Let's settle this once and for all! Who's the Top Dog?

[GarfunkeL]

I've played Teudogar....

 

[Reject_666_6]

Ok now make a Fallout vs Fallout 2 thread.

 

[Junior Boy]

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

Really? Shit, I'm the exact opposite, I didn't know that was the new paradigm. If you're gonna be a nerd, go all out, don't mock the "LARPers." I guess that's why I like Bioware so much. Combat is gravy to me, so I guess I'll love Arcanum.

 

[roll-a-die]

You gave it all of half a day to declare a winner, Crispy?

By Nu-Codex standards, your attention span is above average, I guess.

I woulda givin it a week. And I'm neo-codeine er Nu-Codex.

I do wonder though, why you are calling us nu, which is the thirteenth letter of the greek alphabet?

 

[Crispy]

The fight continues, then! Will anything change? We'll see!

 

[Gragt]

High five, bro!

Like I've been saying: Arcanum is the greatest RPG EVA.

Top hat! America fuck yeah!

 

[Melcar]

No, fuck that. The arena is closed and Fallout reigned supreme. You're all a bunch of sore losers.

 

[Crispy]

I'll give it a couple of days more. Then no one can whinge about the results, except maybe VD.

 

[Joe Krow]

Arcanum's strength is quality role-playing. When it comes to it, even Fallout pales in comparison and PST shouldn't be mentioned at all. It's the fucking king of role-playing, yet it's the last in the poll.

The first encounter in your average gold box game makes more reference to your character then all of Arcanum. The true path to rpg goodness? Less reading more rolling.

Why are you so fascinated by these dialogue flow charts anyway? I mean it was a bad game mechanic when they used it in children's books- it's atrocious when they try to base a video game around it.

Get off your high horse.

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

WAAA!!! Actually rpgs are about customized characters and dice. Combat just happens to be the best way of putting the two together. Combat can offer dozens of possible choices at any time and each one will reference an attribute. Dialogue gives you four choices and at most one of them will even acknowledge that you are playing a character at all. Your love of soap operas will be your undoing Vault Dweller.

 

[Zomg]

I do need to play Teudogar, every previous time I was all Ehhhh backing into it and then something fucked up during installation and I bailed at the first sign of trouble, shameful. Robinson's Requiem, same thing, what a terrible RPG criticismfag I have become.

 

[Reject_666_6]

You realise that everything you just said was debated time and time again on the Codex with no consensus, right?

 

[ghostdog]

I'm the top dog

/inane thread

 

[Junior Boy]

This is fucking stupid. Let's consult Lord Wikipedia.

"A role-playing game (RPG; often roleplaying game) is a game in which the participants assume the roles of fictional characters"

There, done. No dice necessary, homo.

 

[PorkaMorka]

This is fucking stupid. Let's consult Lord Wikipedia.

"A role-playing game (RPG; often roleplaying game) is a game in which the participants assume the roles of fictional characters"

There, done. No dice necessary, homo.

I'm playing the role of Duke Nukem, thus Duke Nukem 3d is a RPG.

QED

(that definition is rather broad for our specialized purposes don't you think)

 

[FeelTheRads]

You realise that everything you just said was debated time and time again on the Codex with no consensus, right?

He never tires of telling us how Arcanum, Fallout etc suck because they have dialog.

 

[Melcar]

I take it then AoD will be more like Arcanum than Fallout. VD deceived us!

 

[Gragt]

I take it then AoD will be more like Arcanum than Fallout. VD deceived us!

Then again Arcanum builds on elements introduced in Fallout.

 

[Jaime Lannister]

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

WAAA!!! Actually rpgs are about customized characters and dice. Combat just happens to be the best way of putting the two together. Combat can offer dozens of possible choices at any time and each one will reference an attribute. Dialogue gives you four choices and at most one of them will even acknowledge that you are playing a character at all. Your love of soap operas will be your undoing Vault Dweller.

Still at it Krow? The "true RPG combat roll-playing" games you like have no dialogue options or completely meaningless ones. "role playing" means that your stats should affect your character outside of combat as well as in it, otherwise you get meaningless LARP dialog like Baldur's Gate and Oblivion.

 

[Xor]

I take it then AoD will be more like Arcanum than Fallout. VD deceived us!

Then again Arcanum builds on elements introduced in Fallout.

Yes, but it fails in areas where Fallout didn't, and doesn't add anything of note It's just a lot longer with moar pointless filler dungeons. Fallout has a superior setting and gameplay, therefore it's top dog.

PS:T was great as a visual novel but the combat made me cry and that's a large part of gameplay in all three choices, so yeah, it gets bumped to third.

They're all excellent games, and anyone who posts here and claims to like RPGs should go out and play all three goddammit. Right now. Go. Get the fuck out of this thread and play them.

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

WAAA!!! Actually rpgs are about customized characters and dice. Combat just happens to be the best way of putting the two together. Combat can offer dozens of possible choices at any time and each one will reference an attribute. Dialogue gives you four choices and at most one of them will even acknowledge that you are playing a character at all. Your love of soap operas will be your undoing Vault Dweller.

Still at it Krow? The "true RPG combat roll-playing" games you like have no dialogue options or completely meaningless ones. "role playing" means that your stats should affect your character outside of combat as well as in it, otherwise you get meaningless LARP dialog like Baldur's Gate and Oblivion.

In after this thread devolves into dungeon crawler vs choice & consequence codex.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

As opposed to the previous 'RPGs are about narratives, combat is an obstacle, so fuck it'?

 

[Carlos' Bitch1]

Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

No, this is a minority opinion. Just because those who espouse this view come across as the most intelligent, don't confuse the two. You could point out the holders of that (rather simplified from what it is in reality) view on one hand around here. I think you will find the Next Gen codex actually prefers something else: Graphics. They will spit in the eye of a Jeff Vogel game, Knights of the Chalice, etc, while either overtly or covertly play right through Fallout 3, Oblivion, whatever the latest story-on-rails-that-has-quick-click-battles-and-boobies!

In any case, I agree with you about Arcanum. You cannot deny that it would be more than incredible if it had a decent combat engine though. You can try denying it, but I don't believe you could be that unintelligent.

 

[Malakal]

Out of those three? Fallout. Arcanum had shit combat, was completely inbalanced and buggy. The only good thing about it was nice quests, but when I remember that fucking dwarf clan area... Torment also had shit combat, very small amount of spells, weapons and other gear and was only good for interesting story. While fun (the story of our hero) all this stuff about planes and morality and suffering and so on was boooring. Goddamnit if I wanted I'd read 2ed manual of the planes or something, I don't need that to be made into a game.
So Fallout it is. First one is better, second one is longer. And quanity has a quality of its own. Nice ammount of weapons/armor, turn based combat with targeted attacks, SPECIAL which is awesome system, lots of skills (even if some are not very useful), lots of fun npcs and places to visit. You can explore in fallout, you can fight in fallout, you can live in that world. It isn't just one trick game. Unlike torment/arcanum.

 

[JarlFrank]

Now the Codex is still debating what RPG is and isn't. Recently the dominating opinion shifted to "RPGs are about combat, choices are LARPing so fuck' em". The results of the poll merely illustrate it.

As opposed to the previous 'RPGs are about narratives, combat is an obstacle, so fuck it'?

Both are an important part of RPGs and there are different subgenres which put different emphasis on one of the two elements.

Case closed, let's move on.

 

[Azael]

Fallout is my favorite among the three. Part of it could be nostalgia I suppose, but it simply feels like a much more complete game than the others, the end result is greater than the sum of its parts. Fallout is far from a perfect game, there are many things which could have been done better, but it's my favorite CRPG. The time limit never bothered me at all since it's actually quite generous and also gives your quest at least some sense of urgency. The Master is my favorite CRPG villain as well, despite his short appearance in the game. I like Fallout 2 a lot as well but quality > quantity. Combat isn't great in Fallout, but I'd say it's clearly the best of the three.

Arcanum did a lot of things very, very good. It has an interesting setting, an interesting (but flawed) character system and offers a lot of roleplaying options. Out of the three games though, Arcanum is the one most marred by sub-par (and too much) combat and I also think that the very scope of the game actually is a detriment. The game would be better if it was smaller and shorter (assuming the right parts were cut of course). It's one of those games that I love starting up and trying some different character concept, but often find myself aborting because I can't be bothered to suffer through the BMC, the Dredge(can be avoided by some characters though) or Thanatos. It's still one of my favorite games, I just think Fallout is better.

Torment is great too, a pretty different game where most of the important gameplay comes through dialogue and traditional dump stats are the most important. Good characters, good writing, compelling and different story. The end game drags the game down thanks to the not to stellar combat and the fact that the game's strengths are completely ignored for most of the last part.

If I'd have to rank the three among themselves, I'd put Fallout as number one, Arcanum second and Torment in the third place.

 

[mondblut]

"A role-playing game (RPG; often roleplaying game) is a game in which the participants assume the roles of fictional characters"

Like in Halo?