KickStarter Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pre-Release Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Shadenuat]

Aside from buffs like Rage, pots/scrolls or if you take some feats? More than IE but less than PoE for sure. https://youtu.be/zYUoopyBPD8?t=187

 

[sstacks]

Sounds like someone did not find the pause button.

But yeah, compared to modern interpretations of IE games, this one is "D&D" so it's rough - you start with low hp, your characters, even fighters or barbarians like Amiri, can get 1-shot to stuff like x3 battle axe crits, your front line can collapse in moments to spells and all that what I've seen.

How many active abilities (buttons to click) do you generally have in this game? On non-spellcaster characters I mean.

Haven't played in a while because LIFE BE CRAZY but IIRC non spellcasters at least had one or two you could lovingly mash and keep track of.

 

[sstacks]

So did anyone play the beta and can comment on the RTWP elements? What does it look like, is it Tyranny with a huuuuge time to kill and is pretty much garbage tier RTWP, or is it looking good?

I saw some of Shane’s ponderous pathfinder playthrough—thank you sstacks. Looks like combat moves substantially faster than POE or Tyranny.

It is my honor to make ponderous videos for you where I flail around and occasionally succeed and/or go in the right direction.

Yeah, combat in PK moves fast. I likes it. Unless I am taking a beat down and don't have time to reverse. In which case I invoke the Save Scum feat.

 

[Infinitron]

Aside from buffs like Rage, pots/scrolls or if you take some feats? More than IE but less than PoE for sure. https://youtu.be/zYUoopyBPD8?t=187

Feats and buffs count, but not consumables. Just trying to get a feel of how micro-managey combat is.

How would it feel like to play an NWN2 that's hard enough that you actually have to pay attention?

I saw some of Shane’s ponderous pathfinder playthrough—thank you sstacks. Looks like combat moves substantially faster than POE or Tyranny.

It is my honor to make ponderous videos for you where I flail around and occasionally succeed and/or go in the right direction.

Yeah, combat in PK moves fast. I likes it. Unless I am taking a beat down and don't have time to reverse. In which case I invoke the Save Scum feat.

OTOH I believe the characters walk rather than run (which is a big plus for some people)

 

[sstacks]

I would say it's like most RTwP combat. If your group is a lot stronger than your enemies just let it unfold, if evenly matched or outmatched you are going to have to micro-manage a lot. You really have to keep an eye on that because you can move 10 feet on a map and hit an encounter of a lot higher difficulty than the last.

 

[sstacks]

I prefer turn-based, so I guess I would rather micro-manage everything.

 

[Jenkem]

where the muhfuggin keys AT

 

[Thonius]

Why the fuck all devs hold so tight for keys? Eh I ques it's a fucking great mystery of a generation..

 

[Infinitron]

New Avellone interview: https://www.gamespot.com/articles/why-pathfinder-kingmaker-turned-to-veteran-storyte/1100-6461970/

Why Pathfinder: Kingmaker Turned To Veteran Storyteller Of Star Wars KOTOR And Fallout

Pathfinder is a household name for those familiar with world of role-playing games, but the uninitiated should know that the franchise has been a marvel in the tabletop space. With Pathfinder: Kingmaker, the series makes its video game debut--it's based on the Kingmaker module using Dungeons and Dragons rulesets from its tabletop counterpart. But since this is a single-player RPG, Pathfinder would need a robust narrative to bring its world to life, which is why developer Owlcat Games teamed up with one of gaming's great storytellers, Chris Avellone.

Avellone has written and designed some of the most critically acclaimed games and memorable stories; from Obsidian's Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II - The Sith Lords and Fallout: New Vegas to CRPG classics like Planescape: Torment and Icewind Dale. More recently, he's worked on Prey and Into The Breach, and is currently working on the System Shock remake as well as Dying Light 2, serving as narrative designer. During a Pathfinder: Kingmaker hands-on session, we were able to chat with Avellone about designing an expansive story for the Pathfinder franchise and staying true to the source material.

As an isometric RPG in the vein of Baldur's Gate games in that it's an isometric RPG, Pathfinder: Kingmaker weaves in elements from the original tabletop experience, especially as it relates to traveling across the Stolen Lands. You can experience it yourself when the game launches for PC and Mac on September 25, 2018. The following interview was edited for clarity and readability.

You've worked with established IPs, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II and Fallout: New Vegas for example. What exactly drew you to Pathfinder, and how different is it working on this game compared to others?

Chris Avellone: So, with Pathfinder, we used to run pen-and-paper sessions back at Obsidian, and what we did was actually have a campaign in an Ocean's Eleven-style. It was really cool! We just made an assortment of characters like a con-man illusionist and we try to pull off heists. That was the most recent Pathfinder game I played. I also played the card game, which I also loved. Just the idea of being able to do this really interested me because there hadn't really been a Pathfinder RPG in the computer space at all.

The other aspect was one thing I've always liked about Pathfinder. I feel that when they do their modules and adventure paths, they make a very conscious effort to create an other-world experience. When I read one of their adventures, rather than just seeing what they're giving me, I'm seeing all the possibilities they present the GM [Game Master], too. So, reading those adventures is sometimes a lot more fun than reading some older modules or other adventures for other systems, because it's giving you room to breathe.

Pathfinder, and D&D in particular, is a different type of this high-fantasy, but coming off of Prey and Into The Breach, how have lessons from very different games fed into what you're doing with Pathfinder? What are you taking from your previous works and how have they influenced Kingmaker?

Well, one aspect is the computer game pays a lot of attention to character growth. Not just your stats, but also the alignment system. And the lesson I'm taking from previous titles--like in Fallout: New Vegas with the whole idea of karma and Planescape: Torment with the alignment tracking where you basically start true neutral and you grow in all directions--using the tracking systems from previous games like that, and being able to "check" it in dialogues and "check" it for certain events happening. Like "hey, here's your true mutual response," or "here's the way a chaotic evil character could solve this situation."

It's more of a matter of having been through that process so many times, I know pretty efficient ways to track alignment shifts. Also, how to make each of those alignments feel satisfying, because one challenge that can happen is--and you run into this problem with Fallout 2--sometimes the mistake you can make is you actually create a path of growth for a character, and then you can accidentally design a dead end around it. Like in Fallout 2, if you were evil and a slaver, you suddenly lose a huge percentage of content for the game because no one would talk to you and quests would get cut off.

You have to make sure if you're providing the chaotic evil options, like in Pathfinder: Kingmaker, you also want to make that character arc satisfying, too. Because if that's the way a player wants to play, make an interesting path and go in that direction.

That also makes me think of how difficult it is to build specific character arcs. For example, in Fallout: New Vegas, I was straight up aligned with NCR. I didn't want anything to do with Caesar's Legion.

Yeah, they have a lot of bad traits!

To say the least! What's it like to build an entire narrative, write all these stories, but know that a lot of people are going to miss out on a big chunk of your work? Is there ever a point which you think, "I want to make sure they're able to see everything," or is it always, "I know going into this that not everyone's going to see everything?"

Yeah, it's the latter of what you just said. I've always been comfortable with having players missing elements. I don't like to mandate a story on someone. For example, as you're exploring the cavern complex in Pathfinder, the way I try and design an area like that is--because you're paying attention to the map and the floor of the dungeon--to be able to visually tell the story and tell it with things that are really hard to escape. If I really need to get something across, I'd use techniques like that.

Overall, I think what's kind of cool is if you're playing a chaotic evil character, someone else plays lawful good, and then you guys talk about the game. Then suddenly you're like, "Yeah, I like trolls in my kingdom. They're like the best armed forces I've ever had," and the lawful good guy's like, "What? You're allowed to do that?" I'm like, "Yeah, it's pretty cool. I wiped out that enemy army" and he's like, "I had a hell of a time with that enemy army!"

I'm cool with that because if everyone did see everything, everyone's story is kind of the same. I think a lot of the role playing joy is when you're exploring that, you get an individual experience with the role playing.

One thing I wanted to mention is that I tend to feel Obsidian went in darker directions. I felt that when you got to work with the Star Wars license and the Fallout license. In those cases, it seemed like you had a lot of creative freedom to take it in a direction you want. What's that like, the process in which you get a license and start to build it out? Is the response, "hey, source materials right here, have fun with it?"

The way we approach it is, when you have a franchise, you sort of want to immerse yourself in it actually before you do any heavy lifting with the tighter plot. You're like, "Okay, what are the stories that have already been told? What's the feel of this franchise?"

After you read like 30, 40, 300 books, you have the mindset. The same thing's true with Star Wars. When we were doing Star Wars, I read all the Young Jedi books, I watched all the movies again, I watched the Star Wars Christmas special. Once you get all that information, it's all in your head. You're like, "Okay, well, now when I propose stuff to LucasArts, I have this background and I know everything a specific character did." And the best part is when you can propose those ideas.

Like in KOTOR 2, there was one example. We have this companion that was a Wookie slaver, and that's unusual. Our producer pushed back and he was like, "I'm sorry, that's just completely inconsistent with the franchise. Wookies just aren't slavers, they're enslaved all the time." and I'm responded, "Well, in Young Jedi book #13, there's a whole character arc involving this one Wookie as a slaver." The producer went quiet and was like, "All right, I guess it's approved."

But we have that information, we know the license, they'll respect you more and they have fewer questions about what you submit to them. I think we got five or six comments in the KOTOR 2 storyline, and that's because we just took the time to make sure that we'd done our research on the license. And if there was ever an issue, we could discuss it and make our case. They're like, "Well, we just trust you now." It's cool.

You've done a lot of work over the years, but are there any particular characters you've written that you're absolutely proud of, or would call a favorite?

Actually, a certain character for Pathfinder: Kingmaker was a lot of fun to write, and I'm really kind of curious to see how he's received because I've never been able to write sort of a very cunning goblin-esque character. The trick in Pathfinder is that the goblins are so different than normal fantasy goblins, that was kind of a treat to write. But yeah, it was fun to do the comedic moments, but it was also to do the serious moments. The fact that you're sort of acting as this goblin's mentor and he's trying to mentor you in his own weird way, that was a lot of fun to write! So, I'm curious to see how people receive him.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/tech/ga...aching-an-Old-School-PC-RPG-Genres-New-Tricks

Pathfinder Kingmaker Release Date Preview: Teaching an Old School PC RPG Genres New Tricks
PATHFINDER KINGMAKER feels like the right sort of homage to old school RPG games, but one that can easily count itself as one of the most exciting new releases of 2018.

It seems our passion for classical roleplaying games never went away.

That’s the resounding impression one gets from seeing the success of Divinity: Original Sin II, Pillars of Eternity II, and Torment: Tides of Numenera - unashamedly hardcore RPGs that harken back to what many consider a golden age for the genre.

It wasn’t long ago, during the early to mid 00s, that they seemingly went out of fashion. Advancements in tech and the booming console market led to the emergence of a cinematic, action-heavy strain of roleplaying game - Fallout 3, The Witcher, Oblivion and Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic being just a few examples.

That said, the demand for traditional RPGs was still there.

Revered classics such as Baldur’s Gate, Wasteland, and Planescape returned to the spotlight, no doubt buoyed by the recent surge in popularity surrounding tabletop, pen and paper roleplaying games.

It’s clear to see where Pathfinder: Kingmaker draws much of its inspiration. Not only that, this debut from the Moscow-based Owlcat Games uses various systems and settings from one of the world’s most established RPG licenses.

Pathfinder is well known among tabletop and roleplaying enthusiasts, second only to the giant that is Dungeons & Dragons.

In fact, it was born from a modified version of D&D’s 3.5 edition, Paizo Publishing eventually developing Pathfinder into its own successful franchise.

“Your player character will travel between more than 145 locations, up to five companions in tow, completing quests, battling a menagerie of creatures, and generally soaking up Pathfinder’s rich fantasy universe”

In 2018 there are now more than 200 sourcebooks, not to mention a myriad of fan-made rules, adventure modules, and other supplementary material.

“Paizo are very involved,” said Alexander Mishulin, Creative Director at Owlcat Games, commenting on the relationship between the two companies.

“At a certain point during development we were contacting them on a daily basis, calling them to discuss various aspects. Every character made for the game has been approved with them and when we write some background lore we check with them whether it is correct.

"They’re very easy to work with - the perfect partners. They are very open to our ideas and even if they don’t fit with the existing lore, we discuss and find a way to make it work within the Pathfinder universe.

"It’s their baby and one hand they protect it but on the other hand they are very happy to let us try and tell the best story possible.”

Spoiler

That story, as Kingmaker’s name suggests, is centred around establishing your very own realm in the world of Pathfinder.

It borrows from a tabletop module of the same name, allowing players to rule from their seat of power, forging alliances, dispatching emissaries, and expanding their influence within The Stolen Lands.

Beneath this overarching layer is a familiar blend of combat and exploration adept fans of the genre will instantly connect with.

Your player character will travel between more than 145 locations, up to five companions in tow, completing quests, battling a menagerie of creatures, and generally soaking up Pathfinder’s rich fantasy universe.

“We played a lot of the Pathfinder tabletop game and we really liked the setting and lore. It’s not just fantasy, it’s very different. For example, just to the south of The Stolen Lands is a kingdom engulfed in revolution where the people are always fighting, destroying one ruler after another.

"They even have guillotines that suck a victim’s soul into the blade to prevent resurrection. It’s a fun place to visit. On the other hand, if you go far to the north, there is a place where, a long time ago, a starship fell from the sky.

"However, this area is ruled by barbarians. Wherever you go in Pathfinder there is something interesting to explore.”

Despite the lore and setting being well-established, as is the case in many classical RPGs, players are afforded plenty of options when it comes to forging their own epic story.

Naturally, this starts at the character creation screen with a paralysing number of options to cycle through, including 7 races and 10 playable classes.

Then, in typical pen and paper fashion, you will spend points on skills, talents, and attributes, as well as choosing your moral alignment.

In Kingmaker, the decisions you make aren’t clearly signposted as being good or evil. There’s plenty of grey in between and these choices will have a notable effect on how your personal story gradually unfolds.

For instance, during Kingmaker’s prologue, at one point you have the option to save some guardsmen or make a beeline to protect the castle’s ruler.

Amidst the chaos, you can also decide whether or not to break into the armoury and procure some weapons.

These choices, combined with the bevy of dialogue options, will ultimately define who you become, what kind of ruler you are, and how you are viewed by your companions.

Owlcat has put a huge emphasis on fleshing out these characters, Kingmaker featuring 11 total companions.

Aside from each having their own unique skills and combat proficiencies, efforts have been made in crafting their motives, personalities and backstories.

As well as working with Paizo, the team also enlisted the help of Chris Avellone, a name synonymous with classic roleplaying games, who has helped bring these companions to life.

When asked what his own favourite RPG was Mishulin laughed, explaining that was the exact question he asks when hiring designers. His answer may surprise you, however.

“In truth, it tends to change all the time but usually I would say Final Fantasy VII. I know I am making a classical RPG and should say something like Baldur’s Gate.

"Those games are great and I’ve spent a lot of time playing those but I remember how many times I played through Final Fantasy VII and I still enjoy it to this day.”

He went on to explain that his love for VII was mainly due to its supporting characters. Given how inherently long roleplaying games can be it’s vital, he claims, for the players to become invested in those companions who accompany them.

Yet despite this being Owlcat’s first game, the Russian developer is far from inexperienced.

“The studio is made up of specialists who have each been working in the industry for 15-20 years. Part of our team came from Nival Interactive who, back in the day, made Evil Islands, Etherlords, and Heroes Of Might & Magic V.”

“Most of the team were working at My.com finishing Skyforge and we started to talk about what we wanted to do next. We have always played a lot of tabletop RPGs and we decided that we wanted a game based on Pathfinder.

"We tried to sell our idea to Paizo and managed to do so. Also, at the time there was a renaissance for RPGs with Pillars Of Eternity and similar Kickstarter projects.”

Pathfinder: Kingmaker was another game to join the crowdfunding platform: in 2017, Owlcat ran a successful campaign with more than 18,000 backers and $900,000 pledged.

In truth, Kingmaker was already well into development, bankrolled by Owlcat’s parent company.

However, like some Kickstarter projects, the team wanted to secure additional funding in order to improve the game and introduce a slew of bonus systems and features.

Aside from netting the developer almost another million dollars to play with, the campaign allowed Owlcat to communicate directly with the backer community, consisting of hardcore, passionate gamers, ready to impart valuable feedback.

Therefore, Pathfinder: Kingmaker feels like a genuine collaborative effort and one that isn’t just a quick cash-in on the nostalgia surrounding classical RPGs.

While definitely a homage, having an enriched setting, kingdom-building systems, and a focus on character-driven stories allows Kingmaker to stand out as one of the most exciting roleplaying games of 2018.

Pathfinder: Kingmaker is released September 25, 2018 - For more info head over to Steam

 

[Chippy]

https://i.pinimg.com/564x/e0/b1/12/e0b1125ac96dbc2618a75231acbc59bf.jpg
I'm leaning towards these developers being a Sisyphus I've been waiting for in terms of RPG incline. As a previous golden backer on a few games, I've already thrown a few developers the idol. Although I didn't back this, I think I'll buy it. Here's hoping we arn't all running down the mountain of decline in a few days past another haughty developer (like Obsidian/Saywer/Beamdog/Oster) that are convinced they've 'got it right this time'.

 

[Jenkem]

Not going to read any of their bullshit marketing until I get my fucking key Chris Avellone tell these fucks to give us our keys

 

[bataille]

RPG games

 

[Hamster]

When asked what his own favourite RPG was Mishulin laughed, explaining that was the exact question he asks when hiring designers. His answer may surprise you, however.

“In truth, it tends to change all the time but usually I would say Final Fantasy VII. I know I am making a classical RPG and should say something like Baldur’s Gate.

Gib refund.

 

[Jenkem]

final fantasy
and not dragon quest

and ff7

GET ME OFF THIS RIDE

 

[cruelio]

The most influential turn based RPG of all time, vs. the Bioware game that ruined CRPGs forever by inventing real time with pause. Big competition here.

 

[Shadenuat]

And Avellone favorite game is Chrono Trigger, so?

 

[Jenkem]

And Avellone favorite game is Chrono Trigger, so?

and chrono trigger is good

ff7 is overrated as fuck, it's the witcher 3 of jrpgs

 

[dragonul09]

Can't believe this game is our last hope for this year, there's not a single decent rpg to be released till 2019 and somehow there's not a single one announced, oh boy this is going to be a bad winter

 

[Jenkem]

The most influential turn based RPG of all time, vs. the Bioware game that ruined CRPGs forever by inventing real time with pause. Big competition here.

dragon quest (particularly 3) started the template of every jrpg that came afterwards

but sure ff7 is the "most influential"

 

[BEvers]

Can't believe this game is our last hope for this year, there's not a single decent rpg to be released till 2019 and somehow there's not a single one announced, oh boy this is going to be a bad winter

Fargo has confirmed that Wasteland 3 is still on track for Q4 2019. And there's still 2 PoE DLCs coming this year.

 

[Moink]

At least FF7 wasn't RTwP

 

[Bocian]

And there's still 2 PoE DLCs coming this year.

Does that change anything?

 

[Shadenuat]

The most influential turn based RPG of all time, vs. the Bioware game that ruined CRPGs forever by inventing real time with pause. Big competition here.

dragon quest (particularly 3) started the template of every jrpg that came afterwards

but sure ff7 is the "most influential"

DQ was never a thing in Russia. And most of shit you concider classics was released ~10 years before most russians would get their first PCs; and never came to us later either. Except through piracy/emu, although not everything.

 

[Suicidal]

And Avellone favorite game is Chrono Trigger, so?

and chrono trigger is good

ff7 is overrated as fuck, it's the witcher 3 of jrpgs

More like Oblivion of JRPGs