Invisible Inc.

[Gondolin]

What did they add?

New versions of the location maps:

new Vault
new CEO office
new Detention Center
new Guard Dispatch
new Server Farm
new Nanofab Vestibule
new Cyberlab (special!)

New starting room variations

 

[spectre]

Brother, I got those Buster Chips for free from safes, not nanofabs. Only one Econ Chip so far.

Right. I had shit luck for security dispatches under the new version.
I think I saw a grand total of zero on my last playthrough.

They are still doing content updates? Ugh, I should not have rage-uninstalled after several failed Expert runs.
What did they add?

Basically, new room layouts, some with more clutter to hide behind. Apart from preventing boredom, it also makes the corpos more distinct in style - K&O got more militaristic looking warehouses and logos and lockers, FTM got a bunch of lab equipment, glass containers filed with yellow ooze... etc..
For rest of the stuff, see my post above the previous. Bunch of new programs, and possibly some items, but it's a bit tricky to find them all. I think I only saw Lightning once, same for the experimental PWR storing chip (but I think they added that one much earlier).

 

[spectre]

Also, I almost forgot, they also incorporated a banter mod into the game. Nothing special, they just trade a few lines at the beginning of the game, but some are quite entertaining. I missed this shit since Jagged Alliance.

 

[Jason Liang]

: Expert plus made me re-evaluate some of the agent choices.
> Decker - doesn't look like much, does he? Remember though, he comes with a guaranteed cloak which is very useful for sneaking, getting out of a tight spot and general misdirection.
You now only need Holocircuit Overloaders to clean house and Chameleon Movement can be useful as well.
Archived decker is even better for sending guards running. Getting into their pheripheral vision cone is something you will do a lot.
> Dr. Xu - E+ was the first time I thought his -1AP a hindrance. Still strong, but no longer 1st pick for me.
> Internationale - I found her very helpful during my first runs to find all those pesky cameras. After a while, I adjusted my peeking habits and found that she's not as essential as I thought.
Still great for hacking pwr and scouting mission objectives and those pesky agent locators.
> arch.Shalem - the fact that KOs now cost 1 alarm tick makes a guaranteed cost-efficient lethal option worth a second look.
> Prism - I didn't think much of her in the beginning, but I have to say, she's a nice all rounder starting with Anarchy. Seed + Lockpick turns her into an efective +1 PWR per round,
and you can get very efficient with a bunch of parasites.
I've yet to take the archived version for a spin, but it does look interesting, if the other starting choices focus on giving her the needed power generation.
She's also a serious contender for soloing the game.
> Banks - seeing that you need to think thrice on each KO on E+, a guaranteed paralyzer will let you get more mileage. You also want to avoid guards in general,
which is where stealing comes in handy. Not to mention, bypassing locks often lets you move more efficiently through the level, which is very important on highest difficulty.

Sharp is by far the most powerful agent for Endless Plus. On campaign you might not have time to customize him with the right Augs but you get that on E+ and being able to naturally KO for 6-7 turns is a ridiculous advantage. It makes KO a no-brainer, even with +1 alarm, and used with Paralyzer III is nearly the same as kill. Modular Frame+Torque Injectors+Penetration Scanner+Predictive Brawling+Chameleon Movement+Subdermal Cloak

Archive Banks is also a top choice as having a guaranteed early Econ Chip completely changes your team's progression; even pulling a 2nd Econ Chip is quite useful, especially for many of the Daemon 2.0s. Having access to 4 custom augment slots is also quite interesting. That said, on endless you do get to a point where you no longer need money and Econ Chips aren't even worth the inventory space anymore.

Shalem's Desert Wind is a unique gear and arguably the best starting custom gear for the endgame of endless. i also like carrying around some Hand Cannons, but saving Shalem from taking 3 +1 piercing augs (therefore freeing one of his aug slots) is huge.

I actually find Internationale's aug to be the most worthless (or nearly as worthless as Deckers'). Occasionally you can save a move from having to peek around corners, but after a while you learn where cameras are going to be anyway. Being able to hack from distance is not useful if you plan on converting power into cash with an Econ Chip anyway.

Xu's aug is useful but it does consume his attack, which is an extremely limited resource (as it's possible to greatly increase your agents' AP, but the only way to increase attacks is Stim III and, I suppose, non-attack KOs like Hologram Overload). He's a lot slower than other agents since other agents, in a pinch, can use Predictive Brawling to convert their attack to +6 AP, while Xu will not have an available attack most turns. Nor can he consistently Overwatch. The nerf to Cloak III hurts him even more since for me Chameleon Movement was his primary source of extra AP. This is the reason why Nika is regarded as a top agent and Xu ends up pretty average on E+.

 

[Gondolin]

I actually find Internationale's aug to be the most worthless (or nearly as worthless as Deckers'). Occasionally you can save a move from having to peek around corners, but after a while you learn where cameras are going to be anyway. Being able to hack from distance is not useful if you plan on converting power into cash with an Econ Chip anyway.

If you start the game with Archived Banks and Internationale, her aug is pretty useful. Since she starts with 1 point in Hacking, you're going to give her the Econ Chip anyway and the fact that she can detect consoles from a distance is not bad at all.

 

[Jason Liang]

If you start the game with Archived Banks and Internationale, her aug is pretty useful. Since she starts with 1 point in Hacking, you're going to give her the Econ Chip anyway and the fact that she can detect consoles from a distance is not bad at all.

Yeah but the only reason to take Internationale over Sharp is for more challenge. Detecting consoles is probably Internationale's most trivial use.

 

[Jason Liang]

I'd rate the starting agents for E+ like:

OP:
Sharp
Nika

Great:
Archive Banks
Shalem 11

Good:
Archive Nika
Xu
Central

Mediocre:
Archive Xu
Archive Shalem 11
Monster
Prism
Banks
Decker

Poor:
Internationale
Archive Internationale
Archive Decker

Not sure about Archive Sharp and Archive Prism yet. I'd rate the power generating aug agents much higher if Portable Servers didn't exist. But they do.

 

[spectre]

Not so. Being able to detect the mission objective is potentially huge when you're on the clock to get out as soon as possible, which in my experience is what Plus difficulty is all about.
I'd argue that it's a matter of preference. For Plus difficulty, I find early game to be crucial, because it actually gets easier once you're all built up. I am finding that Sharp does pretty much nothing early on, and requires lot of investment before he gets ahead of, say, Banks + Paralyzer.
You are spot on about internationale not getting along well with Econ Chip (which is why I begrudgingly settle for Monster to up my evasion game).

Sharp is by far the most powerful agent for Endless Plus. On campaign you might not have time to customize him with the right Augs but you get that on E+ and being able to naturally KO for 6-7 turns is a ridiculous advantage. It makes KO a no-brainer, even with +1 alarm, and used with Paralyzer III is nearly the same as kill. Modular Frame+Torque Injectors+Penetration Scanner+Predictive Brawling+Chameleon Movement+Subdermal Cloak

You are right here, but to be frank, two paralyzers on an agent will give you more or less the same results. The point of Sharp is achieving ridiculous KO times, but post a certain threshold it becomes largely superficial.

Archive Banks is also a top choice as having a guaranteed early Econ Chip completely changes your team's progression; even pulling a 2nd Econ Chip is quite useful, especially for many of the Daemon 2.0s. Having access to 4 custom augment slots is also quite interesting. That said, on endless you do get to a point where you no longer need money and Econ Chips aren't even worth the inventory space anymore.

I'd argue that once you get to that point the game is pretty much "solved". Biggest thing about the custom chip in my view is the reduced cooldown, making it very convenient to use with torque injectors.
Second chip... I dunno. These things are pricy and given that it usually nets around 1000 creds per level, the second one doesn't pay for itself fast enough for my taste.
But no argument here, Archive Banks is a game-changer.

Shalem's Desert Wind is a unique gear and arguably the best starting custom gear for the endgame of endless. i also like carrying around some Hand Cannons, but saving Shalem from taking 3 +1 piercing augs (therefore freeing one of his aug slots) is huge.

Since Shalem will most likely be the designated killer, I don't mind specializing him that way. I'm not too hot for the Desert Wind myself, as the guaranteed Hand Cannon is much more economical.

Xu's aug is useful but it does consume his attack, which is an extremely limited resource (as it's possible to greatly increase your agents' AP, but the only way to increase attacks is Stim III and, I suppose, non-attack KOs like Hologram Overload). He's a lot slower than other agents since other agents, in a pinch, can use Predictive Brawling to convert their attack to +6 AP, while Xu will not have an available attack most turns. Nor can he consistently Overwatch. The nerf to Cloak III hurts him even more since for me Chameleon Movement was his primary source of extra AP. This is the reason why Nika is regarded as a top agent and Xu ends up pretty average on E+.

I believe there is such a thing as too much AP. Predictive brawling on nika lets you do quite a lot of scouting, but I am finding that you will often be blocked by an obstacle that takes time to bypass, be it a guard facing an inconvenient direction, or something that needs to be hacked.
Main reason for xu is bypassing daemons and saving a lot of PWR, which is all good for you when you're using console PWR for Economy Chip.

 

[dukeofwhales]

Main reason for xu is bypassing daemons and saving a lot of PWR, which is all good for you when you're using console PWR for Economy Chip.

I've been trying an maximum cash endless run with Archive Banks and Xu, starting with Parasite and Fusion with the aim of never having to use a console for power, only for cash. Not sure if it's feasible unless I can get the item which decreases cooldowns on the first couple of missions though because the combination of the 4 turn cooldown on the econ chip and the need to wait for parasite to knock off the cameras means it just takes too long and I end up fucking myself. Wondering whether to swap Xu out with Internationale as the detect ability gives you a head start on cameras quite often. You miss out on the free safe hacks though which can save quite a bit of power.

Haven't managed to get very far yet. Of course if I were better at this game that would help too.

 

[34scell]

Archive Internationale plus 5x alarm multiplier to break the game. With volt a disrupter you can use all your attacks for free every turn.

 

[spectre]

I've been trying an maximum cash endless run with Archive Banks and Xu, starting with Parasite and Fusion with the aim of never having to use a console for power, only for cash. Not sure if it's feasible unless I can get the item which decreases cooldowns on the first couple of missions though because the combination of the 4 turn cooldown on the econ chip and the need to wait for parasite to knock off the cameras means it just takes too long and I end up fucking myself. Wondering whether to swap Xu out with Internationale as the detect ability gives you a head start on cameras quite often. You miss out on the free safe hacks though which can save quite a bit of power.

Haven't managed to get very far yet. Of course if I were better at this game that would help too.

You're gimping yourself here. I realize the theme, but IMO parasite as a starting program is only useful with Internationale (cause it reveals lots of possible targets) and Archived Prism (because you have a buster chip and can disappear at will)
- in the latter case, Dynamo may be a better choice.
For Xu and Banks low PWR builds, I'd recommend starting with Seed an Lockpick 1.0, with view of upgrading to 2.0 asap. As a matter of fact, I've been using it with good success for all of my EconChip plays.

Generally, I favor agents with improved hacking to go with Econ Chip. Sharp, Internationale, Monst3r. Xu works, of course (and it's nice that he has a shock trap and a neural disrupter - you don't gimp yourself too much by not having the disrupter on banks),
the sweet spot for Economy Chip seems to be at Hacking 3, so you will have to invest some of that earned cash before you start making a profit.
A bit advantage of that starting setup is that you only need to get a Paralyzer and you're prep'd for almost anything the game can throw at you at low levels (drones, daemons, armored guards).

If you're still learning the ropes, perhaps standard Banks + Dr. Xu would work better for you? If you want the Econ Chip so badly, you can restart if you don't get one in the nanofabs during the first or second mission. It's not as convenient to use,
because it needs speed 2 and has more cooldown, but std.Banks + Xu is a very balanced duet in my opinion.

 

[Jason Liang]

Yeah, I'm not a fan of parasite either. You don't need to save power THAT badly, and it slows you down too much waiting for hacks. Lockpick 1.0 all the way.

I don't think Xu is worth starting. You still need to carry an EMP or two whether you have him or not.

Having a 2nd Econ Chip means you don't have to wait around to cash in during the cooldown.

 

[spectre]

Yeah, I'm not a fan of parasite either. You don't need to save power THAT badly, and it slows you down too much waiting for hacks. Lockpick 1.0 all the way.

Parasite was great for starters back in early access, when they let you pick any two programs, so Parasite + Lockpick worked quite all right.
As it is now it's an excellent auxiliary breaker, and what you want is a main breaker for starters.

I don't think Xu is worth starting. You still need to carry an EMP or two whether you have him or not.

You may be right for Endless, but when the schedule is tighter, I find him great as a full package that can take care of a number of things. A guaranteed shock trap loses its charm once you get mk.III
but its one way you can guarantee being able to drop an armored guard.

Having a 2nd Econ Chip means you don't have to wait around to cash in during the cooldown.

With regular chips, I could see myself doing that, especially if RNGesus won't bless you with torque injectors.
Is it feasible though? You need to spend 800$ + 800$ for them in the first place, which is a-ok for one chip - as it should pay for itself after 1-2 missions, but the second chip will take a much longer time to do so,
Depending on how sooner you get the duplicate +1 rank to hacking will give you more mileage.

 

[Eyestabber]

Just finished experienced for the first time. This game is fucking awesome!

Don't know if this has been discussed before, but check this out:

I made myself a nice little POW camp on the last mission. Drop all guard bodies on the little room you see + trap the door. Both Nika and Central had lvl 3 shock traps, so, apart from some small leaks here and there, I solved most of the opposition by locking them in a room and chain stunning them while Monst3r did his thing. Shock traps ignore armor, so arpen is a non-issue here. That and the fact that a well equiped Nika is pretty scary.

 

[Stormcrowfleet]

So what's the deal with this game ? Cons and pros ?

 

[Jason Liang]

PROS:
Concept++++ (cyberpunk+noir+raygun gothic, awesome)
Design+++++ (procedure-generated rogue-lite, combat and weapon mechanics, stealth system mechanics, alarm system mechanics, hacking mechanics, all clever)
Presentation+++++ (animations, character design, gui)
Length +++ (6-8 hour story campaign, Goldilocks "just right")
Initial Difficulty/ Learning Curve (each day gets appreciatively more difficult)
Customizable Campaigns (if its too difficult you can design your own difficulty)
World Building (one of the better balanced future dystopias, not completely grimdark)
Campaign Plot (classic Neuromancer with a twist)
Gameplay tension/ stress (perfect)
Modability (easy to mod)

CONS:
Long term replayability (game doesn't have enough random variance or content, gameplay gets kind of repetitive after about a month or so)
Long term challenge (even the toughest situations are no problem for a maxed out team of 4 agents)
game balance (lots of agent loot/ augs are OP like Econ Chip, Portable Servers, Cloaks, etc... they break the game design and balance that make the game good)

Overall:
Invisible Inc is an instant classic, the content and design is top notch. But it has imperfections and just not enough content or challenge to last for more than 1-2 months of gaming. The first 10 hours are awesome, the next 10 hours are great, then the game is still enjoyable but it fails to get better after that. Once you've seen nearly everything, the game is done.

 

[Metro]

So what's the deal with this game ? Cons and pros ?

Read the thread?

 

[Cyberarmy]

From MCAs twitter account.
"Play this (good job @klei ) #PAX #AndBeyond"

 

[spectre]

So what's the deal with this game ? Cons and pros ?

You want a quest compass with that? It's a roguelike, turn based stealth game that pulls no punches.
If I were to apply the term liberally, I'd call it a tactical turn based game with character development.
If that's not enough for you, you are beyond help.

Also, yes, it is very good and polished.

 

[Stormcrowfleet]

You people are so edgy tonight. I'm asking because people are starting to finish the game so they can actually give a complete review instead of tidbits. I already knew what the game was about since I checked the thread and the gameplay video.

 

[dukeofwhales]

It's my favourite game of the year so far. Tense, compelling, and a lot of replayability if you're the type to challenge yourself with different party makeups, skills and items. Difficulty levels are spot on too. Have gotten 66 hours out of it so far and will most likely go back for more.

 

[spectre]

Perhaps that was a bit too edgy, but come on man, tactical turn based games that are actually good are so rare, we should be all over it whenever such magic happens.
I blame it on the weather. 40 degrees on my balcony since 11am. Fucking hell.

Really though, unless you actually crave for an AAA experience, or can't stand the roguelike approach, I don't see how you could be disappointed by the game.
I've seen GOG keys at less than 15$. Just go get it.

If I were to nitpick, I liked the game better when it was a bit less cyberpunk and more noir in early access, but they made it so integral to the gameplay that I barely notice.
Story mode can feel a bit lackluster and short, but that's deliberate, as the game was built for replayability from the ground up. It will still be challenging and intense. You'll be surprised how intense can a turn based game.

Myself, I don't mind the game being short, even though I beat story mode in close to 2 hours in time attack mode, steam says I'm getting close to a 200 hour mark of total playtime on this one.
It's actually great to play in short bursts between other stuff, or when you actually have other responsibilities. I could see myself growing weary of the game if I played it for a few days straight.

 

[Jaedar]

You people are so edgy tonight. I'm asking because people are starting to finish the game so they can actually give a complete review instead of tidbits. I already knew what the game was about since I checked the thread and the gameplay video.

Here's the only piece of consumer advice you need for this game: Buy it.

 

[Lucky]

Couldn't wait any longer and got it today. Completely worth it, this is gameplay porn.

Makes me crave for X-COM as done by Klei...

 

[cvv]

Klei announced the 2nd expansion for DS, 3rd if you count multiplayer, but nothing new for invisible.

Oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy oh boy.