Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Roguey]

I imagine Andhaira's going to be thrilled about Josh changing his mind about the paladin's role. Looks like I was wrong there.

So rogues have the best single target damage, barbarians are aoe melee, and wizards are ranged aoe. What does this remind me of, oh yes, Dragon Age 2.

2009-era BC-trolling was classic.

2009-era BC was not a troll.

Her opinions were genuine, but she was definitely stating them in an attention-seeking and inflammatory way e.g." Fallout Torment and Arcanum are toys and bad RPGs", "The Witcher is retarded", "Troika's handling of V:TM lore was as bad as Bethesda's handling of Fallout's" and so on.

 

[Grunker]

^ Roguey: Did he actually say what he was changing Paladins to though? I only saw him mention he was changing them, and then he described the roles of Fighter and Barbarian instead

So rogues have the best single target damage, barbarians are aoe melee, and wizards are ranged aoe. What does this remind me of, oh yes, Dragon Age 2.

You think that's bad? I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

DA2 wasn't shut off from a few good ideas because the game sucked overall. The decision to change the plot to have a more personal focus was good as well.

 

[Infinitron]

I've asked him on Formspring about the Paladins.

Looks like I was wrong there.

Preserved for posterity

 

[Roguey]

I'm wrong about things all the time.

So rogues have the best single target damage, barbarians are aoe melee, and wizards are ranged aoe. What does this remind me of, oh yes, Dragon Age 2.

You think that's bad? I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

I'm trolling.

 

[Grunker]

Preserved for posterity

Almost did that, but then I realized it was all a clever plot so Roguey can refer to that post the next time we make the Light/Dark accusations

I'm trolling

The smiley kind of gave that away bro - my point was that doesn't make the comparison any less true. I just assumed the troll was out of spite for the decision.

 

[Excidium]

I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

How is that creative in any way?

 

[Infinitron]

I'm wrong about things all the time.

I'm trolling.

Preserved for posterity

 

[Grunker]

I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

How is that creative in any way?

Because giving two-handed swords a small AoE arc on basic attacks has almost never been done before? You don't have to invent the wheel to be credited for a nifty idea for fucks sake.

You may think it's BSB, but in RPG-context it hasn't really been used that much except on a few special abilities.

 

[Mangoose]

I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

How is that creative in any way?

Because giving two-handed swords a small AoE arc on basic attacks has almost never been done before? You don't have to invent the wheel to be credited for a nifty idea for fucks sake.

You may think it's BSB, but in RPG-context it hasn't really been used that much except on a few special abilities.

I feel like it requires too much precision in positioning for an RTWP game, though.

 

[Grunker]

I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

How is that creative in any way?

Because giving two-handed swords a small AoE arc on basic attacks has almost never been done before? You don't have to invent the wheel to be credited for a nifty idea for fucks sake.

You may think it's BSB, but in RPG-context it hasn't really been used that much except on a few special abilities.

I feel like it requires too much precision in positioning for an RTWP game, though.

Unfortunately, Obsidian (and Josh) has stated they will put heavy emphasis on positioning - including attacks of opportunity and such. While I think the "engagement"-mechanic looks pretty awesome, putting heavy emphasis on positioning in an RtWP party game is incredibly dangerous in my opinion.

So yeah, I agree with you mostly, but I do think an AoE on melee attacks could work. It would help on groups of weak enemies and wouldn't be too hard to position for.

 

[Excidium]

I mean, DA2 sucked, but the melee AoE concept with two-handed weapons was always a neat idea. I thought it was creative use of a weapon type that was always a bit stuck between things (though 3.5 ed made it work pretty well).

How is that creative in any way?

Because giving two-handed swords a small AoE arc on basic attacks has almost never been done before? You don't have to invent the wheel to be credited for a nifty idea for fucks sake.

You may think it's BSB, but in RPG-context it hasn't really been used that much except on a few special abilities.

DDO had that. And I'm sure other games before. Two-handed weapons hitting adjacent enemies is not something I'd give anyone credit for...

 

[Murk]

It doesn't get used commonly but is something that makes melee more interesting; I believe that is what Grunker is going for.

 

[Delterius]

Unfortunately, Obsidian (and Josh) has stated they will put heavy emphasis on positioning - including attacks of opportunity and such. While I think the "engagement"-mechanic looks pretty awesome, putting heavy emphasis on positioning in an RtWP party game is incredibly dangerous in my opinion.

Indeed, but my hopes lie with the slow-motion mode.

 

[Lilura]

DDO had that.

This.
Talents like 2handed sweep (Origins base), Sweeping Strike, 2handed Impact, Onslaught and Reaving Storm (Awakening exp). There is also a mod for DA:O that makes AoE arc similar to DA2, though I would assume its majorly OP.

And I'm sure other games before. Two-handed weapons hitting adjacent enemies is not something I'd give anyone credit for...

This too.
While not specific to 2handers, IWD2, ToEE, NWN, NWN2... all had cleave, great cleave, last three had whirlwind, not exactly innovative to make just 2handers do it.

 

[Excidium]

By DDO I mean the D&D MMO. But anyway, I prefer when that kind of thing is an active ability instead of a passive one.

 

[Mangoose]

Unfortunately, Obsidian (and Josh) has stated they will put heavy emphasis on positioning - including attacks of opportunity and such. While I think the "engagement"-mechanic looks pretty awesome, putting heavy emphasis on positioning in an RtWP party game is incredibly dangerous in my opinion.

Indeed, but my hopes lie with the slow-motion mode.

Hm, that is a good idea.

So yeah, I agree with you mostly, but I do think an AoE on melee attacks could work. It would help on groups of weak enemies and wouldn't be too hard to position for.

If it's a 360 deg arc that would be better, as that removes the need to micromanage your directional facing.

 

[Lancehead]

I'm wrong about things all the time.

I'm trolling.

Preserved for posterity

 

[Zed]

from sawyer's twitteroo:

"wrapping up for the week"

 

[Blaine]

Microsoft optical mouse on a bare desk... BLARGH.

 

[TripJack]

jesus h christ how can anyone like this hipster scum

and why do the shittiest games always get the longest threads here?

 

[Alex]

There is no long range teleportation... with the exception of magic inventory sacks, which teleport stuff directly to the nearest city

You're a 360 degree-fag as well Alex? o_O

My, the two of us disagree on a lot, but I didn't think you agree with DraQ

You know, I was wondering about this post of yours today. I wrote my post more trying to be funny than anything else, but I suppose I might have hit a never there. I mean, I stayed out of this thread for a long while, and I guess jokes like this might have gotten trite long ago. Anyway, if I annoyed you, I am really sorry, not my intention. I still think that people that design game rules and then try to make the game fiction fit with them have it backwards, though, at least in RPGs.

 

[Lancehead]

You know, I was wondering about this post of yours today. I wrote my post more trying to be funny than anything else, but I suppose I might have hit a never there. I mean, I stayed out of this thread for a long while, and I guess jokes like this might have gotten trite long ago. Anyway, if I annoyed you, I am really sorry, not my intention. I still think that people that design game rules and then try to make the game fiction fit with them have it backwards, though, at least in RPGs.

Funny you should say that because Sawyer had this to say on the matter:

I believe that game designers, whether working in the RPG genre or otherwise, should establish what they want the player to be doing within the world. That is, they must ask themselves what they want the core activities of the player to be. Within those activities, the designer can find ways to allow growth over time in a variety of ways. How they want that growth to occur and what sort of choices they want to force the player to make -- that's what should drive the design of the advancement/RPG system.

Instead it usually seems like most designers sit down and say, "Well what are the ability scores going to be?"

Whether or not he's executing it as he says designers should is up for debate.

 

[Murk]

Image on center monitor -- is that from PE?

 

[Grunker]

There is no long range teleportation... with the exception of magic inventory sacks, which teleport stuff directly to the nearest city

You're a 360 degree-fag as well Alex? o_O

My, the two of us disagree on a lot, but I didn't think you agree with DraQ

You know, I was wondering about this post of yours today. I wrote my post more trying to be funny than anything else, but I suppose I might have hit a never there. I mean, I stayed out of this thread for a long while, and I guess jokes like this might have gotten trite long ago. Anyway, if I annoyed you, I am really sorry, not my intention. I still think that people that design game rules and then try to make the game fiction fit with them have it backwards, though, at least in RPGs.

You didn't annoy me, I just challenged your opinion.

There's a big difference between generally establishing connection between fiction and mechanics and striving for 360 degree realism. Accepting some arbitrary mechanics is required no matter which game you play - even the simulationist GURPS has a few arbitrary necessities. If the inventory thing really solves a tedium, then peace be with the arbitraryness.

 

[Lancehead]

The inventory thing isn't exactly about 360-degree-realism-at-all-costs, although going for a more realistic approach would've served the game just fine, but about sacrificing in-universe logic to cater to lootwhores (with all due respect to whores). In-universe logic breaking arbitrariness wasn't needed there.