Fallout Fallout et tu (Fallout to Fallout 2 engine conversion)

[Lilura]

Once again who cares? i honestly don't give a shit

I know. And it's because you don't have a horse in the race. You're a spectator standing in the crowd who didn't place a bet. As such, you're boring. Go home and mow your lawn.

 

[Latro]

Purism and grognardism aren't the same thing at all.

in the case of an engine overhaul, definitely falls into that realm. there is more bone to pick with beamdog outside of just making the originals impossible to purchase legally, it has changed how people play the games - and definitely in a way outside of developer intent.

old codex would have been more on lilura's side, I think.

 

[Grauken]

Purism and grognardism aren't the same thing at all.

in the case of an engine overhaul, definitely falls into that realm. there is more bone to pick with beamdog outside of just making the originals impossible to purchase legally, it has changed how people play the games

And divided up the modding support network

 

[RoBoBOBR]

 

[Lilura]

And divided up the modding support network

Divided the general communities, too. Fractured them to fuck. The monocled posters and modders are long-gone. With one or two exceptions, only dregs remain.

 

[The_Mask]

The only reason i'm debating you on this topic is because i thought you were reasonable enough to debate.

Big mistake.

 

[Lilura]

old codex would have been more on lilura's side, I think.

Not just ol'Dex, but other forums as well. I remember when Killap's patch was first released: every unnecessary change was criticized by veteran Fallouters. It went on for pages and pages. And Killap was well-respected. Nowadays, it's immediate, uncritical acceptance of any mod, by no-namers.

 

[The_Mask]

codex is getting pretty soft nowadays, definitely not grognard anymore

codex is getting pretty soft nowadays, definitely not grognard anymore

Yes. Too many apologist faggots and insufferable newfags around. Time is due for a purge.

You 2 edge lords believing a mod for Fallout 1 is really the most amazing thing since sliced bread, when the general populace thinks Fallout is shit because 4 and 76 happened.

No one, including the next generation of boomers wants to touch anything Fallout related, unless they have big enough brain damage to have paid $100 for the 76 membership. And if they did, they're too stupid to load up Fallout 1.

Storm in a tea cup. In the land of the blind the one-eyed man is king, etc, etc. the thread.




Superfluous thread - much like any thread Lilura gets involved into.

Spoiler

Also she posted like 10 posts after she quit. lul

 

[Lilura]

Superfluous thread - much like any thread Lilura gets involved into.

Spoiler

Also she posted like 10 posts after she quit. lul

I'm sorry, but this sort of low-ball trolling is so boring. It's posters like this that are dragging the 'Dex way down.

 

[AdamReith]

Somebody needs to sit in the cool down corner for ten minutes.

 

[The_Mask]

I'm sorry, but this sort of low-ball trolling is so boring. It's posters like this that are dragging the 'Dex way down.

Seems like this mod is riddled with bugs. I can't imagine why anyone would touch anything Fallout related that has bugs at the present time.

Like... it is okay to debate things in three dimensions, but the 4th is also important. 76 happened.

Point being: if I want to play Fallout 1, I will load Fallout 1. If I want to dick around in a big bug riddled pet project, I will do so.

 

[Strange Fellow]

old codex would have been more on lilura's side, I think.

New Codex is on Lilura's side regarding Beamdog. As far as I know, only [Redacted Individual Who Must Not Be Named] ever championed the EEs around here. The difference is that Beamdog is criticised for making bad changes and running a scummy business. That's the grognard take. "The EEs suck because they make changes to the original games" isn't the same at all. In fact, to elevate any game to something that can't be criticised or improved upon is profoundly un-Codexian, old or new.

 

[Latro]

That's the grognard take.

Disagreed, a Grognard take was that BG-Tutu was bad because it did exactly what this mod is doing - shoving one game into a later one and calling it an improvement. I should know, because BG-Tutu was a common recommendation years and years ago, and I even played BG1 in Tutu first! And as Lilura pointed out, GoG is also quite happy to take "improvements" and shove it into their releases - gatekeeping from the community is a necessity; companies set on re-releases are listening.

In fact, elevating any game to something that can't be criticised or improved upon is profoundly un-Codexian, old or new.

Preserving the original experience as-is, and recommending that all newbies experience the same thing the original way seems quite Codexian to me.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Wrong. We simply expressed our monocled views on the matter. Scrubs can express theirs, too.

The thing is, the monocle is what seperates us prestigious Codexers from the scrubs. Where's your monocle?

Lexx Great job on this mod.

 

[The_Mask]

The thing is, the monocle is what seperates us prestigious Codexers from the scrubs. Where's your monocle?

You don't have to have a silly little icon next to your username to always have a standard for yourself, always live up to it, and always strive to maintain it.

But you're fun, so have (another) silly little icon that displays my warm fuzzy feelings towards your post, and your general attitude.

 

[Goral]

in the case of an engine overhaul, definitely falls into that realm. there is more bone to pick with beamdog outside of just making the originals impossible to purchase legally, it has changed how people play the games - and definitely in a way outside of developer intent.

Why are you retards comparing Lexx's mod to what Beamdog did? WTF? This isn't even remotely close. I've been Beamdog's hater from day 1 (logo I've made for Beamdog was even Beamdog's official logo on Polish Google for quite a while and my GOGmix "Beamdog is the parasite of the industry" which had over 500 votes got deleted by GOG on their demand) and this is definitely not similar situation.

Beamdog:

1) Took classic RPGs, threw out original creators logo (Black Isle/Interplay) and removed vanilla games from all stores (they could only be downloaded if you would buy their "enhanced versions")
2) Started charging additional money for content previously free (like P:T soundtrack) and much more money for a game just because they modded it a bit
3) They've used mods made by fans and used them commercially (e.g. Qwinn's work), they've also used volunteer translators
4) Their changes aren't optional, you either install EE or you don't

Meanwhile this mod is totally optional, it's free, it's made by hardcore Fallout fans who were fans before Lilura was even born, every logo and credits are in and it actually improves gameplay. Of course for first time experience vanilla playthrough is recommended but this mod isn't for first timers. The fact that it's been modded can only bring good things not bad. If anything we should make backups of this mod because you won't find it on GOG or Steam and sooner or later it might become impossible.

 

[Latro]

Why are you retards comparing Lexx's mod to what Beamdog did? WTF?

Already made the further comparison to BGTutu.

If anything we should make backups of this mod because you won't find it on GOG or Steam and sooner or later it might become impossible.

Or Valve and GOG decide it's the definitive way to play and pack it off to newbies who don't know any better.

 

[luj1]

Why are you retards comparing Lexx's mod to what Beamdog did? WTF?

Because we are dealing with a hysterical, mentally ill woman. For her, NwN:EE was a 'good thing' because it 'brought back the attention to the game'. Yet for this completely free mod (a work of passion not unlike her blog) the same logic suddenly doesn't apply.

 

[Drowed]

So, this thread in a nutshell.

Stay with your authority or whatever, I will get the most bug-free, balanced and interesting version without thinking twice, thanks. I don't speak about this version/mod in specific, but playing Fallout 1 or 2 without unofficial patchs is unthinkable to me. The same goes for many other games - playing Arcanum or, dear god, Gothic 3 without using unofficial patchs is masochism. Why would anyone do that is a mistery to me.

 

[Latro]

Imagine siding with decline simply because Lilura is a woman, or because her innocuous posts cause you tremendous ass-pain. There is a very real point to defending original versions of the game; especially in the case of a major engine port. She is quite vocal in endorsing JA2 Straccialetta which took pain-staking effort to be 100% faithful to vanilla JA2 while quashing all bugs; this mod, BGTutu or any other engine ports are not in the same caliber as Stracc., and what it does is much more than simply fix bugs.

 

[Lexx]

which took pain-staking effort to be 100% faithful to vanilla JA2 while quashing all bugs; this mod, BGTutu or any other engine ports are not in the same caliber as Stracc.

Because the point of this mod isn't to make a 1:1 port of Fo1 in Fo2. If we'd wanted to, we could make a 100% exact copy of Fo1 in Fo2. It probably wouldn't even take us longer than a month, because it only requires two more engine hacks. However, this would be a complete waste of time.
Instead we now have a version of Fallout 1 that is much easier to make mods for, which is why I started this in the first place. If you hate playing mods, then why even post in this thread (a rhetorical question, don't answer)? This version of the game is not for you.

 

[Latro]

If you hate playing mods

I don't.

This version of the game is not for you.

Quite clearly, but try to deal with criticism with more grace, eh?

 

[Drowed]

It's not because she's a woman, that's just Codex being edgy and using the most basic offenses as usual. There will never be an argument here where someone will not call the other a retard, imbecile, neanderthal (although here it is a compliment, I guess), fag, or any other adjective easy to provoke reactions. That's how it is.

The point is that you can defend whatever you want, and people also have the right to think you're an idiot for defending whatever you want. Not being able to see that there is a fundamental difference between creating and/or using any MOD for any game - no matter what modifications or changes it brings to the game in its proposal - or creating a new version that literally seeks to take out all forms of buying the original products (which is what Beamdog and now Blizzard have done in their releases) is a sign of some kind of brain hemorrhage.

 

[Lexx]

Quite clearly, but try to deal with criticism with more grace, eh?

I'm just pointing out the obvious. This project exists to play a modified version of Fallout. If someone hates playing a modified version of Fallout 1, then the case is closed. No point in arguing for 4 pages. I really try not to, but tbh this thread is triggering me pretty hard, because it's wasting so much of my thoughts and time.

/Edit: To add to that, I'm open for any criticism if it's substantial and I can do something about it. "Hurr durr, why do you even exist" really isn't though.

 

[Latro]

at's just Codex being edgy and using the most basic offenses as usual

There's nothing edgy about it, there's a real point to the criticism.

Not being able to see that there is a fundamental difference

Nobody is attacking the concept of mods, it's an attack on engine-porting.