Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Obsidian and inXile acquired by Microsoft

Allyriadil

Educated
Joined
Jun 9, 2018
Messages
38
So future games will probably be a Win 10 exclusive, no wonder why Valve is investing so heavily into Linux.
Fucking Microsoft just closing their eco system more and more, at least I will just pirate it if it's even worth playing at all...
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.
 

Luckmann

Arcane
Zionist Agent
Joined
Jul 20, 2009
Messages
3,759
Location
Scandinavia
There is a huge market saturation for isometric crpgs.
Haha, nigger what? Time to pass the bong along and go lie down, man, you're talking nonsense. Someone perform a FAST, because I think Templar might be having a stroke.
If they make me choose between the Windows Store and piracy, I will choose piracy every time.
Unless things change, classic piracy will become increasingly hard, especially with integrated DRM platforms like the Windows store, combined with increasingly acceptance and reliance on "always-online" software. Every game and every platform will eventually be some kind of online or multiplayer game, and in the end they'll stream the last missing parts of a game, encrypted, to your toaster, and the game will be unplayable without it.

It's part of why platforms like this are so dangerous. They've been conditioning people for over a decade now and made multiple attempts, and with connectivity being more and more of a non-issue, soon they won't give a fuck about chinese rice-farmers, desert towel-heads, hicks in rural Amerikkka, or criminal britbongs in the Australian outback, because they don't represent a relevant market share in the grand scheme of things Jewry.
 

J_C

One Bit Studio
Patron
Developer
Joined
Dec 28, 2010
Messages
16,947
Location
Pannonia
Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.
You sound like it is obvious that sane people are using Linux, but the reality is that you are more retarded if you think like that. In what world are you living in? There are core group of people who are using Linux, but the average Joe (which is 96% of the gaming market) is just using the more comfortable Windows platform. Don't make yourself delusional, Linux is nowhere near Windows and probably never will be.
 

Luckmann

Arcane
Zionist Agent
Joined
Jul 20, 2009
Messages
3,759
Location
Scandinavia
So future games will probably be a Win 10 exclusive, no wonder why Valve is investing so heavily into Linux.
Fucking Microsoft just closing their eco system more and more, at least I will just pirate it if it's even worth playing at all...
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.
I'm still running Windows 7, and with Linux having been hijacked by anti-meritocratic SJW's and a spineless Linus Torvalds cucking out of it because his daughter is an angry lesbo with daddy issues and a chip on her shoulder the size of Bangladesh, there's few viable options anymore, since I refuse to downgrade to Windows 10. My plan was always to move to Linux once Windows 7 wasn't viable anymore, and the increasing support has been a godsend.
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.

You sound like it is obvious that sane people are using Linux, but the reality is that you are more retarded if you think like that. In what world are you living in? There are core group of people who are using Linux, but the average Joe (which is 96% of the gaming market) is just using the more comfortable Windows platform. Don't make yourself delusional, Linux is nowhere near Windows and probably never will be.

But J_C, 96% of the gaming market *is* massively retarded.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
99,683
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
The Larian point of view, from the recent documentary:



David Walgrave: "We don't want to keep on making the same game over and over again. We need to grow, technologically and as a company. We want to become the best RPG maker that there is in the world, and you can't do that with 20 people."

Swen Vincke: "I realized this industry is consolidating. So we do have the reappearance of the indie studios, but as time goes by players will always want better and better and better. They're getting used to having better and better. But it takes a lot of effort to make these things. If we wanted to keep on making RPGs, it was clear to me that we needed to grow, and that we need to be able to be sustainable, and we needed to be innovative. So that requires quite some investment, it requires quite a lot of extra people."

The Consolidation Era of RPGs.
 

Allyriadil

Educated
Joined
Jun 9, 2018
Messages
38
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.
You sound like it is obvious that sane people are using Linux, but the reality is that you are more retarded if you think like that. In what world are you living in? There are core group of people who are using Linux, but the average Joe (which is 96% of the gaming market) is just using the more comfortable Windows platform. Don't make yourself delusional, Linux is nowhere near Windows and probably never will be.

There is no hope for the average joe anyway, they represent the decline. But here on the Codex? You guys gotta know better.
If you have more than one brain cell then Linux is very comfy, they made great strides in the last few years.
BSD too, if you don't buy retarded proprietary RGB gaming keyboards or other shit made for children you should be fine, just requires a bit more tinkering.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,044
If you handle them badly, they're big enough problems to be relevant factors in the eventual commercial failure, yes.
If you handle anything badly (combat system, interface, writing, design, etc), it will cause big enough problems to be relevant factors in the eventual commercial failure or poor performance. My point is that in the digital age a studio doesn't have to sell to the highest bidder to handle these things well.

You can of course do it internally and waste valuable time and resources, or you can outsource it to some schmuck and pray he knows what he is doing. Or you can have proven specialists from your parent corporation handle it for you. Take your pick.
Outsource what though? Talking about design?

If you can freely access expertise and knowledge of highly accomplished engineers and programmers with more professional credentials than your entire company combined, and your only idea how to utilize them is to get them to deal with scripting bugs, you weren't worth buying out in the first place.
RPGs were never about cool tech. They are about design, scripting (complex quests and c&c require heavy scripting), and writing. In which way would Microsoft highly accomplished engineers would be able to help there?

Just like your many considerable talents once resulted in AoD which I consider the best RPG since Arcanum, and once they resulted in Dungeon Rats which I uninstalled after 30 minutes.
One's a complex RPG that took many years of work, the other is a combat game that was put together in 10 months.
 

BEvers

I'm forever blowing
Joined
Aug 14, 2018
Messages
808
Outsource what though? Talking about design?

The combat system in Bard's Tale 4 was outsourced to a studio in North Carolina. Another NC studio was also credited with gameplay design, and it's speculated that they designed some/all of the puzzles.
 

tripedal

Augur
Joined
Feb 22, 2015
Messages
401
Location
Ultima Thule
If marketing and localization are to blame for PoE2's sales, what did Larian do in those departments to make DivOS2 a success?

People like to blame PoE's blandness for Deadfire's bad sales but it's not like DivOS was that great.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,044
Outsource what though? Talking about design?

The combat system in Bard's Tale 4 was outsourced to a studio in North Carolina. Another NC studio was also credited with gameplay design, and it's speculated that they designed some/all of the puzzles.
Well, it certainly explains why many gameplay elements look like they were designed by people who's never played an RPG before.
 

Maculo

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 30, 2013
Messages
2,596
Strap Yourselves In Pathfinder: Wrath
The Larian point of view, from the recent documentary:



David Walgrave: "We don't want to keep on making the same game over and over again. We need to grow, technologically and as a company. We want to become the best RPG maker that there is in the world, and you can't do that with 20 people."

Swen Vincke: "I realized this industry is consolidating. So we do have the reappearance of the indie studios, but as time goes by players will always want better and better and better. They're getting used to having better and better. But it takes a lot of effort to make these things. If we wanted to keep on making RPGs, it was clear to me that we needed to grow, and that we need to be able to be sustainable, and we needed to be innovative. So that requires quite some investment, it requires quite a lot of extra people."

The Consolidation Era of RPGs.

Interesting to say the least. It reminds me of that trend in Hollywood to make "bigger and better" movies each year to keep the masses coming. Even if it produces results, for how long?

Arguably, this trend already happened to all the mainstream game companies (EA, Activision, Ubisoft), I just never would have guessed CRPG-focused companies.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
99,683
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
The way I see it, when the Kickstarter era of RPGs began, there were two goals:

1) Reintroduce oldschool game design concepts that had been abandoned, most notably turn-based and tactical combat.

2) Create a larger, more diverse ecosystem of medium-sized RPG developers that are not beholden to publishers.

The second goal is a failure, but the first one has been a success! That's the difference between what's happening now and what happened in the 2000s. The big publishers are taking over again, but "turn-based combat" isn't a curse word anymore. That's a good thing, and it means the Kickstarter era wasn't a complete waste.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,044
I see a lot of hate for Pillars of Eternity and i do not understand it, seriously. Both were good games. Unless you believe all the critical acclaim they got was because Obsidian had large amounts of money to bribe 100s of critics on metacritic...

There is a reason why PoE II failed to sell, and it is not marketing, it is...
... the fact that most sequels sell half of what the original game sold unless it's offer radical changes. PoE2 offered ship combat but it was fairly minor and cosmetic. The rest was 'more of the same', which after PoE + 2 expansions was a very hard sell.

1) There is a huge market saturation for isometric crpgs.
There really isn't. It's like saying look there are tens of thousands games on Steam, who has time to play them all? Sadly, it's an optical illusion.
 

Latelistener

Arcane
Joined
May 25, 2016
Messages
2,625
Interesting to say the least. It reminds me of that trend in Hollywood to make "bigger and better" movies each year to keep the masses coming. Even if it produces results, for how long?
This says much about Larian. Bigger and better my ass. See where Bioware ended up.
 

Luckmann

Arcane
Zionist Agent
Joined
Jul 20, 2009
Messages
3,759
Location
Scandinavia
If you are not running Linux or BSD by now you are massively retarded.
Don't you know the SJW have come for your Linux and made it submit to their CoC?
Your tone suggests sarcasm, but here's a friendly reminder of the crazies involved and the situation:
KJOYFxg.jpg

6eAGVNs.jpg

IodkYmo.jpg

KQMUrmy.jpg
Also, this: https://lulz.com/linux-devs-threaten-killswitch-coc-controversy-1252/ & this: https://i.imgur.com/6RrVQZm.png

So let's not pretend this is "muh SJW's xD" or not a legitimate issue. They are literally arguing against meritocracy and merit-based contributions to a bastion of neutrality, where the only thing that mattered previously was competence and willingness, and deliberately politicizing a previously apolitical project based on the false Marxist dogma of "everything is politics anyway lmao?", and if someone would have the stones to actually oppose them, the ones opposing them might have to take actions with very real, very enduring, very tangible real-life day-to-day ramifications.
 
Last edited:

Flou

Arbiter
Joined
Mar 23, 2016
Messages
869
Location
Hellsinki
In a perfect world this MS deal will mean that:

1) Boyarsky&Cain can create and work on whatever they fucking wish to work on with very limited interference from the "Upper Management".
2) Badler will direct the next Pillars of Eternity, finishing the trilogy. With proper marketing the game will end up selling millions of units making Badler a wanted project director.
3) Parker will get to create his own Skyrim (in Pillars universe I presume) that actually ends up being better than anything Bethesda has ever created. Both Parker and Feargus can finally stop talking about creating Skyrimesque game of their own.
4) Josh will finally get to work on his tactical game. The game is perfectly balanced and grognards everywhere are satisfied.
5) Feargus, Parker etc. will retire after their contract obligations are done and someone capable of leading the company will takeover the reins and mistreatment of employees (according to Avellone) will cease.

Though I fear that this will happen:

1) Boyarsky&Cain leave to work on some F2P shit after finishing The Outer Worlds and the 2 year period that they've been asked to stay at the company (presuming they are obligated to stay for a while). They never create anything meaningful and Codex mourns their disappareance every year.
2) Pillars of Eternity 3 will not happen. Half of Codex rejoices, while the other half are looking for sharp objects to hurt themselves. Badler forms a company with a number of Obsidian refugees and they manage to create a very mediocre game that the Codex adores, but no one else plays it.
3) Parker will waste 70 million dollars on his Skyrim game that bombs completely. He will be fired on the spot when 1st reviews are released. Parker's wife finally divorces him and takes half of what he earned from selling the company.
4) Josh never gets to make his tactical game. Instead he will forced to lead Parker's game. He spends 3 very unhappy years working on the game and one day just vanishes with his antique bikes, never to be seen or heard again. Codex members around the globe think they saw someone who looked like Sawyer bicycling past them while humming German/Austrian march songs.
5) Feargus now has enough money for three beachouses. His kid, the one who likes bad pizza gets a job at Obsidian angering Avellone yet again about nepotism. Much like his father before him, the kid slowly progresses from Q&A to leading a studio of his own under Microsoft.
6) No one still knows what Chris Jones does.
 

Flou

Arbiter
Joined
Mar 23, 2016
Messages
869
Location
Hellsinki
On a more serious note:

We know that Obsidian wants to grow into 200+ employee company and that Microsoft is betting heavily on GamePass. Sawyer seems enthusiastic about getting to work on gamepass games, while Parker wants to create his Skyrim. This makes me think that Obsidian will stick to being 2-3½ projects company with 1 or 2 bigger projects and 1-2 smaller projects.
Gamepass obvisously requires continous stream of content so smaller projects like Pillars of Eternity 3 (+ numerous DLCs) and Sawyers tactical game are something they could throw in as a filler while Project Indiana and Parker's Skyrim are the bigger projects being worked on.

I don't see purchase as a negative thing for Obsidian. I think with the very lackluster sales that Deadfire managed to achieve layoffs were imminent without this deal. Going for Kickstarter/FIG would not have made them more than few million dollars to create 3rd Pillars game. They failed at what Larian succeeded at and were once again at the mercy of publishers. So instead of going around the world pitching for projects they sold the company and finally don't have to worry about the next deal, milestone or resources and marketing. Sure the deal with MS creates problems of it's own.
This also means Feargus and rest of the Upper Management muppets will retire in a few years. Whether that is a good thing or not, remains to be seen. I'm optimistic about the deal since I really didn't see them making it for much longer. Maybe Feargus will mellow out now that he doesn't have to stress about money as much.
 
Joined
Nov 23, 2017
Messages
4,635
Having a hard time getting my head around the business logic here. Microsoft must not be paying very much.

In a world where Fallout has become one of the biggest gaming franchises around, being able to say "From the creators of Fallout" probably doesn't hurt. They're also very clearly trying to build up developers so they don't have the whole lot of nothing they've had this console cycle with their Xbox One.

Hopefully this just means the two thirds of Troika at Obsidian get what they need for whatever. It'd be nice to get something like a big budget Arcanum that also as great combat that's on the level of everything else Arcanum does so fantastically.
 

lophiaspis

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 24, 2012
Messages
379
Obsidian is an unusual case of a new company created after management issues at the old one being formed by the old crappy management themselves. The actual RPG talent at Interplay went to Troika and the parasites on that talent went to Obsidian, with the exception of MCA who was neutralized by the parasites anyway. Obsidian was founded by Dunning Kruger poster child Chris Parker, and Feargus Urquheart, a jumped up QA tester who coincidentally found himself in a management position, and who only has two real talents: Bullshitting and parasitism. And it is with these two skills of Feargus that Obsidian managed to stumble on for fifteen years. First of all, Feargus bullshitted and guilt tripped MCA into being his slave under the false pretense of being a co-owner, almost as if MCA was Dak'kon and Feargus was TNO. What Feargus thus achieved was to leech off of MCA's talent and reputation, just like his entire career has been built on leeching off of the Interplay talent. And he also got MCA to cover for every hare-brained executive decision even though MCA was never a real owner so much as a glorified employee getting treated like shit and paid way below his market value.

Obsidian's good reputation was always completely undeserved, and the fact that they ever had such a reputation again shows us Feargus' bullshitting and parasitism skills. This was not a studio founded by 'the guys that made Fallout and Torment'; it was founded and led by the man chiefly responsible for chasing Tim Cain out of Interplay. The only great game made to this day by any of the founding members of Obsidian is Planescape: Torment, and any repeat of that effort was prevented by MCA himself being admittedly burned out of being creative lead, and above all by Feargus and Parker's constant dimwitted meddling.

Obsidian was known for making RPGs using other people's engines and games with varying success. This is what Black Isle always did as well. It's not that they were prevented by publishers and circumstances from any great creation of their own: it's that they never had the capacity as a company, even with plenty of great individual talents on the payroll. Feargus and the gang's MO from the BIS days was always to take a great holistic creative effort by someone else, be that Cainarsky or Bioware, and rearrange the parts and throw it all in the blender, producing a result that was sometimes better, usually worse, depending on the quality of the original. (How many parasites have been nourished by Cain/Boyarsky/Anderson's original titanic 1997 creation, starting with BIS itself!)

And after they had released their cargo cult imitations of truly creative works, they would slyly pretend like they had anything to do with the originals - thus fostering a reputation based almost entirely on stolen valor. This found its apogee in Pillars of Eternity, AKA Nostalgia Parasitism: The RPG. "A spiritual successor to Baldur's Gate" - except nobody on the team ever worked on Baldur's Gate. The Project Lead worked on Icewind Dale, a Black Isle project using Bioware's engine, Bioware's graphics, Bioware's design work, Bioware's reputation, to produce something utterly inferior in every way. Sound familiar? They did have the creators of Fallout and Torment on the team, but their skills were criminally underused because of apparent mismanagement. The only creative success by Obsidian to this day is Tyranny, which seemingly slipped through the cracks because the bumbling Feargus-Parker-Sawyer-Fenstermaker clique was busy crapping out PoE leaving the far more talented "B-team" largely alone. Obsidian's talentlessness as a company finally caught up with them with the Dumpsterfire disaster, which showed that Feargus' signature appeals to pity and fake nostalgia are no longer enough to make RPG fans buy all these mediocre games. (Compare the Dumpsterfire implosion to the D:OS explosion, a series that while it may not be to everyone's taste, was clearly made with talent, flair, heart and soul.)

And thus we come to Feargus' latest, greatest piece of bullshit artistry. Even though Feargus was the individual most responsible for making Cain quit Interplay, he somehow managed to get back both Cain and Boyarsky - I don't know what kind of promises he made - and with those two back in the same room the sparks started flying, weird things started happening, and nine months later Indiana was born. And so we are back to where it all began, with Feargus in a unique position to profit off of the exploitation of Cain/Boyarsky's creative energy. And it does seem like this is what let Feargus finally realize his life goal of becoming a sellout. Was it Indiana that made Spencer pull the trigger? Quite possibly. And Feargus must have correctly calculated that Cainarsky would be too invested in their project to complain about everything being sold from under their feet, just like he calculated that MCA would be too guilt-tripped to rebel until he had got what he wanted from him. On top of that is the factor that Spencer is a huge Baldur's Gate fan from the 90s, which of course Feargus has no connection with but makes every effort to present himself as if he did, so it's likely that Feargus' special talent for nostalgia parasitism led him to this happy ending. And it's even possible, if less likely, that this time even the players will have a happy ending, depending on what happens now with Indiana. It may turn out that, if Indiana was fated to be the midwife of Feargus' dream coming true, that Obsidian's mission in life, through all the years of its confused and seemingly pointless existence, was, likewise, to bring Indiana into the world. Fingers crossed.

In any case, hats off to Feargus Urquheart, the fat little QA tester that could. The rags to riches story of a true bullshit king of the RPG industry.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom