Desolate Dancer
Educated
Aww, thanks for using my example. For a moment I imagined that Geishas should have a skill to cause a "brown note effect" using pressure points, but I regretted it immediately knowing it would quickly evolve into a disgusting scat fetish meme.
So I do get where you are coming from, I even accept that you prefer a freer system as opposed to the rather strict class-based systems, all I'm saying is that:
- I haven't met a single class-less game that I liked, I hated all TES because of this alone, and every other similar rpgs to date
- my favorite game is BG2, so is my favorite d&d version is 2e, and consequently, the reason I hate all newer d&d versions is that they had deviated toward this whole mmo-ish dowhatyawant system, freedom to combine any class with any other class, all races are equal etc... That being said, it is completely legit for you or anyone to prefer different styles and methods. I just loved the flavor that 'Gnomes can only be Illusionists' and that 'Paladin must be LG, can't multi, and can fall', etc... To me, this gave immersion to the whole world, and without this the whole new direction is too gimmicky and sterile, anyway...
But just to play along I started to transform BG2 in my mind:
- What if there would be a choice in the beginning to choose "Custom Class" where you can buy all components of any class, and more?
- What if it would be possible to have both ways, I mean you have classes but you can also name and make your own class, but not like any other skill-based game did so far?
I imagine, if you could start BG2 having a 1000 points to distribute, and you could buy anything to make a custom class it would look like the following:
- Do you want to cast spells? Okay, you can buy Divine Scroll access for 4 points per memory slot/level, meaning that a 2nd level would cost 8 each slot, a 3rd level would cost 12 each etc... This means, that a Cleric who has access up to level 7th spells, and has 6 slots per level at max level would cost her 672 points in total. You must always chose the lower level first, so you can't have just 3rd level access and skip the rest, so there would still be some limitations around. But a Wizard by the same model would burn 984 points immediately, almost everything which would 'explain' why they can't use weapons, armors, or anything really aside from casting magic.
- Do you want to hit things in combat? Okay, you can buy THAC0 for 10 points each so a Fighter who improves his THAC0 at every level up to 20th will have to pay 200 points just for this alone.
- Do you want to use weapons? No problem, you can buy proficiency access for 4 points for every weapon type.
- Do you want to be good at using weapons? You have to buy this, and it would be costly the higher proficiency you want to achieve. The first star is is 10 points, 2 stars (Specialized) would cost 30 points, 3 stars (Mastery) would cost 90 points etc...
- You want to use Skills? Okay, it would be cheaper to pick Pick Pockets and would be a bit more expensive to pick up Stealth (depending on in-game usability, value).
- The system would be intelligent enough so if you manage to create an existing class it would immediately tell you. If not, you can name&label your own Custom Class ofc.
- Certain stuff you pick would be mutually exclusive, though you would still be able to do a lot of things that is inefficient or downright counterproductive. In order to do a Paladin-esque feature I would do the following: you can pick certain bad stuff that prohibits you from doing things, or incurs you penalties and limitations, but would in turn give you additional points that you can spend on different things (above 1000, but up to max 1150 e.g.) and there would be a limit on also how many shit you can pick. I mean, a one-eyed, one-legged and one-armed main char would be pretty idiotic to be used but then again, if you prefer having the option to create a cripple I could even accept that.
- You cannot go under a certain granularity. If you pick a component it will also unlock its HLA components, so you literally would have to pregen your custom class by also choosing all his potential future upgrades and career path. So many things you can buy will be a 'package' actually.
. The game would be intelligent enough to check for certain components, if you have access to Mage Book then you are automatically treated as someone who is trained in arcane lore. Other dialogue triggers would check for attribute scores.
I could live with a system like the above since it has an important cornerstone: first you create a class-based system and THEN you try and make it so that the class components and possibly some other unused components to be re-combinable with some minor caveats. The problem with most skill-based systems is that since they tell you to e.g. pick 5 minor and 5 major skills those skills will inherently be same-ish, as you have to bring them under a common denominator first in order to 'balance' the game out (gosh I hate this word). But in the above BG2 example you would literally say that "look, this skill costs waaaay more than this minor shit skill, since its much more powerful and useful in-game" so asymmetry and differentiation would be a part of the game still. Its still more difficult to do than a plain class-based game. It would still cost more time and money to do, and this is the reason that I still fear it is simply not possible. Furthermore, I know you probably hate 'hand-holding' and it is shit when it's overt, but I would argue it's an understandable game design principle. Maybe it is a good idea to enable players to have a sub-optimal build, maybe its not, this is again subjective.
So all we'd have to do is to find the lowest denominator components, be them skills, magic, feats, traits, detriments etc... for each and every class/archetype in a given fantasy rpg setting, which is much easier said than done, even if we do the classes first. I don't think I'll ever see the day for this to happen, there are far too many obstacles irl, but I would support any such initiative.
