NWN Neverwinter Nights (NWN & NWN2) Modules Thread

[Gargaune]

As for the difficulty of Chapter 2 you alluded to, admittedly it's a daunting prospect for me, not gonna lie, that's one of the reasons I'm gonna put on hold Swordflight for a bit, tinkering on a fun yet powerful build (thinking of LE Monk/Rogue) plus I want to finish up some other stuff on my backlog, namely the second part of the Return to Ravenloft mod, big fan of the setting in general.

Most of Swordflight Ch.2 is still accessible to the average player, it's just the last stretch that spikes in difficulty. And it's totally worth seeing, RK built his own little BG2, that 40-50 hours length is not exaggerated. From Ch.3 onwards, though, things go bananas so get ready to break out the occasional cheat if you're not a powergamer, and I know that because I'm not one. I'm still making my way through Ch.5 in short stints every now and then, I can make headway, but I get worn out quickly.

 

[the mole]

technically the base game is a module right, so can I talk about how I got my ass kicked by kalik like 15 times

 

[solemgar]

Anyone still playing persistent worlds nowadays? Seems like the perfect fit for the trolls and deviants of the forum .

 

[Pikoman]

Anyone still playing persistent worlds nowadays? Seems like the perfect fit for the trolls and deviants of the forum .

About 80% of my total playtime in NWN has been on the Ravenloft themed PW and I've been a fairly active presence on it for about 7 years or so.

On the technical side of things, it's pretty good - lots of areas and dungeons, some of them quite well designed and interesting to explore, a few of them being fairly secret and some class specific (A hidden mage refuge comes to mind). A lot of the dungeons in Barovia and Har'akir are a faithful adaption of the ones found in SSI's Ravenloft games, so I'd imagine it'd be cool for a fan of Strahd's Possession/Stone Prophet to check them out, though they are comparatively antiquated and not very interesting as PvE content compared to the newer locations. There's also a scripted weather/season system in place which influences certain spawns, mobs, loot tables and what have you. Of note is the outcast system for spellcasters/non-humans and others deemed undesirables in the settings.

In regards to the playerbase and DM side it's a mixed bag and can vary greatly - as is the case with big PWs most of the time. I myself have steered away from retarded drama and the resident weirdos and cybersexing degens (there's a sizable amount of those types even if erotic roleplay is a permaban offence according to server rules) have left me alone. DMs aren't very active and approachable as well, unless you're in an official faction, though even that is not certain to net you very frequent DM events and interactions.

Don't know much about the other servers honestly. I am ill inclined to shill about the server I play on, considering it suffers from the common faults of your average PW experience - namely weirdos gravitating towards them, but I'd recommend trying out a PW at least once. When things pick up it can be a great time - no other RPG can replicate the tabletop experience as well as NWN when you participate in an event alongside a competent DM, who can channel Aurora's capabilities. Done my fair share of crazy shit on my toons, but said moments are sandwiched between periods of prolonged relative dullness, but when the 'good' periods come it's great fun.

 

[rogueknight333]

Anyone still playing persistent worlds nowadays? Seems like the perfect fit for the trolls and deviants of the forum .

Several months ago I got a character to level 40 on the World of Greyhawk server. Very old school dungeon design with some reasonably challenging combat (and apparently a lot more emphasis on combat than any sort of role-playing, but maybe that was just me). It appeared to have a decent number of players and active and helpful DMs.

 

[solemgar]

Anyone still playing persistent worlds nowadays? Seems like the perfect fit for the trolls and deviants of the forum .

About 80% of my total playtime in NWN has been on the Ravenloft themed PW and I've been a fairly active presence on it for about 7 years or so.

On the technical side of things, it's pretty good - lots of areas and dungeons, some of them quite well designed and interesting to explore, a few of them being fairly secret and some class specific (A hidden mage refuge comes to mind). A lot of the dungeons in Barovia and Har'akir are a faithful adaption of the ones found in SSI's Ravenloft games, so I'd imagine it'd be cool for a fan of Strahd's Possession/Stone Prophet to check them out, though they are comparatively antiquated and not very interesting as PvE content compared to the newer locations. There's also a scripted weather/season system in place which influences certain spawns, mobs, loot tables and what have you. Of note is the outcast system for spellcasters/non-humans and others deemed undesirables in the settings.

In regards to the playerbase and DM side it's a mixed bag and can vary greatly - as is the case with big PWs most of the time. I myself have steered away from retarded drama and the resident weirdos and cybersexing degens (there's a sizable amount of those types even if erotic roleplay is a permaban offence according to server rules) have left me alone. DMs aren't very active and approachable as well, unless you're in an official faction, though even that is not certain to net you very frequent DM events and interactions.

Don't know much about the other servers honestly. I am ill inclined to shill about the server I play on, considering it suffers from the common faults of your average PW experience - namely weirdos gravitating towards them, but I'd recommend trying out a PW at least once. When things pick up it can be a great time - no other RPG can replicate the tabletop experience as well as NWN when you participate in an event alongside a competent DM, who can channel Aurora's capabilities. Done my fair share of crazy shit on my toons, but said moments are sandwiched between periods of prolonged relative dullness, but when the 'good' periods come it's great fun.

I played in prisoners of the mist for like a year. I found it very unwelcoming for good aligned characters, to the point I ended in a small feud with some of edgelord players and decided to stop playing. I found the server exactly as you described and In lieu with my previous experiences years back , especially around cybersexting (comes to mind an epic moment of skeletons wearing strap-ons on the drown city to please matrons, and this is one of the lightest ones lol).

I also found the server geared a lot towards rogues, and regarding my comment about good aligned characters, well I guess they are bound to have a bad time as per the setting anyways

I might give it another shot, was planning to build a rogue/fighter swashbuckling type but not sure how successful that character can be in this server. In the end, you need to be somehow self sustaining in order to have a bit of a wholesome experience in PW servers .

 

[Gargaune]

comes to mind an epic moment of skeletons wearing strap-ons on the drown city to please matrons

( •_•)>⌐■-■

Guess you might say they had a...

(⌐■_■)

boner.

 

[solemgar]

comes to mind an epic moment of skeletons wearing strap-ons on the drown city to please matrons

( •_•)>⌐■-■

Guess you might say they had a...

(⌐■_■)

boner.

I salute you sir

 

[Pikoman]

I played in prisoners of the mist for like a year. I found it very unwelcoming for good aligned characters, to the point I ended in a small feud with some of edgelord players and decided to stop playing. I found the server exactly as you described and In lieu with my previous experiences years back , especially around cybersexting (comes to mind an epic moment of skeletons wearing strap-ons on the drown city to please matrons, and this is one of the lightest ones lol).

I also found the server geared a lot towards rogues, and regarding my comment about good aligned characters, well I guess they are bound to have a bad time as per the setting anyways

I might give it another shot, was planning to build a rogue/fighter swashbuckling type but not sure how successful that character can be in this server. In the end, you need to be somehow self sustaining in order to have a bit of a wholesome experience in PW servers .

Good aligned characters have some factions they can fit in but it depends on your concept and how active and welcoming said faction is. The Cult of the Morninglord comes to mind as well as the Church of Ezra's good aligned sects. Most of the player created and manned factions are some flavour of Good, the Christian faction coming to mind as one of the more prominent ones with their own rental acting as a headquarters and their temple of sorts. Problem is that the Wayfarer Kinship - the formerly traditional catch-all DM supported faction for good aligned adventurer types, has been evicted from Barovia - the main RP hub for characters who'd be interested in adventuring and monster hunting, because they directly challenged Strahd. If you aren't interested in faction play then it's probably going to be an uphill battle and a luck of the draw in regards to whether you'll find a stable group of toons who'd be willing to welcome you in their social circle. Problem is that Mist Camp types for example aren't the brightest roleplayers per say and a lot of them treat the game as an MMO-lite. Still - the MC is the most inclusive social hub and you'd have no problem in regards to joining a party to go dungeoning, as long as you are level appropriate for the stuff they intend to do. An easy way to get a thing going for your PC is joining some of the rentals acting as bars/taverns as well, they're usually hiring security types or bartenders. The most reliable stream of RP though, without having to go through the problems of finding a group of likeminded individuals, is perhaps playing a Garda character. Seldom a boring day as a Garda, though one mustn't be too trigger happy, lest some shitter decides to corpeshide you.

As for rogue/fighter, it is a solid combination as usual, though it is overshadowed by the Beguiler in regards to ninjalooting and the Pure Fighter in regards to PvE and PvP, the fighter has its own schtick in POTM in regards to Combat Forms which I've been told are powerful, haven't played fighter enough to tell you - used to main rogue/fighter skullduggery types. If you're willing to roll an evil or at the very least morally gray rogue-flavoured character, the Red Vardo Traders are usually great fun and my fondest memories have probably been in that faction in particular. Heists, kidnappings, assassinations, Indiana Jones type temple delving etc. - a lot of variety when it comes to DM events and they're usually frequent. Still, it comes with the caveat that you're at risk of the odd PvP spat and the higher likelihood of player conflict being a common theme.

The ERP part of your post, well oof - full with weirdos and deviants as previously mentioned yup. I've been unusually fortunate to avoid such events and serious OOC drama firsthand, but the vast majority of players I've interacted with OOCly have had their own streak of ugly stories be it as spectators or direct participants in them. People have been spotted licking feet and similar shit, there was a Drow group which allegedly indulged in good ol' BDSM rape dungeon type of RP, the infamous cave near Vallaki where a RDD character had a whole clique of people....tasting their "dragon essence" via unchristianlike sources and so on, and so on.

 

[Ramnozack]

Only have a few weeks worth of experience with POTM, but from what I remember its pretty grindy in terms of leveling up, both your crafting skills and your actual level. Have to dedicate a lot of time to doing dungeons and just typing shit in chat to "rp" constantly if you want to level up at a reasonable rate. That put me off just a little, but its probably the best PW I've played so far. Didn't really encounter any weirdos though, specially not any erp ones, so I guess Im lucky.

The worst I've seen was some fuckin random dwarf coming up and stealing my ore off the ground that I was mining and then tried to slowly walk off with it. Told the bald midget to drop it multiple times but he kept giving me lip so I hit him with a cloud of bewilderment and shot him to death with a bow and took my stuff back. Afterwards he got salty and kept dm'ing me bs about how I wasn't rp'ing blah blah.

Overall though the people were nice, rp was cool, remember having to smuggle some opium into a small mining town in the mountains, but there was a player with the local guard, guarding the entrance and checking peoples inventory and their oxen. But seeing as I was determined to start an opioid epidemic in this small town, I cast invisibility on myself and my oxen before entering the village and snuck in through the back. Just an example of the fun stuff you can do on the server.

 

[solemgar]

Thanks Pikoman rogueknight333 and Ramnozack for sharing your experiences.

I might dip again into POTM , just the lack of time to commit to the game brings me down a bit, specially considering how slow the progression is.

 

[MjKorz]

Any internal info on when Luke Scull's Doom of Icewind Dale is coming out? Been waiting for that one for quite a while.

 

[Pikoman]

Alright, after quickly clearing out some other modules from my backlog, I binged Swordflight Chapter I the past few days and I have just completed it. I do think that even as a prologue mod it overshadows a lot of the larger ones in quality, let alone the other prologue type campaigns. For example Chapter I of Swordflight is superior to Return to Ravenloft's Part I which in itself I think is one of the pretty good introductory modules. As for difficulty, I found it to be quite fair and balanced, I don't think there was a moment in which I was stuck with my Rogue/Monk, though admittedly I did not fight Ramurg and the Skeletal Gladiator. Those two mobs would've probably made short work of me, the Gladiator in particular considering I did not have the necessary tools to challenge him at that point in time. Ramurg I could see beating with the tons of traps I had in my disposal, but it would've been quite the undertaking. I'd also like to say that I didn't even deplete my resources that much, buffing pots and similar items were only used for the really tough encounters which would've been nigh impossible without them. All in all, what I'm saying is that I don't understand some of the people who decry Chapter I in particular as being frustratingly hard, I am not a genius in regards to builds and mechanics but I didn't have much trouble. It is still a challenging module, but its difficulty made the experience all the more satisfying and I had an excellent time with Swordflight's encounters/combat design and with its other strong points such as writing, questing, dungeeonering and roleplay reactivity.

Before embarking on a long journey in Chapter II, I'd like to ask you guys as well as rogueknight if he reads this post. First things first, I am using this monk build right here which shows up as the most recent one published in that thread - https://forum.neverwintervault.org/t/swordflight-builds-only/2538/27. I've done some minor adjustments on it, the most obvious one being that I took Rogue on my first level since there was no way in hell I was missing out on the extra skill points. I was also more liberal in regards to skill point allocations, namely investing in Persuasion and Intimidation, since it'd be a waste to not have some RP skills considering Swordflight's frequent use of those in dialogue.

What are your general thoughts on the build outlined in the link above? Bit weirded out myself on stuff like taking Improved Initiative and Improved Stunning Fist instead of Expertise or the two-handed feats. Unsure what the dude meant by taking 'Weapon Focus', failing to specify further what said Focus was in.
Also, provided the build is a bit clapped in some respects and I'd like to reroll, would getting my exported toon into a character editor and manually relevelling it fuck up stuff in regards to Chapter II? Forgot to add a deity as well so there is another reason why I'd wish to edit my character, just wondering if that would cause some issues. Playing on EE btw.

 

[Sabotin]

I think you'd miss on some "Zarala remembers that" moments, but otherwise not much if you import a different character. Quest items get added at the start I believe?

The build seems kinda random, is there some specific goal? Am I missing something with initiative and it's not nigh useless...

I think mnk/rog builds go for the high dex stuff and a crazy number of (sneak) attacks with kamas usually, with kinda even levels. You'll definitely want a strong attack with a martial build, which is harder for non-full BAB classes.

 

[Gargaune]

Any internal info on when Luke Scull's Doom of Icewind Dale is coming out? Been waiting for that one for quite a while.

There's supposed to be a complete build available for his Beta-access Patrons, Scull's just sorting out some stuff before a public release. Soon™. Maybe.

Also, provided the build is a bit clapped in some respects and I'd like to reroll, would getting my exported toon into a character editor and manually relevelling it fuck up stuff in regards to Chapter II? Forgot to add a deity as well so there is another reason why I'd wish to edit my character, just wondering if that would cause some issues. Playing on EE btw.

If I recall correctly, the DB lookup will match the multiplayer account name and the full character name, so as long as you haven't changed your local account, rerolling the same character with the exact same name should allow you to progress with your existing choice flags. Also, for simple changes like just adding a deity, you can use the GFF Editor to edit your PC either in /localvault/ in between chapters or the player.bic inside of a save.

 

[rogueknight333]

.... What are your general thoughts on the build outlined in the link above? ...

NWN checks Initiative according to D&D rules, but the RTwP system means that Initiative almost never actually does anything useful, so taking feats to improve Initiative is rather pointless. Putting skill points in Discipline is also of questionable value, since unless your AC is abnormally low (and a Monk build's AC would normally be exceptionally high, if anything), most any hit that can get past your AC will also be good enough to win the Discipline check, making the skill rather redundant. Not including the Blindfight feat somewhere in the build is also less than optimal. Stunning can be useful, but only situationally (many monsters will be immune), so probably less than ideal to put so much effort into boosting that as well.

Since the build is built around stunning the Weapon Focus feat is presumably in Unarmed Strike, as you need to use that to get Stuns. Kamas are arguably a better choice on balance than going unarmed, though either can work and there are some advantages either way.

A Monk build should typically either take Weapon Finesse and focus heavily on DEX, or Zen Archery and focus heavily on WIS, rather than trying to advance both abilities (STR based Monk is also possible).

In general, Monk builds tend to have very good defence but are weak in offence, especially at higher levels. They are good tanks if you have another party member to do the DPSing for you, but that will not always be the case in SP, though sometimes a henchman can handle that role. If you go with a build similar to the one in the link you are likely to have some fights where you struggle to do damage, though the books you will find allowing Monks to cast Divine Power should be helpful, and multi-classing to Rogue can provide skills like Set Traps and Use Magic Device, which can expand your offensive options as well, so it should be playable enough.

 

[MjKorz]

Any internal info on when Luke Scull's Doom of Icewind Dale is coming out? Been waiting for that one for quite a while.

There's supposed to be a complete build available for his Beta-access Patrons, Scull's just sorting out some stuff before a public release. Soon™. Maybe.

Yeah, I know about the beta. Not going to spoil the experience for myself, I'll wait for the full launch. Hope he can manage to release it this year.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Putting skill points in Discipline is also of questionable value,

Not if you're rolling a barbarian with high str and con, and not bothering to do much about your ac.

 

[Pikoman]

NWN checks Initiative according to D&D rules, but the RTwP system means that Initiative almost never actually does anything useful, so taking feats to improve Initiative is rather pointless. Putting skill points in Discipline is also of questionable value, since unless your AC is abnormally low (and a Monk build's AC would normally be exceptionally high, if anything), most any hit that can get past your AC will also be good enough to win the Discipline check, making the skill rather redundant. Not including the Blindfight feat somewhere in the build is also less than optimal. Stunning can be useful, but only situationally (many monsters will be immune), so probably less than ideal to put so much effort into boosting that as well.

Since the build is built around stunning the Weapon Focus feat is presumably in Unarmed Strike, as you need to use that to get Stuns. Kamas are arguably a better choice on balance than going unarmed, though either can work and there are some advantages either way.

A Monk build should typically either take Weapon Finesse and focus heavily on DEX, or Zen Archery and focus heavily on WIS, rather than trying to advance both abilities (STR based Monk is also possible).

In general, Monk builds tend to have very good defence but are weak in offence, especially at higher levels. They are good tanks if you have another party member to do the DPSing for you, but that will not always be the case in SP, though sometimes a henchman can handle that role. If you go with a build similar to the one in the link you are likely to have some fights where you struggle to do damage, though the books you will find allowing Monks to cast Divine Power should be helpful, and multi-classing to Rogue can provide skills like Set Traps and Use Magic Device, which can expand your offensive options as well, so it should be playable enough.

Thanks! I did think something was up with the weird focus on Initiative feats, yeah. I will probably be taking Weapon Focus in kamas, the two-weapon feats(ambidexterity and that other one) and naturally blind fight. Will also try and even up a little bit my levels so I can have access to a higher UMD skill and a better Sneak Attack roll to offset my Monk's middling damage at least when it comes to enemies that aren't immune to sneak attacks. Currently lvl 4 Monk and lvl 1 Rogue at the start of Chapter II, might start to invest in more Rogue levels after I get lvl 5 or 6 in Monk.

 

[Pikoman]

Was goofing around the NWN wiki sometime ago and I saw that in order to flank your PC should be on the opposite side of the mob that's currently attacked - just like in PnP. Is it actually that way or the article is incorrect? I always used to think that you'd simply have to attack a currently attacked mob in order to "flank", your exact position being irrelevant in regards to getting the flanking AB bonus.

 

[Gargaune]

Was goofing around the NWN wiki sometime ago and I saw that in order to flank your PC should be on the opposite side of the mob that's currently attacked - just like in PnP. Is it actually that way or the article is incorrect? I always used to think that you'd simply have to attack a currently attacked mob in order to "flank", your exact position being irrelevant in regards to getting the flanking AB bonus.

I never even knew NWN implemented it. It seems like one of those things that's gonna be more incidental than deliberate in RTwP, especially with NWN's "dance of death" and constant retargetting, and a bit of a pain in the butt to test just for academic purposes. Sneak Attack merely requires that the target be engaged with another character, rather than a specific position.

On a tangent, why did D&D call it "flanking" if you're meant to be "directly opposite", anyway? Flanking would be to either side, whereas this is a "backstab" attack bonus.

 

[Pikoman]

I never even knew NWN implemented it. It seems like one of those things that's gonna be more incidental than deliberate in RTwP, especially with NWN's "dance of death" and constant retargetting, and a bit of a pain in the butt to test just for academic purposes. Sneak Attack merely requires that the target be engaged with another character, rather than a specific position.

On a tangent, why did D&D call it "flanking" if you're meant to be "directly opposite", anyway? Flanking would be to either side, whereas this is a "backstab" attack bonus.

Checked the Defensive Awareness II feat and the blurb text explaining why your dwarf can no longer be flanked says that they have "awareness" of people behind them as well - more or less confirming what the flanking article on the wiki says. Still don't know if it's implemented literally that way though. It'd be cool if it is IMO, not like it's gonna be that much of a game-changer for my strategy while fighting, but weirdly enough I always liked positioning myself and wrangling my henchman to try and do the same during the "dance of death". It does add a layer of tactical complexity while facing tough encounters.

 

[rogueknight333]

The nwn wiki is usually very reliable, so most likely correct. I am not sure how rigorously the game defines "opposite" though. I think I have gotten the flanking bonus from positions closer to an actual flanking than the rear, but as Gargaune says it is very hard to be sure about such things due to the chaos of RtWP + Dance of Death.

 

[Pikoman]

After taking my sweet time with Swordflight Chapter II, I'm happy to say that I've completed it. All of the good things said about it weren't a bit exaggerated, it really is a Baldur's Gate-esque adventure with myself liking certain parts of the experience more than Swordflight's spiritual ancestors. I don't think there ever was a moment where I was incredibly frustrated or bored with the module and there are many stand-out moments, but my favorite part of the game was the Forest of Mir goblin army quest. Prior to leaving the city I was starting to kick ass and had a comparatively easy time, as much as one can have an easy time in the series. But the moment I entered Tebnas, the goblins and their hill giants started assraping me like crazy, I really had to think about my strategy this time around and was forced to avoid overlooking even the most minute and minor advantadge I could use. It was a big jump in difficulty, but a welcome one at that. Smashing the gobbos was incredibly satisfying and the quest presented arguably the most difficult encounter of the chapter - Gorav, Ulaz and the Aranea caster. Apart from the humanoid army portions, the class quest for evil rogues and the one for monks were excellent and one of the most memorable parts of my playthrough.

The companions I also found to be quite interesting. Lead performer in that regard is naturally Zagash the fucking baller. Dude made life so much easier for me on so many occasions due the merit of being undead or having a fear aura around him. I got used to him so much that I started to dread doing the "Help Zekar" quest with Talu and Snajagh who I didn't even gear up or adventure with beforehand - instead opting for Chelys and Barazh. Thankfully much difficulty was offset by Snajagh being a Cleric and the temporary Harper companion having an undead instakill rapier. The Helmite orc duo henchmen and their quest were likewise quite cool, as was the brief half-fiend companion you could have for the Zekar tower.

The RP options and reactivity are as great as they were in Chapter I, so in summary - excellent. As a player of an evil PC I really liked that being a baddie was not penalized nor discourgaged as much as it is in some of the classic CRPG titles. If anything, it's probably more optimal to play an evil or at the very least neutral, leaning to evil, character due to Zagash being so useful as well as the half-fiend quite literally being able to solo the tower for you.

Now, I'm gonna have to ask again for tips on my build here, since epic level character building are uncharted waters for myself. I've had a pretty good time with this build and as I've said above I can't say I ever hit a wall and struggled for a very long time with an encounter. It is a bit worrisome for me that my sneak attacks are most likely going to get increasingly irrelevant as time goes on and more enemies wind up being immune to crits and sneak attacks. I've been very greedy with the two-handed feats and I am yet to take the almost essential Blind Fight, which should be my last feat before epic levels, unless you guys think something else is more worth it. For the other things I don't have much idea in all honesty, be it spreading my levels and taking feats after lvl 20, so any help is welcome!

 

[rogueknight333]

Good to know you enjoyed the module, though perhaps you should be warned that most people do not think the subsequent chapters are as good, so if you continue the series you have an excellent chance of running into situations that are either incredibly frustrating or boring, which one perhaps depending on how much of a power gamer one is.

Playing as evil is supposed to be more advantageous, on average. As I saw it, if being good offered more material advantages than being evil, there is no reason why any character in the world with more than half a brain would ever be evil.

The biggest problem with your build is that your BAB, and AB generally, are a bit low, so you can expect to sometimes struggle against enemies with high AC (who are not that rare in Swordflight). Again, the books allowing Monks to cast Divine Power should be of some help here. Blindfight in indeed the most crucial feat to get, though Toughness and Improved Critical: Kama would also have been nice to take if you could have fit them in somewhere. Once in Epic levels you should probably primarily focus on taking Great Dexterity feats and try to eventually get Epic Dodge. For that you will need to take the Defensive Roll feat as a Rogue bonus feat at level 10 (you already have Improved Evasion from Monk) and keep your Tumble skill up (which you want to do anyway for the AC bonus). Monk starts to offer diminishing returns past level 20, so you might want to start focusing more on Rogue at that point.