Disco Elysium creative lead Robert Kurvitz was quietly fired from ZA/UM in late 2021, files lawsuit against them

[Maxie]

remember what sorta deranged mind you dealing with people - Kurvits is a normal Estonian last name, but Pedoman insists on spelling it Kurvitz, which roughly corresponds to Whoreson in slavic languages...

someone, at some point, must've noticed that and asked him 'what the fuck robert,' and you just know he sneered obnoxiously

 

[DJOGamer PT]

This is not weird at all in Europe.

...

The fact that people have historically been a bit more relaxed about age gaps here is because once you see it out in the world it's very obvious that there's really not anything all that weird that like a 22 year old and a 16 year old with similar interests and overlapping social circle become romantically involved.

Sorry, but don't generalise the whole continent with whatever degenerate rathole you live in
A 20's something man/woman having a romantic relationship with a boy/girl under 18 is indeed very fucking abnormal

This is misleading
While the age of consent here is indeed 14, it doesn't save you from jail as there's some fine print attached to it
In practice it only means that, if you are prosecuted with whatever sexual crime of a minor they've caught you engaging in (even "attempt" is enough for you to be dragged into court), if you can prove that whatever act happened between you and said minor was consensual, then you get a lighter sentence by a couple of years
But yeah... you still go to jail and get branded as a sex offender for the remainder of your natural life

And as I've already said, even something like a 20 year old dating a recently turned 18 year old, that knew each other for a year or so, is already scandalous enough to have people here raise an eyebrow and whisper behind your back

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

I have a conspiracy theory.

We are watching Disco Elysium 2 right now. Kurvits and Kompas discussed that the best format for a sequel is not a computer game, but a legal drama with off-the-wall plot twists about pedophilia and money laundering in Baku, toxicity, and Junta's sucking corporate dicks. It's kind of like LARP, but on a whole new level of cringe. It must be said, I enjoy Disco Elysium 2 much better than the first one.

 

[Feargus Jewhart]

B. The older partners goes "that's sweet, maybe when you're older, lets just be friends for now" and if the crush persists (which it usually doesn't) it might grow into a long term romantic relationship. This is what in less womanly times was called "having honourable intentions" but I guess the newspeak is "grooming".

Why was a guy in his 20s letting young teenagers into his communist book club? In my 20s I would absolutely never hang out with middle/high school kids.

This is the most reddit-flavored post ever made on the Codex. Holy fucking shit.

I was the first one to call him out as a creep. But there is an important distinction between people attracted to young children and people attracted to teenagers (everyone as soon as they become a teenager themselves). This was something mainstream entertainment used to be able to acknowledge with honesty.

I see 13-14 year Olds through volunteering quite often.

They are children. They talk, look, dress and act like children. Anyone willing to spend time or be attracted to someone who has issues brushing their teeth daily, to whom showering and changing underwear is optional and burping/ farting is funny... They are rude, childish, they talk about tiktok, K-pop, super casual video games and literal middle /high school drama.

14 year old girls are snarky, rude, think they're super smart and like the dumbest shit ever. You have to be a brain damaged pedophile to be attracted to them. There is no honourable intentions when you're trying to get close to a child who probably hasn't changed underwear in four days, ate pure spoonfuls of sugar for breakfast and just spent an hour calling someone's mum a whore on discord for being asked are they 12.


Now that I think about it, they are a lot like codexers in terms of hygiene and interests. Wow.

 

[gurugeorge]

I have a conspiracy theory.

We are watching Disco Elysium 2 right now. Kurvits and Kompas discussed that the best format for a sequel is not a computer game, but a legal drama with off-the-wall plot twists about pedophilia and money laundering in Baku, toxicity, and Junta's sucking corporate dicks. It's kind of like LARP, but on a whole new level of cringe. It must be said, I enjoy Disco Elysium 2 much better than the first one.

Are you telling me that Disco Elysium 2 is a fucking ARG?

 

[Skorpion]

This documentary is evidence that, realistically, all they needed to do to "justify" their firing in the eyes of the mayority of the fanbase was talk to the employees at the company and ask what their take was. Instead they accussed them of mysoginy, trying to steal the IP to sell to other studios (???), lying about the whole money fiasco, etc. I'd need some time to think on it but right now imo realistically the only thing that you could kinda see as being true was them not fullfilling their roles for the final cut, which honestly I find easy to believe seeing as how the entire development of DE was always depicted as a burnout highway. Maybe some mistreatment too, Robert seems like the kind of lead that wouldn't hold back on his words towards other's work.
Seriously, how the fuck is there no paperwork to point out that Kurvitz and company are lying? I can believe them not having any paperwork, they're writers and artists, but how the fuck does that go by the bussinessmen that are juggling millions of euros around?

Absolutely this.

I think that there are some key takeaway things here:
1) Kurvitz and co were catastrophically bad leaders that were lucky to have a competent team around them that delivered not because, but in spite of their leadership.
2) Some VERY shady businessmen did some VERY shady business things around the whole project, which ultimately caused them to fire Kurvitz & co, using made-up nonsense - because those businessmen at that time most likely didn't even know most of the things that have now come to light which would actually have justified letting them go.
3) It would be better for a potential sequel if Kurvitz at least was allowed to keep writing on the world and the project, but should no longer have responsibility over other people. Of course, given all the likely bad blood by now (and Kurvitz' apparent inability or unwillingness to deal with being a terrible leader), that's almost certainly not going to happen.

I'm really curious about how it'll all turn out.
As we now know, there have been very good reasons to let them go, but those were not the reasons used when it actually happened.

Wow, what a mess.

That relationship stuff is honestly just irrelevant drama. Cherry on top, maybe.

So how many 14 year olds have you tried to pick up, Im guessing the number is more than zero if your so blase about it and even leave shitty little emotes on anyone pointing out that part of it is not a cool thing.
Be sure to include all the animals 14 and under you go after your fucking weirdo.

 

[Skorpion]

I categorically disagree with the idea that if an older person starts to date someone younger than them, who they have had prior history with, it automatically qualifies as grooming. Don't get me wrong, this is usually what occurs, but I have also seen situations where this isn't the case.

At the risk of getting strawmanned/painted as something I'm not, I will reference a situation in my own life to illustrate the nuanced nature of these kidns of situations. Growing up, there was a girl (who I still know to this day), who was in my church youth group. There was around a five year age difference between us, so when I was around sixteen/seventeen she was eleven/twelve. The entire youth group was friendly and we did speak a few times, but obviously I had no interest in hanging out with a young girl, and I spent all my time with the older members of the youth group. That being said, even at her young age, I could tell that she was "cute" and would grow up to be an attractive young woman. Fast forward to now where she is eighteen and I am twenty three, and we've seen each other several times and always greeted each other warmly, and she is indeed an attractive young woman.

I am currently in a relationship, and even if that wasn't the case, there are clear differences in maturity and life experience between myself and her, all of which make the hypothetical idea of us dating to be ridiculous/completely unappealing. That being said, let's assume neither of those things were an issue, I'm sure many people would argue that the fact I knew her when she was prepubescent while I was a teenager should be enough to make the idea of dating her absolutely revolting. The issue is that when I consider that idea, I'd be lying if I said it is revolting/off putting. I'll reiterate, the idea of dating the girl is revolting/off putting, but it's fore the aforementioned reasons, and if I was to imagine a hypothetical situation where I knew a girl that doesn't exist where we were the perfect match but there was an age gap and I had know her growing up, it simply wouldn't bother me. If this sounds wrong/disgusting I'd love for someone to explain why.

Now obviously the situation between Kurvitz and Helen is completely different since they did interact constantly, and the difference in age between Helen and Kurvitz is ten years versus the comparatively small in my own situation, and with these things considered it is very likely there was grooming that occurred. But that begs another interesting question, is it possible for an older person and a younger person to interact with no grooming behavior occurring, but for them to fall into love/attraction later on down the line? I'd say yes, and these situations have definitely occurred in the past.

I just want to inject some nuance into this discussion because this is something that is constantly talked about in Kwan and I think the way it is thought of popularly is ridiculous. At the end of the day, it's two consenting adults, and it isn't anyone's business.

the nuance is your situation verses theirs, so a strawman comparison to make it seem ok without admitting you think its ok... ok

 

[Latro]

Kurvitz follows a funny archetype among certain writers…those guys that write about wronged, love-lorn rejected cuckolds that use that type of writing to attract women who think he’s a tortured artist and not just another creep. Very Salinger, really. At least Salinger was the better writer.

 

[ItsChon]

At the end of the day, it's two consenting adults, and it isn't anyone's business.

You wrote a wall of text only to miss the fact that in most places (read: outside the of parts of the Middle East, Indochina and East Indies) 14 is not considered an adult?

Harthwain outing himself as a retard and completely misunderstanding what I wrote. The comment about them being adults refers to their relationship as it exists now.

If they started dating when she was 14/15 and he was 25, absolutely unacceptable. If they knew each other for a few years and started dating once she was 18, 19, 20, etc, if he groomed her it's still absolutely unacceptable, if he didn't groom her it's far more acceptable, but still has the potential to be extremely disgusting and creepy depending on their temperaments. It's that simple. Not surprised the Codex is filled with actual peadophiles to muddy the waters.

 

[Skorpion]

At the end of the day, it's two consenting adults, and it isn't anyone's business.

You wrote a wall of text only to miss the fact that in most places (read: outside the of parts of the Middle East, Indochina and East Indies) 14 is not considered an adult?

Harthwain outing himself as a retard and completely misunderstanding what I wrote. The comment about them being adults refers to their relationship as it exists now.

If they started dating when she was 14/15 and he was 25, absolutely unacceptable. If they knew each other for a few years and started dating once she was 18, 19, 20, etc, it's far more acceptable, but still has the potential to be extremely disgusting and creepy depending on their temperaments. It's that simple. Not surprised the Codex is filled with actual peadophiles to muddy the waters.

Muddy the waters? Bitch your entire wall of text was if its this its ok if its that its not, I did this so its ok but he might have done that so its not, but I dont know but I think it is but maybe not if you say its that but I have an opinion that I cant say so I will say this instead of that.
How about you just admit you dont have an opinion? The rest of us non-pedos will stick with the guy is scum in every other section of his life so were going to go with he was scum in the pedo way too

 

[ItsChon]

the nuance is your situation verses theirs, so a strawman comparison to make it seem ok without admitting you think its ok... ok

Muddy the waters? Bitch your entire wall of text was if its this its ok if its that its not, I did this so its ok but he might have done that so its not, but I dont know but I think it is but maybe not if you say its that but I have an opinion that I cant say so I will say this instead of that.
How about you just admit you dont have an opinion? The rest of us non-pedos will stick with the guy is scum in every other section of his life so were going to go with he was scum in the pedo way too

That's not at all what I was saying. My point is, how do we know there situation wasn't as nuanced as mine? If there is a document or video I missed, please share it with me. If they started dating when she was still very young, it's horrible, if they started dating when she was older, it could still be horrible if he groomed her, if neither of the two occurred, then there is no problem. Seeing as we have no way to determine which of any of these scenarios is true, and I'll never meet them in person to observe said relationship, I don't see any point in shitting on their relationship. It's hilarious you're trying to paint me as a pedo apologist when that is not the case at all. Also, what else has this guy done that's so terrible/scummy, outside of being a neurotic/discouraging boss and a commie?

EDIT: And I didn't do anything. I'm just highlighting that such situations are not black and white like the Codex likes to pretend they are. It is impossible to pass judgement on this guy without knowing the full story, and seeing how that is not available to us, I don't know how we can have people excusing his behavior (pedo sympathizers) and people that are condemning him as a man (reactionary retards).

 

[Axioms]

the nuance is your situation verses theirs, so a strawman comparison to make it seem ok without admitting you think its ok... ok

Muddy the waters? Bitch your entire wall of text was if its this its ok if its that its not, I did this so its ok but he might have done that so its not, but I dont know but I think it is but maybe not if you say its that but I have an opinion that I cant say so I will say this instead of that.
How about you just admit you dont have an opinion? The rest of us non-pedos will stick with the guy is scum in every other section of his life so were going to go with he was scum in the pedo way too

That's not at all what I was saying. My point is, how do we know there situation wasn't as nuanced as mine? If there is a document or video I missed, please share it with me. If they started dating when she was still very young, it's horrible, if they started dating when she was older, it could still be horrible if he groomed her, if neither of the two occurred, then there is no problem. Seeing as we have no way to determine which of any of these scenarios is true, and I'll never meet them in person to observe said relationship, I don't see any point in shitting on their relationship. It's hilarious you're trying to paint me as a pedo apologist when that is not the case at all. Also, what else has this guy done that's so terrible/scummy, outside of being a neurotic/discouraging boss and a commie?

Well this is the Codex so his original sin of obviously making a story focused crpg with narrative and skillchecks.

 

[KVVRR]

I have a conspiracy theory.

We are watching Disco Elysium 2 right now. Kurvits and Kompas discussed that the best format for a sequel is not a computer game, but a legal drama with off-the-wall plot twists about pedophilia and money laundering in Baku, toxicity, and Junta's sucking corporate dicks. It's kind of like LARP, but on a whole new level of cringe. It must be said, I enjoy Disco Elysium 2 much better than the first one.

schizo kino

 

[Latro]

the nuance is your situation verses theirs, so a strawman comparison to make it seem ok without admitting you think its ok... ok

Muddy the waters? Bitch your entire wall of text was if its this its ok if its that its not, I did this so its ok but he might have done that so its not, but I dont know but I think it is but maybe not if you say its that but I have an opinion that I cant say so I will say this instead of that.
How about you just admit you dont have an opinion? The rest of us non-pedos will stick with the guy is scum in every other section of his life so were going to go with he was scum in the pedo way too

That's not at all what I was saying. My point is, how do we know there situation wasn't as nuanced as mine? If there is a document or video I missed, please share it with me. If they started dating when she was still very young, it's horrible, if they started dating when she was older, it could still be horrible if he groomed her, if neither of the two occurred, then there is no problem. Seeing as we have no way to determine which of any of these scenarios is true, and I'll never meet them in person to observe said relationship, I don't see any point in shitting on their relationship. It's hilarious you're trying to paint me as a pedo apologist when that is not the case at all. Also, what else has this guy done that's so terrible/scummy, outside of being a neurotic/discouraging boss and a commie?

Well this is the Codex so his original sin of obviously making a story focused crpg with narrative and skillchecks.

Rpg goty 2019 is our Holocaust…

 

[Roguey]

They are children. They talk, look, dress and act like children.

No, there are very much body differences between those who haven't gone through puberty and those who have.

Anyone willing to spend time or be attracted to someone who has issues brushing their teeth daily, to whom showering and changing underwear is optional and burping/ farting is funny... They are rude, childish, they talk about tiktok, K-pop, super casual video games and literal middle /high school drama.

14 year old girls are snarky, rude, think they're super smart and like the dumbest shit ever. You have to be a brain damaged pedophile to be attracted to them. There is no honourable intentions when you're trying to get close to a child who probably hasn't changed underwear in four days, ate pure spoonfuls of sugar for breakfast and just spent an hour calling someone's mum a whore on discord for being asked are they 12.

A lot of adult women behave childishly, especially from a male perspective. And this image became a meme for a reason.

 

[Axioms]

the nuance is your situation verses theirs, so a strawman comparison to make it seem ok without admitting you think its ok... ok

Muddy the waters? Bitch your entire wall of text was if its this its ok if its that its not, I did this so its ok but he might have done that so its not, but I dont know but I think it is but maybe not if you say its that but I have an opinion that I cant say so I will say this instead of that.
How about you just admit you dont have an opinion? The rest of us non-pedos will stick with the guy is scum in every other section of his life so were going to go with he was scum in the pedo way too

That's not at all what I was saying. My point is, how do we know there situation wasn't as nuanced as mine? If there is a document or video I missed, please share it with me. If they started dating when she was still very young, it's horrible, if they started dating when she was older, it could still be horrible if he groomed her, if neither of the two occurred, then there is no problem. Seeing as we have no way to determine which of any of these scenarios is true, and I'll never meet them in person to observe said relationship, I don't see any point in shitting on their relationship. It's hilarious you're trying to paint me as a pedo apologist when that is not the case at all. Also, what else has this guy done that's so terrible/scummy, outside of being a neurotic/discouraging boss and a commie?

Well this is the Codex so his original sin of obviously making a story focused crpg with narrative and skillchecks.

Rpg goty 2019 is our Holocaust…

Probably won with a classic 52/48 spread.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

I'm tired of the subject of pedophilia. Let's talk about something else.

I can't help but notice that Kurvitz has gotten a lot worse in his physical appearance. He used to be more or less a good-looking guy. Now he's fat, bald, flabby, and looks like an old bum. He really needs to team up with Avellone. I can just see them presenting their newest narrative project together, sitting around a burning barrel somewhere in Skid Row.

Time is a bitch, unironically. Especially if you don't take care of yourself.

 

[Infinitron]

He needs to do something about that missing tooth.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

He needs to do something about that missing tooth.

True. And he's been toothless for a long time. Even in the 2019 interview, when he looked generally better, he had this hole between his teeth.

Perhaps he thinks it's classy in a way. It's hard to know what's in these artists' heads.

Even if it's not a missing tooth, but just an improperly grown or chipped one, surely dentists could fix it.

 

[Axioms]

America is way more focused on fixing teeth than other countries. Also don't Japanese people thing a mild snaggletooth is like, a minor flaw that makes attractive people approachable?

 

[None]

He needs to do something about that missing tooth.

I forget who here said it, but I can't shake the description of Kurvitz as a two-eyed cyclops. The tooth is the least of his concerns.

 

[Feargus Jewhart]

They are children. They talk, look, dress and act like children.

No, there are very much body differences between those who haven't gone through puberty and those who have.

Anyone willing to spend time or be attracted to someone who has issues brushing their teeth daily, to whom showering and changing underwear is optional and burping/ farting is funny... They are rude, childish, they talk about tiktok, K-pop, super casual video games and literal middle /high school drama.

14 year old girls are snarky, rude, think they're super smart and like the dumbest shit ever. You have to be a brain damaged pedophile to be attracted to them. There is no honourable intentions when you're trying to get close to a child who probably hasn't changed underwear in four days, ate pure spoonfuls of sugar for breakfast and just spent an hour calling someone's mum a whore on discord for being asked are they 12.

A lot of adult women behave childishly, especially from a male perspective. And this image became a meme for a reason.

Pedophile.

 

[Cleveland Mark Blakemore]

Reminder that if they were TRVE communists and acquired their communally owned game in a way that didn't involve the exchange of capital this would have never happened.

Marxism was never anti-capitalism. It saw capitalism and it's resources as a necessary stage of development for socialism. It would progress from socialism to communism. Most Marxists want to rush to the communism stage because they are really bad at the other two stages.

I hope Trudeau brings you in for his boy harem and pounds your ass until you see triple. Manboon are not learning animals. What is it like to be a Marxist NPC? Do you believe you have a soul like I do? Do you really think that or is that just programmed into your responses as a random remark?

 

[Roguey]

He needs to do something about that missing tooth.

True. And he's been toothless for a long time. Even in the 2019 interview, when he looked generally better, he had this hole between his teeth.

Perhaps he thinks it's classy in a way. It's hard to know what's in these artists' heads.

Even if it's not a missing tooth, but just an improperly grown or chipped one, surely dentists could fix it.

He probably sees getting an implant as bourgeoisie vanity. I'm sure he could afford it now, but as Axioms said there are European values at work here https://rpgcodex.net/forums/threads...allery-no-longer-on-page-1.32721/post-7388583

 

[yes plz]

They are children. They talk, look, dress and act like children.

No, there are very much body differences between those who haven't gone through puberty and those who have.

Anyone willing to spend time or be attracted to someone who has issues brushing their teeth daily, to whom showering and changing underwear is optional and burping/ farting is funny... They are rude, childish, they talk about tiktok, K-pop, super casual video games and literal middle /high school drama.

14 year old girls are snarky, rude, think they're super smart and like the dumbest shit ever. You have to be a brain damaged pedophile to be attracted to them. There is no honourable intentions when you're trying to get close to a child who probably hasn't changed underwear in four days, ate pure spoonfuls of sugar for breakfast and just spent an hour calling someone's mum a whore on discord for being asked are they 12.

A lot of adult women behave childishly, especially from a male perspective. And this image became a meme for a reason.

very interesting

turn and face the wall