Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain

[Akasen]

They seem to go with everything that's fun in the design. I'm intrigued after watching all the demos because I avoided those 40 minute videos in fear of just seeing some of those lengthy cutscenes typical for the series. To my surprise there is no cinematic animation disturbing the gameplay in those demos unlike most of modern games. All that sticks out is the slowed time after being discovered.

It is very uplifting to see Kojima and co just sit there and show off a game based on its gameplay at all times possible.

The slow down when caught is called "Reflex Mode". The abstraction is that Big Boss has the reflexes to immediately just shoot a guy in the face with whatever he has on hand (Or throw a rifle magazine at their this. This is not a joke. This knocks out the enemy). The technical reasoning as I understand it is that the game becomes very difficult overall without this mode because you are traversing large and open terrain and may not have a certain awareness of where the enemy is. This is also couple with the ability to mark enemies like in so many other games so you can see the enemy behind walls and the map.

 

[Helly]

The only real decline I could see in the gameplay trailer is the regenerating health à la CoD.

 

[Talby]

I liked the part where you tried to interrogate a soldier who only spoke Russian. Boss, being the uber soldier he is, doesn't know that language. You knock the guy out see he has good stats and send him to base. Within a few minutes the guy is not only back in the base, he has been interrogated, agreed to work for you, and learned English.

He actually could speak Russian in Snake Eater, but the head injuries that caused his 9 year coma also made him forget how to speak any languages other than English... which sounds goofy but is apparently not an uncommon result of serious head trauma IIRC.

The reflex mode slo-mo can be turned off in Ground Zeroes, so presumably it can in TPP too. It's too bad they didn't use the system from MGS2 where soldiers had to call in for backup to cause an alert, giving you time to kill them, destroy/jam the radio, etc. Now it's just an instant alert.

 

[Trodat]

Some people are OUTRAGED because how unrealistic this game is.

Since when did 'realism' = good?

 

[Tzaero]

I've never played an MGS game before, and now after seeing the gameplay Im somewhat intrigued.
Has the tactical options and sneaking been like this for most of the series?

 

[Trodat]

I've never played an MGS game before, and now after seeing the gameplay Im somewhat intrigued.
Has the tactical options and sneaking been like this for most of the series?

They were way more linear and you basically had one route to advance, but the core gameplay is pretty much unchanged.

There's way more gadgets now than ever before, companions, stuff like that are new (compared to MGS1-4, I haven't played others).

MGS V gameplay videos give away a more action-ey look than how you would generally play any of the classic MGS games, but altering difficulty settings should change that to better.

And one important part of the series is the melodramatic, over-the-top plot.

 

[dunno lah]

I liked the part where you tried to interrogate a soldier who only spoke Russian. Boss, being the uber soldier he is, doesn't know that language. You knock the guy out see he has good stats and send him to base. Within a few minutes the guy is not only back in the base, he has been interrogated, agreed to work for you, and learned English.

He actually could speak Russian in Snake Eater, but the head injuries that caused his 9 year coma also made him forget how to speak any languages other than English... which sounds goofy but is apparently not an uncommon result of serious head trauma IIRC.

The reflex mode slo-mo can be turned off in Ground Zeroes, so presumably it can in TPP too. It's too bad they didn't use the system from MGS2 where soldiers had to call in for backup to cause an alert, giving you time to kill them, destroy/jam the radio, etc. Now it's just an instant alert.

Not exactly true. It's just that the time gap between getting spotted and enemy yelling "Contact!" into his presumably always-on radio is extremely short. There were many times where I didn't raise the alarm as I took the guy out before he could scream.

The more annoying thing really is that the footsteps are so damn loud even while sneaking. (Don't get me started on D-walker getting so close behind the guy before he realizes it.) All the old MGS and Hitman games did make sneaking actually silent. Don't see why they're not doing the same here. I was damn relieved to see Boss do a slow crawl.

 

[Jick Magger]

I've never played an MGS game before, and now after seeing the gameplay Im somewhat intrigued.
Has the tactical options and sneaking been like this for most of the series?

The series has actually evolved quite radically with each new entry in the series. First two games were the most arcade-like in its presentation of stealth, with the first game being much more comparable to the early 2D Metal Gear Games. The main big changes from MGS1 to 2 was the addition of first person shooting, improved AI, and the addition of an evasion stage after the alert phase (where squads of 4-5 guys would actively patrol areas going through hiding spots to try and find you). They both also had a soliton radar which showed you enemy positions and their cone of vision, which gave you a reliable point of reference from which you could plan your movements to offset the clunky controls and aiming. MGS3 threw out alot of the conventions of the earlier entries: changing the levels from compounds with tight corridors to wide-open jungle areas, got rid of the soliton radar (and in the special editions, got rid of the fixed camera), and beefed up the enemy field of view, meaning you had to rely more on camouflage and crawling through areas to progress. Wouldn't go as far as to call it open world, but it gave you many more options on how to dispatch, confront, or avoid enemies to progress. Metal Gear Solid 4 was a natural progression of MGS3's gameplay: making Snake's movements far more fluid and precise as well as adding a crouch-walk option, free-aiming with your guns (whereas in the earlier entries your only shooting options where relying on the lock-on or aiming through first person), and adding an octo-camo option in favor of MGS3's more clunky menu-based camo system (which had the unfortunate side-effect of making sneaking much easier). The Phantom Pain mostly seems like a further evolution of MGS4's gameplay, which also takes Peace Walker's variation of the camo-system (you can only pick the type of camo/uniform you're wearing before you begin a mission).

 

[Talby]

Not exactly true. It's just that the time gap between getting spotted and enemy yelling "Contact!" into his presumably always-on radio is extremely short. There were many times where I didn't raise the alarm as I took the guy out before he could scream.

The more annoying thing really is that the footsteps are so damn loud even while sneaking. (Don't get me started on D-walker getting so close behind the guy before he realizes it.) All the old MGS and Hitman games did make sneaking actually silent. Don't see why they're not doing the same here. I was damn relieved to see Boss do a slow crawl.

Yeah, that's what I mean. It's possible to interrupt them before they finish yelling "contact!" and avoid the alert, but it's a decline compared to MGS2 or 3 which both had a comparitively complex system for calling in alerts. It's especially odd given Kojima's remarks about making MGSV a stealth simulation, yet the game has bullet time slow-mo when you're spotted. It's not a dealbreaker, but I do think the earlier games did it better.

On realism - the first (Solid) game had a psychic who could brainwash people read your memory card info. The second game had a vampire that could dodge machinegun fire and sprint across water and vertical cliffs. The third game had a man who could control a swarm of bees WITH HIS MIND. Realism has never been been MGS's strong suit.

 

[Somberlain]

I've never played an MGS game before, and now after seeing the gameplay Im somewhat intrigued.
Has the tactical options and sneaking been like this for most of the series?

I haven't played MGS4 but Snake Eater has the best gameplay and sneaking of all MGS games I've played. MGS1 and MGS2 have actually pretty meh sneaking mechanics, it's basically "dodge the cones". For example, movement doesn't make any sound (except on rare and specific surfaces) and enemies have really poor eyesight.

MGS2 has one great feature that a lot of stealth games don't, however; guards give regular situation reports to HQ and if they don't, HQ will send more guards to investigate. This means that the game actually incentives sneaking past enemies instead of knocking out or killing everyone. MGS3 didn't have this feature but sneaking is still harder in that game because you don't have the magic radar and guards aren't as blind as in MGS1 and MGS2. Guards are also harder to spot in MGS3 because their green uniforms provide some camouflage in the outdoor environments.

 

[Tzaero]

If it as enjoyable as Chaos Theory, that'll be alright.

 

[dunno lah]

But given how open the maps are and how much more empowered you are control-wise, I think the MGS2/3 way would be too easily overcome. MGS5 doesn't have Gurlukovich's soldiers who could immediately shoot/knock you down on sight and quickly move to cover to call for an alert. That being said, MGS5 really should bring back these hypercompetent enemy spec forces. Perhaps the Skulls may fill this role?

 

[Alfons]

MGS1 and MGS2 have actually pretty meh sneaking mechanics, it's basically "dodge the cones".

I tried to play MGS1 a while back and I ended up looking at the minimap more than the screen. The fact that you can't see more than a few meters in front of you is shit.

 

[Talby]

But given how open the maps are and how much more empowered you are control-wise, I think the MGS2/3 way would be too easily overcome. MGS5 doesn't have Gurlukovich's soldiers who could immediately shoot/knock you down on sight and quickly move to cover to call for an alert. That being said, MGS5 really should bring back these hypercompetent enemy spec forces. Perhaps the Skulls may fill this role?

Good point, it would have to be balanced differently otherwise it would be too easy to prevent alerts from ever happening.

From descriptions of the behind closed doors demo from a month-ish ago, that's exactly what the skulls are. You don't want to get spotted by those guys unless you're well prepared. I hope there are other difficult enemies as well, like squads that actively hunt for you and look in hiding spaces outside of the alert phase. (similar to clearings from MGS2)

 

[tuluse]

If it as enjoyable as Chaos Theory, that'll be alright.

Just a heads up. All the MGS games are extremely cutscene heavy. MGS4 almost trollishly so (I believe the final ending cutscene is over 40 min long).

The exposition is also super repetitive, they will tell you everything 3 times. You can skip most of it though if you're just in it for the gameplay.

 

[Somberlain]

The exposition is also super repetitive, they will tell you everything 3 times. You can skip most of it though if you're just in it for the gameplay.

This was always one of my biggest issues with the series, not only because it's annoying but it also makes the main characters look like retards, what they aren't supposed to be, as far as I know. I wonder if they do that because they expect most gamers to be idiots who don't understand anything that isn't spoon-fed to them?

NPC: Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun.
Snake: A rail gun???
NPC: Yes, Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun.
Snake: So, Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun, got it. What does a rail-gun do?
NPC: It does x.
Snake: Rail-gun does x???
NPC: Yes, rail-gun does x and stuff like that.
Snake: All right. Rail-gun does x, got it.

And so on.

 

[Alienman]

After watching the 40 min video, and playing the payed "demo", this is a for me.

Shame about micro-transactions though. Real shame

 

[Akasen]

After watching the 40 min video, and playing the payed "demo", this is a for me.

Shame about micro-transactions though. Real shame

Luckily, they seem to be implementing the transactions on the collectible materials you use to build equipment with. Nothing too major.

 

[Machocruz]

Here's my GoTY awards preview, exclusive for Codex readers

Best stealth game: MGSV

Best third person shooter: MGSV

Best open world game : MGSV

Best AI: MGSV

Best doge: MGSV

The UFO Defense award for best base management: MGSV

The System Shock award for best omnipresent radio contact: MGSV

The honorary Paradox Interactive award for most informational game (consoles): MGSV

The Taffer award for best toolset: MGSV

 

[Deleted member 7219]

If it as enjoyable as Chaos Theory, that'll be alright.

I got a lot of Chaos Theory vibes by playing Ground Zeroes.

 

[Jick Magger]

Just a heads up. All the MGS games are extremely cutscene heavy. MGS4 almost trollishly so (I believe the final ending cutscene is over 40 min long).

40 minutes is being generous, if you count the final fist-fight with Ocelot as being part of the cutscenes, the entire ending sequence is easily around an hour and a half long. Hour and ten minutes if you don't count it.

 

[Akasen]

MGS4 is an interesting conversation to had. It's a game that lacks a lot of substance to be honest. Graphically, it's sickening to look at because of the brown filter all over the screen. Gameplay-wise, it's terrible because of how little gameplay there is. There's a particular mission in that game where in which you have to tail some guy and not get caught whatsoever. Sure, stealth game and stuff, but this part of the game isn't interesting in the slightest.

Further, the amount of exposition they are doing is dense, and it's obvious why at the time. This was the last Metal Gear Solid, or so anyone thought. Every little plot detail that was never wrapped up would be getting wrapped up. Which meant that everything unexplained in MGS3 and MGS2 would get some form of explanation. Which meant a lot of explaining was being done to explain or re-explain things that happened in prior games. It was full of exposition and fan service. It makes me wonder what was going through Kojima's head as he sculpted the game with his team. Was the game made out of love? Out of anger towards the fans for wanting answers? Was he misguided in making the game? I doubt that one. So the only answer I have is that MGS4 and every perceivable fault is on purpose. It is not an accident and nothing of the game is an accident. Every little detail of that game must have been made purposefully by a man well aware of what he was making. And to a degree, it's beautiful. To another degree, MGS4 could have been a terrible way to end a franchise.

MGS5 took a while for me to really pick up on. It took me a while to understand what it was, why I should even be excited, and what I loved about these games in the first place. And in the end, I learned to love Hideo Kojima. May he either retire happy or create his own independent development studio and pursue some new IP (or retire).

 

[Luka-boy]

NPC: Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun.
Snake: A rail gun???
NPC: Yes, Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun.
Snake: So, Metal Gear is outfitted with a rail-gun, got it. What does a rail-gun do?
NPC: It does x.
Snake: Rail-gun does x???
NPC: Yes, rail-gun does x and stuff like that.
Snake: All right. Rail-gun does x, got it.

And so on.

 

[bonescraper]

Oh my gawd, the gun porn Phantom Pain beating the dust off the competition in every area (looking at you Ubisoft/Tom Clancy)

Made-up frankenguns don't count.

 

[Talby]

Maybe it's nostalgia, but the goofy exposition and awkward dialogue is kind of charming to me. You're not playing a Metal Gear game unless each boss fight is followed by a 1.5 hour lecture on nuclear disarmament and the meaning of free will.

The Phantom Pain is going to be much less cutscene heavy, though, plus the Big Boss games (Snake Eater onwards) generally have much less of the metababble MGS2 and 4 are infamous for. Peace Walker, while not the best Metal Gear game, has a much better gameplay-to-cutscene ratio even if you ignore most of the side ops. Kojima himself said that the cutscenes in MGS4 had gotten out of hand and MGSV is much more gameplay focused. We'll see how true that is when the game is out.