Hearts of Iron IV - The Ultimate WWII Strategy Game

[Beastro]

Similarly, Japan tentatively asked for terms at least twice during the Pacific War but never got any reply from US.

They sent a feeler to the Soviets asking if the Allies would be ok with a peace status quo ante bellum, because they wanted to rebuild and try again in a generation. They got told that only unconditional surrender would be offered and said "Fuck you! We'll go extinct while bloodying your nose as badly as we can before we do that!" until they got nuked and realized they could be slaughtered at will without taking a toll on the Allies in return.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Similarly, Japan tentatively asked for terms at least twice during the Pacific War but never got any reply from US.

They sent a feeler to the Soviets asking if the Allies would be ok with a peace status quo ante bellum, because they wanted to rebuild and try again in a generation. They got told that only unconditional surrender would be offered and said "Fuck you! We'll go extinct while bloodying your nose as badly as we can before we do that!" until they got nuked and realized they could be slaughtered at will without taking a toll on the Allies in return.

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

 

[Beastro]

Similarly, Japan tentatively asked for terms at least twice during the Pacific War but never got any reply from US.

They sent a feeler to the Soviets asking if the Allies would be ok with a peace status quo ante bellum, because they wanted to rebuild and try again in a generation. They got told that only unconditional surrender would be offered and said "Fuck you! We'll go extinct while bloodying your nose as badly as we can before we do that!" until they got nuked and realized they could be slaughtered at will without taking a toll on the Allies in return.

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

CP surrender wounded German pride without showing all of them in person that they'd lost the war by having enemy soldiers march through their country. You cannot truly win a war unless the enemy bleeds profusely and begs for the bleeding to stop.

Most in the Japanese leadership were concerned more with spiting the Allies and making them suffered that they didn't care about their extinction as a result. It pissed them off to no end that the US had found a way for one aircraft to destroy a city virtually eliminating any form of attrition they'd suffer attacking Japan that would comfort their desire to kill Allies.

 

[cw8]

Started WW3. Lovely dark communist red for Afro Eurasia. Took my own sweet time and took way too long. Africa was particularly tedious. In my game, the African continent probably has max infrastructure entirely, even in the Sahara Desert. Had to wait for infrastructure to get to a decent level before attacking.
Late game UK was a nightmare. I had about 8000+ fighters in storage before starting war with the Allies. When France fell and in the Soviet Battle of Britain, I had depleted the 8000 fighters and was relying on production for reinforcements. They also had 1000-2000+ Allied Naval Bombers, my fleet of 3 carriers and DDs sailed to the English Channel and got sunk in moments. So after the air war of attrition and numerous nukes on London(which doesn't seem to destroy airplanes), UK finally depleted its airpower. With naval superiority I was finally able to invade.

Now for the Americas next. Puppet Germany is insane given the number of divisions and speed in which they produce them.

 

[Beastro]

So after the air war of attrition and numerous nukes on London(which doesn't seem to destroy airplanes), UK finally depleted its airpower.

You could drop 100 of them on the enemy and not kill a single division.

They only lower national unity really. They're effectively an I Win button to allow the player to smash enemies too strong to overcome in a straight up fight.

 

[XenomorphII]

Drop nukes on enemy units engaged in combat. Its effective.

 

[cw8]

So after the air war of attrition and numerous nukes on London(which doesn't seem to destroy airplanes), UK finally depleted its airpower.

You could drop 100 of them on the enemy and not kill a single division.

Like Xenomorph said, I drop nukes on them before engaging in combat or those that are already engaged in combat. Especially good for clustered naval invasions. 20 enemy divisons on a small island? Drop a nuke before your marines engage, they do wonders, heh. I used them in Africa at the start, but realised that it was a waste of time since I had to spend time to repair the infrastructure later.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Yea, I did that around Boston and New York when I invaded Kwa and Canada as the Germans, but eventually shifted to long-distance nuclear blitz to tank their National Unity instead because the infrastructure I'd wrecked was a real pain in the ass for months.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

Late game is such a drag. I just start a new save once I see I'm sufficiently ahead to win the late game. Microing entire Russia east to west with Japan, and entire US with Brazil, really drained my patience.

And yeah, taking down UK is usually the biggest challenge in every save. I've had the same situation with the fighters, I've put up 4000 of them and they've all melted down in what seemed like seconds.

Good trick is to take UK's colonies in South America and Asia (Singapur, Ceylon, Borneo and that one on top of Brazil). They're virtually unguarded, so you just have to prepare naval invasions there before the war starts. It cuts off their entire supply of Rubber and Aluminum, and they simply can't build planes.

 

[Destroid]

I suppose one major difference with the air war compared to sea or especially land is you can't really smash the AI tactically, it's just raw attrition.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Similarly, Japan tentatively asked for terms at least twice during the Pacific War but never got any reply from US.

They sent a feeler to the Soviets asking if the Allies would be ok with a peace status quo ante bellum, because they wanted to rebuild and try again in a generation. They got told that only unconditional surrender would be offered and said "Fuck you! We'll go extinct while bloodying your nose as badly as we can before we do that!" until they got nuked and realized they could be slaughtered at will without taking a toll on the Allies in return.

Okay, keep telling yourself that.

CP surrender wounded German pride without showing all of them in person that they'd lost the war by having enemy soldiers march through their country. You cannot truly win a war unless the enemy bleeds profusely and begs for the bleeding to stop.

Most in the Japanese leadership were concerned more with spiting the Allies and making them suffered that they didn't care about their extinction as a result. It pissed them off to no end that the US had found a way for one aircraft to destroy a city virtually eliminating any form of attrition they'd suffer attacking Japan that would comfort their desire to kill Allies.

Wow. Where did you learn your history? Soviet Union or Texas?

 

[Turtle-Zone 3000]

Does anyone know how HOI4 Kaiserreich is coming along? its in da mod forum.

 

[Corporate_Jew_Master]

I wouldn't bet on it coming out lol.

 

[Turtle-Zone 3000]

I wouldn't bet on it coming out lol.

Whats stopping it?

 

[Corporate_Jew_Master]

I wouldn't bet on it coming out lol.

Whats stopping it?

Amount of work needed. 90% chance the modder has already dropped it.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

One of the guys working on the mod, Selim, posted his third devblog video a week ago. IMO the most interesting one was his second one, which shows their ideas for handling elections and adding a Stability mechanic. Third video is just mostly the Java converter he mentions going to make in the second video to convert minister assets from HoI2 to HoI4.



They have considerably less work to do than the guys who are making Geheimnisnacht, just as an example. They don't need to work on custom graphical assets outside of nation leader portraits in HoI4 style, which is something they clearly got by the ass looking at the timelapses of portrait shooping in Selim's vids. The event chains they'll just have to adapt from DH version, which seriously cuts down on designing needed. Biggest hurdle IMO will be coming up with national focus tree. The rest is simply legwork. I'd say they'll have the first playable version around September.

 

[Yeesh]

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

Yes, I'm sure all thinking people can agree that if there's one thing you can say about the fucking Treaty of Versailles, it's that it just didn't go far enough.

 

[Malakal]

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

Yes, I'm sure all thinking people can agree that if there's one thing you can say about the fucking Treaty of Versailles, it's that it just didn't go far enough.

A-H got destroyed by the terms but Germany didnt lose anything at all. Some French lands, some Danish lands and some Polish lands.

They didnt even pay the reparations at all.

 

[Sulimo]

Easiest Paradox-game to do a WC in. Should have taken Romania and Turkey down as well, but unfortunately they're in my faction and I can't kick them out. Greece and India are puppets.

Ireland is free because the achievement for "Unite the world under the British Empire" actually needs someone in your faction. Because paradox.

 

[Yeesh]

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

Yes, I'm sure all thinking people can agree that if there's one thing you can say about the fucking Treaty of Versailles, it's that it just didn't go far enough.

A-H got destroyed by the terms but Germany didnt lose anything at all. Some French lands, some Danish lands and some Polish lands.

They didnt even pay the reparations at all.

Is this like one of those Holocaust didn't happen / 9-11 was an inside job / Evolution isn't real kind of arguments that are maybe edgey performance art I'm too old and out of touch to appreciate, or are you serious?

Germany had a Kaiser, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had an enormous army and a VERY advanced and expensive navy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had some colonies, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had a world class economy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Here's a Wikipedia page called Hyperinflation_in_the_Weimar_Republic, which Republic of course only existed because of said 'ceasefire'.

Bottom line: Germany didn't lose anything at all.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Personally I would argue that the most severe impact of Versailles was the declaration that Germany was the only guilty party in the war, and as such was treated both as a criminal side and defeated side. This left a lingering resentment in Germany and together with the absurd reparations and restrictions imposed on Germany only paved way for Hitler or some other radical demagogue to take over. Woodrow Wilson was the guy who was genuinely on the level in the conference, but British and especially the French were too dead-set on being assholes about the whole thing.

It's got to do with how WWI ended. Axis surrender was basically a glorified ceasefire, it's no wonder that on the 2nd round Allies decided to go balls deep instead of fighting the same battle for a 3rd time 20 years later.

Yes, I'm sure all thinking people can agree that if there's one thing you can say about the fucking Treaty of Versailles, it's that it just didn't go far enough.

A-H got destroyed by the terms but Germany didnt lose anything at all. Some French lands, some Danish lands and some Polish lands.

They didnt even pay the reparations at all.

I'd say Alsace-Lorraine/Elsass-Lothringen was technically "German" land given that vast majority of the inhabitants at the time spoke some dialect of German (in fact, only 2% of Alsatians spoke French with acceptable fluency and only 8% had limited knowledge of French language).

 

[Malakal]

Is this like one of those Holocaust didn't happen / 9-11 was an inside job / Evolution isn't real kind of arguments that are maybe edgey performance art I'm too old and out of touch to appreciate, or are you serious?

Germany had a Kaiser, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had an enormous army and a VERY advanced and expensive navy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had some colonies, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had a world class economy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Here's a Wikipedia page called Hyperinflation_in_the_Weimar_Republic, which Republic of course only existed because of said 'ceasefire'.

Bottom line: Germany didn't lose anything at all.

I am serious, considering the scale of the war they lost and the atrocities committed, for example in Belgium, Germany got off with nothing.

ad.1. Removing the head of state that started it all is common sense and doesnt in any way even hurt Germany, the guy was an idiot.
ad.2. Disarming the enemy is common sense and wasnt in fact even enforced after few years. Germany was forbidden from having tanks and airforce but somehow they did. So what did the treaty even do?
ad.3. They got those colonies a few years earlier and ultimately it was more of a prestige thing not a real loss.
ad.4. There was this thing called 'Great Depression' perhaps you heard of it, it fucked up the winners as much as it did the losers.
ad.5. Hyperinflation was caused on purpose as a way to get out of reparations. Meanwhile France after 1871 paid their HUGE reparations almost instantly. Can you spot the difference?

Bottom line: Germany got off with losing 11% of their European territory that they took themselves at best 100 years previously.

I mean how can you even argue this, Germany started another world war in 20 years and did really fucking well, does this look like a defeated state to you? With no army, navy and industry?

 

[Average Manatee]

Yeah, to say that Versailles was punishment considering the extent of the war is laughable. Compare the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk to Versailles. The whole thing was a 20 year ceasefire.

Also it needs to be said that part of Germany's recovery (their biggest problem being that they bankrupted themselves during the war, not the direct effect of Versailles) was due to that fact the disbanding the military saved so much money and the Allies were pretty much bound to protect Germany if it was attacked. France and the UK were both still experiencing massive economic problems when war started in 1939. France literally went bankrupt in 1936 and politicians refused to risk war when Germany remilitarized the Rhineland because it was feared (justifiably) that the cost could start another economic collapse and a 2nd round of the Great Depression.

 

[Yeesh]

Is this like one of those Holocaust didn't happen / 9-11 was an inside job / Evolution isn't real kind of arguments that are maybe edgey performance art I'm too old and out of touch to appreciate, or are you serious?

Germany had a Kaiser, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had an enormous army and a VERY advanced and expensive navy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had some colonies, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Germany had a world class economy, then after the 'basically just a ceasefire' Treaty, they didn't.
Here's a Wikipedia page called Hyperinflation_in_the_Weimar_Republic, which Republic of course only existed because of said 'ceasefire'.

Bottom line: Germany didn't lose anything at all.

I am serious, considering the scale of the war they lost and the atrocities committed, for example in Belgium, Germany got off with nothing.

ad.1. Removing the head of state that started it all is common sense and doesnt in any way even hurt Germany, the guy was an idiot.
ad.2. Disarming the enemy is common sense and wasnt in fact even enforced after few years. Germany was forbidden from having tanks and airforce but somehow they did. So what did the treaty even do?
ad.3. They got those colonies a few years earlier and ultimately it was more of a prestige thing not a real loss.
ad.4. There was this thing called 'Great Depression' perhaps you heard of it, it fucked up the winners as much as it did the losers.
ad.5. Hyperinflation was caused on purpose as a way to get out of reparations. Meanwhile France after 1871 paid their HUGE reparations almost instantly. Can you spot the difference?

Bottom line: Germany got off with losing 11% of their European territory that they took themselves at best 100 years previously.

I mean how can you even argue this, Germany started another world war in 20 years and did really fucking well, does this look like a defeated state to you? With no army, navy and industry?

Dearest bro,

I did not say it was unreasonable for Germany to lose what I listed. I only listed some of what was lost to counter the claim they lost nothing. If you don't think Germany in the years immediately following their complete surrender and the Versailles treaty of 1919 looked like a defeated state, then your looking must be askew. We all know how history went in the next few decades, but none of that changes the fact that the terms imposed upon Germany at the end of WWI were very heavy and indeed completely destabilized the country as a whole. I'm not sure how much punitive you could have realistically expected the terms to be; you pointed out that Germany didn't pay their reparations, but it's more true to say Germany was incapable of paying those reparations on the time-table demanded.

I express no opinion on the question of whether more or less was deserved. I only say that you'd be deeply revising history to maintain that "Germany got off with nothing."

 

[XenomorphII]

Wasn't the Kaiser already gone by the time the ceasefire and the treaty happened? I was thinking he was kicked out by his own people, he had fled to the Netherlands, and Germany was already a republic, as it was the temporary government that initiated the ceasefire and negotiated the peace. The treaty just forbade the restoration of the monarchy, as far as I am aware.