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Pathfinder Pathfinder: Kingmaker - Enhanced Plus Edition - now with turn-based combat

Discussion in 'Owlcat Games' started by Elex, Nov 20, 2018.

  1. Desiderius Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard Patron

    Desiderius
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    Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    It’s a bit much.

    Ranged Investigator (Empiricist is best) is sick, but I’m not even on Summoner or Spiritualist.
     
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  2. Dishonoredbr Savant

    Dishonoredbr
    Joined:
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    They're really hard to understand , i still trying to grasp how ''fuse'' two elements correctly and if it's normal to waste a turn in turnbased to charge up with gather power
     
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  3. Desiderius Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard Patron

    Desiderius
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    Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Just hit 2500. Some of that has to be afk, but still.
     
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  4. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    I wrapped up my BTSL run with Steelrager Bloodrager, Occultist Arcanist, Hunter Who Trips, Shaman Archetype with Mystery, Ninja, and Arsenal Chaplain Warpriest archer.

    Going for another run with Skald, Ocean’s Echo Oracle (gets inspire courage), Eldritch Archer Magus, School Savant (Admixture) Arcanist, Winter Witch, Naturalist Summoner. I had fun blasting with the last party and the new metamagic feats so I wanted to try more of that with dazing, rime, etc on the Arcanist and Witch. Skald with a bunch of gishes is weird in theory but in practice with decline rage it sort of works and the two songs make up for everyone’s mongrel BABs.

    Summoner is kind of clunky though, not sure if I will stick with that or maybe roll another Hunter, Sanctified Slayer, evil Warpriest, etc. Would like to get some Druid spells, too.
     
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  5. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    Yeah. A bunch of that is the game being idle while I’m working remotely, heh.
     
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  6. Desiderius Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard Patron

    Desiderius
    Joined:
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    Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    You gotta do what you gotta do. Sometimes one big jizz is what you need against bosses. Normal turn is using the Move Action one since your Blasts don’t get iteratives*, so you don’t mind Standard Action since a full attack doesn’t buy you anything. You don’t use your combined blasts regularly until later since they cost more, but at 16th level that goes down and you can spam them.

    * - Blade DOES get iteratives. It looks like it sux. It doesn’t.

    I once stupidly said that the Deadly Aim on Kalikke was the only wasted Companion Feat in the game. It’s really good if you pick up an energy blast for Touch AC to beef them up. Then later you go off.
     
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  7. Catacombs Cipher Patron

    Catacombs
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    Make the Codex Great Again! Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex
    I was about to say... Must be nice to have the option to alt-tab into the game; let use a machine that can be used fork and gaming. ;)
     
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  8. Desiderius Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard Patron

    Desiderius
    Joined:
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    Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Yeah, walk me through putting one together for Wrath and the next seven years and I’ll send the Codex $150 USD to dispense with as you see fit.
     
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  9. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    I think either CoTW or Fumi’s Codex adds a bunch of the missing feats that Kinetic Knight uses like Kinetic Whip. So I will revisit that at some point.
     
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  10. Catacombs Cipher Patron

    Catacombs
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    Make the Codex Great Again! Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex
    If you allow PMs, I can send you my thoughts.
     
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  11. santino27 Arcane Patron

    santino27
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    I'm building a new rig next month, but a lot of the choice depends on whether the new AMD chips live up to their hype.
     
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  12. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    The daemon eidolon is the sweet looking robed wormy guy. 10/10 would summon again.
     
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  13. Trashos Arcane

    Trashos
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    At some point Kimo (the introverted artisan who is trying to court the dryad) says he is getting dating advice from some guy who seems to know about these things. A few meters down the road is Sharel, an artisan who makes a variety of +CHA items.

    Hmmm.... the plot thickens.
     
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  14. LannTheStupid Товарищ Patron

    LannTheStupid
    Joined:
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    Location:
    Soviet Union
    Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    I like how artisans with the most disgusting quests are the most valuable.
     
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  15. Trashos Arcane

    Trashos
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    Nazrielle had better bring me some Rapiers for my Rapier Wizard/Eldritch Knight. In my previous playthrough as a Rapier Sword Saint, she didn't bring me any (and yes, I was specifically asking for the rapier group, but it is not just rapiers in there). So I played all the way to the Rushlight Tournament with the +2 Strategem. Hopefully this time she will deliver.

    In other news: I have to admit that the more time I spend with the Pathfinder system and the more I understand it, the more I respect it and like it. (Note that I am not in touch with the other current systems)
     
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  16. Desiderius Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard Patron

    Desiderius
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    Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    You do understand that a big advantage of EK over SS is that you have Martial Proficiency so can use any weapon you want, right? You’re wasting half of your class. Even Rogues and Bards can use Rapiers.
     
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  17. Trashos Arcane

    Trashos
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    I do not like playing without a weapon focus. Not to mention that Improved Critical loses its meaning without it. This build is not just an Eldritch Knight, he is a Rapier Eldritch Knight.

    The extend to which Kingmaker supports weapon focuses is a different matter (ie, it supports it well only for specific weapons).
     
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  18. Serus Arcane

    Serus
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    Small but great planet of Potatohole
    I know you jest but...
    I can use a cheat instead, would be faster. Or not play in the first place. BTW, the trick with reserve mercenary created only for crafting purposes might not work that well as you think. Crafting only advance during rest - iirc the description of the mod. You'd actually need to drag the guy along. As to ring of mirror images - i doubt that the mod allows to make one. Anyway you can stop yourself from doing it.

    On the other hand, does the ability to make items you need and not rely on what you find or ability to make scrolls is a big help in practice or not? There are cost included (like need to use feats). If there is someone who actually played with the mod, please share your opinion.
     
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  19. Mr. Magniloquent Liturgist

    Mr. Magniloquent
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    Still having a great time with this game. I found myself caught in the endorphin loop of "....just one more rank up". While it does take quite a bit of time, I really enjoy the kingdom aspect. Having forged my nation state with cities, town, regional upgrades is very satisfying. Optimizing my settlement layouts for mechanical benefit as well as aesthetic/concept is a snare for my OCD. I could have completed this run a long time ago, but I really want to elevate the kingdom as high as I can before crossing that finish line.
     
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  20. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    There is a list of items you can make in the description of the mod: https://www.nexusmods.com/pathfinderkingmaker/mods/54
    It does look like you can make rings or wondrous items with “cast x per day” enchantments.

    Anyways, I have been considering the mod mostly for BTSL, since the item selection there is really meager and I’ll often end up with like a +5 pitchfork or something being the only great weapon, compared to the main campaign where they are falling out of the sky. As a case in point, the run before I built my Bloodrager there were two items on the vendor that avoided rage exhaustion. The actual run that I used my Bloodrager, there was nothing. I suppose I could use the Respec feature after I’ve figured out what the vendor actually has, if I wanted to be a purist.

    I’m also using COTW, so itemization for the non-base classes is not quite as good. So that might be another incentive.

    Re: Mirror image for everyone, not sure how I feel about that. It’s such a huge boost to survivability, but on the other hand, it’s readily available to a number of builds that don’t seem to give up much relative to classes who don’t have it available. I.E., you’re not really making a big sacrifice with a magus archetype over a barbarian and you get mirror image, and this is without any mods. Same with bards and other 2/3 casters.

    So if the premise is that locked doors keep honest people honest and you should avoid making mirror image items available by avoiding the mod, well then there is nothing stopping you from running a couple kensai and soloing the game or whatever in vanilla, either. COTW exacerbates the issue, since you can take a Bloodrager, skald, archetypes etc and get mirror.

    I think the main issue is that the encounter design is extremely vulnerable to pre-buffing. It would be interesting if they had more frequent dispelling encounters and more prebuffing of their own. Might widen the playing field a bit.

    Anyways, tl;dr: Mirror image is too good and I don’t really know what to do about it other than just indulge in it but not going full retard, and I haven’t tried the crafting mod yet but I’m interested in it for next BTSL run.
     
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  21. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    Yeah, I’m coming to appreciate a splatbook heavy system like this for a cRPG. On tabletop, I’ve felt the burden of having to recall everyone’s artisanal build and keep track of all of these interrupts and crap, but the computer will track all that stuff for you and so it’s not really a burden. Great fit for a cRPG.

    One potential flaw though that I’ve noticed is there is a bit of a feeling of rocket tag at many stages of progression. Most fights last 2-3 rounds or so, with a few exceptions, once your party is semi-optimized. And I’m not talking about full on vivisectionist karate serial killer builds, but like just Ekun and Jub doing their things will wreck shit.

    This became really noticeable while taking a break to play, of all things, Dungeons of Nahbeulheuk. It has what I think many on codex would consider “hp bloat” or “bullet sponges”, and the CCs generally only last a round, but this adds way more texture to the encounters in my opinion. You have to look ahead to what the thing will be doing 3 or so rounds from now and dropping something immediately is often a full party effort.

    Anyways, I don’t know how much of that is the system vs how much is the encounter design, itemization, etc. But Kingmaker with at about 0.5x playback speed would be good (and less trash encounters, more artisanal set pieces). Wish there were difficulty options to make the enemies just have flat more HP and make CC shorter duration or something. Unfair doesn’t feel any less rocket tag, just feels like I’m funneled into more optimized party to achieve the same tactics as lower difficulties.

    Maybe a derpy house ruled party will be my next play through.
     
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  22. Trashos Arcane

    Trashos
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    I have not played Dungeons of THAT. Your description (slow battles, CC lasting very little) kinda reminds me of the PoE1 system, which I am not exactly missing. However, this detail:
    .. reminds me of the boss battles in BG2, where I knew exactly what each boss would do in each round. I liked that encounter system a lot. I have mentioned in my early writings ITT that the one thing I am missing from BG2 is the mage duels (round 1 he does this I do that, round 2 he does this I do that etc), and I am still missing them.

    Other than that, however, this Pathfinder system is a lot of fun. I feel lucky that I have a chance to play such a rich system in this day and age, in a decently high profile release.
    (I have lost track with what DnD has been doing. I will learn about it soon through BG3, although it is an expensive release, and I fear that they may dumb it down.)
     
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  23. Cleric of Asmodeus Learned

    Cleric of Asmodeus
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    Update: Skalds are really sweet. Has cool stuff going on at all levels. Adding rage powers to the song is a neat mechanic, spell kenning lets you grab some good spells from wizards, can fight ok. Really could use like 10 more feats but can't have everything. Really pleased that they added them to the core in WotR.

    Winter witch having hexes for down time and then an amped up DC for cold spells, which work well with the rime metamagic, is also novel. Other characters are kind of a bag of stats so far but it's early days.
     
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  24. Sykar Arcane

    Sykar
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    Turn right after Alpha Centauri
    Take elf as SS and enjoy free longsword proficiency!
    :happytrollboy:
     
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  25. LannTheStupid Товарищ Patron

    LannTheStupid
    Joined:
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    Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    The Elven Schutzstaffel. I like this idea.
     
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