Path of Exile is a MAJESTIC incline

[Aothan]

The moment I switched from arc to storm call (swapped 1 support gem + 10 passives), the build became significantly better.

some of the ascendancy classes could make for a difference, the aforementioned Elementalist or for the Templar the Inquisitor. Single target damage particularly against bosses will be limited but if nothing else at the time works I could always change skills around (e.g. Storm Call) for these situations

though I am probably more inclined to go with melee, even ye old Glacial Hammer, and gradually develop a character with MoM and Elemental Overload

Ok I get that but then what's the point of Evasion, Acrobatics and Phase Acrobatics if it does dick in boss fights? At least with ES I could survive an accidental hit or two.

for the most part Phase Acrobatics always felt like an overextension of Evasion, and similarly in my view I always preferred combining the hybrid defence nodes for Evasion and Armour (i.e. evasion benefits with some form of damage mitigation). Evasion can work really well with a little damage mitigation, my Ranger with a shield found Dominus easier than most if not all of my Templars

 

[T. Reich]

Well, that's what I though of at first, as well. "Oh, I can just switch to Storm Call for the boss, or use Whirling Jar and hope for a huge ignite (lolno), or use Vaal Storm Call, or whatever".
But then - WHY? I just switched one skill gem for another skill gem (literally), and the build instantly became better in all aspects.

EDIT: Oh, I just remembered one more thing that made Arc bad even for general mob clearing. IT'S NOT INSTANT. While a lot of aoe skills strike all the affected targets simultaneously, Arc ever so slowly jumps from enemy to enemy to the point where your extra arcs from previous cast start to overla with the new cast's arcs and are wasted. Plus it means the mobs actually have the time to react before they die, so enjoy your extra damage taken. All this, combined with the fact that you can't really control the spread pattern of chainig arcs means that by virtue of RNG some mobs will occasionally miraculously survive your casts, slowing you down and endangering you even more.

 

[Sykar]

I got a question for resident CI experts. Did you guys try to play a CI character without stun immunity or avoidance ? How terrible was that experience? :D

The cries over it are overbloated by people trying to play it melee. It's almost a non-issue for long range builds.

 

[ArchAngel]

Well, that's what I though of at first, as well. "Oh, I can just switch to Storm Call for the boss, or use Whirling Jar and hope for a huge ignite (lolno), or use Vaal Storm Call, or whatever".
But then - WHY? I just switched one skill gem for another skill gem (literally), and the build instantly became better in all aspects.

EDIT: Oh, I just remembered one more thing that made Arc bad even for general mob clearing. IT'S NOT INSTANT. While a lot of aoe skills strike all the affected targets simultaneously, Arc ever so slowly jumps from enemy to enemy to the point where your extra arcs from previous cast start to overla with the new cast's arcs and are wasted. Plus it means the mobs actually have the time to react before they die, so enjoy your extra damage taken. All this, combined with the fact that you can't really control the spread pattern of chainig arcs means that by virtue of RNG some mobs will occasionally miraculously survive your casts, slowing you down and endangering you even more.

Arc can work with crits and Inquisitor just like every elemental build :D
But yea, Storm Call is fun.
If you could link Arc with LMP or GMP that would go a long way in fighting masses. Then we could have two setups, one with Arc and Storm Call for bosses.

 

[Padre]

Ok guys what are you plans for Breach league? I'm going Siege Ballista Inquisitor. Have seen this BoTW on ggg's channel and it looked super fun. Only problem is, deadeye variant seems quite expensive so I'm going full ele crit 3-4 ballistas. And Inquisitor was born for crit

 

[T. Reich]

I playes Siege Ballista two leagues ago - it was fun and viable, plus there are a lot of different ways to build it.

I will probably skip Breach, or just start it later. If/when I do, I'll probably join the dark side this time around (can't be arsed really) and do the current FotM crit BF DW assassin, unless BF gets nerfed hard.

 

[made]

Decided to make chaos-themed caster to blow off some steam. Blight seems to suck (at least at lower levels) so I ended up using essence drain/contagion. Plays a lot like the old poison trapper except with one more button to press, and I went with a lowlife Occultist instead of hp build. I expect survivability to tank in maps but it's smooth sailing in merc so far.

 

[Grunker]

ED/contagion on a lowlife is one of the best, steady builds out there, so I doubt survivability will become that much of a problem if you know what you're doing. Of course, a Shavs does help...

 

[Damned Registrations]

Evasion is always going to be garbage in a game with OHKO moves. But even if PoE didn't have stuff that will randomly one shot you, evasion would still be shit because it does nothing vs spells. Even spell dodge does nothing against a number of spells/abilities (various DOT effects, corpse explosion) and spell dodge is pretty much impossible to get decent amounts of. Armour is shit as well for the same reason- it's a defense that is completely bypassed by certain damage types. Chaos was supposed to do that to ES, but then they put in the current CI and ES was broken forevermore at the top end of gear. ES is the only defense that nothing can bypass, therefore it's always going to be the best. HP does the same thing, but it's not a defense stat you can get on armour/shields/etc. so it doesn't scale the same way.

ES letting you survive one shots isn't an aberration btw, it's the intended design. It's not like they couldn't just make a slam attack that does ten million damage and ignores evasion/dodge/block. Those attacks are meant to be survivable, they're just shit at balancing the other defensive options.

 

[Aothan]

Well, that's what I though of at first, as well.

to answer "why" it is mostly an interest in playability rather than functionality that limits enjoying gameplay (and yes GGG's design confounds this), as it is many skills appear redundant next to various configurations because of how the game is becoming increasingly focused on the screen vanishing with the press of a button. However there are plenty of skills and playstyles which can be enjoyable and practical enough to varying degrees, Arc is an example that I think has potential and can be used with different designs, the main challenge with this skill is probably that of boss encounters but that too can be a good thing for gameplay purposes

still, there is a greater possibility I will be starting with a melee character and seeing if I'm interested in trying another type of class later on, the discussion on evasion reminds me of how fun melee Rangers (armour and evasion) can be but I'm undecided

 

[T. Reich]

It's relatively easy to build a tanky maxblock armor+evasion duelist (thanks to the strong gladiator ascendancy) with 6 endurance charges + fortify on top of that, but your biggest problem would be the damage that you do - it would require a strong pick of "melee" skill and sizeable investment.

...Damn, you reminded me why armor is shit in the current meta . Just fortify and 5+ endurance charges, and you get more physical (and not just physical) mitigation than 30k+ armour would give you most of the time. Then stack tons of evasion and block/dodge on top of that, and you've got your solid multilayered defense without bothering with armour. Add LC/Kintsugi on top of that to make armor even more redundant. And, yes, it's doable on ranger, you'll just have to travel through duelist to mara, but as a melee char you'd want that anyway - for more life and "melee" damage nodes.

 

[Aothan]

if or when I start with my melee Templar I'll be including additional endurance charges combined with armour and energy shield (and MoM etc), which will be something of a first for me since I've usually limited endurance to the standard number of charges

what gems did you use for Arc in a four link item ? I've been thinking to start with Arc, Lightning Penetration, Faster Casting, and Innervate but I don't remember how or if different types of damages are modified with Arc so maybe Added Cold Damage with the Templar's numerous multipurpose elemental nodes and the Celestial Judgement notable nearby

 

[Jason Liang]

I'm starting with a HC Hierophant/ Juggernaut Scion and I've made a pretty sick tree that gets 7 endurance charges. As for gems, maybe something with a staff? Not sure what skill. Spectral Throw+Sweep staff?

 

[Sykar]

ED/contagion on a lowlife is one of the best, steady builds out there, so I doubt survivability will become that much of a problem if you know what you're doing. Of course, a Shavs does help...

It's great, I just wish my Shavs were 5 or 6 links instead of just 4.

 

[Sykar]

Evasion is always going to be garbage in a game with OHKO moves. But even if PoE didn't have stuff that will randomly one shot you, evasion would still be shit because it does nothing vs spells. Even spell dodge does nothing against a number of spells/abilities (various DOT effects, corpse explosion) and spell dodge is pretty much impossible to get decent amounts of. Armour is shit as well for the same reason- it's a defense that is completely bypassed by certain damage types. Chaos was supposed to do that to ES, but then they put in the current CI and ES was broken forevermore at the top end of gear. ES is the only defense that nothing can bypass, therefore it's always going to be the best. HP does the same thing, but it's not a defense stat you can get on armour/shields/etc. so it doesn't scale the same way.

ES letting you survive one shots isn't an aberration btw, it's the intended design. It's not like they couldn't just make a slam attack that does ten million damage and ignores evasion/dodge/block. Those attacks are meant to be survivable, they're just shit at balancing the other defensive options.

Armor does nothing against spells either. So does normal block. Evasion is a good supplement for ES builds since ES profits more from getting ways to start early than from just reducing damage, which is also why two of the most important stats on your flask is Ignite and Bleed removal/immunity.
Now consider that a lot of one shots are magical and armor does not look as good as you try to make it out to be. It is more "steady" than Evasion but that's it.
Furthermore Armor becomes less potent the bigger the damage you take.

http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Armour

While Evasion cares only about the attack value.

 

[made]

ED/contagion on a lowlife is one of the best, steady builds out there, so I doubt survivability will become that much of a problem if you know what you're doing. Of course, a Shavs does help...

It's great, I just wish my Shavs were 5 or 6 links instead of just 4.

It's cheaper than ever to link stuff nowadays, a 5L should be easily obtainable.

I had a Shavs lying around but lack good endgame ES gear for the other slots but maybe I can piece something together with the new bases they've introduced lately.

Also have an Apep's Rage and a Consuming Dark that I'm trying to decide between. Too bad you can't dual wield them.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Now consider that a lot of one shots are magical and armor does not look as good as you try to make it out to be.

Armour is shit as well for the same reason- it's a defense that is completely bypassed by certain damage types.

The extra special shitty part about armour is that at the end of the day, it shares it's functionality with %phys damage resist from things like endurance charges and flasks- which are ten times easier to build up. You could be running the heaviest armour build in the game and still end up taking more phys damage than a guy in a fucking tabula with no shield who is spamming his basalt flasks + 10 endurance charges. At least evasion isn't made entirely obsolete by a single flask and some charges. Though block is really the way to go if you want to be hit less often in PoE. Spell block is easier to obtain than ever making it the closest thing to ES for a universal defense. Still a garbage defense mode because of damage spikes though. A defense that lets you always survive nine hits in a row is far, far better than one that lets you survive 30 on average but might have you die from an unlucky string of 5.

 

[Sykar]

Now consider that a lot of one shots are magical and armor does not look as good as you try to make it out to be.

Armour is shit as well for the same reason- it's a defense that is completely bypassed by certain damage types.

The extra special shitty part about armour is that at the end of the day, it shares it's functionality with %phys damage resist from things like endurance charges and flasks- which are ten times easier to build up. You could be running the heaviest armour build in the game and still end up taking more phys damage than a guy in a fucking tabula with no shield who is spamming his basalt flasks + 10 endurance charges. At least evasion isn't made entirely obsolete by a single flask and some charges. Though block is really the way to go if you want to be hit less often in PoE. Spell block is easier to obtain than ever making it the closest thing to ES for a universal defense. Still a garbage defense mode because of damage spikes though. A defense that lets you always survive nine hits in a row is far, far better than one that lets you survive 30 on average but might have you die from an unlucky string of 5.

Evasion profits from Endurance charges just as much since to my knowledge it is a multiplier to armor and not additive. Furthermore there is nothing to prevent you from running Granite Flasks on ES builds with 100% increased armor, that helps noticably in almost all cases where you have to tank some physical damage and you do not want to entirely rely on Evasion.

ED/contagion on a lowlife is one of the best, steady builds out there, so I doubt survivability will become that much of a problem if you know what you're doing. Of course, a Shavs does help...

It's great, I just wish my Shavs were 5 or 6 links instead of just 4.

It's cheaper than ever to link stuff nowadays, a 5L should be easily obtainable.

I had a Shavs lying around but lack good endgame ES gear for the other slots but maybe I can piece something together with the new bases they've introduced lately.

Also have an Apep's Rage and a Consuming Dark that I'm trying to decide between. Too bad you can't dual wield them.

Not in Standard which is all I play. Cba with leagues and races.

 

[Aothan]

I don't think armour is rendered obsolete or less functional in mind of how much damage it will absorb from heavier attacks, defensively armour works by mitigating the constancy of damage, and to some degree the flux or spikes that would place character's health levels into a more vulnerable state without first reducing physical damage. A good example is from successive attacks such as the Tentacle Abominations and other ranged projectile attacks that come in volleys, and the types of mid-range spikes these can cause which in turn make a character temporarily susceptible to all other types of damage taken. The same advantages can also be observed from the benefits of evasion against physical attacks and how effective evasion proves by dodging a greater number of projectiles. The two together work neatly which is why I'm such a fan of armour and evasion as a hybrid defence, and admittedly wyrmscale armour is one of the better looking armour types

I would look at the utility of armour or any type of defence alongside the means to use these and not be altogether specialised into one type of build and set of passives, for example reliable access to armour rating, with a moderate number of endurance charges and Mind over Matter makes for a well-rounded defence and is flexible enough for other areas of character design

 

[Sykar]

I think Shavs armor is damn stylish, as are the Necromancer garbs which I prefer on my Summoner characters to wear.

 

[made]

Cba with leagues and races.

Me neither. So you get to keep all your currency and master levels between leagues. If you let Vorici 5L your chest, it takes at most 150 fuses - easily farmable even for super casuals.

 

[Sykar]

Cba with leagues and races.

Me neither. So you get to keep all your currency and master levels between leagues. If you let Vorici 5L your chest, it takes at most 150 fuses - easily farmable even for super casuals.

True enough. I thought you meant acquiring a 5/6L Shavs is (relatively) cheap, brain fart on my part.

 

[ArchAngel]

Cba with leagues and races.

Me neither. So you get to keep all your currency and master levels between leagues. If you let Vorici 5L your chest, it takes at most 150 fuses - easily farmable even for super casuals.

Actually it is faster to buy Jeweller's Touch for 30c

 

[made]

Actually it is faster to buy Jeweller's Touch for 30c

Seems like a crappy prophecy for anything but low-end items. If you ever want to 6L it you'd have to jew it from scratch anyway.

 

[ArchAngel]

Actually it is faster to buy Jeweller's Touch for 30c

Seems like a crappy prophecy for anything but low-end items. If you ever want to 6L it you'd have to jew it from scratch anyway.

Still better than wasting 150 fusings for Vorici.