Dragon Age: Inquisition Pre-Release Thread

[DalekFlay]

"I can't tell elf waifu blood magic is bad"

Yes, you can.

You can say naughty naughty and wave your finger, you cannot say summong demons is evil and kick her ass to the curb or kill her. You hunt blood mages constantly throughout both games but elf waifu must be your friend for no apparent reason.

 

[2house2fly]

I was bored by what I saw of dragon Age 2, but some stuff I've heard about it sounds interesting. Apparently there are a couple of places where the dialogue tone you've gone for most influences something, like you threaten someone and they know you're bluffing because you're a Good Guy. If they can expand on stuff like that in the next one, well, I'm burned out on fantasy settings after 200 hours of Skyrim and will be even more so after Project Eternity, so I probably still won't bother with it.

 

[Volourn]

"You can say naughty naughty and wave your finger, you cannot say summong demons is evil and kick her ass to the curb or kill her. You hunt blood mages constantly throughout both games but elf waifu must be your friend for no apparent reason."

Bullshit

 

[Roguey]

Volourn's right on this one. You can choose not to interact with Merrill at all and if you don't max out her friendship or rivalry (this of course requires not doing her personal quest at all) and choose to side with the templars at the end, you can kill her.

 

[Volourn]

"Volourn's right on this one."

I'm right on EVERY one.


"ou hunt blood mages constantly throughout both games"

btw, On this point, speak for your fukkin'; self. My character does not hunt blood mages. I hunt evil doers. Some happen to be blood mages some aren't. I even work with blood mages. SO FUCK OFF.

 

[DalekFlay]

Volourn's right on this one. You can choose not to interact with Merrill at all and if you don't max out her friendship or rivalry (this of course requires not doing her personal quest at all) and choose to side with the templars at the end, you can kill her.

My DA2 memory is not perfect but I remember screaming at the screen during that moment that I wanted to drop her ass right there and it wouldn't let me. They at least make you behave friendly to her for that mission.

 

[Volourn]

No, they don't. Don't lie. You can tell her to shut the fuck, and refuse to do the mission completely. And, if you do decide to do it, there are multiple ways to deal with it.

This bullshit myth that there is no C&C or multiple solutions in DA2 is a complete and utter lie. In fact, not counting the 'fetch quests'; the quests have more ways to complete them than FO.

It's one thing to hate on DA2 for its repetitve maps but to claim that there is no or little C&C in it is to be a delusional ignorant fuckwit. DID YOU PLAY THE GAME? FFS

 

[bminorkey]

I want all of Geralt's clothes. (TW2 sucks, though)

your fashion sense sucks. (TW2's great, though)

 

[eremita]

I was bored by what I saw of dragon Age 2, but some stuff I've heard about it sounds interesting. Apparently there are a couple of places where the dialogue tone you've gone for most influences something, like you threaten someone and they know you're bluffing because you're a Good Guy. If they can expand on stuff like that in the next one, well, I'm burned out on fantasy settings after 200 hours of Skyrim and will be even more so after Project Eternity, so I probably still won't bother with it.

Yep, It's an awesome feature and I'm pretty interested who come up with it. The execution could be better but the idea itself is brilliant.

BTW, I think personality type dialogue wheel (DA2 and Alpha Protocol) is fucking genius idea, solving a lot of issues I had with some aspects in more traditional systems.

The point is, you don't need so many answers with personality type dialogue system. There is nothing in the whole fucking world that can't be summed up in to either friendly/diplomatic, sarcastic/ironic/humorous or agressive/straightforward answer. Alpha Protocol proves it. It's up to player why is he friendly or douche (role-playing motherfuckers) and those causes have nothing to do with NPCs reactions - he/she just sees a white knight/douche... In the end, those 20 answers from Torment has like 3-4 possible reactions anyway... Also, that picture is biased, because 1) Lots of those "answers" are actually questions and you usually have up to four or more of those in dialogue wheel. The rest of it have to deal with nuance (but in the end all of them fall into one of the personality types mentioned), which is not the case with personality based dialogue. 2) It's conveniently/purposely chosen and that's pathetic. As has already been said, conversations with 20 "answers" are scarce in Torment and there are usually more than three in DA2.

 

[Athelas]

In the end, those 20 answers from Torment has like 3-4 possible reactions anyway...

How the fuck can there be only 3 reactions when the questions are all very specific - i.e. why did you ask Pharod to search for the Bronze Sphere? And what the screenshot doesn't show is that the responses in Torment typically branched into smaller dialogue trees of their own. From my brief experience playing Dragon Age, I remembered that the conversations always funneled you into a narrow path - if you asked about subject A first, you weren't allowed to ask about subject B and C, even if that NPC was friendly and always willing to help you. The dialogue system in Torment is by no means perfect, but it's a much better facsimile of human interaction than Bioware's dialogue wheel.

It's up to player why is he friendly or douche (role-playing motherfuckers)

There's a lot more to role-playing than just being friendly or a douche, you know. In Torment for instance, there's a lot of discovery and questioning since you're an amnesiac. But let's take a look at that Dragon Age dialogue system you called 'fucking genius', shall we? There's no option to turn him down gently, no option to change the subject, no option to break off the conversation and let him know what you think later, etc. And care to explain how the option to say you're hungry enhances your immersion?

 

[eremita]

In the end, those 20 answers from Torment has like 3-4 possible reactions anyway...

How the fuck can there be only 3 reactions when the questions are all very specific - i.e. why did you ask Pharod to search for the Bronze Sphere? And what the screenshot doesn't show is that the responses in Torment typically branched into smaller dialogue trees of their own. From my brief experience playing Dragon Age, I remembered that the conversations always funneled you into a narrow path - if you asked about subject A first, you weren't allowed to ask about subject B and C, even if that NPC was friendly and always willing to help you. The dialogue system in Torment is by no means perfect, but it's a much better facsimile of human interaction than Bioware's dialogue wheel.

It's up to player why is he friendly or douche (role-playing motherfuckers)

There's a lot more to role-playing than just being friendly or a douche, you know. In Torment for instance, there's a lot of discovery and questioning since you're an amnesiac. But let's take a look at that Dragon Age dialogue system you called 'fucking genius', shall we? There's no option to turn him down gently, no option to change the subject, no option to break off the conversation and let him know what you think later, etc. And care to explain how the option to say you're hungry enhances your immersion?

Using Straw man are we? I was explicitly speaking about the mechanic itself, about the idea. The dailogue system has nothing to do with limited CC in DA2. Just look at Alpha Protocol... There's your proof with similiar dialogue wheel and non-linear conversations in the same game.

What does discovery and questioning has to do with players reaction? Thats fucking non sequitur; I can summed up everything under personality types and still ask questions about whatever. No correlation no conflict.

Also, when it comes to the choice, of course those reactions are changed into yes/no options. Both DA2 and AP have those.

 

[Infinitron]

Joined: Sep 1, 2013
Messages: 17

 

[meanwhileInPoland]

Joined: Sep 1, 2013
Messages: 17

so why do we still let people register on codex?bunch of newfags

 

[eremita]

Joined: Sep 1, 2013
Messages: 17

Is that supposed to be an argument? I'm stalking this site for years btw... Not that it matters, being registered to random site where you swear a lot doesn't make you or your opinion more entitled about any subject...

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

Joined: Sep 1, 2013
Messages: 17

Is that supposed to be an argument? I'm stalking this site for years btw... Not that it matters, being registered to random site where you swear a lot doesn't make you or your opinion more entitled about any subject...

I dunno bro...you sound like a complete biodrone. and Alpha Protocol had good CnC despite the popamole dialogue wheel...not because of it. the tones are mostly gimmicky, a non voiced PC is much more conducive to roleplaying... but the wheel is good for popamoles. it forces you to hear the shitty voice acting...not jsut read the dialouges. Cause msot fo the time the dialogue lacks substance.

 

[Roguey]

How the fuck can there be only 3 reactions when the questions are all very specific - i.e. why did you ask Pharod to search for the Bronze Sphere? And what the screenshot doesn't show is that the responses in Torment typically branched into smaller dialogue trees of their own. From my brief experience playing Dragon Age, I remembered that the conversations always funneled you into a narrow path - if you asked about subject A first, you weren't allowed to ask about subject B and C, even if that NPC was friendly and always willing to help you. The dialogue system in Torment is by no means perfect, but it's a much better facsimile of human interaction than Bioware's dialogue wheel.

Recursive dialogue trees are actually a bad thing. NPCs shouldn't be treated as information dispensaries. The majority of those Torment options are TELL ME ABOUT X.

But DA2 still had them too. Under the Investigate option.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

How the fuck can there be only 3 reactions when the questions are all very specific - i.e. why did you ask Pharod to search for the Bronze Sphere? And what the screenshot doesn't show is that the responses in Torment typically branched into smaller dialogue trees of their own. From my brief experience playing Dragon Age, I remembered that the conversations always funneled you into a narrow path - if you asked about subject A first, you weren't allowed to ask about subject B and C, even if that NPC was friendly and always willing to help you. The dialogue system in Torment is by no means perfect, but it's a much better facsimile of human interaction than Bioware's dialogue wheel.

Recursive dialogue trees are actually a bad thing. NPCs shouldn't be treated as information dispensaries. The majority of those Torment options are TELL ME ABOUT X.

But DA2 still had them too. Under the Investigate option.

I disagree, it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way. That's to say, there should be some limit on repeating same questions, after which NPC could get angry or refuse to talk to you.

 

[Roguey]

I disagree, it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way. That's to say, there should be some limit on repeating same questions, after which NPC could get angry or refuse to talk to you.

Human conversation isn't recursive either. "Let's talk about something else" "new topic" works but there are better ways of making dialogue flow like a conversation while hitting all topics of interest.

The big exposition dump with Letho at the end of Witcher 2 was particularly disappointing. They turned what should have been a tense conversation into a plodding, unnatural-sounding info dump.

The "asking a npc to repeat him/herself" problem can be avoided if all conversations are logged. Dragon Age: Origins did this for most recent conversations up to a point, Risen and Divinity 2 did as well.

 

[DalekFlay]

No, they don't. Don't lie. You can tell her to shut the fuck, and refuse to do the mission completely. And, if you do decide to do it, there are multiple ways to deal with it.

I don't believe you, because I fought like hell to find that option.

 

[2house2fly]

I disagree, it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way.

Human conversation also doesn't work like

"Welcome, stranger."
"Good day. I need a powerful wizard to help me in my quest. I was told to ask at this village."
"Aye, stranger. Whoever told you that was surely referring to that accursed Killbad."
"Who is Killbad?"
"He is the evil wizard who plagues our people with nightmares."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"Who do you think killed his daughter?"
"She flaunted her magic, and many of us simple villagers were scared. Belar the blacksmith got drunk and declared that she would kill us all. I worry that he may have done it."
"Where can I find Killbad?"
"He must be near the village to cast his spell. Nobody has tried to find him yet, but I think he is staying in the abandoned fort to the east."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"I need a powerful wizard for my quest. Maybe if I can convince Killbad to come with me he will leave you in peace."
"Perhaps. It is likely the only way you could convince him would be to find his daughter's killer."
"Who do you think killed his daughter?"
"She flaunted her magic, and many of us simple villagers were scared. Belar the blacksmith got drunk and declared that she would kill us all. I worry that he may have done it."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"Where can I find Killbad?"
"He must be near the village to cast his spell. Nobody has tried to find him yet, but I think he is staying in the abandoned fort to the east."
"Who is Killbad?"
"He is the evil wizard who plagues our people with nightmares."
"Show me what you have for sale."
"The best weapons and armour at the most reasonable prices, stranger!"

 

[Volourn]

"I don't believe you, because I fought like hell to find that option."

Bullshit. You can refuse to help her and you get major rival points. You have the option to change your mind, but you are not forced to do the quest. And, when/if you do the quest you can refuse to turn over the mirror/thingameyjg to her. So, shut the fuck uo with your fukkin' bullshitz. It is embarassing to you.

 

[Aeschylus]

No, they don't. Don't lie. You can tell her to shut the fuck, and refuse to do the mission completely. And, if you do decide to do it, there are multiple ways to deal with it.

I don't believe you, because I fought like hell to find that option.

Sorry, Volourn's right, you can kill any mage in your party before the final battles if you side with the templars consistently. I don't know that rivalry is even required.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

I disagree, it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way.

Human conversation also doesn't work like

"Welcome, stranger."
"Good day. I need a powerful wizard to help me in my quest. I was told to ask at this village."
"Aye, stranger. Whoever told you that was surely referring to that accursed Killbad."
"Who is Killbad?"
"He is the evil wizard who plagues our people with nightmares."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"Who do you think killed his daughter?"
"She flaunted her magic, and many of us simple villagers were scared. Belar the blacksmith got drunk and declared that she would kill us all. I worry that he may have done it."
"Where can I find Killbad?"
"He must be near the village to cast his spell. Nobody has tried to find him yet, but I think he is staying in the abandoned fort to the east."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"I need a powerful wizard for my quest. Maybe if I can convince Killbad to come with me he will leave you in peace."
"Perhaps. It is likely the only way you could convince him would be to find his daughter's killer."
"Who do you think killed his daughter?"
"She flaunted her magic, and many of us simple villagers were scared. Belar the blacksmith got drunk and declared that she would kill us all. I worry that he may have done it."
"Why does Killbad plague your people with nightmares?"
"His daughter came to this village, and someone killed her. Nobody knows who, so he punishes us all."
"Where can I find Killbad?"
"He must be near the village to cast his spell. Nobody has tried to find him yet, but I think he is staying in the abandoned fort to the east."
"Who is Killbad?"
"He is the evil wizard who plagues our people with nightmares."
"Show me what you have for sale."
"The best weapons and armour at the most reasonable prices, stranger!"

Oh man. Mate, how long did it take you to make such quality dialogue? Hours? Is this the second, or maybe even third version?

You know - when someone can't write for shit - surprise - his or her dialogues would be shite regardless of the system (be it dialogue wheel or multiple text choices dialogue). Also - using unfunny made up on the spot text as an arguement supporting your point of view is kinda pathetic. You didn't see me ITT posting this picture

as an example why dialogue wheel is bad concept. Same level of arguements, really.

 

[DalekFlay]

No, they don't. Don't lie. You can tell her to shut the fuck, and refuse to do the mission completely. And, if you do decide to do it, there are multiple ways to deal with it.

I don't believe you, because I fought like hell to find that option.

Sorry, Volourn's right, you can kill any mage in your party before the final battles if you side with the templars consistently. I don't know that rivalry is even required.

I'm not talking about the final battle. I am talking about when you meet her, the head elf makes you take her to the summit, she performs blood magic to get past the super door barrier thing, you have three options: 1) awesome, 2) okay then, 3) that was naughty but it's fine.

 

[Volourn]

Oh, you are talking about the first time you meet the Keeper and the Merill. That is part of the Flemeth quest. Iw as referring to Merill's personal quest in part 2 not bring the item Flemeth gave you up the mountain (where you end up meeting Fklemth again).

Also, you don't have to approve of her use of blood magic. You cna tell her that blood magic is not cool but you have to deal with it because it is the only known way to get past the barrier. Duh. SUCK IT UP BOZO.

not everything is supposed to be HAPPY HAPPY RAINBOW AND BUTTERFLIES