Dragon Age: Inquisition Pre-Release Thread

[DalekFlay]

Also, you don't have to approve of her use of blood magic. You cna tell her that blood magic is not cool but you have to deal with it because it is the only known way to get past the barrier. Duh. SUCK IT UP BOZO.

But how does that make sense if I am roleplaying a templar mage control advocate, which is the big story B path in the game? You make a game about the central issue of mage control versus mage freedom and then saddle the PC with a rogue mage sister and blood mage helper. It makes little sense.

 

[Volourn]

You can treat your sister like shit/even turn your back on her and you can anger the blood mage helper to a point she'll turn on you.

Yeah, it be nice if you could MURDER DEATH KILL everyone but that is the way it is.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

Also, you don't have to approve of her use of blood magic. You cna tell her that blood magic is not cool but you have to deal with it because it is the only known way to get past the barrier. Duh. SUCK IT UP BOZO.

But how does that make sense if I am roleplaying a templar mage control advocate, which is the big story B path in the game? You make a game about the central issue of mage control versus mage freedom and then saddle the PC with a rogue mage sister and blood mage helper. It makes little sense.

Eh, Merril wasn't made for you (or me, for that matter). She was made for this people:

They usually don't care about logic, or plot holes, the care about "FEELS". Bioware constantly and with full awareness caters to their tastes, so I doubt that situation would be different with DA:I.

That's to say, not all of their younger fanbase is completely uncritical, and DA2 was so shitty, that even some of new consoletard kids complained.

 

[Volourn]

I should point out I'm no Merrill fan. I have no intention of ever completing her 'romance'. She looks like a teenie and an ugly one at that. *shudder* But, to say there is no C&C involving her is plain bullshit.


As for those quotes above: *double shudder*. ie. That poor husband (wife?) of that first quote. I wonder how it feels to know that your significant other is more in love with a fictional character than she is with you. L0L

 

[Psquit]

Bunch of shit. biotards always pussy out when they have to kill someone in their fantasy sex emulator.

 

[Roguey]

But how does that make sense if I am roleplaying a templar mage control advocate, which is the big story B path in the game? You make a game about the central issue of mage control versus mage freedom and then saddle the PC with a rogue mage sister and blood mage helper. It makes little sense.

You're roleplaying Hawke, who has his/her own ideas even if you choose to go pro-templar/anti-magic. Those ideas include not turning in your sister or killing Merrill on sight.

And though you can call on Merrill at any time she's not really in your party if you never use her. She lives in a house in the Alienage and has her own life.

 

[Lhynn]

I should point out I'm no Merrill fan. I have no intention of ever completing her 'romance'. She looks like a teenie and an ugly one at that. *shudder* But, to say there is no C&C involving her is plain bullshit.
As for those quotes above: *double shudder*. ie. That poor husband (wife?) of that first quote. I wonder how it feels to know that your significant other is more in love with a fictional character than she is with you. L0L

He was stupid enough to marry her in the first place, so w/e.

Merril is a perfectly well written character, shes also boring, uninteresting and made to resonate with bored womens, and mens that fancy them. No one with two braincellls and decent taste gave two shits about her, but thats not the target audience for bioware anymore. They shoulda gone extra animu and given her big tits, thats a personality trait that everyone likes.

 

[DalekFlay]

They should have her come back as a really evil enemy in DA:I and make those people all commit suicide.

 

[2house2fly]

You know - when someone can't write for shit - surprise - his or her dialogues would be shite regardless of the system (be it dialogue wheel or multiple text choices dialogue). Also - using unfunny made up on the spot text as an arguement supporting your point of view is kinda pathetic.

The quality of the dialogue isn't relevant (though what I wrote was actually genuinely epic) the point is that in most RPGs I've played the conversations can go just like that, with you navigating freely through options that have already been explored, your questions and the NPC's response being repeated verbatim, around and around until the end of time if you so choose. You said

it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way.

I just wanted to point out that asking the same question over and over and returning to previous topics also isn't how human conversation works.

 

[Zed]

They should have her come back as a really evil enemy in DA:I and make those people all commit suicide.

it would be x-japan all over again

 

[Ninjerk]

Also, you don't have to approve of her use of blood magic. You cna tell her that blood magic is not cool but you have to deal with it because it is the only known way to get past the barrier. Duh. SUCK IT UP BOZO.

But how does that make sense if I am roleplaying a templar mage control advocate, which is the big story B path in the game? You make a game about the central issue of mage control versus mage freedom and then saddle the PC with a rogue mage sister and blood mage helper. It makes little sense.

Eh, Merril wasn't made for you (or me, for that matter). She was made for this people:

They usually don't care about logic, or plot holes, the care about "FEELS". Bioware constantly and with full awareness caters to their tastes, so I doubt that situation would be different with DA:I.

That's to say, not all of their younger fanbase is completely uncritical, and DA2 was so shitty, that even some of new consoletard kids complained.

Therapist gold mine.

 

[DraQ]

I want all of Geralt's clothes. (TW2 sucks, though)

your fashion sense sucks. (TW2's great, though)

The point is, you don't need so many answers with personality type dialogue system. There is nothing in the whole fucking world that can't be summed up in to either friendly/diplomatic, sarcastic/ironic/humorous or agressive/straightforward answer.

Bullshit.

Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters.

Joined: Sep 1, 2013
Messages: 17

Is that supposed to be an argument? I'm stalking this site for years btw...

False.

If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question.

Not that it matters, being registered to random site where you swear a lot doesn't make you or your opinion more entitled about any subject...

I disagree, it's really downright stupid when you can't ask a NPC same question two times, or return to previous topic. Human conversation doesn't work this way. That's to say, there should be some limit on repeating same questions, after which NPC could get angry or refuse to talk to you.

Human conversation isn't recursive either. "Let's talk about something else" "new topic" works but there are better ways of making dialogue flow like a conversation while hitting all topics of interest.

That's why dialogue trees are absolutely rotten way of doing freeform conversation (asking a lot of general questions about a lot of specific stuff) - that's where topic system shines.
Trees, however, are pretty damn good for managing a conversation going in definite direction that nevertheless allows you to affect its flow.

Tools for the job, people, tools for the job.

The "asking a npc to repeat him/herself" problem can be avoided if all conversations are logged. Dragon Age: Origins did this for most recent conversations up to a point, Risen and Divinity 2 did as well.

You can also augment it by vanishing questions you don't want to be re-asked (on per NPC basis) or by making them react differently to repeated querries.
You can make NPC end conversation and possibly get pissed if you ask too many - or wrong - questions, etc.

 

[eremita]

"Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters."

What you say defines who you are for others. Because... you know... people use words... well, you know - to understand each other. It depends on your PERSONALITY TYPE/ATTITUDE what exactly are you trying to express through WORDS (Well, unless you're hoping for some sick game where you're supposed to be a mean fuck who tortures himself with telling kind words...).


"If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question."



Nope, It's the truth.

 

[Lhynn]

"Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters."

What you say defines who you are for others. Because... you know... people use words... well, you know - to understand each other. It depends on your PERSONALITY TYPE/ATTITUDE what exactly are you trying to express through WORDS (Well, unless you're hoping for some sick game where you're supposed to be a mean fuck who tortures himself with telling kind words...).


"If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question."



Nope, It's the truth.

Kinda like i can tell you are a fucking idiot just by reading your bullshit?

Dialogues dont decide who you are, not really. you can be an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit. you can just be a liar, or you can be a tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words. And all that cant be realistically represented with just dialogue alone.

Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2.

What would have given you a "personality" would have been selecting 1 personality out of 3 and playing the whole game with the predetermined answers for that particular choice. There are other (better) ways, but well, i dont want to write a wall of text.

 

[tuluse]

Asking which dialog mechanic most closely represents how real people talk is the wrong question to ask.

 

[DraQ]

""

Nope, It's the truth.

You meant "r00fles!".

Spoiler

Never knew Volourn was a potato.

Spoiler

 

[eremita]

"Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters."

What you say defines who you are for others. Because... you know... people use words... well, you know - to understand each other. It depends on your PERSONALITY TYPE/ATTITUDE what exactly are you trying to express through WORDS (Well, unless you're hoping for some sick game where you're supposed to be a mean fuck who tortures himself with telling kind words...).


"If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question."



Nope, It's the truth.

Kinda like i can tell you are a fucking idiot just by reading your bullshit?

Dialogues dont decide who you are, not really. you can be an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit. you can just be a liar, or you can be a tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words. And all that cant be realistically represented with just dialogue alone.

Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2.

What would have given you a "personality" would have been selecting 1 personality out of 3 and playing the whole game with the predetermined answers for that particular choice. There are other (better) ways, but well, i dont want to write a wall of text.

Yeah, nice fantasy man, show me some game where "an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit"... I have never seen this done in a complex way (and I played pretty much every RPG worth my time). All you've got is usually some lie/stab in the back option in the beginning/ending of dialogue/quest. And it is not a problem to put these lie/yes/no etc. options in attitude dialogue system...

Also, are you fucking retarted? Haven't you read the previous posts? Again, attitude type can solve your "tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words" problem, because you can hide everything under it. As I was saying, It's up to the player why is he acting like a tough guy (being prick/being white knight with trust problems etc.), but that has nothing to do with NPCs reactions. NPC (in the regard of fucking quest) can't possibly know why you're aggresive/straightforward so he/she will always be responding to that particular attitude - that is much more real. So there's no conflict to your role-play.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

So Pretty princess can quote. Or at least his alt can.

 

[Volourn]

"Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2."

Bullshit. DA2 espicially gave you a personality. Don't fukkin' lie. It did so much that if you selected the same type of response repeatedly it would lead to Hawke speaking a certain way more often than not. Why do you lie?


"So Pretty princess can quote. Or at least his alt can."
Fuck off, you piece of shit.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

"Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters."

What you say defines who you are for others. Because... you know... people use words... well, you know - to understand each other. It depends on your PERSONALITY TYPE/ATTITUDE what exactly are you trying to express through WORDS (Well, unless you're hoping for some sick game where you're supposed to be a mean fuck who tortures himself with telling kind words...).


"If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question."



Nope, It's the truth.

Kinda like i can tell you are a fucking idiot just by reading your bullshit?

Dialogues dont decide who you are, not really. you can be an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit. you can just be a liar, or you can be a tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words. And all that cant be realistically represented with just dialogue alone.

Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2.

What would have given you a "personality" would have been selecting 1 personality out of 3 and playing the whole game with the predetermined answers for that particular choice. There are other (better) ways, but well, i dont want to write a wall of text.

Yeah, nice fantasy man, show me some game where "an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit"... I have never seen this done in a complex way (and I played pretty much every RPG worth my time). All you've got is usually some lie/stab in the back option in the beginning/ending of dialogue/quest. And it is not a problem to put these lie/yes/no etc. options in attitude dialogue system...

Also, are you fucking retarted? Haven't you read the previous posts? Again, attitude type can solve your "tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words" problem, because you can hide everything under it. As I was saying, It's up to the player why is he acting like a tough guy (being prick/being white knight with trust problems etc.), but that has nothing to do with NPCs reactions. NPC (in the regard of fucking quest) can't possibly know why you're aggresive/straightforward so he/she will always be responding to that particular attitude - that is much more real. So there's no conflict to your role-play.

 

[Lhynn]

"Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2."

Bullshit. DA2 especially gave you a personality. Don't fukkin' lie. It did so much that if you selected the same type of response repeatedly it would lead to Hawke speaking a certain way more often than not. Why do you lie?

Could you be more of a whinny little bitch?

anyway, a personality? that must be a fucking joke. describe the personality of the little cunt you played. tell me, was he of quick temper? modest? was he kind? soft hearted? did he value life? was he an idealist?
was he patient? did he take charge? do things his own way? was he a loner?

Merril had a personality, bland, boring and stupid, but a personality, you could guess what she would think of X or Y issue.

My character on shadowrun returns had a personality, he was a professional with a soft spot for his friends and family. and the game offered me a chance to play it as i saw fit. that is how its done, you couldnt play as anything you liked, but you had a chance to show a wide array of personality traits and form a somewhat interesting persona.

Hawke? apart from being a mass murderer hermit that lives in a cave and has a huge boner for quest markers. you could basically play him as a goodboy, a prick or a cunt, thats his whole array.

 

[Stainless Veteran]

"Dialogue trees aren't for deciding who you are (they might, but indirectly and it isn't their primary purpose). They are for deciding what you say when that matters."

What you say defines who you are for others. Because... you know... people use words... well, you know - to understand each other. It depends on your PERSONALITY TYPE/ATTITUDE what exactly are you trying to express through WORDS (Well, unless you're hoping for some sick game where you're supposed to be a mean fuck who tortures himself with telling kind words...).


"If you had, you wouldn't have asked that question."



Nope, It's the truth.

Kinda like i can tell you are a fucking idiot just by reading your bullshit?

Dialogues dont decide who you are, not really. you can be an evil motherfucker that just masks himself as a good guy, waiting for the trust to grow and the time to strike for maximum profit. you can just be a liar, or you can be a tough good guy that speaks with actions and not words. And all that cant be realistically represented with just dialogue alone.

Dragon age never gave you a personality, it gave you a stance on a matter amongst several, but you were always the same prick, especially on dragon age 2.

What would have given you a "personality" would have been selecting 1 personality out of 3 and playing the whole game with the predetermined answers for that particular choice. There are other (better) ways, but well, i dont want to write a wall of text.

Well, they've tried to give Hawke fixed personality, just like Shepard. Problem is, they failed. Mass Effect had its share of retarded dialogues, but some lines were quite amusing, or even good (in a pulpy way, but still). Jennifer Hale's acting really helped. While in DA2 we got medicore (somtimes) and bad (usually) writing, and the people who made seriously considered this a valid personality:

I mean, their "sarcastic" dialogue didn't have an ounce of sarcasm, and often was downright sociopathic. Two others were even more bland, as in "DURR HURR I SMASH THINGS!11" and "WHY DOESN'T ANYONE CARE ABOUT WORLD PEACE!1". And there was serious disconnect between dialog lines when you've, for example, fist picked sarcastic option, and then peaceful. Oh, and VA sucked.

tl;dr: Bioware tried to make pulpy personality like Shepard, but ended up with moronic one-dimensional stereotype.

 

[Volourn]

"anyway, a personality? that must be a fucking joke. describe the personality of the little cunt you played. tell me, was he of quick temper? modest? was he kind? soft hearted? did he value life? was he an idealist?
was he patient? did he take charge? do things his own way? was he a loner?"

Are you an idiot? My hawke had a personality. So did yours. Seriously, why are so retarted?


"My character on shadowrun returns had a personality, he was a professional with a soft spot for his friends and family. and the game offered me a chance to play it as i saw fit. that is how its done, you couldnt play as anything you liked, but you had a chance to show a wide array of personality traits and form a somewhat interesting persona.""

Bullshit.


"Hawke? apart from being a mass murderer hermit that lives in a cave and has a huge boner for quest markers. you could basically play him as a goodboy, a prick or a cunt, thats his whole array."

Double bullshitz.

 

[Lhynn]

I keep forgetting that i shouldnt feed the trolls

 

[DalekFlay]

I keep forgetting that i shouldnt feed the trolls

Especially the borderline retarded ones.