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Preview Oblivion E3 hype from ConsoleGold

Saint_Proverbius

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obediah said:
Well Morrowind was made with crappy x-box in mind, and say what you will about it, at no point while playing it did it feel like a console port. Not that Bethesda couldn't fuck it up this time, but I think they did an okay dual release last time.

No, it didn't feel like one except the scope of it felt rather limited. There was gobs of terrain to cover and some dungeons here and there, but not much to really do.

That said, given how Morrowind for the PC got all those neat expansions, mods and other things, you'd have to be stupid to buy the XBox 360 version of Oblivion.

The KotoR reaked of shitty port. Run through the game in glorious 1600x1200 and pick up phat lewt. Open inventory and the screen turns into a postage stamp. So I have to scroll around these tiny little windows to read text and look for my midichlorian potion while 85% of my screen is black. What fucking retards.

Well, everything from the controls to the interfaces screamed THIS GAME IS A PORT. Not to mention the fun interviews with BioWare boys about how they're altering the game's controls and interface for the PC release - which they obviously didn't spend a lot of time on.
 

NeutralMilkHotel

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Dec 14, 2004
Messages
389
Saint_Proverbius said:
obediah said:
Well Morrowind was made with crappy x-box in mind, and say what you will about it, at no point while playing it did it feel like a console port. Not that Bethesda couldn't fuck it up this time, but I think they did an okay dual release last time.

No, it didn't feel like one except the scope of it felt rather limited. There was gobs of terrain to cover and some dungeons here and there, but not much to really do.

That said, given how Morrowind for the PC got all those neat expansions, mods and other things, you'd have to be stupid to buy the XBox 360 version of Oblivion.

I don't think so. I believe they've stated that they're looking into how to get downloadable software to the 360 version. I wouldn't be surprised if they made a service that supplied downloads for mods and expansions for the 360 version.

So it might be somewhat of a hassle, but then again upgrading hardware for the PC is a pain in the ass as well. So I would think both versions have their pro's and con's.
 

MrSmileyFaceDude

Bethesda Game Studios
Developer
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Sep 24, 2004
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716
ALL Xbox 360 titles must be Live enabled. Oblivion is no exception.

GCM: One of the things Microsoft is pushing with the 360 is the ability to connect with anyone anywhere in the world. Will Oblivion take advantage of the online capabilities of that system?
Todd Howard: We’re planning some cool Xbox Live things, mostly involving lots of downloadable content and mods, but I can’t really get specific yet.
 

Deathy

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 15, 2002
Messages
793
NeutralMilkHotel said:
I don't think so. I believe they've stated that they're looking into how to get downloadable software to the 360 version. I wouldn't be surprised if they made a service that supplied downloads for mods and expansions for the 360 version.

Patches, too?

Well, the line between consoles and PC's is ever blurring.
 

Spazmo

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The main thing I hate about consoles has always quite simply been gamepads. Most types of games just play better with a keyboard and mouse. I don't really mind limitations on graphics or memory usage as a consequence of console portage (which will not be issues with Xbox360 and PS3 ports... for about a year after the release of those platforms), I just really hate using a keyboard and mouse to navigate an interface designed for a gamepad. That's the main reason Morrowind could be ported so easily (beyond the many efforts of Bethesda's programming staff, of course): the first person perspective is a lot easier to do on console than the isometric POV RPGs ought to have (I'm not saying that's why Morrowind was first person; that would be a stupid thing to say given that Daggerfall and Arena were similarly FP). I honestly think that those goddamn gamepads are really holding all the console platforms back. Most of them intend to be just one device you can buy and play any game on. The eventual plan of console manufacturers is for people to have PCs for work, web surfing and other junk and play games on consoles. That wouldn't be so bad if I wasn't forced to play RPGs and RTSes on a control device intended for Street Fighter II.
 

Drakron

Arcane
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Messages
6,326
MS have been ... not very keen of allowing Live service to patch games, perhaps they know too well who joined their ship and by allowing patches to be common place it would mean publishers sould act as in the PC market, "release and patch" ... its bad enough already with some Xbox titles that are very bugged (such as SW:KotOR2:TSL).

Bugged release games would mean one of the greatest confort of console games (being less bugged that PC titles) would go away from the Xbox 360, something that Sony would take advantage of.

Also Live service is not world reaching, in my country there is no Live service and so the first online console was the PS2 and not the Xbox, I doubt the situation will change with Xbox 360.
 

FireWolf

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The Corporate Machine
The whole reason why I said I wasn't trying to be an asshole is because that statement did come off a bit assholish. The problem I have with starting in a prison just makes little sense to me. "Hi, I'm a criminal. Can I help you with your problems?" Not to mention the issue of how you get let out of prison. "Okay, you're a down right criminal that we've locked up to keep away from society, but since there's this cataclysm going on, we'll let you out to save the world." Frankly, I don't want to play being a criminal, even a wronged criminal, I tend towards the moderately good/questionably moraled character, and being caught is just plain insulting :)

Sequels that play out exactly the same as previous itterations are the bane of existence. It is a "championchip manager" thought process. I don't really want to play the game equvalent of the rocky series.

The majority of bugs in PC games tend towards the "incompatible hardware/software" issues simply due to the sheer range of PC products available to the PC gamer. Of course, there are other errors, crashes and other things that arn't directly related to PC component variability, but there is always the safety cushion of patches which encourages publishers to put silly constraints on developers. What is confusing about this state of affairs is that Publishers havent caught onto the fact that releasing a bug-ridden game with potential is going to offer poorer sales than a game with good potential having a longer development time and fewer bugs.

I prayed the xbox would come out with a mouse and keyboard, or at least something similar like the stategy master peripheral that added more keys. The introduction of analogue sticks was impressive and added greatly to the versatility of the gamepad, but the mouse is still quicker, more relaxing to use and more accurate for FPS, RTS and other games. About the only titles that I can comfortably say the gamepad is better is a hack and slash or third person adventure where direct control of the character's 360 degree movement just makes things easier, but even then a mouse would still be helpful and the keyboard also satisfies that kind of movement almost as well.

As a rule, I tend not to enjoy ported console titles, or pc titles ported to the console. Titles that are jointly developed always seem to fall short of the mark. The console's controls often limit the versatility of the mouse/keyboard combination in the PC version, as well as the different demands of both markets for specific genres on these diverse platforms. I'll not say that console players tend towards less complex titles, as this isn't the case. Merely that expectations are different and either one or both sides will be dissapointed by trying to satisfy everyone.
 

crpgnut

Augur
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Messages
337
Location
St. Louis,MO,USA
This is just my 2¢. Though I use the start location argument, it really applies to anyone who doesn't like a certain feature of any game :D

I'm not sure why anyone would complain about where you start in a game. Does it matter? What would your ideal start location be? Would that be the ideal start location for every other human on the planet? Didn't think so. TES games have always started with you basically being a prisoner. Daggerfall was a slight deviation. You were still trapped in a location though. In all cases, you are only a prisoner for a very short time. It really doesn't matter where the game starts, so Bethesda just stayed with their traditional opening. That's all there is to it. Nobody is going to change the game just for the 0.000001% of whiners who don't like a certain feature.

I don't really like the changes they're making to combat. It isn't going to affect my purchase decision; I'll preorder the second it is available. Why? I've enjoyed enough of the aspects of all the other games in the series to overlook the few aspects I didn't like.

Gee MSFD, I've bought multiple copies of all your games. I want you to go back, right now, and change combat so that it is the perfect system for me. I don't care that you've worked hard for 3 years creating something that all the designers and QA people have had input on, I want it to cater to my whim and my whim only. You mean you can't do that? Well then, I'm going to post that you suck on every forum I visit. I'll ruin you! You won't make a dime because I have aligned myself against you.

Does the above paragraph sound like the ranting of an insane person? Of course it does :D
 

Drakron

Arcane
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Messages
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FireWolf said:
The majority of bugs in PC games tend towards the "incompatible hardware/software" issues simply due to the sheer range of PC products available to the PC gamer.

Used to be.

Most bugs are script errors and that shows sloppy beta testing.

Look at KotOR2, there are script errors that prevent two quests to be completed because the script have the variables wrong.

Publishers use the hardware/software excuse to rush games down the door, one thing is Nvidia latest drivers making the game run slow, another is a dialogue loop because of a script error, you cannot blame anyone but the developer for the script.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
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"Most types of games just play better with a keyboard and mouse."

No. This false. And, full of shit. And, so much balony that it's disgusting.
 

Spazmo

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You're telling me you could play Baldur's Gate on a gamepad? Starcraft? Far Cry? And I don't give a flying fuck if you don't play those last two games or that type of game ("R00FLES!!!"), it's still just true: keyboard and mouse is just plain better for most types of games. If not, why does KOTOR play the way it does? Why do console FPSes have autoaim? And why do all console RTSes suck? Because of the gamepad. It's just not as good as keyboard and mouse.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
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"You're telling me you could play Baldur's Gate on a gamepad?"

Why the hell not? I pretty much played the IE games with just the left click on the mouse, and the space bar to pause. That's two buttons which console controllers cna easily control. The keyboard is just more useful for quick entry; but even then it doens't really go much quicker. Not to mention, it is possible to use a keyboard with consoles - at least the PS2.

And, oh, sports games are 100% better on console with a controller than they are with a computer's keyboard and control. No contest.
 

Spazmo

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I said most, not all. Sports and fighting games probably play better on gamepads. And the hypothetical ability of a given console to support keyboards is totally irrelevant when the games are designed for gamepads anyways.
 

Major_Blackhart

Codexia Lord Sodom
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Games developed at the same time for consoles and PC... DX2 anyone? Or was everyone just trying to avoid that giant pink elephant in the room.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
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"And the hypothetical ability of a given console to support keyboards is totally irrelevant when the games are designed for gamepads anyways."

Um. No. A PS2 does support keyboards. This isn't hypothetical. This is a fact.
 

Spazmo

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[quote="Volourn"Um. No. A PS2 does support keyboards. This isn't hypothetical. This is a fact.[/quote]

Congratulations on failing to address the point. Keyboard support aside, PS2 games are still made for gamepads. Keyboard support is hypothetical because nothing on consoles uses them.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
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Still crying over spilled milk?

Keyboard for games = overrated


Period.
 

Saint_Proverbius

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Volourn Theory in action, yet again.

Maybe one day Volourn will figure out why you could only move one character at a time in KotOR's combat where you could move all six in Baldur's Gate.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
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I know. BIO sloppiness in that regard. Go figure. Did you know there are tons of console games that consist of player controlled parties that the PC can control the individual characters seperately. KOTOR's control problems is not a console problem. It's a design problem for that specific game. Moron.
 

FireWolf

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That the PS2 has a keyboard makes very, very little difference. The key peripheral for the PC is the mouse. The keyboard, as I suggested previously, could be replaced with a dedicated array of buttons since, in PC games, that's all they tend to be use for: a range of keys who's position is known that provide hotkeys for actions in a game. The mouse provides a significantly better degree of accuracy and speed over an analogue stick for positioning things like a crosshair or a cursor.

Incidently, PS2 might have a keyboard, but the PC has gamepads, joysticks, mice, keyboards, specifically designed hotkey peripherals, programmable keypresses and endless other gadgets that mean you can play console designed games on a PC without altering the control system.

Games developed at the same time for consoles and PC... DX2 anyone? Or was everyone just trying to avoid that giant pink elephant in the room.

I've heard bad things about this title. However, since I haven't played the title, I don't feel qualified to talk about it.

I'm not sure why anyone would complain about where you start in a game. Does it matter? What would your ideal start location be?

When your main interest in a game is the story and your role within a world, rather than graphical flare or busty elves, where you start is important - as important as where the story of your character ends. Don't suggest I go read a book instead, since story telling in a book and storytelling in a game are entirely different. Books are stories about other people's characters who you relate to and are entirely dislocated from the reader. Game's stories are intereactive and tell the story of your character through situations defined by the game developers. Starting off as a criminal in every title merely because 'we've always done it' isn't, to my mind, a valid excuse for continuing to exhibit a lack of imagination. There is no perfect answer to the question of where to start, everyone is different, doesn't mean you shouldn't try to come up with interesting and new situations. That Oblivion starts in a dungeon probably wont impact me greatly, since I haven't played any elder scrolls games besides morrowind, but that doesn't mean my opinions regarding variation in stories is any less valid. I want to experience new stories, not relive the old ones with bump mapped nipples.
 

Hazelnut

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UK
FireWolf said:
Games developed at the same time for consoles and PC... DX2 anyone? Or was everyone just trying to avoid that giant pink elephant in the room.

I've heard bad things about this title. However, since I haven't played the title, I don't feel qualified to talk about it.

I loved Deus Ex, but DX2 left me cold - in fact I still haven't finished it. Wouldn't bother if I were you.

Oh and "Pink Elephant" - huh? I think you mean "White Elephant"? :lol: (reference)

FireWolf said:
I'm not sure why anyone would complain about where you start in a game. Does it matter? What would your ideal start location be?

When your main interest in a game is the story and your role within a world, rather than graphical flare or busty elves, where you start is important - as important as where the story of your character ends. Don't suggest I go read a book instead, since story telling in a book and storytelling in a game are entirely different. Books are stories about other people's characters who you relate to and are entirely dislocated from the reader. Game's stories are intereactive and tell the story of your character through situations defined by the game developers. Starting off as a criminal in every title merely because 'we've always done it' isn't, to my mind, a valid excuse for continuing to exhibit a lack of imagination. <snip>

Yes, you are absolutely right - where you start is vital to those of us that buy games for reasons other than the busty elves pictured in mag ads. In fact I think that it's for exactly this reason that PC's start imprisoned in the TES game - because the way they do it implies absolutely nothing about the PC except for they somehow ended up locked up. It doesn't imply criminality/immorality or anything. Maybe you were a scapegoat, or said the wrong things about the local warlord or slept with his son/daughter etc etc. Iit's a blank slate with no context, because it's a location/situation that's been forced on the PC and not chosen (unless the PC broke in for some reason :roll: ) as well as having as many explanations as your imagination can think of. Unlike working on a farm when someone rides in on horseback with a note from the emperor: "Would you please save the word for us? Ta very much, Emp."

It's only a 'tradition' because they it works well and gives them the kind of open ended starting point that they want. Jeez there's enough stuff to improve without changing something that works so well.. :lol:
 

Sol Invictus

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Pax Romana
Speaking of awesome PC peripherals, I just bought this:
6401.jpg
 

FireWolf

Liturgist
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Messages
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The Corporate Machine
I've been thinking about getting a new mouse. Let me know how that one works out.

Being in a dungeon I can understand working for one title. But always starting out in a dungeon in every elder scrolls game seems a little lacking in the originality department. I'm sure that if some effort was put into it, a different convincing story that involves the PC in the main plot could be devised. Hell, your start could be defined by your class choice. I'm all for multiple endings to games, why not multiple beginings, too?
 

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