Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[sea]

I have to say . . .

I am not a Sawyer fanboy, and didn't really know anything about the guy until I started posting here a few years ago. But when I read posts like his response to Monte Carlo, I am glad he is making this game. At the very least, the guy knows his shit. That is so rare these days.

Although sometimes I think Sawyer's decisions are, let's say, a bit "weird" (like Intelligence determining combat stats), most RPG dev teams would be grateful to have someone as good with systems and mechanics design as he is. He's one of the few who seems to be able to anticipate and extrapolate potential problems in systems on paper well before they are implemented, and come up with solutions. Sometimes those solutions are not always one's first instinct, and it's not like those choices always lead to ideal results, but at least he is proactive and self-critical about it, and that's very valuable.

 

[Hormalakh]

^ AND he's willing to listen to criticism and discuss the ideas based on merit. he doesn't run from an argument.

 

[Decado]

Also, I backed PoE because I wanted to play a game in the old IE style. That does not mean I want a goddamn Xerox copy of BGII. I am glad they are trying out different things like messing with class expectations and ditching the hit points mechanic. If that means I have to shred my grognard diploma, consider it shredded.

I can appreciate people's desires to relive the old days but my god, what's the point of playing games if you don't occasionally want to try something new?

 

[tuluse]

Also, I backed PoE because I wanted to play a game in the old IE style. That does not mean I want a goddamn Xerox copy of BGII. I am glad they are trying out different things like messing with class expectations and ditching the hit points mechanic. If that means I have to shred my grognard diploma, consider it shredded.

I can appreciate people's desires to relive the old days but my god, what's the point of playing games if you don't occasionally want to try something new?

To bitch about balance

 

[JamesBond]

The problem with 3.* rangers in D&D is not that they are only good against their Fav. Enemies. This is just plain diverting the question. The truth is that all melee and ranged classes without proc damage from precision suck in 3.* . The ranger class design isn't at fault at all. It is the monster design. This problem has been brought up so many times that it is hard to believe that people still fall for it.

Allow me to detail:

The problem in D&D is that with increasing level of challenge the Monsters become more and more resistant to direct damage from weapons. This is mainly, but not exclusively, due to the HP and AC bloat. Ranger design is actually quite nice in 3.* that it allows a varied kind of playstyle while roleplaying a Ranger. Which by the way ain't got nothing to do with "Ranged". A ranger is a tracker.

The real problem is that Melee Fighters and Archers are generically dependent upon direct damage output. Rogues can bypass that with Sneak damage which tends to lend a hand. Wizards with super powered status effects or the same damage scaling of spells. Thus a melee fighter who does not invest in powerplay from the Power attack and tactical feats derivatives is as f*cked as a ranger in the long run.

Just my two cents.

 

[Abelian]

Yeah I'm not a big fan of "rangers are ranged" thing that has become the norm, even though I think drizzt clones are just as lame.

It strikes me that rangers should be ranged. It's in their name after all.

Anyways, I don't care if rangers can dual wield, or not. That is basically a trope taken from DnD and has persisted ever since, for no particular reason other than the fact that designers have always done it. It makes a bit of sense too, considering that a ranger would be the outdoorsy type, and is supposed to be (at least) an accomplished hunter of animals. Being good with a bow seems like a prerequisite, there.

Some have theorized that the reason Rangers got the dual wield ability in AD&D is because Aragorn briefly dual wielded when driving off the Nazgul at Weathertop.

I've read that the ranger archetype was based on Aragorn, so that wouldn't surprise me at all.

 

[hiver]

What a lot of hogwash for just not wanting to do a double version, or almost two classes - for one type of a character. In case the animal was an option.

And then reaching for the cheap, oh someone would always be unhappy, blah, blah...

No, the fact is that its a worse option overall. A Ranger without any animal companions would actually be the most acceptable and play the best - for most people.
Though the changes to the usual IE horrible mechanics of the Ranger+ac, in this case are made to be best possible. If we really have to be all sentenced to that particular version of the "type".


But that doesnt mean the idea doesnt have its own clear deficiencies. It seems something belonging more in the realms of childish fantasy, rather then anything contemporary. Its reminds me of a kind of a silly, disney type of schtick, in general style.
However that is approached there is always the issue of how will the companion "level up" over the whole game, where difficulty curve is supposed to go higher and higher. What, my dog is going to grapple and hinder and handle tougher, more powerful fantastical monsters and beasties, vampires, ghosts, dragons? Advanced human enemies? A bat will...screech louder at them? Or maybe there will be animal armor somewhere.

Certainly, these companions could be very useful for scouting purposes - but that depends on how areas are designed, on role of environment generally, and how useful such knowledge can be at all? Everyone knows that you could stealth and scout ahead in IE games but... it didnt really matter that much in those dungeons. Those enemies would still be dealt with in the usual manner.


In the opposition to that, is the Ranger type of a more serious persuasion. A woodsman, mountain man, scout, tracker, probably a herbalist and things like that. A sort of quintessential border type. Jeremiah Johnson perhaps.
Fast, nimble, soul use connected to being attuned to nature the most, ranged combat specialist, add him a tomahawk, knives, and PoE guns and with the spread of other abilities and eventual talents - it can be very adaptable to widest range of players.

Add bonuses to abilities when in forested open nature, with added specialization for other specific types of environment or terrain in the game, that work as benefit with mandatory balancing negatives - and make him the best archer in the game, through skills or specific class mechanics or talents.

 

[Zed]

Monte Cook concludes a recent session of OD&D with this:

So, here in 2014, would I play 1974 D&D again? Absolutely. Would I make it my game of choice? Probably not. I’d have to muck with the rules more. The differentiation in hit points, for example, is hard to design around. The spell selection needs to be more interesting. Fighters probably need a little something more (although making sure that all magic weapons are more interesting than simple +1 swords might be enough as the game goes along).

Since my recent stint with D&D professionally ended, I haven’t played much D&D, and frankly, wasn’t sure if I would again. Which made me really sad. But I’ve found that by distilling D&D down to its very essence, I don’t have to worry about editions, versions, or anything like that. OD&D showcases what I really love about the game, and makes it all the more clear that all the other stuff–skill systems, complex monster designs, a vast array of character options and complex combat rules, etc.–is very much secondary. That stuff, which we so often refer to as “crunch,” is actually “fluff.” It’s cool, it’s fun, it’s interesting, but it’s also ultimately unnecessary. For me, it’s the experience–dungeons, fighters, magic users, clerics, thieves, monsters (both familiar and strange), party dynamics, spells (again, familiar and strange), and so on–that is the true heart of the game.

I wonder if Sawyer would agree..?

 

[Infinitron]

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/63037-summoning/page-9#entry1415718

I don't categorically hate the idea of a stamina drain associated with the summoned creature(s), but it does raise some concerns. The whole point of summoning a creature is usually to add some combat ability to the party. Should the cost be too high you're left with a depleted summoner and the creature isn't around long enough to do all that much good.

2nd Ed./3.X charms/dominates and summons are incredibly powerful compared to the higher level raw damage spells because the summons give the party 1) disposable hit points 2) an extra action/actions every round 3) an assortment of resistances and abilities often not available to the party -- and they're able to do this all with one spell. Summons should feel very useful and powerful, but they should not become the de facto tactic. If it reaches that level, it's not really a tactic at all; it's just the thing you keep doing in every fight.

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/65057-game-narrator-chapters/#entry1415722

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

 

[Rake]

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

 

[Chaotic_Heretic]

idonthavetimeforthiscrap
Instead of crying like a little girl... get Divinity Original Sin.
From what has been released, the editor looks quite good.

And its Turn Based.

 

[Roguey]

Caring about whether or not you can have/make original content mods is truly the most autistic of desires. I've never seen anything worth a damn, so leave the creation of content to the pros.

 

[Scruffy]

idonthavetimeforthiscrap
Instead of crying like a little girl... get Divinity Original Sin.
From what has been released, the editor looks quite good.

And its Turn Based.

they're mantears dude
also, isn't OS popamole?

 

[Abelian]

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

In before Kevin Michael Richardson is announced to have started working with Obsidian.

 

[Infinitron]

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

In before Kevin Michael Richardson is announced to have started working with Obsidian.

That's Bioware-style, bro: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001773/

 

[Volrath]

idonthavetimeforthiscrap
Instead of crying like a little girl... get Divinity Original Sin.
From what has been released, the editor looks quite good.

And its Turn Based.

they're mantears dude
also, isn't OS popamole?

No.

 

[Bubbles]

It's still in Alpha, sticky cover is a distinct possibility.

 

[imweasel]

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

 

[J_C]

We are planning to have a narrator for the game.

These narrator sequences were very good in the IE games, they added so much to the atmosphere. Too bad nowadays devs rather make a cutscene instead of making a much cheaper, but more interesting narration.

 

[Surf Solar]

idonthavetimeforthiscrap
Instead of crying like a little girl... get Divinity Original Sin.
From what has been released, the editor looks quite good.

And its Turn Based.

they're mantears dude
also, isn't OS popamole?

It really isn't. It's quite a lot of fun.

 

[Excidium]

God that BG narrator was fucking annoying. They could at least sync the text scroll speed with the narration.

 

[J_C]

God that BG narrator was fucking annoying. They could at least sync the text scroll speed with the narration.

What was annoying about it?

 

[Athelas]

Besides it being needlessly long-winded and annoyingly vague, the narration also ascribes a ton of feelings and motivations to the player character.

 

[Excidium]

God that BG narrator was fucking annoying. They could at least sync the text scroll speed with the narration.

What was annoying about it?

The lack of synch, I say it right there.

Besides it being needlessly long-winded and annoyingly vague, the narration also ascribes a ton of feelings and motivations to the player character.

Yeah that too, but that's a general thing with BG, specially early on. It's a really amateurish game in the writing department.

 

[Surf Solar]

Didn't these dreams also came randomly after you rest somewhere? Atleast that's how I remember it in BG2. Especially with those retarded "gameplay" sections in the dream