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Incline Disco Elysium - The Final Cut - a hardboiled cop show isometric RPG

Hydro

Educated
Joined
Mar 30, 2024
Messages
657
The game even manages to blame Tchernobyl on communism, disguising it into other names.
Not really? The pawn shop guy literally says that their aim was to provide cheap energy for people and that they failed because they lacked the tech. I’m failing to see “blame” here.

What’s your take on Tchernobyl though?
 

Lord_Potato

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Nov 24, 2017
Messages
11,072
Location
Free City of Warsaw

Disco isn't different from that. When you select "communist" choices, the game says you should "start shooting people" and doing "mass graves". Typical anti-communist propaganda, nothing I didn't expect from a Baltic humanities idiot. The game even manages to blame Tchernobyl on communism, disguising it into other names. Doesn't say anything about Fukushima, this is a democratic technogenic disaster, all is well.
Oh, remind me, what natural disaster was responsible for Chernobyl disaster? Was it an earthquake? A tsunami? A solar flare? A storm of epic proportions perhaps?

No. The only disaster that caused Chernobyl was the Soviet rule. Soviets ordered the construction of a faulty powerplant and ignored all criticism, then gave another order, to push its design to the limits, which in reality proved to be way above those limits.
 

Beastro

Arcane
Joined
May 11, 2015
Messages
9,825
Location
where east is west

Disco isn't different from that. When you select "communist" choices, the game says you should "start shooting people" and doing "mass graves". Typical anti-communist propaganda, nothing I didn't expect from a Baltic humanities idiot. The game even manages to blame Tchernobyl on communism, disguising it into other names. Doesn't say anything about Fukushima, this is a democratic technogenic disaster, all is well.
Oh, remind me, what natural disaster was responsible for Chernobyl disaster? Was it an earthquake? A tsunami? A solar flare? A storm of epic proportions perhaps?

No. The only disaster that caused Chernobyl was the Soviet rule. Soviets ordered the construction of a faulty powerplant and ignored all criticism, then gave another order, to push its design to the limits, which in reality proved to be way above those limits.

But, but, but, that's exactly like designing a NPP to withstand the most powerful known tsunami's to hit the region only for nature to hit it with one bigger than anyone thought was possible!

...right?
 

Longes

Augur
Joined
Jan 13, 2013
Messages
440
I would argue that the authors' communism shows up mostly in the need to pull punches. The game has nothing to say about centrism/moralism beyond sneering. The game can have brutally honest exploration of fascist bitterness and take potshots at broke hobocop Harry trying to be an ultra-liberal sigma male hustlegrinder. But for communism, it still has to end at the romantic idea of communism. Yeah, the communist book club may have exiled their economist because he didn't agree that turnips will grow better under communism. But their impossible tower of communism defied gravity for a second, so communism is still worth pursuing goddammit!
 

Hydro

Educated
Joined
Mar 30, 2024
Messages
657
I would argue that the authors' communism shows up mostly in the need to pull punches. The game has nothing to say about centrism/moralism beyond sneering. The game can have brutally honest exploration of fascist bitterness and take potshots at broke hobocop Harry trying to be an ultra-liberal sigma male hustlegrinder. But for communism, it still has to end at the romantic idea of communism. Yeah, the communist book club may have exiled their economist because he didn't agree that turnips will grow better under communism. But their impossible tower of communism defied gravity for a second, so communism is still worth pursuing goddammit!
I would argue that the only thing this game deems worth pursuing is becoming a decent human being capable of empathy. It promotes the idea that after all the ideologies have failed (and there’s no better one in sight) it is the simple folk that is capable of fixing things. The “good” playthrough is to basically try to make things work together as they are without going into extremes, or relying on ideologies.
 

Lord_Potato

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Nov 24, 2017
Messages
11,072
Location
Free City of Warsaw
Soviets ordered the construction of a faulty powerplant and ignored all criticism
Yeah, I also learn history from HBO.
Rome was tits.
I guess Yuri Andropov, chief of KGB and later General Secretary of the communist party was an HBO consultant.

https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter...struction-chernobyl-aehs-atomic-power-station

Contemporary Soviet journalist Liubov Kovalevska too:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...l-plant/deabfee2-61ce-4c6f-94cf-0a5e8c62902e/
 

Sweeper

Arcane
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
4,074
Soviets ordered the construction of a faulty powerplant and ignored all criticism
Yeah, I also learn history from HBO.
Rome was tits.
I guess Yuri Andropov, chief of KGB and later General Secretary of the communist party was an HBO consultant.

https://digitalarchive.wilsoncenter...struction-chernobyl-aehs-atomic-power-station

Contemporary Soviet journalist Liubov Kovalevska too:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...l-plant/deabfee2-61ce-4c6f-94cf-0a5e8c62902e/
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/about
You're too far gone bro.
>Washington Post
lol, lmao
 

Laz Sundays

Educated
Joined
Jan 12, 2020
Messages
353
I would argue that the authors' communism shows up mostly in the need to pull punches. The game has nothing to say about centrism/moralism beyond sneering. The game can have brutally honest exploration of fascist bitterness and take potshots at broke hobocop Harry trying to be an ultra-liberal sigma male hustlegrinder. But for communism, it still has to end at the romantic idea of communism. Yeah, the communist book club may have exiled their economist because he didn't agree that turnips will grow better under communism. But their impossible tower of communism defied gravity for a second, so communism is still worth pursuing goddammit!
I would argue that the only thing this game deems worth pursuing is becoming a decent human being capable of empathy. It promotes the idea that after all the ideologies have failed (and there’s no better one in sight) it is the simple folk that is capable of fixing things. The “good” playthrough is to basically try to make things work together as they are without going into extremes, or relying on ideologies.
..which is hilarious, cause that's what centrism should be. Yet, like how we treat agnostics, it's labeled as being a pussy that has no balls to make a firm stance. People are bullheaded extremists that can't figure out it's precisely why we're so easily kept in the constant state of Divide. The balance of the natural polarity should be the obvious endgame and it's only actively preached by eastern philosophy. Smh
 
Vatnik
Joined
Sep 28, 2014
Messages
12,348
Location
USSR
But their impossible tower of communism defied gravity for a second
Haven't seen this content, but sounds like an obvious metaphor for USSR, which lasted a "second" in the grand scheme of history.
And they brand it as "impossible", these so called "commie authors", uh huh.

the communist book club may have exiled their economist because he didn't agree that turnips will grow better under communism
Typical anti-soviet propaganda point about Lysenko.
 

Harthwain

Arcane
Joined
Dec 13, 2019
Messages
5,581
The game has nothing to say about centrism/moralism beyond sneering.
That's funny. Because I consider myself a centrist and I think their portrayal of centrism is interesting. Sure, it is done in a parody-like way, but it is really well written. To the point where it manages to land at least some of its punches.

But for communism, it still has to end at the romantic idea of communism.
Is your romantic idea of communism "firing squads", "animal wagons", "eating the rich" and "impaling all people who have more than 25 real in their pocket"? Because that's how the game wants you to build communism.
 

Longes

Augur
Joined
Jan 13, 2013
Messages
440
The game has nothing to say about centrism/moralism beyond sneering.
That's funny. Because I consider myself a centrist and I think their portrayal of centrism is interesting. Sure, it is done in a parody-like way, but it is really well written. To the point where it manages to land at least some of its punches.

But for communism, it still has to end at the romantic idea of communism.
Is your romantic idea of communism "firing squads", "animal wagons", "eating the rich" and "impaling all people who have more than 25 real in their pocket"? Because that's how the game wants you to build communism.
Was the text too challenging? You got tired and couldn't read the last two sentences of my message?
 

Harthwain

Arcane
Joined
Dec 13, 2019
Messages
5,581
Was the text too challenging? You got tired and couldn't read the last two sentences of my message?
We get so many retards thinking Disco Elysium promotes communism than you looked like yet another one. The game doesn't really "pull the punches" on communism. In fact, it's pretty straightforward about it from get-go.
 

ind33d

Learned
Joined
Jun 23, 2020
Messages
1,832
what is the economic system where everyone lives in the forest and shuts the fuck up? i support that one
 

Sweeper

Arcane
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
4,074
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/about
You're too far gone bro.
>Washington Post
lol, lmao
Yes, we know that while criticizing Chernobyl we can only use Soviet sources provided by the Soviet authorities themselves.

Because obviously Soviets were known for transparency, openness and publically owning their own mistakes.

Retard.
>Posts the western equivalent of Soviet propaganda mouthpieces
>Views them as legitimate sources
>Calls someone else retarded
You're not as smart as you think you are potato bro.
 

Cohesion

Codex made me an elephant hater.
Patron
Joined
May 14, 2015
Messages
1,462
Location
Moscow, Russia
Codex+ Now Streaming!
Was the text too challenging? You got tired and couldn't read the last two sentences of my message?
We get so many retards thinking Disco Elysium promotes communism than you looked like yet another one. The game doesn't really "pull the punches" on communism. In fact, it's pretty straightforward about it from get-go.
Can we agree that disco is a good cyoa (adventure) game? And main theme isn't about politics at all. Quest for Glory had more RPG elements than Disco (+combat). Still great game.
 

Harthwain

Arcane
Joined
Dec 13, 2019
Messages
5,581
Can we agree that disco is a good cyoa (adventure) game?
no.png


And main theme isn't about politics at all.
Still, politics plays a major role in the game. Enough to fill the shoes of alignment in other RPGs. Only with much more impact in this case, as pretty much everything is filtered through political alignment (or, in some cases, the Thought Cabinet). I do agree, however, that politics doesn't work the way the common Disco Elysium's detractors think it works.

Quest for Glory had more RPG elements than Disco (+combat).
Disco Elysium doesn't simply have RPG elements. It was made from ground up to be an RPG (and built off of the actual homebrew PnP RPG system). You can't say the same about any game that just happens to have RPG elements.
 

Lord_Potato

Arcane
Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Nov 24, 2017
Messages
11,072
Location
Free City of Warsaw
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/about
You're too far gone bro.
>Washington Post
lol, lmao
Yes, we know that while criticizing Chernobyl we can only use Soviet sources provided by the Soviet authorities themselves.

Because obviously Soviets were known for transparency, openness and publically owning their own mistakes.

Retard.
>Posts the western equivalent of Soviet propaganda mouthpieces
>Views them as legitimate sources
>Calls someone else retarded
You're not as smart as you think you are potato bro.
I posted two sources: a letter from KGB chief and an article from a local Ukrainian journalist from before the disaster. Both stating the same thing: there were numerous construction failures during the building of Chernobyl nuclear plant.

Yes, both sources were posted in the West (and translated from Russian) by Western organizations. I don't see how exactly this could work differently. The letter was confidential in the Soviet Union and the newspaper article suppressed after the initial publication.

Understandably, Soviet authorities were not know for boasting about their failures, especially after disasters that resulted from said failures.

I'm not sure what exactly are you sperging about. The Chernobyl disaster is a fact and unlike Fukushima it was not a result of a natural cataclysm of epic proportions. Hence, the reasons were of a more human nature.
 

Marat

Arcane
Wumao
Joined
Jan 6, 2017
Messages
2,759
"Investigations faulted lapses in safety and oversight, namely failures in risk assessment and evacuation planning.[8]"

I guess 'reasons of human nature' only discredit the respective economic and political system when it is convenient for them to do so.
 

Laz Sundays

Educated
Joined
Jan 12, 2020
Messages
353
People who call Disco an isometric rpg are to be blamed for the dissonance. You're the ones putting emphasis on being punctual when it comes to genres. So why are you then bitching at others when they load up Disco - which you described as isometric rpg - and they see a visual pointclicky novel instead. With strong rpg elements, sure, huge part of it is c&c roleplay but it's still not eligible to share the same tag with Fallouts, Icewinds, etc.

Make up your mind already. If tagging matters so much then stick to it all the way.
 

Laz Sundays

Educated
Joined
Jan 12, 2020
Messages
353
"What's Disco Elysium?"
"Isometric rpg."
"Like old Baldur's, Fallouts and such?"
"Umm, no."

?
 

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