Good Quake maps

[Sjukob]

 

[Kabas]

Took this^ Mjolnir for a spin. Together with the ironwail sourceport devs recommended.

Looks gorgeous even if somewhat oversaturated with details. And the first map is fun so far.
You also ain't lacking in weapon variety here. Already found the shadow axe from Arcane Dimension, lava nails frowm Dissolution of Eternity and Heretic 1 wand that acts differently from how i remember. I expect to find a lot more.

I hope i didn't screw myself over by killing that bystander toad. I swear, it wasn't meek and in fact it actually tried to kill me.

Spoiler

Also found Heretic themed bonus levels

At this rate i am going to be playing Quake for the rest of my life.

 

[Sjukob]

I haven't tried it myself yet, but I've heard that it's sort of all over the place in terms of quality.

 

[Kabas]

Already can see there is this opinion coming from judging by the overall visual style.
Edit: And on a second thought i am not so thrilled anymore about the weapon variety. Instead i am now worried that it's going to feel like a bloat very soon.

 

[Sjukob]

With the recent release of Mjolnir, this one went under the radar, I guess. But it was released about 2 weeks ago and is waiting for you to get it.

 

[toughasnails]

With the recent release of Mjolnir, this one went under the radar, I guess. But it was released about 2 weeks ago and is waiting for you to get it.

I'm enjoying this quite a bit so far, although the "trampolines" are by far my least favorite among the new movement gimmicks.
An Excursion to Carcosa is a stand-out from the maps I've played. Actually reminded me of Constantine's mansion from Thief of all things, both the geometry & texturing and overall weirdness. Best to go into it without knowing more about it beforehand.

 

[Matador]

Played Quake campaign after lots of years. Had a blast.

After that I played Arcane Dimensions: tears of the false god map. Do you agree with me is overrated?

- It´s stunning visually.

- Decent level design but too open spaces.

- I don´t like the scarcity of ammunition. I wasn´t wasting ammo and was tight in a lot of moments. Do they think this is a survival game and is fun to Axe monsters?

- Outdoors spam of the poison spitting ghosts. So I was snipping them from big distance to avoid getting in nasty situations. Not too thrilling.

- Also by far I prefer smaller levels in the original campaign.

Is this the direction the community is going with maps? Not very impressed aside from the visuals.
Any recommendations for someone who prefers more old school levels?

 

[Kabas]

Add constantly respawning enemies in the same locations over and over again to the list.

Any recommendations for someone who prefers more old school levels?

It's surprisingly hard to find an actually small map amongst these popular mods like Arcane Dimensions or Alkaline.
I can recommend Underdark Overbright. Wouldn't call it's levels exactly as small as the original Quake but none of them feature maps the size of "450 enemies, 30 secrets".
UO also doubles as a showcase for copper mod so hope you don't mind some minor gameplay changes like the way certain weapons work or nerfing of the Vore projectiles.

 

[Matador]

Add constantly respawning enemies in the same locations over and over again to the list.

Any recommendations for someone who prefers more old school levels?

It's surprisingly hard to find an actually small map amongst these popular mods like Arcane Dimensions or Alkaline.
I can recommend Underdark Overbright. Wouldn't call it's levels exactly as small as the original Quake but none of them feature maps the size of "450 enemies, 30 secrets".
UO also doubles as a showcase for copper mod so hope you don't mind some minor gameplay changes like the way certain weapons work or nerfing of the Vore projectiles.

I started The Horde of Zendar and looks right up my alley.

I don't mind maps being a bit larger, but at least maps that resemble the old good Quake flow. I don't want arenas with 1000 monsters like in the Nu Doom.

I like classic gameplay with exploration of castles and bases, finding secrets, unlocking shortcuts and opening doors and good designed encounters, ambushes,clever traps, etc.

What you mention about respawning sounds awful.

 

[Kabas]

What you mention about respawning sounds awful.

I meant Tears of the false god.

I like classic gameplay with exploration of castles and bases, finding secrets, unlocking shortcuts and opening doors and good designed encounters, ambushes,clever traps, etc.

Underdark Overbright will definitely be right up your alley too then.

 

[luj1]

With the recent release of Mjolnir, this one went under the radar, I guess. But it was released about 2 weeks ago and is waiting for you to get it.

Looks better than Mjolnir. Mjolnir is very rough around the edges and inconsistent in quality

This is also the most ambitious quake project I saw in years

 

[luj1]

Played Quake campaign after lots of years. Had a blast.

After that I played Arcane Dimensions: tears of the false god map. Do you agree with me is overrated?

- It´s stunning visually.

- Decent level design but too open spaces.

- I don´t like the scarcity of ammunition. I wasn´t wasting ammo and was tight in a lot of moments. Do they think this is a survival game and is fun to Axe monsters?

- Outdoors spam of the poison spitting ghosts. So I was snipping them from big distance to avoid getting in nasty situations. Not too thrilling.

- Also by far I prefer smaller levels in the original campaign.

Is this the direction the community is going with maps? Not very impressed aside from the visuals.
Any recommendations for someone who prefers more old school levels?

Horde of Zendar

 

[luj1]

Underdark Overbright will definitely be right up your alley then.

Underdark Overbright and The Punishment Due are the ONLY packs/campaigns that can stand toe to toe with Arcane Dimensions

 

[Kabas]

Didn't like Punishment Due as much tho i won't deny that it does have some memorable encounters.

 

[toughasnails]

Just released, altho the uploader fucked up the slipseer page.
https://www.slipseer.com/index.php?resources/peril3-0.253/
There are some vids available of the maps whilst they were still in development:


Not sure if I'll bite the bullet for this appears to be even more of an unrestrained kitchensink than Mjolnir turned out to be but the maps sure look nice (even tho already from the vids they don't look as interesting to actually play).

 

[Ash]

Played Quake campaign after lots of years. Had a blast.

After that I played Arcane Dimensions: tears of the false god map. Do you agree with me is overrated?

- It´s stunning visually.

- Decent level design but too open spaces.

- I don´t like the scarcity of ammunition. I wasn´t wasting ammo and was tight in a lot of moments. Do they think this is a survival game and is fun to Axe monsters?

- Outdoors spam of the poison spitting ghosts. So I was snipping them from big distance to avoid getting in nasty situations. Not too thrilling.

- Also by far I prefer smaller levels in the original campaign.

Is this the direction the community is going with maps? Not very impressed aside from the visuals.
Any recommendations for someone who prefers more old school levels?

Look to older releases, solid maps of that style are scattered around, just not in the quantity I would like. Indeed, Quake mapping community has a case of visual art and architecture retardation fetish. They're still good, great even, but Quake the way id did should be the standard. But that criticism aside I still had a great time playing all their shit. good shit. They're good at what they do. But I still consider it a little beneath id software and other classic 90s devs from a gameplay POV.

Specific recommendations are hard. Just keep playing map jams and episodes and you'll learn to love all the grand architecture obsession because they stlll do provide notable gameplay, but from time to time you will come across true monocled old school gameplay-first level design.
In an attempt to nudge you specifically towards that, I'll recommend to you Cimmerian night, a short episode of old school goodness. But I don't know if it serves as the best I found. I just forget names.

https://www.quaddicted.com/reviews/cimmeriannight.html

 

[Kabas]

Pretty architecture is pretty to look at.

 

[Ash]

You must love modern AAA games then. It's the same philosophy just taken to the extreme. So much time (money) is spent in the looks that the gameplay HAS to be dumb to ensure an ROI.
Yeah, these quake maps don't quite suffer in remotely the same way and I'm being facetious, but realize gameplay and visuals are forever in conflict, even in simple quake mapping. But I do want to commend them; their maps do still provide decent gameplay. I just think the priorities are messed up. id software's were not. Until Doom 3.

If you design a map around gameplay concepts first and foremost, you'll get an optimal gameplay experience but it will most likely be abstract, not make much architectural or realistic sense, and not be pretty. This is largely what Quake vanilla maps were.
If you design around visuals as a priority, the gameplay is going to suffer; not be as optimal as possible. Can still be good gameplay but not optimal. This is a significant portion of the Quake mapping community.

Thankfully the Doom mapping community doesn't suffer from this idiocy, in my experience. Perhaps only because they can't: the old engine doesn't allow for much visual flair, unless you get really technical with it.

 

[Kabas]

Methinks the issue doesn't lie in the focus on cool visuals at the expense of gameplay. It lies in the mappers inability to show any sort of restraint resulting in maps that are way too big and long for their own good.
Bite sized original Quake maps are indeed the golden standard.

 

[Ash]

Nope not a size issue. I never felt a single quake community map I played was too long, but maybe I didn't play enough (currently at ~150).

Outside of eventual performance issues please explain in objective, logical terms how level size hinders level design standards.

Some games don't even have "levels", the whole thing is continuous. Is it because you fatigue and need a new theme, because even within a single level you can have multiple themes, as well as multiple designers behind it.

 

[luj1]

Outside of eventual performance issues please explain in objective, logical terms how level size hinders level design standards.

a map can definitely be too big, just look at Foggy Bogbottom. too much enemies, too much everything. its like 3 maps in one map

anyway regarding ur other posts, as someone whose first PC game was Wolf3d on a floppy disk im gonna disagree 1000%

Quake modding community has long surpassed q1 and q2 og maps (which are excellent). AD/UO maps enable gameplay which is 3 layers above quake. More dynamic encounters, better puzzles and secrets. AD/UO is quake on steroids. This is because gameplay is augmented by the level design (which you call architecture) not hindered by it. Idk where u get that from

 

[Kabas]

Foggy Bogbottom

The map that teached me to experience dread every time i see enemy count approaching 400.
Still liked it overall but the experience would have been better if it was a shorter.

I choose the path of neutrality and say that some modding maps indeed suprass the originals but at the same time many of them could benefit from following the original design cues more closely.

 

[Ash]

Outside of eventual performance issues please explain in objective, logical terms how level size hinders level design standards.

Quake modding community has long surpassed q1 and q2 og maps (which are excellent). AD/UO maps enable gameplay which is 3 layers above quake. More dynamic encounters, better puzzles and secrets. AD/UO is quake on steroids. This is because gameplay is augmented by the level design (which you call architecture) not hindered by it. Idk where u get that from

"More dynamic encounters"

A significant portion of AD encounters are arenas, or large space outdoor engagements, because architecture/visuals over gameplay philosophy. The new enemies and special scripting is what helps add some gameplay substance. Sure there's still plenty good encounters here and there but you're overreaching.
AD is good but it absolutely does NOT surpass id's gameplay-oriented level design. Every inch of the vanilla game is thought of from the perspective of gameplay concepts before anything else. That's the kind of level designers id were

Thank fuck because otherwise the 90s could have been very different perhaps.

As for foggy ass, you have a short attention span. I'm being facetious, I barely remember the level. But again, levels can have multiple themes. And I wonder how you handle open world games that have no levels, or Half-Life were a chapter can go on for ages, or [insert other examples of good games with long stretches]...so yeah I think it could be an attention span issue, or an issue with the map's design not making good use of its theme (variety issue), or maybe the map itself is just shit. I don't remember much...actually if I recall I do remember a notable amount of copy-paste, and not great use of its theme perhaps. But I will have to play it again to make any true final judgement calls.

anyway, size is NOT a determining factor of level design quality in most cases. that's kind of retarded. Otherwise games with long ass levels that take an hour+ would be shit. if theres a problem with a long level, it's because the designer didn't make it consistently good enough; the level design itself sucks.

 

[Jack Of Owls]

Just bought this from a key store for $3.33. Woo hoo! Haven't played it in years but with all the new mods, updates and enhancements out it's about time I do. No, the modding community is nowhere near as developed or as great as that for Doom, but I figure that since I last played Quake around 15-20 years ago, there must be at least some mods on a par with good Doom user-made pwads. Now I just hope I don't get physically ill playing at 120 FPS on a 65" screen. If God meant for man to play FPSs at those speeds and screens that size he would have given him VR panels built right into his eyeballs.

 

[Matador]

Just bought this from a key store for $3.33. Woo hoo! Haven't played it in years but with all the new mods, updates and enhancements out it's about time I do. No, the modding community is nowhere near as developed or as great as that for Doom, but I figure that since I last played Quake around 15-20 years ago, there must be at least some mods on a par with good Doom user-made pwads. Now I just hope I don't get physically ill playing at 120 FPS on a 65" screen. If God meant for man to play FPSs at those speeds and screens that size he would have given him VR panels built right into his eyeballs.

Not a big fan of it (deviates from classic quake level design, focusing more on arenas), but Arcane dimensions is the most popular map pack:
https://www.moddb.com/mods/arcane-dimensions