KickStarter Kingdom Come: Deliverance Pre-Release Thread [RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Quillon]

while for years before that the screenshots were drop dead gorgeous.

And game was running like shit, even in their latest presentations, pop-ins all over the place and I'm not sure if they can reasonably optimize it however much downgrades they apply.

 

[thesheeep]

So involved are the community that one major feature of Kingdom Come: Deliverance was actually directly inspired by them – the quick-save feature. Unable to decide if quick save should be in the game at all or not, some fans suggested that for a game developed in the Czech Republic it’d feel particularly appropriate if saving the game happened in a pub. Suddenly, booze was the answer – because of course it was.

“We came up with a liquor where every time that you quick save you have to drink that liquor. It’s an item in your pocket and if you want to save you need to have this item. If you overdo the quicksaving, you get drunk and you get sick. We don’t want you abusing the quicksave button in front of every chest or whenever you have to pick a lock or something.”

And thus, in a strangely poetic twist, a highly realistic video game has booze as a method of saving progress when for most of us – let’s be honest – it’s more likely to delete it. Regular saves and auto saves are still included, though the quick save option is tied to alcohol – which has a whole sub-system of its own.

Meh. Typical case of designer diva(s).
I prefer when games let players decide how they want to play instead of enforcing crap like that.
This is not a roguelike FFS.

That said, at least it is funny.

 

[Paul_cz]

Most likely they just dropped the graphics quality entirely. Classic case of bait and switch, happens every time. No point in trying to rationalize it by claiming that it's just console screenshots until actually proven otherwise.

Vávra stated on FB that it is from PS4.

That said I don't doubt the game will probably look slightly worse than the beta did when it comes to draw distances and stuff, but I don't care since at least it will get me higher framerate, which matters more than graphics anyway.

 

[fantadomat]

Kingdom Come Deliverance: a medieval RPG about realism, drunk quicksaves and the right type of chicken - VG247

So involved are the community that one major feature of Kingdom Come: Deliverance was actually directly inspired by them – the quick-save feature. Unable to decide if quick save should be in the game at all or not, some fans suggested that for a game developed in the Czech Republic it’d feel particularly appropriate if saving the game happened in a pub. Suddenly, booze was the answer – because of course it was.

“We came up with a liquor where every time that you quick save you have to drink that liquor. It’s an item in your pocket and if you want to save you need to have this item. If you overdo the quicksaving, you get drunk and you get sick. We don’t want you abusing the quicksave button in front of every chest or whenever you have to pick a lock or something.”

And thus, in a strangely poetic twist, a highly realistic video game has booze as a method of saving progress when for most of us – let’s be honest – it’s more likely to delete it. Regular saves and auto saves are still included, though the quick save option is tied to alcohol – which has a whole sub-system of its own.

That sounds retarded in my book.

 

[Iznaliu]

Kingdom Come Deliverance: a medieval RPG about realism, drunk quicksaves and the right type of chicken - VG247

So involved are the community that one major feature of Kingdom Come: Deliverance was actually directly inspired by them – the quick-save feature. Unable to decide if quick save should be in the game at all or not, some fans suggested that for a game developed in the Czech Republic it’d feel particularly appropriate if saving the game happened in a pub. Suddenly, booze was the answer – because of course it was.

“We came up with a liquor where every time that you quick save you have to drink that liquor. It’s an item in your pocket and if you want to save you need to have this item. If you overdo the quicksaving, you get drunk and you get sick. We don’t want you abusing the quicksave button in front of every chest or whenever you have to pick a lock or something.”

And thus, in a strangely poetic twist, a highly realistic video game has booze as a method of saving progress when for most of us – let’s be honest – it’s more likely to delete it. Regular saves and auto saves are still included, though the quick save option is tied to alcohol – which has a whole sub-system of its own.

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

 

[Modron]

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

To be honest I don't really care for any restrictions on when and where I can save you never know when you're going to have to step away from a game to go do shit for work/friends/family, deal with pets, make food, you know generally live and would rather not lose progress or leave a game running because I don't have some requisite item to save. Also let's not forget we don't live in a perfect world and games do have a tendency to crash every now and again so the more saving the better. Now while I don't really savescum but I do kind of obsessively save in many games at regular intervals.

I guess I just need to read up on the regular saving mechanics before I make up my mind about item linked quick saving.

 

[fantadomat]

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

To be honest I don't really care for any restrictions on when and where I can save you never know when you're going to have to step away from a game to go do shit for work/friends/family, deal with pets, make food, you know generally live and would rather not lose progress or leave a game running because I don't have some requisite item to save. Also let's not forget we don't live in a perfect world and games do have a tendency to crash every now and again so the more saving the better. Now while I don't really savescum but I do kind of obsessively save in many games at regular intervals.

I guess I just need to read up on the regular saving mechanics before I make up my mind about item linked quick saving.

I agree with you mate,real life happens a lot. Not being able to save is a total console shit,i stay away from games that have checkpoints and can't manually save.

 

[cvv]

I agree with you mate,real life happens a lot. Not being able to save is a total console shit,i stay away from games that have checkpoints and can't manually save.

Except one of the best RPGs ever (THE best for me) is Dark Souls and one of the main reasons it's so great is precisely because it has checkpoints.

As one wise philosopher said, only a Jedi deals in absolutes...or some such.

 

[Carrion]

I think Dark Souls saves your progress constantly. It's not really a checkpoint system in the traditional sense.

Not being able to save anywhere you like to is fine if the game has no bugs, never crashes and has gameplay that fits a limited save system, and even then there should at the very least be a "save and quit" option somewhere. I don't mind replaying a level two dozen times in a strategy game or a tactical shooter, where there's little to no busywork involved and you can re-evaluate and change your approach every time you reload a save, but mundane RPG stuff like talking to people, selling and buying stuff, looting containers, rearranging your inventory etc. gets infuriating if you're required to do it again every time you fuck up.

I don't mind developers trying new things, but the KCD system does sound kind of nonsensical. If regular saving is allowed, you'll still be able to savescum your way out of a tough spot, whereas putting limits on quick saving means that the inevitable crash or game-stopping bug in a non-tough spot is likely to wipe out a lot more progress than it would otherwise.

 

[cvv]

I think Dark Souls saves your progress constantly.

It's not a full checkpoint system, you keep the items you find after death and also quests progress. But your ass does get returned to the last checkpoint (bonfire) and mobs respawn which is what really matters. It's what gives the game the tension and ultimately the sense of accomplishment if you get from one bonfire to the next (well not in DS3 where From caved in to the casuals and planted bonfires a few fucking meters from each other).

 

[vonAchdorf]

I think you don't run out of "Savovitz", you just have to drink a shot every-time you use quick save, so it won't prevent saving when you have to leave thegame for real life reasons. You can cure drunkenness with sleeping and potions. We'll see how much it interferes with the gameplay. If it's annoying, there'll surely be mods on PC.

 

[Multidirectional]

It's not a full checkpoint system, you keep the items you find after death and also quests progress.

And even if you Alt+F4 out of the game next time you launch you continue from the same place you exited. Unless during boss fight in which case it returns you back behind fog wall. It's a constant save. Lack of this is what I dislike about Nioh, that samurai soulslike. When you exit the game it returns you to last "bonfire". There they are more like checkpoints.

 

[Cloak and Dagger]

This is my most anticipated game in a while.

 

[Kyl Von Kull]

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

To be honest I don't really care for any restrictions on when and where I can save you never know when you're going to have to step away from a game to go do shit for work/friends/family, deal with pets, make food, you know generally live and would rather not lose progress or leave a game running because I don't have some requisite item to save. Also let's not forget we don't live in a perfect world and games do have a tendency to crash every now and again so the more saving the better. Now while I don't really savescum but I do kind of obsessively save in many games at regular intervals.

I guess I just need to read up on the regular saving mechanics before I make up my mind about item linked quick saving.

This is why we need a time travel RPG—the PC has a wearable time machine (obv in the form of a wrist or pocket watch) that can send your mind back to earlier temporal save points, set by you. But you can’t go back to before you had the time machine/wristwatch. Maybe your big time machine broke down and you’re stuck with the crappy wearable that can keep you alive but not send you back to your own time. Basically it would just be a normal save anywhere system with an in-game explanation that everyone in the game world could address directly. NPCs and companions who know about the device could get suspicious when you seem to have foreknowledge or know exactly what they want to hear: “hey asshole, how many times have you had this conversation with me and jumped back? Stop messing around with the fabric of the universe just to get in my pants.” It would make so much sense, since obviously your greatest power in most RPGs is the ability to time travel back to an earlier save. And the C&C could be awesome if you get to travel to multiple eras, like Chrono Trigger minus the JRPG stuff, crossed with a real CRPG.

If it’s a time travel game, you can save scum without breaking immersion. If anything, save scumming would become a real gameplay mechanic and with decent AI they could mess around with the butterfly effect: having your temporal reloads slightly change things every time. Or maybe there are no save zones where something is scrambling your machine.

Kingdom Come 2: Back To The Future

It’s not as silly as it sounds since i’m pretty sure Deliverance was also an 80s movie. I wonder if Vavra will let you make anyone squeal like a pig.

 

[cvv]

It's not a full checkpoint system, you keep the items you find after death and also quests progress.

And even if you Alt+F4 out of the game next time you launch you continue from the same place you exited. When you exit the game it returns you to last "bonfire".

Yeah but that is a very limited kind of save, it doesn't allow you to savescum battles or loot. Which is the whole point of the KCD system and this debate.

Lack of this is what I dislike about Nioh, that samurai soulslike.

Interestingly it's one of the few things I like more in Nioh. It makes more sense and it's not as exploitable as in DS.

 

[Liquorice]

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

To be honest I don't really care for any restrictions on when and where I can save you never know when you're going to have to step away from a game to go do shit for work/friends/family, deal with pets, make food, you know generally live and would rather not lose progress or leave a game running because I don't have some requisite item to save. Also let's not forget we don't live in a perfect world and games do have a tendency to crash every now and again so the more saving the better. Now while I don't really savescum but I do kind of obsessively save in many games at regular intervals.

I guess I just need to read up on the regular saving mechanics before I make up my mind about item linked quick saving.

This is why we need a time travel RPG—the PC has a wearable time machine (obv in the form of a wrist or pocket watch) that can send your mind back to earlier temporal save points, set by you. But you can’t go back to before you had the time machine/wristwatch. Maybe your big time machine broke down and you’re stuck with the crappy wearable that can keep you alive but not send you back to your own time. Basically it would just be a normal save anywhere system with an in-game explanation that everyone in the game world could address directly. NPCs and companions who know about the device could get suspicious when you seem to have foreknowledge or know exactly what they want to hear: “hey asshole, how many times have you had this conversation with me and jumped back? Stop messing around with the fabric of the universe just to get in my pants.” It would make so much sense, since obviously your greatest power in most RPGs is the ability to time travel back to an earlier save. And the C&C could be awesome if you get to travel to multiple eras, like Chrono Trigger minus the JRPG stuff, crossed with a real CRPG.

If it’s a time travel game, you can save scum without breaking immersion. If anything, save scumming would become a real gameplay mechanic and with decent AI they could mess around with the butterfly effect: having your temporal reloads slightly change things every time. Or maybe there are no save zones where something is scrambling your machine.

Kingdom Come 2: Back To The Future

It’s not as silly as it sounds since i’m pretty sure Deliverance was also an 80s movie. I wonder if Vavra will let you make anyone squeal like a pig.

That's a solid concept. An interesting take on time-travel that's not possible in any other medium. I'd like to see someone try it.

 

[Carrion]

Yeah but that is a very limited kind of save, it doesn't allow you to savescum battles or loot. Which is the whole point of the KCD system and this debate.

I don't know the exact details of the system, but to me it doesn't look like it'd prevent savescumming in any meaningful way. What it does do is discourage the "quicksave every five seconds" playstyle, but saving often is what you should be doing even if you're in a safe zone with zero risk of dying. You'll never know when your progress is undone by factors beyond your control, like a bug or a power outage, and it always boggles my mind when someone says they lost an hour or so worth of progress because they "forgot to save" or something like that. Saving frequently and using multiple different save slots is simply the smart thing to do, and that goes double for ambitious Eastern European RPGs that will likely have more than a few rough edges on release (and probably long afterwards as well).

Earlier in development they had an idea of granting you a stat/XP bonus the longer you go without loading a save, the purpose being to discourage the player from reloading the game after every small adversity like failing a skill check somewhere. While the idea probably would've been vulnerable to more than a few exploits, I kind of liked it because it would've punished loading rather than saving, which is what these systems should really do in the first place.

 

[Paul_cz]

Well, I for one am glad they are at least discouraging save scumming, and doing it in such amusing "trueslav"-style.

Who knows how it will work in practice but better than nothing.

I am pretty sure the game will have regular autosaves anyway.

 

[Odinson]

I guess the playtesters couldn't handle not being able to save constantly like RPG players expect to be able to.

To be honest I don't really care for any restrictions on when and where I can save you never know when you're going to have to step away from a game to go do shit for work/friends/family, deal with pets, make food, you know generally live and would rather not lose progress or leave a game running because I don't have some requisite item to save. Also let's not forget we don't live in a perfect world and games do have a tendency to crash every now and again so the more saving the better. Now while I don't really savescum but I do kind of obsessively save in many games at regular intervals.

I guess I just need to read up on the regular saving mechanics before I make up my mind about item linked quick saving.

This is why we need a time travel RPG—the PC has a wearable time machine (obv in the form of a wrist or pocket watch) that can send your mind back to earlier temporal save points, set by you. But you can’t go back to before you had the time machine/wristwatch. Maybe your big time machine broke down and you’re stuck with the crappy wearable that can keep you alive but not send you back to your own time. Basically it would just be a normal save anywhere system with an in-game explanation that everyone in the game world could address directly. NPCs and companions who know about the device could get suspicious when you seem to have foreknowledge or know exactly what they want to hear: “hey asshole, how many times have you had this conversation with me and jumped back? Stop messing around with the fabric of the universe just to get in my pants.” It would make so much sense, since obviously your greatest power in most RPGs is the ability to time travel back to an earlier save. And the C&C could be awesome if you get to travel to multiple eras, like Chrono Trigger minus the JRPG stuff, crossed with a real CRPG.

If it’s a time travel game, you can save scum without breaking immersion. If anything, save scumming would become a real gameplay mechanic and with decent AI they could mess around with the butterfly effect: having your temporal reloads slightly change things every time. Or maybe there are no save zones where something is scrambling your machine.

Kingdom Come 2: Back To The Future

It’s not as silly as it sounds since i’m pretty sure Deliverance was also an 80s movie. I wonder if Vavra will let you make anyone squeal like a pig.

Not a RPG, but a game with mechanics exactly like this is the 80's visual novel (more a adventure game than a visual novel) Yu-No: A girl who chants love at the edge of the world. It's parallel worlds, with a map of the worlds the player visits to make new choices.

 

[Iznaliu]

I am pretty sure the game will have regular autosaves anyway.

I imagine if they have a regular autosave option, that it will be disabled on harder difficulties, or at the very least, there will be a special mode or even just an achievement for playing without it.

 

[cvv]

I am pretty sure the game will have regular autosaves anyway.

I imagine if they have a regular autosave option, that it will be disabled on harder difficulties, or at the very least, there will be a special mode or even just an achievement for playing without it.

I doubt it, they said the game will autosave - probably after some quest events - but nothing about any difficulties. Not sure there even are difficulty levels.

 

[Iznaliu]

Not sure there even are difficulty levels.

I imagine there would probably be at least a token implementation of them.

 

[SlamDunk]

Daniel Vavra posted some new screens.

For anyone wondering about the third-person view: https://twitter.com/DanielVavra/status/935657422718414850

 

[Iznaliu]

Daniel Vavra posted some new screens.

For anyone wondering about the third-person view: https://twitter.com/DanielVavra/status/935657422718414850

Actually bothering to change the button graphics from controller buttons to keys on a keyboard is a huge incline.

 

[cvv]

We hosted World Exclusive at Warhorse Studios in Prague to pursue this very question: Will Kingdom Come: Deliverance with its unusual ideas be a new genre milestone? Or does all the medieval realism of the fun on the track?

For about eight hours, we tested the Kingdom Come: Deliverance campaign in full and without restriction . This game time is not enough to play through a 50- to 60-hour adventure colossus, so we were provided with some additional savegames.

Aaand the rest is behind a paywall. Anyone here from the Krautland with a subscription to this rag?

However they have a "quick" overview. Google translated but better than nothing:

But beyond that, here's an overview of what unique selling points Deliverance will have for the February 2018 release from other role-playing games. And of course we exclude the most obvious difference in advance, that Kingdom Come plays in the historical Middle Ages and not in a fantasy kingdom.

1. It really is a real RPG
Kingdom Come does not start with a furious battle like Dragon Age: Inquisition and no execution like Skyrim . Instead, you begin as a blacksmith's son Henry in a Bohemian village with boring errands. They're meant to express the yawning dullness of Henry's life - and that's one of Deliverance's greatest strengths. We are dealing here with a real role play.

Fighting is just one of many aspects, instead there are skills for drinking , eating, parlia- menting and reading. Kingdom Come does not exaggerate, but strives for a plausible world in which we actually play a role. The gameplay is solely for the purpose of enhancing this effect.

For example, we can open a book with a low reading skill, but there the letters on one page are wildly swapped. You can try deciphering this word goulash , but then you haveto ponder in front of the screen like someone who can barely read. Such tricks are just terrific.

Kingdom Come does not take us by the hand , it does not throw us away with action-spectacle, but offers above all atmosphere, immersion and story. However, the focus is more on the atmosphere, less on an innovative story than, for example, Planescape: Torment .

2. It has the "most realistic" combat system
Fighting may only be one feature among many, but it's still one of the best. The combat system of Kingdom Come will probably simulate swordplay from the ego perspective better than any other game. Similar to Chivalry: Medieval Warfare you use the mouse to determine the direction of impact, to block, counter and lunges.

But the whole score calculation is much more detailed and complex. For example, whoever beats on plate armor with a sword does not achieve anything at all. A targeted stab between the armor pieces, however, works wonders. Our hero Henry and his opponents also do not magically gain more life energy as they level up. That would break with the realism claim of the game.

In real life, an ax blow falls on the neck of a giant as well as a tiny creature. It counts the right armor, the clever feint and the use of the correct weapon. For example, a club also zombies plate armor quite consistently. Of course, in terms of realism here and there are a few concessions to the playability. For example, the opponents always get quite far, so we even get the chance of a parade. But we accept that, because in a nutshell: The combat system is great.

3. It makes no compromises in decisions
After the prologue, main character Henry loses his home and his parents. He begins a new life in the city of Rattay - and from there we will reach the finale of the campaign. At the beginning many tasks are quite banal . One patrols in the city, resolves quarrels between residents or escorts a noble son. But you should not be fooled by that.

The quests could become one of the biggest strengths of the game, as the developers are clearly trying to respond to all possible actions of the players. For example, in a quest we go undercover into a monastery to bring a criminal around the corner. However, we do not know what that looks like.

As a supposed Benedictine novice you actually have to reenact the strict daily routine of the monks, so get up at 4 o'clock in the morning , sing, eat in silence, pray, work. And to find out as much as possible about the disguised gangster in the little spare time. This quest alone takes several hours and has many possible paths.

For example, you can trust the wrong person and get poisoned on the first evening .Fortunately, Henry does not die and may even agree to flee the convent with the gangster. Let's just lie to the client while the criminal flees. Or Henry just stabs him after their escape together.

We can also be thrown out of the monastery and fail - but even then there is still the possibility to run with the drawn sword into the dormitory and stab off the guy. You just have to come out alive again.

A lot of quests should rank at this level of complexity. And that's true of some of us who played it ourselves. More about this (as mentioned above) in our cover story .

4. The Open World is not an activity theme park

The game world of Kingdom Come is similar in size to the main area of The Witcher 3 .Of course there are no deserts and snowscapes in the Bohemian heartland, but the game offers a credible historical reconstruction of a long-forgotten era. Because many people think about Assassin's Creed , we want to make a difference: Kingdom Come is no amusement park.

There are no lookout towers, treasure chests, robber camps and other attractions behind every corner. Instead, the game leans more to Red Dead Redemption and dares sometimes wide rides through landscapes in which little happens.

But that does not mean that there are no hotspots. Nearly 1,000 sights can be found on the world map, including special hunting grounds, ruins, villages, castles and so on. In general, the design motto at Deliverance is: Fewer to fill more locations with more exciting content than to follow an open-world formula.

5. The story starts very slowly in the genre comparison
Kingdom Come wants to score with atmosphere and story. With the former, this also works really well, but the narrated story starts quite slowly. Although the game makes every effort to put us in the role of forging son Henry - but an effectively transported story is not automatically a good one .

Ultimately, it is (at least in the first 8 hours) a simple hero's journey of the brand Luke Skywalker : Young man of simple circumstances loses his family through a cruel enemy and works his way up to the brave warrior to seek revenge. Seen 1,000 times, also in many RPGs.

According to Lead Designer Daniel Vavra, this routine startup should provide a good foundation for developing Henry in as many directions as possible. May be true, but does not make the story interesting. Those who want extravagant roleplaying stories arebetter off with titles like Torment . And a The Witcher 3 transports us more consistently from one story climax to the next.

But let us not judge too soon: Kingdom Come offers a 50- to 60-hour campaign , which we at best scratched. In addition, the great atmosphere makes us want to lose ourselves in the medieval world, hour after hour. Maybe the story will develop in more interesting directions, we'll see that in time for the release in our GameStar test.