Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 RELEASE THREAD

[Longes]

Review.

Overall, Baldur's Gate 3 is a great game. Larian has mastered the immersive sim approach to RPGs, and Baldur's Gate 3 has a lot of reactivity, alternate solutions, options, methods, etc. The combat is fun, if rather easy, the writing is mostly good, and the voice acting is consistently great. On the technical side, the game is very good-looking, but Larian got greedy and performance in act 3 is abysmal. This is something that needs urgent patching. I get that they wanted to show the bustling lively streets of the city, but their implementation can not handle it. It's unplayably bad for some people.

In terms of the narrative, I have mixed feelings. The central story is excellent up to act 3, where the pacing falls apart. Once again Larian can not stick the landing, and once again the final act is the worst one. The branching narrative promised by act 1 isn't actually real, as all branches converge back into a single stream, and one of the branches is much more rewarding than the other. And ultimately, I can not help but feel that Larian's adherence to Origins is a mistake that holds their storytelling back. In having to write a narrative applicable to everyone, it ends up being a narrative fitted to no one. All of us are John Baldursgate now. Outside of self-contained personal sidequests, no one character can have story-changing moments. For all that Dark Urge is Tav+, Dark Urge still ends up with plenty of loose ends at various points because no one else could have those interactions so they can not be resolved for the Dark Urge either.

Now, onto the specific characters. Spoilers ahead. I'll start with the major villains:

• Auntie Ethel. Easily the most memorable villain in the game. Despite only showing up in two side quests, Auntie Ethel is charismatic, funny, you can have a ton of different interactions and outcomes with her, and the decisions you make regarding her in act 1 carry over to act 3. A show-stealer.
• Goblin Horde. Act 1 doesn't really have a proper villain. Your opponent is the threat of the goblin horde, and its actual leaders are bit players with no development. If you are playing a good guy, it's entirely possible you've never even talked to any of them. Minthara gets more development if you choose evil, but she's not really worth it. In the end, Act 1 is a slow-burning introduction to the central conflict, a very Baldur's Gate 1 Nashkel Mines affair.
• Raphael. Absolute joke. For all the billing this chump cambion got, the dude shows up exactly three times in the game, one of which is to give you a side quest. Waste of space this guy.
• Ketheric Thorm. The most well-developed of the Three, Ketheric gets an entire act to himself and it works wonderfully. Top marks to Ketheric.
• Lord Gortash and Orin the Red. I'm putting them together because they are the chump duo of act 3. Both are rushed, neither gets much development. Hope you like reading random books if you want to learn who the main villains are. Orin gets slightly personal for the Dark Urge, but even then, it's not what I'd call a developed villain.

I'm not going to go over companions one by one. They are mostly charming enough. I feel like there are too many companions to the point where Larian was neither willing nor able to handle all of them. I'd take quality over quantity any day here. If you don't have resources to actually write Karlach - don't include Karlach. Very, very few companions have consistent payoffs throughout the entire narrative. Astarion is Sir Not Related To The Main Story, while the likes of Gale and Lae'Zel are rather firmly integrated into it. And it's still weird and feels like a symptom of a poorly managed writers' room that three companion stories are the same story about abuse by their parental figure and two companion stories are about them having bombs in their body. Shadowheart is perhaps the strangest companion of them all by virtue of her inciting incident (Shadowheart stealing the Astral Prism) having no relation to Shadowheart's actual story and being mentioned nowhere in Shadowheart's actual story.
In conclusion, Baldur's Gate 3 is definitely a great game. It does a lot of things very right, and even if it chokes a bit by the end, it has much more good than bad in it. Is it my favorite RPG ever? No, I think Wrath of the Righteous has a stronger narrative in many ways. But as a game, Baldur's Gate 3 is decidedly one of the best ever made.

Though it could do with some patching and an expansion or two.

 

[dukeofwoodberry]

No way it can be one of the best games ever when it's a D&D game about adventuring with a group and they drop the ball as bad as they did with party members. The party members are by and large complete shit. Yes the main storyline sucks too but that's more forgivable for me because the main story is just an excuse to have an adventure. But if you can't make interesting companions and capture the the feeling of a lively party, you failed to some degree.

 

[ferratilis]

It's a good game, but it can't hold a candle to IE titles or Kingmaker imo. Even Wrathfinder, with all its cringe, is a far more enjoyable and challenging experience than this. It might be that I'm more inclined to RTwP combat, but there's always something off-putting about Larian games, it's hard to describe. It's a well-made RPG, don't get me wrong, just not one I'll be coming back to for years to come.

 

[Swen]

Companions are good (besides Karlach and maybe Wyll), also look them as if they're being role played by real players in a table top set up.

Anyway, it's best game of all time on Opencritic too. Haters gonna hate

 

[dukeofwoodberry]

It's a good game, but it can't hold a candle to IE titles or Kingmaker imo. Even Wrathfinder, with all its cringe, is a far more enjoyable and challenging experience than this. It might be that I'm more inclined to RTwP combat, but there's always something off-putting about Larian games, it's hard to describe. It's a well-made RPG, don't get me wrong, just not one I'll be coming back to for years to come.

I prefer the combat in this. The combat and skill check system are both fantastic

 

[Swen]

It's a good game, but it can't hold a candle to IE titles or Kingmaker imo. Even Wrathfinder, with all its cringe, is a far more enjoyable and challenging experience than this. It might be that I'm more inclined to RTwP combat, but there's always something off-putting about Larian games, it's hard to describe. It's a well-made RPG, don't get me wrong, just not one I'll be coming back to for years to come.

Owlcucks need to know their place

 

[dukeofwoodberry]

Companions are good (besides Karlach and maybe Wyll), also look them as if they're being role played by real players in a table top set up.

Anyway, it's best game of all time on Opencritic too. Haters gonna hate

Gayle is trash. Halsin is trash. Minthara is severely lacking in content. La zael is meh at best. Shadow tits is okay. Guess Asterion is decently written but I can't use him.

The majority suck and the couple that don't suck are just okay. No stand outs.

 

[ferratilis]

It's a good game, but it can't hold a candle to IE titles or Kingmaker imo. Even Wrathfinder, with all its cringe, is a far more enjoyable and challenging experience than this. It might be that I'm more inclined to RTwP combat, but there's always something off-putting about Larian games, it's hard to describe. It's a well-made RPG, don't get me wrong, just not one I'll be coming back to for years to come.

Owlcucks need to know their place

Kingmaker on release and Kingmaker today are very different games.

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

Gonna give this up for now and finally start saving up for a new pc.
I play mostly old or undemanding games so never felt the need for it and bg3 was running fine until the city itself which seems was a bridge too far and can't go more then 1 area without it feeling sluggish af and needing to restart the game every time to fix the memory leak or w/e is going on.
Ah well, can't really blame the game for it, i was underspec to begin with and it was semi miraculous that was able to play act 1-2 without any issues.

Did shadowheart and astarion's final quest and resolved their arcs, got shadowheart sex scene so overall seems a good time to end especially now i know how game ends and that it really doesn't matter too much what i do anyways. Hopefully when i do get back into this game in a few months larian will have fixed the endings and generally polished up people's grievances *fabulously optimistic*.

So final first impressions for what little it's worth since didn't play through to the end, thus opinions are likely to be subject to change for better and for worst.

the good

+Deus ex like freedom when it comes to approaching in game situations. When people praise the reactivity and freedom, i'll assume this is what they are talking about: for the same situation you can do stuff like bribing/talking past a guard, teleport and sneak past, or climb up high and featherfall where you need to be, and probably half a dozen more ways that i didn't think about. Point is the game gives you a bunch of tools and it's up to you how to use it, or you can brute force your way through everything if you're capable enough. Easily game's best strength and what truly makes bg3 stand out from other rpgs.
This is the kind of game you can ask people "how did you handle x situation?" and you will get a bunch of different answers. Best thing about the game imo and a nice evolution from d: os 1 without it being the cancer that was d: os 2.

+Pretty. I'm still not convinced blowing millions on motion capture and voice acting every minor thing is really the way to go in rpgs or a reasonable expectation to have, would rather they have invested it in other things BUT since it's there, can at least admit they did a good job making every random npc seem lively and didn't just blow the budget on cocaine and hookers, no the money is very much fully on display.

+Chunky. Seems like there's lots of content indeed, and the random side quests i did didn't feel super boring or that i was merely being a fedex delivery guy.

+Found the ratio of fighting vs talking and rolling for things to be a good balance and part of what kept me engaged.

+5e might be a garbage system but in this case as another poster puts it: it works great for putting a limit on larian's worst impulses as with d: os 2.
Also some people might call it cheese but i enjoyed pushing people off cliffs to their deaths like this was mortal kombat and generally having to be very mindful about terrain and positioning.
The number of spells and abilities about right too, could probably do with a little more but i ended up enjoying bg3 combat more so then pathfinder wrath which past a certain point felt like an exercise in how to stack as many modifiers as possible. Maybe i am just dumb but never got into the build autism of that game and i was apparently a dumbass for not dipping 1 level in vivisector and stubbornly sticking to being a pure fighter.

the bad

-Horrible ui and general clunkiness when it comes to QoL, some of which i suspect is due to the focus on coop.

-Reactivity in dialogue and story seems to have been massively overblown by hype, it's no better then old dragon age games (people praising race and class specific dialogue as if it was something radically new immediately comes to mind) and in some ways, an outright regression.

-Unimpressed by companions for variety of reasons that have been talked to death. Let's just say the hype and marketing acting like this was going to be some friendship/romance simulator proved to have been massive lies, another regression from older bioware games.

-Cutscenes and voiceovers forcing your character to act in ways you wouldn't want them to and telling you what to think. Dragon age and Mass effect games had these to to a degree aswell, but bg3 is really bad for this.

Overall, i dunno if it's the best rpg evar!!!!! and i'll leave that to wiser minds then myself, but i'd say in the end despite its failings and issues, still pretty good and had fun with it even when i started getting annoyed by certain things like how seemingly everything with a penis and tentacles was making a pass at me for simply being nice and sociable. Is this a simulator of what it's like to be a woman irl or something? JfC. But yeah minor gripes aside, game's good enough for my tastes without me thinking it's clearly outright better then other rpgs i've liked.

I actually decided to play a women character to make all the things making passes at me less cringe. At least a girl on girl if it ends up happening by accident I can deal with a lot more than my big bad fighter I sort of ego tie to myself being suddenly ass rammed by some hobgoblin just because I gave him a head nod. I am still trying to actually avoid anything making passes at me, but I can tell its going to be futile, everything is trying to fuck me...

 

[Lemming42]

Might as well ask it here since the conversation's turned, is Kingmaker worth it with turn-based? I played it on release but a mixture of not giving a shit about the setting and absolutely hating RTWP made me bounce right off it.

Not sure if the turn-based mode is going to be actually good or just a hastily-made option that's badly transplanted onto shit fights intended for RTWP.

 

[Justicar]

Shadowcute

Too bad "she" has a male face with hair, I fear that my character wake up with Shadowheart having a penis C.

I swear to god you fags are some of the weakest people in existence. "Oooh, look at this man face. So ugly, so hideous."

Looks like a fat man retard

 

[Reinhardt]

also look them as if they're being role played by real players in a table top set up.

i would punch them and find some normal people to slay some skellies in the crypt.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Might as well ask it here since the conversation's turned, is Kingmaker worth it with turn-based? I played it on release but a mixture of not giving a shit about the setting and absolutely hating RTWP made me bounce right off it.

Not sure if the turn-based mode is going to be actually good or just a hastily-made option that's badly transplanted onto shit fights intended for RTWP.

The "tacked on" tb mode in KM works better and smoother than the one included from the start in Wrath. I don't think it will salvage the game for you if you hated it from the start, though.

 

[Swen]

It's a good game, but it can't hold a candle to IE titles or Kingmaker imo. Even Wrathfinder, with all its cringe, is a far more enjoyable and challenging experience than this. It might be that I'm more inclined to RTwP combat, but there's always something off-putting about Larian games, it's hard to describe. It's a well-made RPG, don't get me wrong, just not one I'll be coming back to for years to come.

Owlcucks need to know their place

Kingmaker on release and Kingmaker today are very different games.

Still trash. Owlcuck games haven't made any good game to date. All trash.

As is projected in the reviews from users too.

They will never be as good as Larian.

Cope, seethe and dilate Owlcucks

 

[Grauken]

Still trash. Owlcuck games haven't made any good game to date. All trash.

Dude, you're allowed to like other games too even if you favor BG3

 

[AwesomeButton]

Gayle is trash. Halsin is trash. Minthara is severely lacking in content. La zael is meh at best. Shadow tits is okay.

Trash: I can play dolls with the NPC, but I'm not interested in this one
Severely Lacking in Content: I want to play dolls with this NPC, but the designer didn't add enough romance talk.

What happened to "best companions are mute companions in IWD and half-mute companions in BG"

 

[Swen]

Still trash. Owlcuck games haven't made any good game to date. All trash.

Dude, you're allowed to like other games too even if you favor BG3

I don't take prisoners, I KILL THE COMPETITION!

 

[bataille]

It's so weird that you lose 2 companions if you side with goblins i would be ok if we had like 10 guys to chose from but that really limits your party

You have 12 others to chose from though, not even including the other origins or Minsc and Jaheira. Henchmen.

Man, I felt like such an idiot when a friend mentioned this to me after I'd done the hag lair and underdark sequences with just 3 bodies. I was so excited about changing the lame illusion wizard subclass to the enchantment one that it completely blotted out the second part of Withers' tirade which mentioned providing souls for hire.

Spoiler

 

[Grauken]

Gayle is trash. Halsin is trash. Minthara is severely lacking in content. La zael is meh at best. Shadow tits is okay.

Trash: I can play dolls with the NPC, but I'm not interested in this one
Severely Lacking in Content: I want to play dolls with this NPC, but the designer didn't add enough romance talk.

What happened to "best companions are mute companions in IWD and half-mute companions in BG"

Modern zoomer reactionaries are wimps compared to previous generations, the decline is real

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

What you never saw is something like a female general

English national heroine Boudica want's a word with you.

Lmao, the fucking pathetic cope. And the fact you LITERALLY think women could be generals. Imagine actually believing this retardation.

You are such a tremendous idiot, it's breathtaking.

Dude, you have profesional wombyn soccer teams who can't even beat a bunch of amateur 16 year old boys imagine thinking women belong in war.

L1bruls are mentally challenged there's no other explanation how you could believe nonsense like this. You know how many Ukranian female soldiers died in the current war? 100, out of fucking 15k or 18k killed in action. ONE HUNDRED. The Ukranian goverment doesn't constript women because they realize that is utterly insane and when shit hits the fan and things get actually serious delusions like the idea men and women are completely interchangeable go out the fucking window.

the other issue is its dangerous to the men, because unless they are separated so that the women act in independent groups (which makes them a lot less effective) when shit starts getting serious men will overreact to protect women in a way they would not do or behave if it were an all male unit. Men will start to want to protect the women over their actual objective, and its not something you can really stop in the way men are wired to behave naturally, its sort of like asking them to not protect a child in danger. Its not a good fighting model. You can have separate units entirely I suppose, but that creates some issues as well.

 

[dukeofwoodberry]

Gayle is trash. Halsin is trash. Minthara is severely lacking in content. La zael is meh at best. Shadow tits is okay.

Trash: I can play dolls with the NPC, but I'm not interested in this one
Severely Lacking in Content: I want to play dolls with this NPC, but the designer didn't add enough romance talk.

What happened to "best companions are mute companions in IWD and half-mute companions in BG"

IWD is a combat simulator. In a story game I like traveling with a party that has interesting personalities and interactions. Makes you feel more like you're adventuring with a group than by yourself

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

Shadowcute

Too bad "she" has a male face with hair, I fear that my character wake up with Shadowheart having a penis C.

I swear to god you fags are some of the weakest people in existence. "Oooh, look at this man face. So ugly, so hideous."

This thread:

I would bang her, just to make her feel better about herself. Would not want her to feel bad, like I did not think she was hot or something. So yeah, a sympathy bang you know.

 

[Herumor]

Ketheric Thorm. The most well-developed of the Three, Ketheric gets an entire act to himself and it works wonderfully. Top marks to Ketheric.

I thought that Gortash and Orin would have similar set pieces for their confrontations, but boy, was I wrong or what.

It really feels like Bane and Bhaal just don't give that much of a shit about their Chosen.

 

[Lemming42]

I agree with the sentiment that the companions suck but idk exactly why. Okay, most of them aren't conceptually interesting, but something about them all just feels oddly crap.

The actual archetypes are fine - Astarion is there for sardonic commentary and to have a little evil-to-not-evil redemption arc, Karlach's there to take the piss out of stuff, Lae'zel's there to give the martial/pragmatic opinion, Gale's there to get a restraining order, etc. Theoretically they're fine, but in practice they're just utterly underwhelming. Maybe it's the lack of any kind of progressive relationship with any of them - yeah, they sometimes dump you with a faceful of their (mostly bad) backstories, but half the time you go up to them in camp and find that there's nothing new to talk about.

Dragon Age - for its infinite faults - understood that in this sort of game, camp should be an extended break from regular gameplay where you get to do your dumb dating sim shit and develop your friendships with the crew (Mass Effect understood the same). I didn't like the Dragon Age setting or characters much, but Morrigan, Alistair, Leliana and even fucking Wynne felt way more involved in what was going on and like they had a much stronger presence in the story than anyone in BG3.

I'd prefer to make my own party in the end but I don't like the weird hirelings system in this game.

 

[Longes]

Ketheric Thorm. The most well-developed of the Three, Ketheric gets an entire act to himself and it works wonderfully. Top marks to Ketheric.

I thought that Gortash and Orin would have similar set pieces for their confrontations, but boy, was I wrong or what.

It really feels like Bane and Bhaal just don't give that much of a shit about their Chosen.

It's the pacing. Ideally you'd have four acts: a much shorter first act accommodating you to the game and teaching you the basics (probably cut out most of act 1 and move it elsewhere), and then an act each for each of the chosen. But that's not how Larian did it. Instead the biggest act of the game is act 1, which also has the least relevance to the main plot. It's like if Baldur's Gate 1 was consumed by the Nashkel Mines situation.