Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Cael]

The whole Time of Troubles affair was basically an in-setting justification for the changes in AD&D from 1e to 2e

AFAIK was no change between 1st and 2nd editions with regards to gods, if anything the 2nd edition took the idea of killing a god off the table - an idea which did exist in 1st edition.

After all, 2nd edition was not a re-write like the munchkin 3rd edition was, but a polished, marketable, organized and playtested 1st edition. The rules are the same between them, the tables are the same, the classes are the same - with some minor nips and tucks. It's perfectly reasonable to consider the 1st and 2nd edition to be the same game and the denomination 2nd edition fits very well.

The Times of Trouble affair was written with much fanfare from TSR, to change the setting, so TSR had a plausible reason to sell the Forgotten Realms setting again (now in a gold box!) and all the new source books. The map changed, new characters were introduced, the factions evolved and so on.

The Avatar trilogy was not written to clarify gods in the FR or their relationship with 2nd edition AD&D.

It was written for marketing reasons, to encourage people to buy the 2nd edition FR boxed set, because otherwise there wouldn't be a reason to do that - the difference between 1st and 2nd edition AD&D didn't really affect the FR setting.

https://twitter.com/TDenningauthor/status/1137860389755072512

Wait... There are people claiming that the Avatar Crisis wasn't done to explain the transition from 1st to 2nd? Like the Spellplague was specifically done to explain the transition from 3.5 to 4th?

Seriously? That is some boneheaded deliberate ignorance right there...

 

[Lilura]

her blog does serve an invaluable role within the RPG community. It's good to have you back.

Thanks for the kind words, Alpan. I wholeheartedly agree with the value you place on my commentary. No one has come before me, none are with me now, and none will come after. And the best part is? With the advent of BG3, I'm going to get bigger. And with more might, comes more right.

You have the page stats to check what I'm about to claim: Your Baldur's Gate and Fallout coverage is little (if any) better than the myriad FAQs that populated the internet before you were ever a thing. If I want an appraisal of those games' myriad content, I go to GameFAQs, not your blog.

Please cite retrospectives on GameFAGs. Also, a lot of those guides are outdated, poorly written or just plain wrong. At any rate, it was clear in the snippet you quoted that I'm not trying to take on GameFAGs: I'd rather write retrospectives and commentary rather than walkthroughs for retards.

Your competitive advantage is your Neverwinter Nights coverage, which has no equal, followed by JA2 and ToEE. By all means continue to cover the BG series, but recognize that those games don't make you.

Actually, my BG coverage has made my blog what it is. It constitutes half of my coverage and 80% of my traffic at least. It's a Baldur's Gate blog.

In general terms, my Infinity, Aurora and Electron engine coverage has no equal. There hasn't been, in the history of those three engines, a more prolific commentator. This is a fact. A competitor would need to drop everything and get busy for the next few years to get where I'm at. Or assemble an army and throw money around (which I could also do in response).

 

[Efe]

arent gibberlings3 the ultimate authority on everything infinity engine?

 

[Lilura]

arent gibberlings3 the ultimate authority on everything infinity engine?

Not on commentary; they have none. They're a great modding community, though.

 

[ArchAngel]

arent gibberlings3 the ultimate authority on everything infinity engine?

Not on commentary; they have none. They're a great modding community, though.

For commentary we got RPGCodex.

 

[Lilura]

For commentary we got RPGCodex.

Different animal that isn't comparable or competing with any blogger.

• Doesn't write multi-part retrospectives on BG
• Doesn't write pro-tip guides on BG
• Doesn't write walkthroughs for BG
• Too much diversity in coverage/community for pinpoint focus and consistent tone

If you're equating 'Dex-based BG posters with commentary, then there is no comparibility either because forums aren't the format or venue for article writing. And certainly, to single you out as an example, I am hardly replying to commentator even of the lowest calibre: you are naught but a butthurt shitposter who is lost in the shuffle, and unread.

 

[smaug]

For commentary we got RPGCodex.

Different animal that isn't comparable or competing with any blogger.

• Doesn't write multi-part retrospectives on BG
• Doesn't write pro-tip guides on BG
• Doesn't write walkthroughs for BG
• Too much diversity in coverage/community for pinpoint focus and consistent tone

If you're equating 'Dex-based BG posters with commentary, then there isn't much comparibility either because forums aren't the format or venue for article writing. And certainly, to single you out as an example, I am hardly replying to commentator even of the lowest calibre: you are naught but a butthurt shitposter who is lost in the shuffle, and unread.

Who gives a shit about tips and tricks? It’s more fun to figure the shit out of your own anyway. The only good thing about your blog was convincing me to play JA2, and ToEE.

 

[Lilura]

Who gives a shit about tips and tricks?

I said pro-tip guides. Like my ApR write-up, THAC0 Lord write-up, super-tanker write-up etc. And this: which veterans consult often for a refresher/ideas. How do I know? Explicit, veteran-only search strings.

It’s more fun to figure the shit out of your own anyway.

No shit, Captain Obvious.

The only good thing about your blog was convincing me to play JA2, and ToEE.

Which is a pretty big thing since they're both great.

 

[Atlantico]

https://twitter.com/TDenningauthor/status/1137860389755072512

Or anything to that effect. Exactly as I wrote. And that's exactly the answer I'd expect, because that's the answer I've been giving in this thread.

Not one of you neckbeards has suggested a single rule change between 1st ed. and 2nd ed. that the Avatar trilogy was written to explain away in a direct or indirect way.

That being said, which one of you hairy-backed turkaroaches managed to fuck up a simple question and why the fuck are you autists bothering Troy Denning?

edit: oh it was actually Efe who is now extremely butthurt. Go figure.

Wait... There are people claiming that the Avatar Crisis wasn't done to explain the transition from 1st to 2nd? Like the Spellplague was specifically done to explain the transition from 3.5 to 4th?

Cael you dumb shitbrain, nobody was claiming whatever your little turdmind anally-evacuated over this forum. Now go clean up after yourself.

The assassin class was introduced into D&D in Supplement II: Blackmoor by Dave Arneson, distinct from the thief class introduced by Gary Gygax's Supplement I: Greyhawk, and continued as a separate class in AD&D 1st edition, but it was eliminated as a separate class in AD&D 2nd edition.

Yes, and that's not a rule change and has nothing to do with Bhaal's death, Bane and Myrkul were also killed, remember? Assassin is a sub-class available as an option in 2nd. ed. and the gods of FR do not represent character classes regardless.

If anything they represent alignments, elements or philosophies. Not PC character classes.

It wasn't a necessity for TSR to create an in-setting justification for rules changes from 1st edition AD&D to the 2nd edition; they didn't bother doing so for either Greyhawk or Dragonlance, but they decided to do so for what they had intentionally established in 1987 as the new, flagship, baseline campaign setting of AD&D.

You keep insisting on these alleged rules changes, which are supposedly represented in the Avatar Trilogy, but don't mention any of them - it would be quite helpful if you listed any of them.

No question, rules were changed between the editions, to a limited degree - but that did not affect the FR setting or any setting for that matter.

In fact, as you should know, character classes and races are setting specific in 1st and 2nd edition AD&D. Changes in core rules don't affect AD&D settings up to 2nd ed. at least. Core rule books did not dictate settings.

The reason for the Avatar Trilogy was marketing and setting the 2nd ed. of AD&D as the definite edition going forward.

People seem to forget that until the 2nd ed. there was no tradition, incentive or precedent for people to just abandon their old rulebooks for new ones.

TSR made sure that they did and it had nothing to do with rule-changes, but by updating their most popular settings and making it more convenient for people to use 2nd edition rulebooks with the new 2nd ed. settings. But that's literally all it was: more convenient.

If you wanted to play 1st edition AD&D and use the Gold Box Forgotten Realms, there was no practical problem to it. But it was more convenient to use 2nd. ed.

 

[Efe]

i gave you the answer from the source and I doubt any writer feels bothered to be asked about their work.
if you want to phrase it better,please do so and see what he says? just keep this shit attitude of yours in check when talking to him please
so smaug is ur buttbuddy? or alt?

 

[smaug]

I don't know what argument is taking place, and I don't care. I'm just going to rate everyone's post "butthurt".

 

[Atlantico]

i gave you the answer from the source and I doubt any writer feels bothered to be asked about their work.

Yes, and as you should have realized as you read his answer, is that he confirms what I wrote - and you know what else? It's not a secret at all. Never was.

The Avatar Trilogy was in fact written to change the FR setting because of the arrival of the 2nd edition AD&D. The 2nd edition arrived because of rule changes, but not the Avatar Trilogy or the FR setting update.

They're related, but not the same.

if you want to phrase it better,please do so and see what he says? just keep this shit attitude of yours in check when talking to him please

That's the faggiest remark I've read all day - though the day is young - but he's already answered my question and confirmed what I wrote. I see no reason to bother the man more than you already have.

 

[Cael]

i gave you the answer from the source and I doubt any writer feels bothered to be asked about their work.
if you want to phrase it better,please do so and see what he says? just keep this shit attitude of yours in check when talking to him please
so smaug is ur buttbuddy? or alt?

It is better to ignore the fool (whom I only found out you were talking to because I replied to your post above) as I have. The kid acts like a maladjusted arrogant spoilt 7 year old and should be put in the same quiet corner.

 

[Efe]

honestly Cael, i havent seen someone move goalposts so quickly before. i would ignore him if i believed in such actions to be helpful.
AD&D changed the rules and Avatar trilogy changed the setting so these changes made sense lorewise
if you still aren't convinced, i invite you to talk this out with lilura. perhaps an edgier approach will make you see the light

 

[agris]

Lilura Very OT, but I don't believe there's a general topic for your blog. Have you considered covering Silent Storm? It is a damn good TB strategy game, and it isn't regarded in posterity (in English) as highly or commonly as it should be. It obviously is not an RPG, but it has similarities with JA2 and ToEE - plus a Fallout-ish world map traveling / POI system.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I've always loved those shitflinging and dick measurement festivals between D&D buffs. I just sit back and enjoy the show.

 

[Harry Easter]

Guess it will be close to D:OS2:

True to the series, it's an RPG in which you control a party of heroes with their own backgrounds and motivations. It's possible that there will be an origin stories system inspired by Divinity: Original Sin 2. In BG3 these may act as a videogame equivalent of a D&D character sheet. "I thought the origin stories were a really good addition to the RPG genre," says Vincke. "like we did them, and it would be strange if we went back on that."

Would've been stupid otherwise.

Link: https://www.pcgamer.com/baldurs-gate-3-everything-we-know/

 

[Lilura]

Lilura Very OT, but I don't believe there's a general topic for your blog.

Not sure what you mean by this.

Have you considered covering Silent Storm? It is a damn good TB strategy game, and it isn't regarded in posterity (in English) as highly or commonly as it should be. It obviously is not an RPG, but it has similarities with JA2 and ToEE - plus a Fallout-ish world map traveling / POI system.

Yeah, I have. I love the game and rate it second only to JA2 in respect to tactics. I've said that several times on the blog, too.

Problem is, I don't have much time to sit down and get into it. For me to play and write about such a game requires that I not be interrupted for days at a time, and things are as hectic as hell at the moment. I'm actually glad there isn't much info on BG3 right now because I've barely got the energy to shitpost on the 'Dex.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Guess it will be close to D:OS2:

True to the series, it's an RPG in which you control a party of heroes with their own backgrounds and motivations. It's possible that there will be an origin stories system inspired by Divinity: Original Sin 2. In BG3 these may act as a videogame equivalent of a D&D character sheet. "I thought the origin stories were a really good addition to the RPG genre," says Vincke. "like we did them, and it would be strange if we went back on that."

Would've been stupid otherwise.

Link: https://www.pcgamer.com/baldurs-gate-3-everything-we-know/

"We'll stay true to our roots, so we'll give players lots of systems and lots of agency to use these systems and try to accomplish what you need to on your personal adventure and your party's adventure. That's not going to change; that's the core of what we're doing. But then there will be an interpretation of D&D, because if you port the core rules—we tried it!—to a videogame, it doesn't work."

Notions of Dragon Age Inquisition type of gameplay are intensifying.

 

[agris]

Lilura Very OT, but I don't believe there's a general topic for your blog.

Not sure what you mean by this.

As in, a forum thread devoted to your blog. I would have just PMed you, but you're blocking me :D

Understood re: time. I barely have time to play anything these days, although Blackguards 1 is quite good at pulling me in for the stolen 30 minutes here and there.

 

[Cael]

honestly Cael, i havent seen someone move goalposts so quickly before. i would ignore him if i believed in such actions to be helpful.
AD&D changed the rules and Avatar trilogy changed the setting so these changes made sense lorewise
if you still aren't convinced, i invite you to talk this out with lilura. perhaps an edgier approach will make you see the light

You should see the other idiot we have in this place, who admitted that he was wrong, but refuse to admit he is wrong in the same post because the person he is arguing with might be the homophobe the guy claimed he is but is too polite to say it out loud. No seriously. He knew he was wrong, but he immediately made shit up so that he doesn't have to apologise. It was basically the clown news network manifest in one kid.

Of course, he claimed to be a hot-headed kid from Eastern Europe, but he has only 130+ posts since 2017, and have posted at least a dozen posts in the last day or so. He hits so many caricatures, that I am left wondering if he is a trolling alt.

 

[Harry Easter]

Notions of Dragon Age Inquisition type of gameplay are intensifying.

Nah, Swen is not a fan of that stuff. But I could imagine, that they could to let the camera zoom in on the speaker and you have conservations like in Dragon Commander, but gameplaywise it's more like D:OS. Or like NWN2, without the shitty camera.

 

[smaug]

honestly Cael, i havent seen someone move goalposts so quickly before. i would ignore him if i believed in such actions to be helpful.
AD&D changed the rules and Avatar trilogy changed the setting so these changes made sense lorewise
if you still aren't convinced, i invite you to talk this out with lilura. perhaps an edgier approach will make you see the light

You should see the other idiot we have in this place, who admitted that he was wrong, but refuse to admit he is wrong in the same post because the person he is arguing with might be the homophobe the guy claimed he is but is too polite to say it out loud. No seriously. He knew he was wrong, but he immediately made shit up so that he doesn't have to apologise. It was basically the clown news network manifest in one kid.

Of course, he claimed to be a hot-headed kid from Eastern Europe, but he has only 130+ posts since 2017, and have posted at least a dozen posts in the last day or so. He hits so many caricatures, that I am left wondering if he is a trolling alt.

He's gay what do you expect?

 

[Lilura]

As in, a forum thread devoted to your blog. I would have just PMed you, but you're blocking me :D

I haven't blocked you specifically. Just PMs generally. If anyone wants to see my friendlier side, there's always the blog's comments section.

I've created a couple of threads before for this and that write-up, but they didn't go down too well so I just stopped.

Understood re: time. I barely have time to play anything these days, although Blackguards 1 is quite good at pulling me in for the stolen 30 minutes here and there.

Yep, right now, I only have the time to boot up MAME and play some Golden Axe or something.

 

[Cael]

honestly Cael, i havent seen someone move goalposts so quickly before. i would ignore him if i believed in such actions to be helpful.
AD&D changed the rules and Avatar trilogy changed the setting so these changes made sense lorewise
if you still aren't convinced, i invite you to talk this out with lilura. perhaps an edgier approach will make you see the light

You should see the other idiot we have in this place, who admitted that he was wrong, but refuse to admit he is wrong in the same post because the person he is arguing with might be the homophobe the guy claimed he is but is too polite to say it out loud. No seriously. He knew he was wrong, but he immediately made shit up so that he doesn't have to apologise. It was basically the clown news network manifest in one kid.

Of course, he claimed to be a hot-headed kid from Eastern Europe, but he has only 130+ posts since 2017, and have posted at least a dozen posts in the last day or so. He hits so many caricatures, that I am left wondering if he is a trolling alt.

He's gay what do you expect?

I know and am friends with homosexual people of both genders. They definitely do not act like that. He seems more like a wannabe like Kevin "I Wrote For You" Maginn than the real deal.