I think I understand a bit better, but still am a bit confused about some stuff. The game doesn't seem to give an indicator as to which classes are considered basic, but from the Gothic wiki, it seems to be: Fighter, Mage, Cleric, Thief, Alchemist, Servant.
I guess with that in mind - are Fighters not really worth keeping long-term, do you usually class change them to one of the advanced classes? I rolled a Samurai initially because I just happened to get a roll in the 20s very quickly on a character. But if you class change a Fighter into a Samurai, the only real added benefit would be the HP gained while as a Fighter, right? (which I guess would probably be pretty big) But the newly created Samurai will still level just as slowly as he would originally? Or is it sort of expected that you'll class change multiple times in order to build up a bigger HP pool quicker?
Also, for something like a Lord or Valkyrie, could you learn the Cleric spells first on a Cleric, and then change to one of those two, and retain all the spells? (is this what is meant by the spell retention only working for classes that learn that spell type?) Could you go from say, a Cleric to a Fighter, and then be a Fighter with Cleric spells? (but you'd have less casts of the Cleric spells, right?)
For the Thief, since it seems like you ultimately want to end up with one as sort of the final class of a character, would it be better to change a different character into one later, after you've learned whatever spells, rather than creating one outright? (because it doesn't seem like changing from Thief into anything would really be beneficial?) But it also seems like you always want a Thief, for traps, so would you have to still carry one around in the meantime?
Sorry for the questions all over the place, I appreciate the responses.
No worries - these are not necessarily obvious things but the stuff that makes the game interesting.
Question about Class Ranks and what does it all mean?
In terms of class rank, it is not described in the game but the fans have generally used the following denominations based upon the experience needed to reach levels (ie. basic classes need less experience to reach each level and hence level faster):
Basic: Fighter, Mage, Cleric, Thief, Alchemist, Servant
Intermediate: Bishop, Hunter, Brawler, Bard, Shaman, Summoner, Valkyrie
Advanced: Lord, Samurai, Ninja.
You should also note that some races (Faeries, Dragonnewts and werebeasts) also need more experience per level (meaning they level slower).
What are fighters for and should you class change them?
It is true to say that fighters do not add much apart from than HP to switching to other classes. However, there are reasons for not wanting to change class:
(1) Whilst they Fighters level fast because of the above bit and they end up with the highest raw damage (that also makes it a useful class to potentially do a final class change into after acquiring some useful utility spells); and
(2) All Elminage games throw in items called "Innocent" gear which is amongst the best gear in the game, and it can only be worn by characters that haven't class changed.
I actually always tend to run with at least one fighter - it is boring the scheme of things, but then by mid game regardless of what you have done with others you still always have a dependable fighter.
With respect to changing from a fighter to a Samurai, yes they will still level at the same rate as before with only maybe some extra HP - changing class is really cosmetic in that instance. It is better to make a Samurai out of a Mage (to get the spells faster) or out of another spell casting class.. which leads to
Retention of Spells between class changing
For a Lord or a Valkyrie, can you first learn all the spells as a Cleric and retain them when you change to a Lord / Valkyrie? Yes that is correct. Just remember though that Clerics can only be Good / Evil initially, so if you want to create a Valkyrie (which is Neutral only) you will need to find a way to effect that. The other thing to remember is that you don't get the healing scaling bonus with a Lord or a Valkyrie (same with a mage going to a Samurai or Bard/Entertainer). A Bishop though retains some of the scaling. I know Aweigh has argued at the end game / post game there is a really decent argument for a Cleric in the party, just because the scaled healing is that much more useful.
You can go from a cleric to a fighter but in that instance you only a max of 3 spell mana per level that you have learnt (so for example if you got to a point as a cleric where you could cast 8 level 1 spells, when you swap over you will only be able to cast 3 level 1 spells. The one exception is going from an Alchemist to a Hunter; in that instance for some bizarre reason you retain the same number despite the fact that Hunters don't learn Alchemist spells.
Thief Class Changing
Yes there are really no benefits from changing from a thief to another class. And yes there are benefits in turning a spellcaster into a thief so that they have access to utility spells.
I tend to have a thief that I start with, and I create a thief from a spellcaster as well later down the track. In Elminage Original the best weapons are generally monster weapons that you will want to steal, so having a thief all the time is good, although troublesome. In Elminage Gothic this is not the case, and in that one I tend to just to use a series of characters that can use the alchemist spells to detect / remove traps and unlock.
Hope that helps? Also if any of the real Elminage nerds want to give better advice, please do (I know there are others who know this game way better than I do out there).