Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[toro]

Though I doubt that a lot of people who have bought several Obsidian titles even know about this Kickstarter project to begin with and believe that far more people would support it if only they knew.

They run a stealth campaign on purpose. Somewhat similar to larping an F-117 in Yugoslavia...

 

[Jarpie]

I already pledged on KS/Codex and I don't want to change anything there. But seriously, nobody is troubled by the lack of one single screenshot?

Yep, I pledged on both. Problem?

That was for the "But seriously, nobody is troubled by the lack of one single screenshot?" and not for pledging.

Fine. So "screenshot" is too much to ask from Obsidian, even if others were better prepared and could show prototypes for their games: FTL, Grimdawn, Legends of Eisenwald, Blackspace ... and so on.
Then, why there is not one artwork as interesting as the ones from Wasteland2 KS campaign?

Because Obsidian doesnt have anything to show yet, and even if they would have WIP-screenshot I wouldn't want them to show it because it would most probably just backfire due vast majority of the people being stupid and not getting that it's just WIP.

 

[tuluse]

By the way, this bit caught my attention from the RPS interview:

RPS: Obsidian’s always been a cut above, well, pretty much everyone in terms of writing. And yet, it’s arguable that you haven’t had the success you deserve. Why do you think gamers don’t value great writing in the same way, say, movie viewers do? Or do they? Does modern culture in general discount great writing?

Avellone: Good writing does not make a popular or accessible game. While we value stories and deep character interactions, there are other factors at work that feed into success, and the Kickstarter is proof of our success in the industry. People are willing to back our ideas and stand behind them, and we’re ready to prove ourselves.

They have 50K backers. While it's an impressive amount of backers for a Kickstarter project, it's pretty abysmal number of people to associate with their success in the industry. To the contrary, it would only show that their success in the industry is inflated by publisher-ensured sales. If they were owned by a publisher, they would be closed down a week after releasing a game that only sold around 50K units.

Though I doubt that a lot of people who have bought several Obsidian titles even know about this Kickstarter project to begin with and believe that far more people would support it if only they knew.

How many people usually a pre-order a game 2 years in advance with little knowledge about what it will become?

Kickstarter contributions should not be compared to sales until we see some hard numbers about how these games sell. I wouldn't be surprised if kickstarter contributors are only 5-10% of total people who would buy such a game.

 

[IronicNeurotic]

Though I doubt that a lot of people who have bought several Obsidian titles even know about this Kickstarter project to begin with and believe that far more people would support it if only they knew.

You also have to consider that not 100% of the market for this game would support a kickstarter in general. You literary throw money at people with the vague promise that a game may arrive with time. I doubt all that many people, except more or less obssesed fans would go for it.

 

[J_C]

Looks like done by retarded pre-teens recruited from Deviant Art for junk food and a pat on the back..

Wow, you really know how to be a dick to other (grown up) people.

 

[villain of the story]

Nothing against your other points, but I kinda doubt that. Solely because you don't actually carry a big ass axt in one hand and a big ass sword? in the other like its nothing while wearing full armor. Except if you are a monster and that girl doesn't really look the part.

The sword is strapped to her belt and she's merely carrying the axe. It's only a posture that doesn't try to emphasize her combat-readiness. And people carry far heavier stuff in more inconvenient ways. But what I meant with authentic realism is the details of her outfit.

I might be idealising, of course. That picture wakes up a good amount of 80s high fantasy art nostalgia in me. Something that even the art from IE games failed to deliver with their airbrushed modernish contemporary styles.

 

[toro]

Because Obsidian doesnt have anything to show yet, and even if they would have WIP-screenshot I wouldn't want them to show it because it would most probably just backfire due vast majority of the people being stupid and not getting that it's just WIP.

Not a solid argument.

The original presentation on KS was underwhelming. That clip was not enough. There would be no backfire if they had shown some artworks from the start, the skills systems, perks, classes and other things. But in the current situation, they basically dug themselves into a hole.
Each update can start a shitstorm: cool-downs, bland artworks, magic system, RTwP and so on. And now, they are basically afraid to show anything, because they don't want to lose money. A behavior which is not only unethical, but it also questions the entire vision behind this game. Sure, it makes sense from a financial point of view, but in the end, the idea is that: KS is a platform based on trust and Obsidian should show more trust in their fans, instead of clumsily chase the money.

 

[villain of the story]

You come across as extremely ignorant and illiterate, toro.

Whatever, this bit from the IndieRPGs interview caught my eye:

Why real-time with pause; why not turn-based combat? How do you respond to critiques like this one from the CRPG Addict?

It’s how Infinity Engine combat is set up, and we’re fine with it if it makes it feel more like an Infinity Engine game.

Kind of a crappy answer. "IE-game" is the new AWESOME button.

 

[Infinitron]

The REAL Awesome Button has always beeen the IE games' Turn Undead ability.

Watch those fuckers gib!

 

[Infinitron]

http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer

 

[Jarpie]

Because Obsidian doesnt have anything to show yet, and even if they would have WIP-screenshot I wouldn't want them to show it because it would most probably just backfire due vast majority of the people being stupid and not getting that it's just WIP.

Not a solid argument.

The original presentation on KS was underwhelming. That clip was not enough. There would be no backfire if they had shown some artworks from the start, the skills systems, perks, classes and other things. But in the current situation, they basically dug themselves into a hole.
Each update can start a shitstorm: cool-downs, bland artworks, magic system, RTwP and so on. And now, they are basically afraid to show anything, because they don't want to lose money. A behavior which is not only unethical, but it also questions the entire vision behind this game. Sure, it makes sense from a financial point of view, but in the end, the idea is that: KS is a platform based on trust and Obsidian should show more trust in their fans, instead of clumsily chase the money.

As it has been said in here so many times, Obsidian clearly has paced out the info they give on the whole month so they have something concrete to update on, such as classes just the other day. Giving information out gradually also helps them to keep Project Eternity in the news-sites when they potentially write news-stories on the developments and gain more visibility the kickstarter project.

They might not have specifics even down yet before they know how big budget they get so they wont have to re-do the designs, such as how many classes and races they can do, or what kind of combat/magic system they can have (as for example how many abilities and spells they can code into the game) - system with fewer spells works well with some other magic-system, but more spells needs different kind of system.

They are in the very early of the development and I completely understand why they chose to run the Kickstarter campaign now, instead of getting something ready - if they'd had designed the story, plot and scope of the game for say, 2 million dollars, and they would get 3 million dollars, they would have to at least partially redesign the game and it would take unnecessary time and money to do, and obviously manhours.

 

[Ion Prothon II]

I already pledged on KS/Codex and I don't want to change anything there. But seriously, nobody is troubled by the lack of one single screenshot?

Yep, I pledged on both. Problem?

That was for the "But seriously, nobody is troubled by the lack of one single screenshot?" and not for pledging.

It's not too bright to ask for a screenshot from not existing game and everyone knows it. But they should show some concepts, screenshots from editors, things like that. Concepts- like scetches how the game is supposed to look like, even if it's just something scratched with a pen in metro.

Stuff from WIP games has been often appearing in PC magazines, strange it isn't now. In KS projects relations with community seem crucial, and meanwhile developers have no problems with typing at twitter how big shit they did in the toilet.

 

[toro]

You come across as extremely ignorant and illiterate, toro.

Care to say more than one line?

 

[Crooked Bee]

xD

The question about lurking at RPGCodex was mine. While drunk. :D

 

[Infinitron]

xD

The question about lurking at RPGCodex was mine. While drunk. :D

Haha, I knew that was you!

I guess we could say this bee was...BUZZED!

 

[Crooked Bee]

xD

Bzzz bzz

 

[Roguey]

What screenshots? There is no game to make screenshots with.

Adam Brennecke said he's already seen the first screenshot (from his Penny Arcade interview). I presume they're saving it for the media blitz of the final week.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

While drunk.

What's yr poison?

 

[Crooked Bee]

This is what I get for eatin' crackers with my gin and drinkin' in my Sunday dress.

 

[toro]

Because Obsidian doesnt have anything to show yet, and even if they would have WIP-screenshot I wouldn't want them to show it because it would most probably just backfire due vast majority of the people being stupid and not getting that it's just WIP.

Not a solid argument.

The original presentation on KS was underwhelming. That clip was not enough. There would be no backfire if they had shown some artworks from the start, the skills systems, perks, classes and other things. But in the current situation, they basically dug themselves into a hole.
Each update can start a shitstorm: cool-downs, bland artworks, magic system, RTwP and so on. And now, they are basically afraid to show anything, because they don't want to lose money. A behavior which is not only unethical, but it also questions the entire vision behind this game. Sure, it makes sense from a financial point of view, but in the end, the idea is that: KS is a platform based on trust and Obsidian should show more trust in their fans, instead of clumsily chase the money.

As it has been said in here so many times, Obsidian clearly has paced out the info they give on the whole month so they have something concrete to update on, such as classes just the other day. Giving information out gradually also helps them to keep Project Eternity in the news-sites when they potentially write news-stories on the developments and gain more visibility the kickstarter project.

They might not have specifics even down yet before they know how big budget they get so they wont have to re-do the designs, such as how many classes and races they can do, or what kind of combat/magic system they can have (as for example how many abilities and spells they can code into the game) - system with fewer spells works well with some other magic-system, but more spells needs different kind of system.

They are in the very early of the development and I completely understand why they chose to run the Kickstarter campaign now, instead of getting something ready - if they'd had designed the story, plot and scope of the game for say, 2 million dollars, and they would get 3 million dollars, they would have to at least partially redesign the game and it would take unnecessary time and money to do, and obviously manhours.

I agree with pacing out the information, but not in the way they did it. A KS campaign doesn't start when the project becomes active on KS's page, which means that for a company as Obsidian is quite unprofessional to ask for money without sharing any information what-so-ever. If you remember, they did not even reveal the races in their original presentation. Not to mention the following crap with the additional companions when the original number of companions was not known. This is not pacing out the information. But whatever.

As for "if they'd had designed the story, plot and scope of the game for say, 2 million dollars, and they would get 3 million dollars, they would have to at least partially redesign the game and it would take unnecessary time and money to do, and obviously manhours." ... o_O. This would be the most desirable situation for Obsidian, cause the surplus money would be spent to make a better product or develop an add-on. Not to mention that Obsidian doesn't have to respond to anyone for wasting them.

 

[Comrade Goby]

Anything about possibly showing us that screenshot? It was some interview and apparently they have one.

I'm thinking maybe for the final 2 day push or something.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

gin

Blech.

However, I do still approve of your willingness to be a distinguished drunkposter.

 

[Jasede]

^______^ = stuffies + nyan
Black Hound / Black Cat

 

[toro]

It's not too bright to ask for a screenshot from not existing game and everyone knows it. But they should show some concepts, screenshots from editors, things like that. Concepts- like scetches how the game is supposed to look like, even if it's just something scratched with a pen in metro.

Stuff from WIP games has been often appearing in PC magazines, strange it isn't now. In KS projects relations with community seem crucial, and meanwhile developers have no problems with typing at twitter how big shit they did in the toilet.

I did not think that "screenshot" would be taken ad-literam. But at least you get the point.

 

[Roguey]

Well, since he sometimes lurks...
http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/378574849280329910

Have you read "The Prince of Nothing" books by R Scott Bakker? The importance of souls in PE gave me that vibe.


I have not. It sounds cool, though. Thanks.

danger danger josh sawyer!
Don't waste your time reading or getting any influence from R "SPOONS" Bakker's trite crap. Instead read these awesome articles and reviews about how he's a misogynist fauxgressive crybaby tool:
http://requireshate.wordpress.com/2011/08/16/r-scott-bakker-prince-of-misogyny/
http://requireshate.wordpress.com/2...s-tears-and-the-insecurity-of-the-privileged/
http://requireshate.wordpress.com/2012/04/17/r-scott-bakker-neuropath-of-misogyny/
http://requireshate.wordpress.com/2012/04/20/r-scott-bakker-neuropath-and-the-spoon-of-secrets/

Also the comments section here: http://thegrumpyowl.com/2012/02/28/a-non-vicarious-straight-up-stfu/
They throw walls of text at each other so here's the tl;dr for the less-attentive:
Scotty: MY SALES ARE DOWN THE TOILET BECAUSE OF HER (ToT)
Wanni: LOL （￣ー￣）
Roguey: ILU (*°∀°)=3