and a lot of other games). I don't mind it. Although one of the few bad things I could say about D:OS2 is that many unique items are lackluster and not really unique. That could've been handled better.

 

[Cryomancer]

One per character (nothing stops you from playing a party of four summoners). In D:OS2 fully buffed minions are very strong. You seem to imply that controlling a swarm of weaklings would be more interesting. How exactly?

This doesn't look like "weakelings", in fact a Thanadaemon looks far stronger than any dos2 summon

"Cooldowns are bad" is just a dogma. People say that but they can never explain why cd/s are so bad. In D:OS2 many cd/s are long enough to make abilities effectively once per encounter. How is this system so different from any other form of resource management?

I will make a analogy with a molotov

"i ran out of molotovs on my backpack' is a good reason to not be able to use molotovs
"i have infinite molotovs but acn only use one each X seconds" makes no sense.

Cooldowns started with wow and are the WORST and most boring mechanic.

In most fights you can easily increase range by jumping to high ground. We could have a round of the old "what's better - 13m limit or hit-and-run abuse of sniping?" debate here, of course. But let's just accept that all VG combat systems are imperfect in some way.

Enemies can snipe you too. Did you played dark souls? Anor Londo archers are one of the most infamous enemies...

 

[Spectacle]

Its mentioned plenty of times that they are "working closely and cooperating" with WoTC for this game so no chance WotC allows them to butcher BG for mass production and turn it into "another cat co-op game for his gf" btw cat co-op game for GF's turned out to be one out of very few good new cRPGS released in last decade.

WotC allowed Sword Coast Legends to happen...

 

[Lacrymas]

"Cooldowns are bad" is just a dogma. People say that but they can never explain why cd/s are so bad. In D:OS2 many cd/s are long enough to make abilities effectively once per encounter. How is this system so different from any other form of resource management?

Not only do they not make sense, they encourage an MMO-like "rotation" where you have a most efficient way to use abilities one after the other and you have to constantly juggle a bunch of cooldowns. Make casting times instead. 3-turn CD = 3-turn casting time. That also forces you to think about positioning, whether an enemy can interrupt you, there's an opportunity cost involved (you can cast 3 other less powerful spells in that time for example), more powerful abilities actually make sense and can be balanced now, etc.

 

[Atchodas]

You are implying that channelling a spell for 3 turns is better than 3 turn cool down? Are you fucking insane ?

 

[prodigydancer]

This doesn't look like "weakelings", in fact a Thanadaemon looks far stronger than any dos2 summon

First, balance-wise, a horde of strong minions is even worse than a swarm of weak ones. Second, being able to overwhelm enemies with summons is generally considered a bad thing. I distinctly remember people complaining about mass summoning in BG (and ever more so in IWD2 where HoF difficulty could be completely cheesed with summons). Third, it's debatable but my opinion is that controllable summons are more tactically advanced that uncontrollable ones.

i have infinite molotovs

But you don't. A limited resource is a limited resource. I don't know why people make such a big deal of how it's limited. I don't think that all systems are equal (e.g. I prefer vancian magic in PoE over "per-encounter but only two casts per spell level" in Deadfire) but cooldowns aren't bad per se. It's all about implementation.

makes no sense.

Dagger against full plate makes no sense. No VG combat system is realistic.

Cooldowns started with wow and are the WORST and most boring mechanic.

Now that sounds like personal preference. It's fine that you don't like apples but it doesn't mean that oranges are objectively better.

Enemies can snipe you too. Did you played dark souls? Anor Londo archers are one of the most infamous enemies...

I don't play DS and I don't like annoying mechanics.

 

[Cryomancer]

First, balance-wise, a horde of strong minions is even worse than a swarm of weak ones. Second, being able to overwhelm enemies with summons is generally considered a bad thing. I distinctly remember people complaining about mass summoning in BG (and ever more so in IWD2 where HoF difficulty could be completely cheesed with summons). Third, it's debatable but my opinion is that controllable summons are more tactically advanced that uncontrollable ones.

Everyone hated when BG:EE limited summons. In fact the most popular mods generally remove this BS. Be able to control 5 Efreets but not 6 CR1 skeleton makes no sense. 3.5e had a good limitation on summoning(your caster level * 2 HD worth of creature) And the "balance cult" is responsible for ruining many fantasies. The guy controlling a big undead army is one of the coolest class fantasies. The sniper too, everything is being ruined by the sake of balance... Also BG is a SP game, nobody will be prejudiced by cheese tactics. On PnP summons are even stronger since they can summon more unities.

Dagger against full plate makes no sense. No VG combat system is realistic.

If you can hit in the "visor", yes, you can pierce. But on Baldur's Gate, the average guy with a sword is extremely unlikely to hit in one of the enemy gaps. Plate armor on BG has different AC values for blunt and slashing weapons. Anyway, a game doesn't need to be 100% realistic, but allow the bare minimum of immersion, is what i expect. I wanna use a crossbow in a VG and feel like it is a crossbow, not a nerf gun(ironically, nerf guns probably has bigger range than dos2 ranged weapons)

Now that sounds like personal preference. It's fine that you don't like apples but it doesn't mean that oranges are objectively better.

Yes, not like to consta watch my action bar to see what devs allow me to use is not fun

I don't play DS and I don't like annoying mechanics.

Personal preference and it is not a annoying mechanic. In fact, projectiles on Dark Souls are far slower than IRL. Hell, is easy to evade anything, from a trowing knife, to a longbow and to a lightning.

Not only do they not make sense, they encourage an MMO-like "rotation" where you have a most efficient way to use abilities one after the other and you have to constantly juggle a bunch of cooldowns. Make casting times instead. 3-turn CD = 3-turn casting time. That also forces you to think about positioning, whether an enemy can interrupt you, there's an opportunity cost involved (you can cast 3 other less powerful spells in that time for example), more powerful abilities actually make sense and can be balanced now, etc.

Not 3 turn casting time. That would make inviable most spells without significant buffs. But anything is better than cooldowns.

• Make the ludicrous powerful skills hard to obtain(eg - the strongest dark magic/hex on DKS2 who need you to face a long covenant quest and defeat the strongest boss vs dark in the game)
• Conditions, like moonlight ray on M&M VI that can only be used at night on outdoors

• Uses/casts per rest, used in many games, including pokemon

• Have a drawback, eg - the strongest hex also costs all of your souls on DS2

• Require reagents like ultima online

• Casting time like most Dragon's Dogma spells

• Require the sacrifice of a companion like DD Sacrificial Bolt

• Costs gold

• Ages the caster like Divine Intervention on M&M or inflict a perma debuff

• Costs XP like many 3.5e D&D spells

• A vaal system like PoE where you need to collect souls, eg, summon skeleton raises few weak skeletons, vaal summon skeleton needs to be charged but summons a undead army

 

[Lacrymas]

You are implying that channelling a spell for 3 turns is better than 3 turn cool down? Are you fucking insane ?

I'm not implying that, I'm stating it outright. A 3 turn cooldown might better be translated as 2 turn cast time, or whatever, the relative values don't matter much in this hypothetical situation of why casting times are better than cooldowns.

Not 3 turn casting time. That would make inviable most spells without significant buffs. But anything is better than cooldowns.

3 turns was just an example. They won't be unviable, they'll actually be balanced and have an opportunity cost attached that can justify their power level.