Mass Effect Legendary Edition remaster trilogy

[Atlantico]

It is strange that EA never looked at Mass Effect as their own Far Cry or Call of Duty that could support annual or biannual releases.

I imagine EA or Bioware didn't perceive RPGs as having long-term series potential, like Battlefield or FIFA.

Mass Effect wasn't a blockbuster hit. It was moderately successful. ME2 was engineered from the start, to be a blockbuster hit.

In other words, the original ME was ditched and ME2 was a soft reboot of the series and it was a massive success.

What I imagine EA/Bioware execs learned from this, was that ME1 was not a winning formula, while ME2 was the golden ticket.

It's ironically similar to what happened to Dead Space and DS2 (and then DS3), which is also and EA franchise from a similar time period.

This lesson is mostly wrong, IMO - in reality, games tend to sell on the reputation of the last game in the series. This may seem counter-intuitive, but it probably has to do with how word-of-mouth works, piracy and deep discounts for older titles.

ME2/ME3 make the galaxy feel way too small, like it's a neighborhood or something.

Precisely, and it also reminds me of the new Star Wars movies. Perhaps this is some kind of a mental trap that some writers/producers fall into when trying to be risk-averse.

It's just a terrible waste of resources and potential, but probably the most "safe" and cynical option.

The missed opportunities and wasted potential of ME2 is excruciating.

It's like seeing an entire crop of grapes, from your favorite vineyard, being crushed to make grape-soda.

What a waste.

 

[J1M]

After playing ME1, and considering it was supposed to be a trilogy from the get go (I'm not even sure if it was public knowledge back then, but let's pretend for now), the logical construction of the trilogy would have been so :
Start (ME1) : What reapers are, what happened to the protheans, what threat faces the galaxy. Subplot : Do you side with the council and champion galactic cooperation or do you push the pro-human agenda.
Ending (ME3) : Considering the revelation of ME1, it's safe to assume the end of the trilogy is about how the galaxy faces the reapers, and how they break the never ending cycle (I assume the most cliché version should have prevailed here). Subplot could be about how this threat is faced by either an harmonious coalition of species or humanity alone, who would have by your actions fucked up the council's power and freed europe from brussels technocrats.

In this regard, I would have assumed the bridge, ME2, to explore the galactic politics further, as it should have been the (more or less impactful) C&C generator for the last part. The actual plot would have logically been : how do you convince everyone that the threat is real and they should prepare. The subplot would be how you either favour the council or mankind in your quest for rallying ressources, allies and support from the galaxy.

Since ME2 turned out to be about how there are reapers out there and they need to be stopped, ie. didn't advance the plot of ME1 one bit but rather stuttered on the same shit, but with poorer delivery (Sovereign in ME1 being presented as giving close to 0 fucks about Shepard while whatsitsname in ME2 being homoerotically obsessed with Shepard, which is mega lame), it's difficult to produce a satisfying ending in ME3, since ME3 has to 'fill the shoes' of ME2 and produce a satisfying result to your choices/the plot at the same time. I have very few memories of ME3, but I remember thinking "well ME2 matters fuck all now, doesn't it ?" and the whole trilogy feels utterly pointless in the end.

Imagine getting a proper ME2, where the threat of the reapers is looming in an even more anxiogenous way, as pretty much nobody in the galaxy gives a fuck about your ramblings and keep on following their petty agenda, some of your fellow human included. This would have been a great theme to explore, and with the basic paragon/renegade system could offer two versions : you Ghandi the galaxy up or you settle for the universal chaos, revel in it and use the reaper threat to hijack political power for your faction.
The missed opportunities and wasted potential of ME2 is excruciating.

A villain can't remain mysterious or threatening after you've already prevailed over them multiple times. Only having one antagonist makes a setting feel small.

 

[MajorMace]

After playing ME1, and considering it was supposed to be a trilogy from the get go (I'm not even sure if it was public knowledge back then, but let's pretend for now), the logical construction of the trilogy would have been so :
Start (ME1) : What reapers are, what happened to the protheans, what threat faces the galaxy. Subplot : Do you side with the council and champion galactic cooperation or do you push the pro-human agenda.
Ending (ME3) : Considering the revelation of ME1, it's safe to assume the end of the trilogy is about how the galaxy faces the reapers, and how they break the never ending cycle (I assume the most cliché version should have prevailed here). Subplot could be about how this threat is faced by either an harmonious coalition of species or humanity alone, who would have by your actions fucked up the council's power and freed europe from brussels technocrats.

In this regard, I would have assumed the bridge, ME2, to explore the galactic politics further, as it should have been the (more or less impactful) C&C generator for the last part. The actual plot would have logically been : how do you convince everyone that the threat is real and they should prepare. The subplot would be how you either favour the council or mankind in your quest for rallying ressources, allies and support from the galaxy.

Since ME2 turned out to be about how there are reapers out there and they need to be stopped, ie. didn't advance the plot of ME1 one bit but rather stuttered on the same shit, but with poorer delivery (Sovereign in ME1 being presented as giving close to 0 fucks about Shepard while whatsitsname in ME2 being homoerotically obsessed with Shepard, which is mega lame), it's difficult to produce a satisfying ending in ME3, since ME3 has to 'fill the shoes' of ME2 and produce a satisfying result to your choices/the plot at the same time. I have very few memories of ME3, but I remember thinking "well ME2 matters fuck all now, doesn't it ?" and the whole trilogy feels utterly pointless in the end.

Imagine getting a proper ME2, where the threat of the reapers is looming in an even more anxiogenous way, as pretty much nobody in the galaxy gives a fuck about your ramblings and keep on following their petty agenda, some of your fellow human included. This would have been a great theme to explore, and with the basic paragon/renegade system could offer two versions : you Ghandi the galaxy up or you settle for the universal chaos, revel in it and use the reaper threat to hijack political power for your faction.
The missed opportunities and wasted potential of ME2 is excruciating.

A villain can't remain mysterious or threatening after you've already prevailed over them multiple times. Only having one antagonist makes a setting feel small.

I agree, by facing reapers again and again, you make them mundane. Having a different (or better, no actual) villain in ME2 would have worked very well imo.
Making dissensions and petty oppositions the actual enemy, and making ME2 an exploratory rpg instead of a hollywood tps, would have served ME3 much more.

Well, not if you want to conquer the market that is. And since this was probably their goal, they made the hollywood tps and cashed in. Owell.

 

[Nutria]

I imagine EA or Bioware didn't perceive RPGs as having long-term series potential, like Battlefield or FIFA.

ME was made before Bioware got bought out. At that time they were trying to develop their own IP because they were tired of the hassle of licensing stuff like D&D and Star Wars. So they made Jade Empire and ME hoping to build their own setting that they could make sequels in. I don't think they intended ME to be just a trilogy at that time though. There's no good reason why they couldn't have just kept making more games forever.

 

[Roguey]

I'm amazed why no rpg developer has ever tried to replicate the mass effect formula. Obsidian, CD projekt, inxile, etc, they try the same pedantic shit over and over again while the space opera set piece extravaganza with larger than life characters resumes itself to mass effect and nothing else.

The market is there, as this remaster shows, anything similar would sell millions, the expertise is there, no lack of developers versed on third person action games. No sure what is missing.

Is The Outer Worlds truly that forgettable?

 

[Kem0sabe]

I'm amazed why no rpg developer has ever tried to replicate the mass effect formula. Obsidian, CD projekt, inxile, etc, they try the same pedantic shit over and over again while the space opera set piece extravaganza with larger than life characters resumes itself to mass effect and nothing else.

The market is there, as this remaster shows, anything similar would sell millions, the expertise is there, no lack of developers versed on third person action games. No sure what is missing.

Is The Outer Worlds truly that forgettable?

Outer worlds is nowhere near to being the same type of game as mass effect.

 

[Roguey]

Outer worlds is nowhere near to being the same type of game as mass effect.

It's in space and you have a crew of wacky companions, not sure what else you want. Sticky cover?

 

[Kem0sabe]

It's in space and you have a crew of wacky companions, not sure what else you want. Sticky cover?

Third person, varied environments, space opera story with your hero fighting to save the Galaxy from an overwhelming force and against all the odds, big dramatic set pieces.

In mass effect I actually felt like I was playing s hero doing everything to get shit done. In outer worlds I felt like a character in a sitcom doing from sketch to sketch.

 

[Riddler]

I imagine EA or Bioware didn't perceive RPGs as having long-term series potential, like Battlefield or FIFA.

ME was made before Bioware got bought out. At that time they were trying to develop their own IP because they were tired of the hassle of licensing stuff like D&D and Star Wars. So they made Jade Empire and ME hoping to build their own setting that they could make sequels in. I don't think they intended ME to be just a trilogy at that time though. There's no good reason why they couldn't have just kept making more games forever.

My impression was that it was announced as a trilogy from the start as part of a publishing deal with Microsoft. ME1 was initially only released on Xbox.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Outer worlds is nowhere near to being the same type of game as mass effect.

It's in space and you have a crew of wacky companions, not sure what else you want. Sticky cover?

Outer Worlds is as close to Mass Effect as Fallout is, completely different subgenres.
Mass Effect: mix of space opera and military sci-fi
Outer Worlds: pulp sci-fi/comedy (and space western to some extent too I suppose)
Doesn't help that Outer Worlds is mediocre trash.

They actually don't differ that much in playtime for a full playthrough, you know. And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

 

[Yosharian]

I'm amazed why no rpg developer has ever tried to replicate the mass effect formula. Obsidian, CD projekt, inxile, etc, they try the same pedantic shit over and over again while the space opera set piece extravaganza with larger than life characters resumes itself to mass effect and nothing else.

The market is there, as this remaster shows, anything similar would sell millions, the expertise is there, no lack of developers versed on third person action games. No sure what is missing.

Is The Outer Worlds truly that forgettable?

Outer what now?

 

[Roguey]

And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

"Drew Karpyshyn is a better writer than Leonard Boyarsky" isn't something anyone would expect to see on the Codex back in the 00s.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

"Drew Karpyshyn is a better writer than Leonard Boyarsky" isn't something anyone would expect to see on the Codex back in the 00s.

No man is immune to the californian brain parasite

 

[Riddler]

And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

"Drew Karpyshyn is a better writer than Leonard Boyarsky" isn't something anyone would expect to see on the Codex back in the 00s.

That was before Boyarsky burned out hard though.

 

[Ismaul]

And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

"Drew Karpyshyn is a better writer than Leonard Boyarsky" isn't something anyone would expect to see on the Codex back in the 00s.

That was before Boyarsky burned out hard though.

A decade at Blizzard on Diablo 3 will do that.

 

[J1M]

Outer worlds is nowhere near to being the same type of game as mass effect.

It's in space and you have a crew of wacky companions, not sure what else you want. Sticky cover?

Outer Worlds is as close to Mass Effect as Fallout is, completely different subgenres.
Mass Effect: mix of space opera and military sci-fi
Outer Worlds: pulp sci-fi/comedy (and space western to some extent too I suppose)
Doesn't help that Outer Worlds is mediocre trash.

They actually don't differ that much in playtime for a full playthrough, you know. And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

Mass Effect 1 is space opera plus lovecraftian mystery.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Outer worlds is nowhere near to being the same type of game as mass effect.

It's in space and you have a crew of wacky companions, not sure what else you want. Sticky cover?

Outer Worlds is as close to Mass Effect as Fallout is, completely different subgenres.
Mass Effect: mix of space opera and military sci-fi
Outer Worlds: pulp sci-fi/comedy (and space western to some extent too I suppose)
Doesn't help that Outer Worlds is mediocre trash.

They actually don't differ that much in playtime for a full playthrough, you know. And with that playtime ME1 managed to construct a vastly more detailed, interesting world than the Outer Worlds writers could have ever hoped to have done.

Mass Effect 1 is space opera plus lovecraftian mystery.

ME1 is definitely military sci-fi. There's even a term used in sci-fi literature for this because the two overlap so much: military space opera

 

[Justicar]

 

[Padzi]

This is how I shapeshift while changing outfits.

 

[HansDampf]

The Dark Matter plot is a bit of a meme. People overstate the number of references to it in ME2. I've been intentionally looking out for references to it this time, and thus far there's only been one when you rescue the Quarian in an early mission. He says the Collectors had traces of dark energy readings. But honestly, that's the kind of thing you might write about them anyway, since they are supposed to be a mysterious threat from a mass relay that nobody else can travel through.

It's in Tali's recruiting mission.
https://masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/Dholen

quarian scientists are worried about dark energy destabilizing Dholen and causing it to mature into a red giant too rapidly

This would have been the fate of the entire galaxy if the Reapers didn't intervene. Rapidly aging and dying stars. No more habitable planets.

 

[donkeymong]

I wonder what happened between ME1 and 2 to cause this shift in direction.

We go from a game with good writing to a game with pretty much no qualities.

I thought the gameplay in ME2 was ok

Lol, not even close. No combat rolls, no blindfire, no proper grenades. Artificial cover, sticking out in the enviroment, no enemies flanking you.No decent melee attacks.All that something that even the first Gears of War has, that set the standard in popamole third person shooters(and was relased some years before.In the first game
, biotic and tech powers were powerfull and fun, so they made up for that, also, cover wasnt needed late game.

 

[donkeymong]

Yes, we know all of this because ME is the most analysed video game series in existence. Quite undeservedly if you ask me, but eh.

A decade has passed and it's all a mess and it's interesting to see how you can go from a rather generic and safe action-RPG to the disasters that followed - the main disaster being that ME2, terrible as it was, appealed to the mainstream.

.

One million more really isnt such a success:
https://www.vgchartz.com/article/250066/mass-effect-a-sales-history/

Especially considering higher cost for developing that one.

 

[Orud]

Wasn't the switch done after gathering feedback from ME1 reviews, where the common complaints were terrible shooting mechanics, dull side missions and the Mako being shit to control?

That they changed the shooting mechanics, was fine. What was not, was also gutting all other combat mechanics (healing kits, grenades, etc... ) at the same time. I do believe we can blame Gears of War for this, since the combat almost became a carbon copy of it. Combat arena's with waist-high cover everywhere, slow-high-damage omni-blade melee attacks, blood on the edge of your screen when low on heath and, finally, regenerative health. Despite the switch, I still think ME2 was a shit shooter. It wasn't until ME3 that they changed it into an enjoyable shooter with decent mechanics. I really enjoyed ME3's multiplayer, but it also stopped being an RPG, combat-wise. Some people might claim build diversity, but it was minor (both in the amount of builds and differences between builds).

However, I have less understanding for the outright removal of the Mako. It added scale along with a sense of exploration and otherworldliness to any mission, not just the side missions. While some missions were nothing but shooting galleries and the controls were annoying, it was integral to making ME1 feel like a grand universe. They should've tweaked it rather than removing it, because a simply flyby of an area can't replace it.

 

[Nano]

It's in Tali's recruiting mission.

Her loyalty mission too.

But to be honest, "we need to genocide everyone every 50k years because of dying stars" is probably even dumber than what they came up with in ME3.

 

[Gregz]

So, how does the remaster of ME1 compare to the original?