Colony Ship Early Access Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[razvedchiki]

all this is because people were crying that the skill point system of AOD destroyed their families lifes and probably had a hand on global warming.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

 

[CappenVarra]

leave randomness alone

 

[lukaszek]

I guess actual complain is about snowball effect of rng skills. Currently game is too slow for it to matter, might be worth looking into in future.

One thing I didnt check is whether there is a skill xp cap per enemy. As in can you farm dodge xp by leaving some easy, early fight be only to come back later with really nice DT armor and just stand there, skipping each turn? Possibly equip dagger to graze for 0 dmg and lvlup blade this way too?

 

[Momock]

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

It totaly is random (you say it yourself: "Not really random", because you know that simply saying "It isn't random" would be a lie), and it's a even more blatant with a skill like critical strike that is hugely inconsistent in it's rising (it could be a lot or it could be zero, in the same combat, playing exactly the same actions) while at the same time the difference between two levels of the skill being the more significant of all of the combat ones (a single point makes the difference between a guy you can takedown and a guy you can't). As a result it asks from the player even more metagaming and quickloading than usual in your games, so that's saying something!

Spot beating a round the bush and fix it pleeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaase!!!*

*or not, I guess. I already bought the game, so my opinion hardly matters anymore, LOL!

I guess actual complain is about snowball effect of rng skills. Currently game is too slow for it to matter, might be worth looking into in future

There's that, but also le fact that if I want to squeeze all the learning points out of a fight I'm going to have to reload it many times even after winning! Kind of like rerolling the character creation in the old D&D RPGs until you get only 18s, or reseting the console each time a warrior gets a point in magic in the Fire Emblems. It gives me PTSD only to think about it! Thank God I have more self-control over this things nowadays...

 

[Vault Dweller]

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

It totaly is random (you say it yourself: "Not really random", because you know that simply saying "It isn't random" would be a lie), and it's a even more blatant with a skill like critical strike that is hugely inconsistent in it's rising (it could be a lot or it could be zero, in the same combat, playing exactly the same actions) while at the same time the difference between two levels of the skill being the more significant of all of the combat ones (a single point makes the difference between a guy you can takedown and a guy you can't). As a result it asks from the player even more metagaming and quickloading than usual in your games, so that's saying something!

You look at each individual roll and see a random chance. I look at the player-submitted builds and see the expected distribution of over hundred rolls. In other words, 20% chance means nothing if you roll once or twice.

 

[Momock]

So... it's random.

You're worst than a muslim who's asked to condemn a terrorist attack... you just can't say it!

 

[Jaedar]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

I think you are right, but there is a bootstrapping problem with these skills imo. If your cs is low, you will have a hard time raising it. But once you get a few levels it becomes pretty easy. Lone wolf helps a lot with getting the first few levels, but aside from that I think it might be a bit too hard? Maybe I'm just bad though, or unwilling to invest in otherwise subpar perks.

 

[Momock]

Well, in the end (of my last run) I managed to cut the throats of many people with Faythe, but for a while I was quite desperate and didn't find out how to make the skill grow. I think it's because she starts with CS at 1 that it's so hard to begin. In the end I had to restart from scrach and take the warrior feat first instead of the furtivity ones, for the increased accuracy leading to more criticals in combat (and wait for the broken invisibility sphere to do the big sneaking scenarios). So a combat feat made her a better ninja than the ninja feats. So intuitive!

 

[Parabalus]

Well, in the end (of my last run) I managed to cut the throats of many people with Faythe, but for a while I was quite desperate and didn't find out how to make the skill grow. I think it's because she starts with CS at 1 that it's so hard to begin. In the end I had to restart from scrach and take the warrior feat first instead of the furtivity ones, for the increased accuracy leading to more criticals in combat (and wait for the broken invisibility sphere to do the big sneaking scenarios). So a combat feat made her a better ninja than the ninja feats. So intuitive!

You get way more CS for killing people in combat than while sneaking, like 400% more + other combat skills. Needs a lot of tuning.

 

[Pladio]

I guess actual complain is about snowball effect of rng skills. Currently game is too slow for it to matter, might be worth looking into in future.

One thing I didnt check is whether there is a skill xp cap per enemy. As in can you farm dodge xp by leaving some easy, early fight be only to come back later with really nice DT armor and just stand there, skipping each turn? Possibly equip dagger to graze for 0 dmg and lvlup blade this way too?

It's limited. I think max of 80 for évasion/armour.

 

[Whisper]

So... it's random.

You're worst than a muslim who's asked to condemn a terrorist attack... you just can't say it!

Allah Akbar!

 

[Pladio]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

I think you are right, but there is a bootstrapping problem with these skills imo. If your cs is low, you will have a hard time raising it. But once you get a few levels it becomes pretty easy. Lone wolf helps a lot with getting the first few levels, but aside from that I think it might be a bit too hard? Maybe I'm just bad though, or unwilling to invest in otherwise subpar perks.

If you make use of Aimed Attacks - they increase your CS chance. That's an easy way to raise it.

For example ->
CS skill only increases CS chance by 1%
Aimed attack increases CS chance by 10%

 

[Parabalus]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

I think you are right, but there is a bootstrapping problem with these skills imo. If your cs is low, you will have a hard time raising it. But once you get a few levels it becomes pretty easy. Lone wolf helps a lot with getting the first few levels, but aside from that I think it might be a bit too hard? Maybe I'm just bad though, or unwilling to invest in otherwise subpar perks.

If you make use of Aimed Attacks - they increase your CS chance. That's an easy way to raise it.

For example ->
CS skill only increases CS chance by 1%
Aimed attack increases CS chance by 10%

Is this something good though?

Instead of playing to win the encounter you are playing to level up your skills.
Really egregious when you get random goons under your control.

 

[Pladio]

Is this something good though?

Instead of playing to win the encounter you are playing to level up your skills.
Really egregious when you get random goons under your control.

You have to be very OCD to do fights in this way. But you can do it if you want to.

I tend to just play the game.

 

[lukaszek]

cant wait for hybrid builds telling you how to milk specific encounters to keep your combat stats reasonably high

 

[Parabalus]

You shouldn't be able to do that, like you can't with non-combat skills.

In the current version there's no need for it, but judging by VD's posts he's going to up the difficulty a lot.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

I think you are right, but there is a bootstrapping problem with these skills imo. If your cs is low, you will have a hard time raising it. But once you get a few levels it becomes pretty easy. Lone wolf helps a lot with getting the first few levels, but aside from that I think it might be a bit too hard? Maybe I'm just bad though, or unwilling to invest in otherwise subpar perks.

If you make use of Aimed Attacks - they increase your CS chance. That's an easy way to raise it.

For example ->
CS skill only increases CS chance by 1%
Aimed attack increases CS chance by 10%

Is this something good though?

Instead of playing to win the encounter you are playing to level up your skills.
Really egregious when you get random goons under your control.

Or you can just play the game and see what you'd end up with. If you never use aimed attacks, don't. If you don't need CS feats, don't use them. Then a sniper type character will have high CS and a fast shooting pistolero won't. Hardly a problem that needs fixing.

 

[Parabalus]

Dudes, your missing the point: it's RANDOM. Randomness is already bad, but in character creation or leveling it's CHAOTIC EVIL.

"Your skill progression reflects how you play.", ok, that's good and all. BUT... it doesn't have to be random, or does it?

If players consistently raise evasion and critical strike by playing in a manner that favors these skills, it's not really random, is it?

I think you are right, but there is a bootstrapping problem with these skills imo. If your cs is low, you will have a hard time raising it. But once you get a few levels it becomes pretty easy. Lone wolf helps a lot with getting the first few levels, but aside from that I think it might be a bit too hard? Maybe I'm just bad though, or unwilling to invest in otherwise subpar perks.

If you make use of Aimed Attacks - they increase your CS chance. That's an easy way to raise it.

For example ->
CS skill only increases CS chance by 1%
Aimed attack increases CS chance by 10%

Is this something good though?

Instead of playing to win the encounter you are playing to level up your skills.
Really egregious when you get random goons under your control.

Or you can just play the game and see what you'd end up with. If you never use aimed attacks, don't. If you don't need CS feats, don't use them. Then a sniper type character will have high CS and a fast shooting pistolero won't. Hardly a problem that needs fixing.

CS is good even without aimed attacks, ie. Berserker melee wants it.
Basically everyone wants as much CS as you can get since it's free damage, and unlike Armor/Evasion useful during sneaking and dialogue.

It's only not a problem since everything is tuned so generously currently.
Playing with a party it's conceivable you could have swings of 0-500 CS XP per fight, and if you miss a check along the way it would leave a sour taste.

 

[Pink Eye]

>judging by VD's posts he's going to up the difficulty a lot.
That's cause for celebration! I hope they do!

 

[Alphons]

Edit: Momock thanks for feedback, I'm leaving Penniless for now, maybe I'll have some idea what could be done to improve it (currently it's mostly a joke).


Since Master Trader in it's current form is getting retired, here're some suggestions of non-combat feats , ? for stuff I'm not entirely sure about (requirements, feat names):

Con artist (7 Intelligence)- you get bonus disposition when persuading characters with Intelligence lower than yours. Characters with equal or higher Intelligence can see through your act and are annoyed by it, giving you a penalty to disposition.

Thug? (6 Charisma, maybe Strength?)- each point of Charisma above 5 gives you a bonus to your Combat Reputation and maybe Streetwise, but only for the purpose of intimidation (for example those 2 bandits that can run away in Armoury or intimidating Will to pay up for protection)

Penniless? (8 Charisma)- gives you special dialogue lines whenever you have to pay (outside of normal trading- so for example getting mugged by junkies or buying disruptor cores for Cole) that require less money, but a lot more self-pity and whining.

 

[Efe]

are there any plans for pets?
I'd love an attack frog.

 

[Momock]

Since Master Trader in it's current form is getting retired, here're some suggestions of non-combat feats , ? for stuff I'm not entirely sure about (requirements, feat names):

Con artist (7? Charisma and 7 Intelligence)- you get bonus disposition when persuading characters with Intelligence lower than yours. Characters with equal or higher Intelligence can see through your act and are annoyed by it, giving you a penalty to disposition.

Thug? (6 Charisma, maybe Strength?)- each point of Charisma above 5 gives you a bonus to your Combat Reputation and maybe Streetwise, but only for the purpose of intimidation (for example those 2 bandits that can run away in Armoury or intimidating Will to pay up for protection)

Penniless? (8 Charisma)- gives you special dialogue lines whenever you have to pay (outside of normal trading- so for example getting mugged by junkies or buying disruptor cores for Cole) that require less money, but a lot more self-pity and whining.

Con artist and Thug? ("Thug Life" would be an ideal name) sound good, but I'll only apply the latter to combat rep checks tough, since they are the intimidations using your own combat prowess -or partially fake combat prowess in that case-, while the others that use streetwise are intimidation by bringing up the big fishs or another menace beside yourself. Penniless is meh, you already have dialog options to avoid paying. Also you should remove the charisma requirement for Con artist since it'a about compensating low charisma with intelligence.

 

[Ihavenoidea]

Personally I think that a perk that gives + 7-10 ini each combat round (named veteran or something) could work while being relatively balanced.
So start with 20, next turn 27, next turn 34 etc.

 

[Momock]

You have to be very OCD to do fights in this way. But you can do it if you want to.

Oh sorry, I though this was RPG Codex, wrong door!

PS: if you have OCD there's no wanting and not wanting to do.

Personally I think that a perk that gives + 7-10 ini each combat round (named veteran or something) could work while being relatively balanced.
So start with 20, next turn 27, next turn 34 etc.

So you become a veteran by the time of a single encounter but forget everything about it after drowning your victory in alcohol with the buddies and have to restart from scrach?

Maybe change the name for something like "getting on the move" or "getting a feeling"!