Zuikov said:Everything is well designed
F1 got the annoying timed mainquest
You mentioned Tandi's father already so I'll just mention the "doctor" of Shady Sands and the poor farmer to whom you could teach farming. Killian and Gizmo in Junktown have shitton of character and the gang-members ain't bad either - the psycho, the delusional charming leader, the little kid who just wants to belong. Then you have Doc Morbid and his clever plan of revenue, great talk there - and finally the bar keeper with his sad tale. Oh and the love birds - the tavern wench and her sweetheart, the boxing champion whom you can challenge. Necropolis is bit poor, the leader of the resistance does not have many lines. Seth, otoh, has quite a few good ones illustrating his sick mind "everyone is a tool for me" and the super mutants had a few good ones as well. And that's without Hub and LA remains (Adytown, Library, Gun Runners etc) or the super computer in Glow or the various people with BoS.Start with non-sidekick NPC
Yeah, adventurous Ian, frontier-lawman Tycho, Dogmeat and sassy Katja. It wasn't supposed to be a party game to begin with so they did pretty good, considering.Sidekicks?
Except you aren't a scion of great family, you are just a random shmuck whom the Overseer convinced to go. Heck, the opening scene reveals the fate of the previous guy. The timed quest wasn't an annoyance at all, it was a great feature which ensured that the player was always on his toes. It wasn't too strict - 150 days was plenty enough to visit all the cities and find the chip plus you could buy more time from Water Merchants if it was getting close. Furthermore, the second part didn't have a timelimit (I don't consider the 500 day Mutant Army timer a real limit, as 500 days is, again, more than enough to completely explore the wasteland) - and even that was removed in the official patch.Story?
Zuikov said:Konjad said:RP while not perfect adds some good things to FO2. Anyway I never finished FO2, I have to do it finally. Shit, why do I end playing FO2 every time after less than 15hrs? :\ I'm in decline. I completed FO1 in one looong session (with breaks for sleep) yet I can't play Fo2
That's because FO1 is 10 times better game than FO2. Vince at Irontowerstudio forums explained it well:
Fallout 1 is a well focused game. It's perfect. Everything is well designed, well thought-through, makes sense, and fits the theme and the setting. The Master, the "villain" of the game, isn't really a villain (he thought that he was doing the right thing), which is why it's possible to defeat him without a fight.
Fallout 2 is a "mix of everything" game. It's a game designed by a bunch of 13-year olds following the unbeatable "won't it be cool if the game had...." principle. It has huge gangsters with tommy guns running casinos, it has yakuza with samurai swords, it has so many weapons that you can switch to a new gun every 5 min, it has more lulz than the Codex, it has a king-fu fighting town, it has scientologists with celebrities, it has tribals, aliens, drug dealers, talking deathclaws, and even real GHOSTS. The game's a joke.
The main villain is a stereotypical "I kill everyone for the lulz" villain who looks like a giant robot. (the 13 year olds strike again!) You can't reason with him. The only way to beat the game is to fight him.
Overall, I feel that FO2 locations, NPCs, and quests are clearly inferior to FO1. While FO2 is better than most games (mostly due to being a sequel to a great game), it failed to deliver the quality of the original.
Fowyr said:You can't play F1.
You can't play any M&M except M&M8. I see a pattern.
In this particular case it will be very unkind. Senility? Maybe. Madness? Absolutely yes, but mental retardation can't hold over me yet. Call me Prophet, call me Devourer of Lesser Souls, call me Holder of the Vast and Useless Knowledge, call me Hoarder of Morale Obsolete Things, call me Crazy Man in the Old Mansion, but don't compare me with morons, imbeciles and idiots in medical sense of word.laclongquan said:What a load of nonsense, sir. Your statement fail logically and factually in every particular. Indeed, one can use that as a proof of your advanced senility as a charitably interpretation. An unkind observator may use that to accuse you, sir, of imbecility.
*lights a pipe*laclongquan said:*tap his nose*
Might I remind me the audience that the two series above Fallout and Might and Magic got newer titles than Fallout2 and MM8 Days of the Destroyer.
Unless they changed it all you gotta do is talk to the kid just outside the orphanage. Wall of text, yes I'll help you, then go talk to mom.Admiral jimbob said:Couldn't find the trigger in the Den for the orphanage quest, though, any pointers?
Vaarna_Aarne said:I like FO1 and FO2 in equal measure, with advantage going to the one currently in fresher memory.
Konjad said:RP while not perfect adds some good things to FO2. Anyway I never finished FO2, I have to do it finally. Shit, why do I end playing FO2 every time after less than 15hrs? :\ I'm in decline. I completed FO1 in one looong session (with breaks for sleep) yet I can't play Fo2
That's because FO1 is 10 times better game than FO2. Vince at Irontowerstudio forums explained it well:
Fallout 1 is a well focused game. It's perfect. Everything is well designed, well thought-through, makes sense, and fits the theme and the setting. The Master, the "villain" of the game, isn't really a villain (he thought that he was doing the right thing), which is why it's possible to defeat him without a fight.
Fallout 2 is a "mix of everything" game. It's a game designed by a bunch of 13-year olds following the unbeatable "won't it be cool if the game had...." principle. It has huge gangsters with tommy guns running casinos, it has yakuza with samurai swords, it has so many weapons that you can switch to a new gun every 5 min, it has more lulz than the Codex, it has a king-fu fighting town, it has scientologists with celebrities, it has tribals, aliens, drug dealers, talking deathclaws, and even real GHOSTS. The game's a joke.
The main villain is a stereotypical "I kill everyone for the lulz" villain who looks like a giant robot. (the 13 year olds strike again!) You can't reason with him. The only way to beat the game is to fight him.
Overall, I feel that FO2 locations, NPCs, and quests are clearly inferior to FO1. While FO2 is better than most games (mostly due to being a sequel to a great game), it failed to deliver the quality of the original.
I just started a playthrough two days ago with the old version.Apparently someone is still updating Fallout 2:
https://forums.bgforge.net/viewtopic.php?f=34&p=531
Fallout 2 Unofficial Patch, updated:
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/Fallout2_Unofficial_Patch
Version 12
Version 10
- Fixed custom ddraw.ini configuration.
- Removed old workarounds for 'too many items'.
- Install script now removes itself after installation.
- Sfall updated to 4.2.2.
Version 9
- General:
- Fixed crash when trying to talk to Pariah dog (introduced in v9).
- Arroyo:
- Fixed crash when talking to Hakunin with low karma.
Version 8
- General:
- Added missing siptbox2 script.
- Standartized 'deathclaw' spelling.
- Various under the hood changes: better debug, code cleanup, switched to gcc for preprocessing, removed unused d3d dlls.
- Added patchinf script, now UP version is visible in-game, like RP.
- Den:
- Fixed "Error" in Tubby's dialog.
- Modoc:
- Disabled stuck Modoc shitty death narration (not intended to work in UP).
- NCR:
- Fixed fadein/out in Vortis' dialog.
- Enclave:
- Fixed final slideshow not playing.
- Vault City:
- Fixed Cassidy stage 0 armor bonus.
Version 7
- General:
- Fixed party proto issue introduced in v7.
- Modoc:
- Reverted Jonny's dialog faulty fix.
Version 4
- General:
- Changed localizations to use proper language name from fallout2.cfg.
- Enabled AIBestWeaponFix, AIDrugUsePerfFix and StartGDialogFix in sfall.
- Uncensor: "chem" > "drug", "habit-forming" > "addictive".
- Deleted files that were identical to their master.dat versions.
- Fixed music path correction in the installer.
- Arroyo:
- Fixed Cameron not giving a second chance at training as promised.
- Den:
- Made Anna's ghost invulnerable, also disabled stealing.
Added missing scripts.lst.
Version 3
Version 2
- Created a complete package.
- Added localizations.
Repacked into .dat file.
Version 1
- General
- Fixed Laddie being counted as a "strange" party member instead of K-9.
- Added scr_return() for all scripts attached items in OBJ_DUDE, to prevent an issue that when you used a remove-after-use item, using other items without closing the inventory will make them being removed as well, even if they shouldn't be.
- Fixed Sierra Mission Holodisk and Broadcast Holodisk setting each other's GVAR.
- Fixed Vic not being counted as one of human/male party members in various scripts.
- More foolproof hintbook (from RP).
- Implemented Karma Beacon and Cult of Personality for general reactions.
- Fixed discrepancy in addressing player (you/name) when using Traps skill on various doors.
- Robobrain now has intelligence 10, combat armor stats but 0% EMP resistance on all stages.
- Various under the hood changes, optimizations and cleanups.
- Corrected a plethora of typos.
- Getting weapon upgrades won't reload them with free ammo anymore.
- Spelling standartization
- Stockman's Association (instead of Stockmen's).
- Auto-Doc.
- Pip-Boy.
- Jet, jethead.
- Robobrain.
- RobCo.
- BeatCo.
- Arroyo
- Mynoc actually has a sharpened spear now.
- Broken Hills
- If Francis leaves before wrestling with him, that quest will be crossed out.
- Dead professor will no longer show floats when clicking on the scorpion.
- When caught stealing from the scorpion, it will just hiss instead of using human floats.
- Den
- Fixed Billy's response when asking for a second chance at sex.
- Sex with Karl advances time.
- Metgzer now has money in his inventory after Vic is bought from him.
- Enclave
- Ensured that blast doors always get locked in the final fight. If Granite has joined the player, the door between him and Frank will remain open.
- Military base Mariposa
- Moved unreachable boxes on the first and second level to be reachable.
- Modoc
- Jonnny won't speak to the player until he sees Laddie. (Ensuring that talking to him before starting the quest won't break it.)
- PC will get up after the methane explosion.
- Bess and Laddie are no longer counted as party members.
- NCR
- Fixed a dumb character being prematurely thrown out of dialog when talking to Doc Jubilee about Vault 13 and then asking about "Mother Lode?".
- Added fadein/out when Vortis escorts PC out.
- Hoss should be more eager to give up.
- Moved a table in Dusty's cantina to be accessible.
- New Reno
- Fixed wielding four new bladed weapons not being counted as wielding a knife when talking to Little Jesus.
- Changed the team of slaves in the Stables to TEAM_RND_SLAVE.
- Inhaling Jet with Angela will correctly apply all Jet effects, including possible addiction.
- Miss Kitty will correctly apply bonuses on PC and companions.
- "Oral" in Cat's Paw does count as sex.
- Fixed boxers being unable to use hook punches.
- Lloyd's body won't disappear after reloading.
- Fixed Salvatore's guards walking out prematurely when watching the transaction the second time.
- Vault 15
- The enemies have their weapons equipped now.
- Vault City
- Fixed Skeev not returning back to his post after sending dumb character to the servant allocation center.
- Seeing Phyllis advances time.
- Redding
- Bartender in Last Gasp will ask for the correct amount of money, get the correct amount and get PC/party actually drunk.
- Sierra Army Base
- When punching bags, don't show exact bonus. Actual behaviour isn't changed (tagged skill gets +4, untagged +5).
- Fixed organ extraction room:
- Everyone in the room gets killed (including Sierra defence bots if any).
- Humans yield normal brain, mutants/ghouls/deathclaws/dogs - abnormal, all the rest - none.
- Karma penalty applies for anyone but Sierra defence bots.
Fallout 2 Restoration Project, updated:
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/Fallout2_Restoration_Project
Version 12
Version 11
- Fixed incorrect WorldMapSlots placement in ddraw.ini.
- Fixed re-stocking Red 888 Guns (introduced in v11).
- Fixed rpu-install.command being left out on cleanup.
Version 10
- Fixed custom ddraw.ini configuration.
- Removed old workarounds for 'too many items'.
- Moved more ini files into mods directory.
Version 9
- General
- Disabled AIBestWeaponFix by default, as it's not much of a fix.
- Fixed Goris de-robing script so that it'll actually enable UseFileSystemOverride when necessary.
- Fixed sound path correction in the installation script.
- Added a .command installation script for Mac OSX users.
- Arroyo
- Plant/corn from EPA seeds gets placed on the correct elevation now.
- Den
- The drug dealer and his bodyguard now receive/equip their weapons at the first time the player enters the Den Residential map.
- EPA
- Planted seed will now properly grow in the green level.
- San Francisco
- Fixed bug with being unable to disable force field to Shi emperor.
- Added previously missing UP fixes:
- AHS-7 will properly turn hostile upon pickpocket.
- Emperor force field is disabled with Repair, not Science.
- Blowing up Emperor field emitter will set Shi hostile.
- Badger will stock Bozar and G11E.
- Badger will keep re-stocking after 7 years.
Version 8
- General
- Allowed all Kaga versions to be knocked down, for consistency.
- Added Party Orders to release package.
- Added missing "being hit" animation for Sulik in leather armor.
- Fixed rifle animations preventing NPCs from equiping those rifles.
- Fixed Kitsune being unable to equip weapons and not showing armor.
- Den
- Fixed missing orphan floats.
- EPA
- Fixed Depressed Mr. Handy causing slowdowns.
- Modoc
- Fixed being unable to resque Jonny if talked to him before starting the quest.
- Fixed shitty death narration being stuck.
Added missing item highlight and party control mods.
Version 7
Version 6
- Enabled some QoL features in sfall: DontTurnOffSneakIfYouRun, NumbersInDialogue, WorldMapFontPatch, PartyMemberExtraInfo.
- Removed files identical to their master.dat versions.
- Removed duplicate files from animations components.
- Fixed Russian character descriptions being shown when using English language.
- Fixed several worldmap markers being shown in Russian when using English language.
Version 5
- Added npc armor frms and hopefully the last missing files from 2.3.3 auto installer.
- Fixed npc armor and ammo mod script installation on unixes.
Fixed more packaging artefacts.
Version 4
Added missing scripts.lst.
Version 3
Version 2
- Created a complete package.
- Added localizations.
- Converted some options from install time into separate dat packages and/or ini settings.
Repacked into .dat file.
Version 1
- General
- Damage formula no longer erroneously defaults to YAAM.
- Various under the hood changes and optimizations.
- Abbey
- Computer desk in SW map corner gives a message when used.
- Both deatchclaws have correct scripts now.
- Fixed brother Paul not giving access to computers if the beast was killed, but the book wasn't retrieved.
- Broken Hills
- Allowed to use lockpicks in Chad's quest.
- Den
- Fixed dealer's bodyguard description.
- Deleted 0-stack ammo pack from Metzger's desk.
- Bobby's floats tweaked to reflect he's packing things.
- Enclave
- Fixed RP NPC suffering no damage in the puzzle room.
- Fixed vertibird pad area being immune to meltdown countdown and FEV poisoning.
- Klamath
- Fixed Duntons offering the job on the pastures, then telling the PC off. Also, fixed CoP check in their script.
- Gecko
- Lenny: moved ammo from hands to inventory.
- Hubologists' stash
- Added proper messages for using skills and items on the top door.
I tested them for a few hours today, no issues so far.
same but finishedI just started a playthrough two days ago with the old version.Apparently someone is still updating Fallout 2:
https://forums.bgforge.net/viewtopic.php?f=34&p=531
Fallout 2 Unofficial Patch, updated:
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/Fallout2_Unofficial_Patch
Version 12
Version 10
- Fixed custom ddraw.ini configuration.
- Removed old workarounds for 'too many items'.
- Install script now removes itself after installation.
- Sfall updated to 4.2.2.
Version 9
- General:
- Fixed crash when trying to talk to Pariah dog (introduced in v9).
- Arroyo:
- Fixed crash when talking to Hakunin with low karma.
Version 8
- General:
- Added missing siptbox2 script.
- Standartized 'deathclaw' spelling.
- Various under the hood changes: better debug, code cleanup, switched to gcc for preprocessing, removed unused d3d dlls.
- Added patchinf script, now UP version is visible in-game, like RP.
- Den:
- Fixed "Error" in Tubby's dialog.
- Modoc:
- Disabled stuck Modoc shitty death narration (not intended to work in UP).
- NCR:
- Fixed fadein/out in Vortis' dialog.
- Enclave:
- Fixed final slideshow not playing.
- Vault City:
- Fixed Cassidy stage 0 armor bonus.
Version 7
- General:
- Fixed party proto issue introduced in v7.
- Modoc:
- Reverted Jonny's dialog faulty fix.
Version 4
- General:
- Changed localizations to use proper language name from fallout2.cfg.
- Enabled AIBestWeaponFix, AIDrugUsePerfFix and StartGDialogFix in sfall.
- Uncensor: "chem" > "drug", "habit-forming" > "addictive".
- Deleted files that were identical to their master.dat versions.
- Fixed music path correction in the installer.
- Arroyo:
- Fixed Cameron not giving a second chance at training as promised.
- Den:
- Made Anna's ghost invulnerable, also disabled stealing.
Added missing scripts.lst.
Version 3
Version 2
- Created a complete package.
- Added localizations.
Repacked into .dat file.
Version 1
- General
- Fixed Laddie being counted as a "strange" party member instead of K-9.
- Added scr_return() for all scripts attached items in OBJ_DUDE, to prevent an issue that when you used a remove-after-use item, using other items without closing the inventory will make them being removed as well, even if they shouldn't be.
- Fixed Sierra Mission Holodisk and Broadcast Holodisk setting each other's GVAR.
- Fixed Vic not being counted as one of human/male party members in various scripts.
- More foolproof hintbook (from RP).
- Implemented Karma Beacon and Cult of Personality for general reactions.
- Fixed discrepancy in addressing player (you/name) when using Traps skill on various doors.
- Robobrain now has intelligence 10, combat armor stats but 0% EMP resistance on all stages.
- Various under the hood changes, optimizations and cleanups.
- Corrected a plethora of typos.
- Getting weapon upgrades won't reload them with free ammo anymore.
- Spelling standartization
- Stockman's Association (instead of Stockmen's).
- Auto-Doc.
- Pip-Boy.
- Jet, jethead.
- Robobrain.
- RobCo.
- BeatCo.
- Arroyo
- Mynoc actually has a sharpened spear now.
- Broken Hills
- If Francis leaves before wrestling with him, that quest will be crossed out.
- Dead professor will no longer show floats when clicking on the scorpion.
- When caught stealing from the scorpion, it will just hiss instead of using human floats.
- Den
- Fixed Billy's response when asking for a second chance at sex.
- Sex with Karl advances time.
- Metgzer now has money in his inventory after Vic is bought from him.
- Enclave
- Ensured that blast doors always get locked in the final fight. If Granite has joined the player, the door between him and Frank will remain open.
- Military base Mariposa
- Moved unreachable boxes on the first and second level to be reachable.
- Modoc
- Jonnny won't speak to the player until he sees Laddie. (Ensuring that talking to him before starting the quest won't break it.)
- PC will get up after the methane explosion.
- Bess and Laddie are no longer counted as party members.
- NCR
- Fixed a dumb character being prematurely thrown out of dialog when talking to Doc Jubilee about Vault 13 and then asking about "Mother Lode?".
- Added fadein/out when Vortis escorts PC out.
- Hoss should be more eager to give up.
- Moved a table in Dusty's cantina to be accessible.
- New Reno
- Fixed wielding four new bladed weapons not being counted as wielding a knife when talking to Little Jesus.
- Changed the team of slaves in the Stables to TEAM_RND_SLAVE.
- Inhaling Jet with Angela will correctly apply all Jet effects, including possible addiction.
- Miss Kitty will correctly apply bonuses on PC and companions.
- "Oral" in Cat's Paw does count as sex.
- Fixed boxers being unable to use hook punches.
- Lloyd's body won't disappear after reloading.
- Fixed Salvatore's guards walking out prematurely when watching the transaction the second time.
- Vault 15
- The enemies have their weapons equipped now.
- Vault City
- Fixed Skeev not returning back to his post after sending dumb character to the servant allocation center.
- Seeing Phyllis advances time.
- Redding
- Bartender in Last Gasp will ask for the correct amount of money, get the correct amount and get PC/party actually drunk.
- Sierra Army Base
- When punching bags, don't show exact bonus. Actual behaviour isn't changed (tagged skill gets +4, untagged +5).
- Fixed organ extraction room:
- Everyone in the room gets killed (including Sierra defence bots if any).
- Humans yield normal brain, mutants/ghouls/deathclaws/dogs - abnormal, all the rest - none.
- Karma penalty applies for anyone but Sierra defence bots.
Fallout 2 Restoration Project, updated:
https://github.com/BGforgeNet/Fallout2_Restoration_Project
Version 12
Version 11
- Fixed incorrect WorldMapSlots placement in ddraw.ini.
- Fixed re-stocking Red 888 Guns (introduced in v11).
- Fixed rpu-install.command being left out on cleanup.
Version 10
- Fixed custom ddraw.ini configuration.
- Removed old workarounds for 'too many items'.
- Moved more ini files into mods directory.
Version 9
- General
- Disabled AIBestWeaponFix by default, as it's not much of a fix.
- Fixed Goris de-robing script so that it'll actually enable UseFileSystemOverride when necessary.
- Fixed sound path correction in the installation script.
- Added a .command installation script for Mac OSX users.
- Arroyo
- Plant/corn from EPA seeds gets placed on the correct elevation now.
- Den
- The drug dealer and his bodyguard now receive/equip their weapons at the first time the player enters the Den Residential map.
- EPA
- Planted seed will now properly grow in the green level.
- San Francisco
- Fixed bug with being unable to disable force field to Shi emperor.
- Added previously missing UP fixes:
- AHS-7 will properly turn hostile upon pickpocket.
- Emperor force field is disabled with Repair, not Science.
- Blowing up Emperor field emitter will set Shi hostile.
- Badger will stock Bozar and G11E.
- Badger will keep re-stocking after 7 years.
Version 8
- General
- Allowed all Kaga versions to be knocked down, for consistency.
- Added Party Orders to release package.
- Added missing "being hit" animation for Sulik in leather armor.
- Fixed rifle animations preventing NPCs from equiping those rifles.
- Fixed Kitsune being unable to equip weapons and not showing armor.
- Den
- Fixed missing orphan floats.
- EPA
- Fixed Depressed Mr. Handy causing slowdowns.
- Modoc
- Fixed being unable to resque Jonny if talked to him before starting the quest.
- Fixed shitty death narration being stuck.
Added missing item highlight and party control mods.
Version 7
Version 6
- Enabled some QoL features in sfall: DontTurnOffSneakIfYouRun, NumbersInDialogue, WorldMapFontPatch, PartyMemberExtraInfo.
- Removed files identical to their master.dat versions.
- Removed duplicate files from animations components.
- Fixed Russian character descriptions being shown when using English language.
- Fixed several worldmap markers being shown in Russian when using English language.
Version 5
- Added npc armor frms and hopefully the last missing files from 2.3.3 auto installer.
- Fixed npc armor and ammo mod script installation on unixes.
Fixed more packaging artefacts.
Version 4
Added missing scripts.lst.
Version 3
Version 2
- Created a complete package.
- Added localizations.
- Converted some options from install time into separate dat packages and/or ini settings.
Repacked into .dat file.
Version 1
- General
- Damage formula no longer erroneously defaults to YAAM.
- Various under the hood changes and optimizations.
- Abbey
- Computer desk in SW map corner gives a message when used.
- Both deatchclaws have correct scripts now.
- Fixed brother Paul not giving access to computers if the beast was killed, but the book wasn't retrieved.
- Broken Hills
- Allowed to use lockpicks in Chad's quest.
- Den
- Fixed dealer's bodyguard description.
- Deleted 0-stack ammo pack from Metzger's desk.
- Bobby's floats tweaked to reflect he's packing things.
- Enclave
- Fixed RP NPC suffering no damage in the puzzle room.
- Fixed vertibird pad area being immune to meltdown countdown and FEV poisoning.
- Klamath
- Fixed Duntons offering the job on the pastures, then telling the PC off. Also, fixed CoP check in their script.
- Gecko
- Lenny: moved ammo from hands to inventory.
- Hubologists' stash
- Added proper messages for using skills and items on the top door.
I tested them for a few hours today, no issues so far.
You mentioned Tandi's father already so I'll just mention the "doctor" of Shady Sands and the poor farmer to whom you could teach farming. Killian and Gizmo in Junktown have shitton of character and the gang-members ain't bad either - the psycho, the delusional charming leader, the little kid who just wants to belong. Then you have Doc Morbid and his clever plan of revenue, great talk there - and finally the bar keeper with his sad tale. Oh and the love birds - the tavern wench and her sweetheart, the boxing champion whom you can challenge. Necropolis is bit poor, the leader of the resistance does not have many lines. Seth, otoh, has quite a few good ones illustrating his sick mind "everyone is a tool for me" and the super mutants had a few good ones as well. And that's without Hub and LA remains (Adytown, Library, Gun Runners etc) or the super computer in Glow or the various people with BoS.