My collected criticism on Pillars of Eternity (very minor spoilers)

[Lurker King]

I don't bash the game but it's hard to deny that some of the criticism is spot on. When you can fit all useful Wizard spells in one memorize selection (grimoire), you know something is wrong.

There is a difference between criticizing the game and bashing the game. The encounter design have problems, of course. Do you think I like that meager grimoire? Of course, I don’t. But to say that the writing is bad? In comparison to what? D: OS? Give me a fucking break.

 

[Lurker King]

We can go all night, or you can try to actually argue instead of just crying nostalgia glasses/ edgy / Sawyter-hater and thinking you are clever.

We are talking past each other. What I had in mind are players that can’t criticize PoE while acknowledging its good points.

 

[Lhynn]

The chanters for instance, are pretty cool.

Not really, mechanics for that class are utter crap. The idea is fine i guess.

 

[Scruffy]

i voted worst (worse by the way) than bg1 even if it's better than bg1 because at least bg1 gave me the sensation of being out in the wilderness, exploring stuff and finding things. PoE is just a letdown in too many things that could have been so easy to implement better.

 

[Lhynn]

I don't bash the game but it's hard to deny that some of the criticism is spot on. When you can fit all useful Wizard spells in one memorize selection (grimoire), you know something is wrong.

There is a difference between criticizing the game and bashing the game. The encounter design have problems, of course. Do you think I like that meager grimoire? Of course, I don’t. But to say that the writing is bad? In comparison to what? D: OS? Give me a fucking break.

D: OS writing wasnt recieved well, but combat in D:OS is so much better than in PoE that its sort of embarrassing.

 

[prodigydancer]

But to say that the writing is bad? In comparison to what? D: OS? Give me a fucking break.

Full-time D:OS fanboys are obnoxious but few. And no-one takes them seriously anyway. With this in mind, D:OS had its moments: Zombie Jake, the furry wizard and that troll who was teaching his son tricks of the trade (the one trick that is). They really blew it every time they tried to be serious though - drama isn't Larian's strong suit.

 

[Bonerbill]

I don't bash the game but it's hard to deny that some of the criticism is spot on. When you can fit all useful Wizard spells in one memorize selection (grimoire), you know something is wrong.

There is a difference between criticizing the game and bashing the game. The encounter design have problems, of course. Do you think I like that meager grimoire? Of course, I don’t. But to say that the writing is bad? In comparison to what? D: OS? Give me a fucking break.

D: OS writing wasnt recieved well, but combat in D:OS is so much better than in PoE that its sort of embarrassing.

I think it's obvious considering RTwP was never that great of a system to begin with. No way you make turd look decent.

 

[prodigydancer]

I think it's obvious considering RTwP was never that great of a system to begin with. No way you make turd look decent.

 

[J_C]

And I think both the shittyness of DOS's writing and the shittyness of PoE's combat is overexaggerated. Not that this should surprise anyone, we are talking about the Codex here.

 

[Lhynn]

And I think both the shittyness of DOS's writing and the shittyness of PoE's combat is overexaggerated. Not that this should surprise anyone, we are talking about the Codex here.

No one is saying that combat in poe is bad. its just a repetitive grind, due to poor and mostly non existant encounter design, and the character system being banal shit boring. But it certanly has its moments and potential if some stuff was modified, hard counters need to be included for one.

 

[Shevek]

Encounters get pretty good at the end and they are ok before that. If you think the character system sucks, you must have hated the ie games since this is way better than that.

 

[Lhynn]

Encounters get pretty good at the end and they are ok before that. If you think the character system sucks, you must have hated the ie games since this is way better than that.

Its not tho.

 

[Mastermind]

The chanters for instance, are pretty cool.

Not really, mechanics for that class are utter crap. The idea is fine i guess.

What's wrong with their mechanics?

 

[Shevek]

Encounters get pretty good at the end and they are ok before that. If you think the character system sucks, you must have hated the ie games since this is way better than that.

Its not tho.

Sure it is.

 

[Lhynn]

The chanters for instance, are pretty cool.

Not really, mechanics for that class are utter crap. The idea is fine i guess.

What's wrong with their mechanics?

For one they are mostly passive, you can only fit 2 songs if you want to keep the buff constant, higher level songs take longer to finish, thus delaying phrase counter. And then you have the issue with their chants being available after the combat was already defined, some paralyze wont help you 20+ seconds into the fight, by that time if it isnt over you already know where the battle is headed.

 

[Lhynn]

Encounters get pretty good at the end and they are ok before that. If you think the character system sucks, you must have hated the ie games since this is way better than that.

Its not tho.

Sure it is.

Attributes are simply better in AD&D, they tell you more about your character than poe does, and they are not nonsensical stupidity that could be replaced color based attributes like pillars has. Not all warriors are tank, not all rogues are dps, etc. Hard counters make sense because you dont have ghosts sliping on grease or get to burn creatures that dwell in volcanoes, this has a bigger impact than simply looking stupid, this makes it so that every fight ends up being roughly the same, because your tactic work against everything more or less, etc etc.

If you were paying attention instead of being a full time apologist i wouldnt need to tell you this shit..

 

[Shevek]

Half the attributes in the IE games didn't actually do anything and there were next to no stat checks. Nonsensical stupidity is a wisdom, int and charisma stat that does nothing exdept affect a wish spell and minimally lower some store prices.

 

[Lhynn]

Half the attributes in the IE games didn't actually do anything and there were next to no stat checks. Nonsensical stupidity is a wisdom, int and charisma stat that does nothing exdept affect a wish spell and minimally lower some store prices.

Yeah, worst criticism you can elevate against IE attributes is that they werent used enough.

 

[Shevek]

Or, at all. Or when they were used did next to nothing . Or were totally invalidated by items.

 

[Ziem]

The chanters for instance, are pretty cool.

Not really, mechanics for that class are utter crap. The idea is fine i guess.

What's wrong with their mechanics?

their passives are okay, but actives are garbage due to how the game plays out

woohoo i finally get to cast some shitty spell!
oh wait, nvm, the fight is already over

 

[Mastermind]

I've never had that issue during the longer and tougher encounters, even with level 3 phrases.

 

[Lhynn]

Or, at all. Or when they were used did next to nothing . Or were totally invalidated by items.

I would say key stats were very important to their classes, and that importance was extremely clear, i dont see any problem with that, an engineer needs to be smart, so does a mathematician, a politician needs to be wise and charismatic, being strong is not really that will help their career, thats just how things are.
Its good that they were invalidated by items, makes for good and interesting items to find. Never did i regret having 18 dex after finding the gloves of dexterity, i just gave them to a party member that needed them.
I honestly have no idea what you are criticizing here, other that they werent used enough.
PoE attributes, like many of its design flaws were made to ape to IE fans, and just for that reason. Not that it matters anyway, level trumps attributes in both games, the difference is that in one they make sense, in the other they simply dont.

 

[SausageInYourFace]

Attributes are simply better in AD&D, they tell you more about your character than poe does

I would say key stats were very important to their classes

Roll fighter, put everything in str, some in dex and con, dump the rest
Roll mage, put everything in int, dump the rest
Roll rogue, put everything in dex, dump the rest

10/10 character creation, would dump stats again. thank god there is no actual variety, I like things to be same!

 

[Shevek]

Int did nothing at all. In the EE versions, they made it necessary for high level spells but originally you could cast the highest lvl spells with minimal int. Wis was supposed to do more but it just gave a few low level bonus spells (was supposed to affect saving throws I think but it didn't). Basically meaningless. Charisma was pointless. You were flush with cash, so price effects were meaningless and its other effects were very small. The only stats that mattered were str, Dex and con. Even those were implemented shittily since str, for example, was useless in wide ranges.

Of all the places you can critique PoE, stats isn't one of them. The system may not be perfect but its good and certainly allows for FAR more meaningful character customization than the extremely poorly implemented stats in the ie games.

Seriously man, if you think ie did stats right, you have exactly ZERO credibility.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Roll fighter, put everything in str, some in dex and con, dump the rest

Unless you want to dual-class (or wear NPC specific gear with UAI if you dual-class to thief), in BG2 there are mindflayers that will eat your puny brain in one hit if you dump INT (though of course there are potions of Genius).

Roll mage, put everything in int, dump the rest

You also put 18 in DEX, 16 in CON and high WIS if you want to abuse the Wish spell.

Roll rogue, put everything in dex, dump the rest

It's Thief and no one with a brain would dump STR on him, not with his THAC0 level progression (you can't backstab with ranged weapons).