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Broken Age - Double Fine's Kickstarter Adventure Game

Coyote

Arcane
Joined
Jan 15, 2009
Messages
1,149
Played Act 2 last night. My mostly spoiler-free take:

The puzzles in Shay's section are weak, about what you'd expect following Act 1 despite a feeble attempt to mix things up with the knot puzzle. They mostly consist of wandering around talking to people and following up on the obvious hints they give in dialogue. The one notable exception is the puzzle that requires you to switch to Vella, as it's pretty much the only time before the endgame when there's something on the screen hinting at the solution to a puzzle without the game pasting a giant, blinking "PUZZLE SOLUTION HERE" marquee on it.

Where Shay's section does excel is in implementing unique reactions to item combinations/using items on various things in the environment. Half of my entertainment came from actively avoiding the solution to each puzzle so that I could see what people had to say about trying out my inventory in various places. Even when the puzzles are weak, this kind of attention to detail can add a lot to an adventure game, and the amount of effort they put into implementing even responses that most players will never see (because, for example, an item is used in a puzzle right next to where you found it) is downright impressive.

Vella's section is the reverse. It has better puzzles, though only slightly; there's more variety, but not really any more challenge. OTOH, Vella's section is much more lacking in unique reactions compared to Shay's. Even with about half the number of inventory items and smaller number of things in the environment with which to interact, Vella delivers generic "this item won't work here" lines far more often than Shay ever does.

Then there's the endgame. This has by far the most engaging puzzles in the entire game because it finally takes off the training wheels and leaves the player to figure things out on his own. I especially liked the final hexipal puzzle in Shay's section:

A) Rather than being presented with a solution/hint in the immediate environment, you have to think back to something you saw earlier in the game.
B) You have to realize that the hexigal's flashlight-waving motion could be repurposed for swinging the mallet.
C) Using the burn marks to figure out how to configure the wires is surprisingly subtle for Broken Age, and AFAIK Vella doesn't remark on it in any way.

Of course, it turns out that if you let Vella's part of the final puzzle reset, the hexigal is restored to working, flashlight-swinging order, largely negating A and C. But at least it made for a great puzzle at the time.

However, the final puzzles are also implemented in a somewhat tedious way; more of the player's time is spent on the unchallenging process of getting pieces into place than on figuring out what to do in the first place. The rewiring itself is essentially a mixture of memorization and match-the-symbol, neither of which make for compelling puzzles, and the way the puzzle resets just makes the player do the same things over again without presenting any new obstacles. Nevertheless, if the puzzles had been on the level of this part throughout the entire game, I would be able to recommend it without reservation.

As for the overall game, I'll just leave it at this: the primary thing that Broken Age has going for it IMO is its sense of humor. As much as Schafer has declined in other ways, his games still do that "blending the absurd and mundane" type of humor better than anything else I've played since the LucasArts days, and depending on how much that factored into your enjoyment of his previous games, it might be worth playing for that alone. Aside from that, though, you'd be better off looking elsewhere if you want something resembling the classics BA was originally pitched as a successor to.

Edit: Eliminated some longwindedness.
 
Last edited:

RPGMaster

Savant
Joined
Feb 23, 2011
Messages
703
Shay probably has more lines of unique dialogue because Elijah Wood did his voice recording for free whereas Vella's probably got paid per line/hour.
 

Metro

Arcane
Beg Auditor
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
27,792
Based on Act 2, I would even say I'm looking forward to Broken Age 2 (especially since the ending clearly did have a sequel in mind)

We've briefly discussed this earlier in the thread, but all the loose ends left over from the ending are wrapped up with still images during the credits. I imagine the sequel (or at least a sequel based on this story) was scrapped after Act 1.

Oh well, I wasn't aware of that since I didn't watch the credits. Makes sense though, given their financial situation.

It would take thirty million dollars to make Broken Age 2.
 

Zarniwoop

TESTOSTERONIC As Fuck™
Patron
Joined
Nov 29, 2010
Messages
19,234
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Played Act 2 last night. My mostly spoiler-free take:

The puzzles in Shay's section are weak, about what you'd expect following Act 1 despite a feeble attempt to mix things up with the knot puzzle. They mostly consist of wandering around talking to people and following up on the obvious hints they give in dialogue. The one notable exception is the puzzle that requires you to switch to Vella, as it's pretty much the only time before the endgame when there's something on the screen hinting at the solution to a puzzle without the game pasting a giant, blinking "PUZZLE SOLUTION HERE" marquee on it.

Where Shay's section does excel is in implementing unique reactions to item combinations/using items on various things in the environment. Half of my entertainment came from actively avoiding the solution to each puzzle so that I could see what people had to say about trying out my inventory in various places. Even when the puzzles are weak, this kind of attention to detail can add a lot to an adventure game, and the amount of effort they put into implementing even responses that most players will never see (because, for example, an item is used in a puzzle right next to where you found it) is downright impressive.

Vella's section is the reverse. It has better puzzles, though only slightly; there's more variety, but not really any more challenge. OTOH, Vella's section is much more lacking in unique reactions compared to Shay's. Even with about half the number of inventory items and smaller number of things in the environment with which to interact, Vella delivers generic "this item won't work here" lines far more often than Shay ever does.

Then there's the endgame. This has by far the most engaging puzzles in the entire game because it finally takes off the training wheels and leaves the player to figure things out on his own. I especially liked the final hexipal puzzle in Shay's section:

A) Rather than being presented with a solution/hint in the immediate environment, you have to think back to something you saw earlier in the game.
B) You have to realize that the hexigal's flashlight-waving motion could be repurposed for swinging the mallet.
C) Using the burn marks to figure out how to configure the wires is surprisingly subtle for Broken Age, and AFAIK Vella doesn't remark on it in any way.

Of course, it turns out that if you let Vella's part of the final puzzle reset, the hexigal is restored to working, flashlight-swinging order, largely negating A and C. But at least it made for a great puzzle at the time.

However, the final puzzles are also implemented in a somewhat tedious way; more of the player's time is spent on the unchallenging process of getting pieces into place than on figuring out what to do in the first place. The rewiring itself is essentially a mixture of memorization and match-the-symbol, neither of which make for compelling puzzles, and the way the puzzle resets just makes the player do the same things over again without presenting any new obstacles. Nevertheless, if the puzzles had been on the level of this part throughout the entire game, I would be able to recommend it without reservation.

As for the overall game, I'll just leave it at this: the primary thing that Broken Age has going for it IMO is its sense of humor. As much as Schafer has declined in other ways, his games still do that "blending the absurd and mundane" type of humor better than anything else I've played since the LucasArts days, and depending on how much that factored into your enjoyment of his previous games, it might be worth playing for that alone. Aside from that, though, you'd be better off looking elsewhere if you want something resembling the classics BA was originally pitched as a successor to.

Edit: Eliminated some longwindedness.

I actually thought the endgame puzzles were the easiest/most logical. It became obvious that you'd have to figure out the exact order and timing of doing things and swiching between the characters or the whole shebang resets and you have to start over.

Dem ropes tho :rage:
Same for anything to do with the Space Weaver.
 

Zarniwoop

TESTOSTERONIC As Fuck™
Patron
Joined
Nov 29, 2010
Messages
19,234
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
fast travel to carol in act 2?

*headdesk*


:0-13:

Where/What? Not double clicking on exits?

If you're with the big dumbass in the clouds giving directions, and you tell him the wrong thing, he says "Now it's a whole other knot". Choose the dialog option "I'll be back with another diagram" or similar. Don't choose the "O shit we screwed up" option which ends the dialog. If you pick the right option you'll instantly appear at Carol and you can ask her for a new diagram. As soon as she gives it to you, you will teleport back up to the ladder. You don't have to haul ass all the way past the tree and the lumberjack etc every time. Saves a LOT of time.
 

RPGMaster

Savant
Joined
Feb 23, 2011
Messages
703
You have to be a special kind of retard to think Act 2 would have all new locations and characters from Act 1.

I really don't understand this criticism. One of the best things about Act 2 was seeing the same locations from a different perspective.
 

Tytus

Arcane
Joined
Jul 9, 2011
Messages
3,644
Location
Mazovia
You have to be a special kind of retard to think Act 2 would have all new locations and characters from Act 1.

I really don't understand this criticism. One of the best things about Act 2 was seeing the same locations from a different perspective.


I agree, that revisiting old locations after they changed through the events you as a player witnessed is pretty cool. But I think he is arguing that a game that had a budget of 3.3 mln plus all the money from sales of the episode 1 should also have something else. He means that that the old locations should be a starting point for new places, new content, new side characters you can meet and not be the entirety of episode 2. (or at least I think it is what he meant, he wasn't really coherent in his rant).

And I kinda agree. When you initially ask for 400k petrodollars but instead you get 3.3m plus all the money from sales of the first part it looks really cheap and uninspiring when you basically get the same game twice with little variety. Also you have the issue with game not closing it's own story arc.

It seems that shafer made Dragon Age 2 of adventure games.
 

Modron

Arcane
Joined
May 5, 2012
Messages
11,121
Is he intentionally trying to look like Dante from Clerks?

edit: Well, actually more like Clerks 2 Dante.

If that's an act DSP is one of the most dedicated performers out there (probably just some Assperger's). Never forget this is the guy who spent 52 minutes stacking things in black mesa before giving up because he couldn't figure out how to crouch jump despite the game and people telling him exactly how to do it.

PS DSP also spent 5+ minutes running around a 15 sqft room in one of the newer alien games trying to figure out what they meant by get in the turboloader despite the exoskeleton being very obviously lit up in center of the screen.
 

PlanHex

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Messages
2,126
Location
Copenhagen, Denmark
Never forget this is the guy who spent 52 minutes stacking things in black mesa before giving up because he couldn't figure out how to crouch jump despite the game and people telling him exactly how to do it.
Haha, it's that guy?! Why the fuck did I spend 15 minutes listening to the stupid opinions of some n00b who can't even into crouch jump? Bee pls.
 

Zarniwoop

TESTOSTERONIC As Fuck™
Patron
Joined
Nov 29, 2010
Messages
19,234
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Is he intentionally trying to look like Dante from Clerks?

edit: Well, actually more like Clerks 2 Dante.
Yeah because he's in colour. :troll:

Also you forgot to say:

W-w-wow, what a terrific audience.
 

Metro

Arcane
Beg Auditor
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
27,792
Most people on Steam don't even play the games they own for more than an hour. It's too bad there are no achievements, otherwise you'd most likely see 10-20% of them have the 'finish X chapter' one.
 

Miserable Panda

Educated
Joined
May 10, 2015
Messages
46
I have to say, I succesfully endured though the wire puzzle at the ending, even with that awful timing thingie (FOR GOD'S SAKE, DONT GO DOWN THE LADDER). I suffered though that puzzle where you have to bring the little dude to the locked room, have no idea how I solved it. But man, the puzzle with the snake, piss off. I was stuck half an hour with that thing. At least the game was not so easy compared to the first act.
Overall it was a fine game, not quite as good as the first one, and to tell you the truth, I felt the ending was quite bad. Not felt a single thing when the credits rolled out. Maybe a little dissapointed, by all the time Double Fine took, and how the final product ended up.
Wonder how many millions Schafer will need for the sequel.
 

kazgar

Arcane
Joined
Apr 23, 2008
Messages
2,164
Location
Upside Down
Most people on Steam don't even play the games they own for more than an hour. It's too bad there are no achievements, otherwise you'd most likely see 10-20% of them have the 'finish X chapter' one.


Achievements were added partway through the development cycle for part 2 and are there for the whole game.

Stats will be weird though because if you played part 1 before they happened, you can continue on with part 2 and not have any of them from the first part even though you couldn't be there without getting them. Part of the reason they were recommending starting again (fuck that)
 

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